abso-fecking-lutely
If we finish 4th, should Ole get the job full time? [Poll added]
- Thread starter Nikelesh Reddy
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Again, Di Matteo was only good for the cup run but not the league. If OGS manages to get back 11 pts in 21 games to finish top 4, it is going to be one of the biggest achievement after a bad run as someone rightly pointed out. Totally different story. Anyway, we just have to see how we behave and approach big games.
Some people seem to forget that some of the current players like Rashford, Lingard and Pogba have played for Ole in the youth team! He knows them, it's not like it's a random manager. Remind me who's the biggest star of the team right now? Paul Pogba, and he knows Ole!
That should never be underestimated.
If the others like Martial, Matic, Sanchez, Lukaku, Lindelof play well, then even better!
I don't think players will let him down just like that, even after a couple of months or years. At least not those who have played for him.
That should never be underestimated.
If the others like Martial, Matic, Sanchez, Lukaku, Lindelof play well, then even better!
I don't think players will let him down just like that, even after a couple of months or years. At least not those who have played for him.
Yes, without any shadow of a doubt.
Solskjaer has a 21 game 'league campaign' in which United have to play every single PL team in the country.
In order to finish fourth, he would need to maintain league title winning form.
If Ole achieves that, he'll have demonstrated he's good enough. How the hell is that not sufficient evidence that he's the right man?
If we finally find ourselves on the right path after 5 years of being subpar, it'd be madness to change horses in mid-stream.
Our last 3 appointments have taught us that good managers can't always replicate their past success at other clubs. Mourinho is one of the best managers in history for crying out loud, and yet he failed! Finding somebody who can show he's capable of doing do it HERE with THIS squad, should automatically mean we stop looking.
Solskjaer has a 21 game 'league campaign' in which United have to play every single PL team in the country.
In order to finish fourth, he would need to maintain league title winning form.
If Ole achieves that, he'll have demonstrated he's good enough. How the hell is that not sufficient evidence that he's the right man?
If we finally find ourselves on the right path after 5 years of being subpar, it'd be madness to change horses in mid-stream.
Our last 3 appointments have taught us that good managers can't always replicate their past success at other clubs. Mourinho is one of the best managers in history for crying out loud, and yet he failed! Finding somebody who can show he's capable of doing do it HERE with THIS squad, should automatically mean we stop looking.
We need a TOP attack minded coach which Ole is not. It's gonna take more to compete with Pep and Kloop. I Would like Ole as an assistant
Too soon to be thinking about giving Ole the job on a full time basis just yet. He has done remarkably well to change our mindset to one of an attacking outfit so far, but there are sterner challenges ahead for sure.
Let him enjoy being back at the club he loves and re-evaluate at the end of the season. If he manages to get us into the top 4 playing attractive, attacking football, it would be pretty hard to look beyond him, but let us see.
Whatever the decision, i am just enjoying the football and Ole's boyish enthusiasm at the moment. A refreshing change from the all round negativity and grumpiness of Jose.
For these reasons i voted - Undecided -
Let him enjoy being back at the club he loves and re-evaluate at the end of the season. If he manages to get us into the top 4 playing attractive, attacking football, it would be pretty hard to look beyond him, but let us see.
Whatever the decision, i am just enjoying the football and Ole's boyish enthusiasm at the moment. A refreshing change from the all round negativity and grumpiness of Jose.
For these reasons i voted - Undecided -
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Having just watched the Man City v Liverpool game and looking at the intensity, defensive mindset, positional play and attacking prowess of both teams I am not so sure that we can compete with those guys this season. Both teams do not carry passengers when they play.
Ole has done a fantastic job with the players he has at his disposal. Unfortunately, if we take off our RED glasses we would have to admit that every game we go into we are carrying 2 - 3 passengers. Whether through drop off in form or just plain under the standard of being a Man Utd player.
I've read elswhere on the forumn who should be kept and who should go; and I agree with most choices.
It's my round of way of saying that I believe Ole is good enough to be offered the position permanently. Between him and his current coaching staff I'm very sure there is enough experience in them to determine what is required going forward. A knowledgeable and proven DOC would only enhance the team. I have no doubt that Ole would be competitive against a Klop, Guardiola or Pocchetino - provided management is prepared to make improvements to the squad.
In an absolute Manchester Utd dreamworld finishing top four, winning FA Cup and reaching CL Final would be the ultimate achievement for 18/19.
Unfortunately, when you go through our squad there just isn't enough quality to make it happen. One out of three wouldn't be bad.
This could be Ole's undoing.
Ole has done a fantastic job with the players he has at his disposal. Unfortunately, if we take off our RED glasses we would have to admit that every game we go into we are carrying 2 - 3 passengers. Whether through drop off in form or just plain under the standard of being a Man Utd player.
I've read elswhere on the forumn who should be kept and who should go; and I agree with most choices.
It's my round of way of saying that I believe Ole is good enough to be offered the position permanently. Between him and his current coaching staff I'm very sure there is enough experience in them to determine what is required going forward. A knowledgeable and proven DOC would only enhance the team. I have no doubt that Ole would be competitive against a Klop, Guardiola or Pocchetino - provided management is prepared to make improvements to the squad.
In an absolute Manchester Utd dreamworld finishing top four, winning FA Cup and reaching CL Final would be the ultimate achievement for 18/19.
Unfortunately, when you go through our squad there just isn't enough quality to make it happen. One out of three wouldn't be bad.
This could be Ole's undoing.
I'm undecided.
The fact is . It's been 4 games and it's one thing coming in and telling the players and good they are and getting them to go and enjoy themselves. It's very much another when you need to build a top side and you need tell some home truths. Recruit players and shifting out the dead wood.
That said it's totally possible that OGS is exactly what we've crying out for and his style of play and connection to the fans will take us places.
The fact is . It's been 4 games and it's one thing coming in and telling the players and good they are and getting them to go and enjoy themselves. It's very much another when you need to build a top side and you need tell some home truths. Recruit players and shifting out the dead wood.
That said it's totally possible that OGS is exactly what we've crying out for and his style of play and connection to the fans will take us places.
And what did Ole do or not do that a top attack minded coach like Pep or Klopp would have done with our players?
I am just going to say what Eto'o shared: "When he arrived, I reminded Guardiola that he'd never been a great player. I told him in no uncertain terms that Eto'o was the one who would make him win".
Well guess what? Ole is a great striker, and is already sharing with our strikers how to score goals even better.
He's not going to leave his current post to become an assistant unless he gets fired at Molde. Even then he'd get a more lucrative offer from some team than being an assistant manager.
Kloop and Pep have an established world class philosophy. Ole has not shown this. The players are attacking more, passing forward and pressing but I would Not suggest it is advanced tactical play. Bobby Martinez could do this. There are levels to management and Ole is near the bottom of end
It's too early, it's how we do in the champions league and top sides for me and ultimately how we finish. It's a fantastic start and I'm loving Ole, just too soon. Think we need to wait before getting carried away. I'm not against the possibility but football fans are really reactionary, it's all over nothing for some. Same people that want him here, could change after one result. Let's evalute again at the end of February, think then we will get to see what Ole can do against bigger sides.
Ah ok, Martinez could have made the players suddenly do off ball running, and the various tactical changes? I rate Ole because he has already worked with a low budget team and made them win something so he can do it at United. Furthermore, he has played with Rashford, Pogba and Lingard and seems to be able to work with Martial and others.
I have no problem admitting Ole may not be the greatest tactical manager ever but SAF was not the greatest tactical manager too. What made us win was the mental strength and the man management skill he had.
We will see how he manages this team but I would not be surprised if we beat Pep and Klopp teams because we are more unpredictable.
If you wanted predictability, we should have stayed with LVG. Don't laugh, he was able to tell all the players they needed to control before shooting and every attacking pattern had to be trained... remind you of someone? Yes, it's Pep style. Did it work for us?
I am absolutely not denying that we need a better tactical understanding. It's something that has always made our life hard on the European scene, but nevertheless, I don't think Ole is that bad compared to Pep or Klopp.
Just a feeling on this one.
A bloke that's one three fifths of feck all saves for two titles in a two horse race league and one German Cup? I wouldnt call it world class until he wins substantial trophies with it.
He beat Bayern Munich with a far lesser team and fractional investment. Also got to the CL final with Liverpool and Dortmund neither had any business there as there were far bigger teams. It's a world class coaching philosophy. What has Ole done again?
Im not calling Ole's approach world class either but DiMateo and Rijkaard (who actually won far more than Kloop) actually won the champions league and people hardly call their philosophies world class. He also had that same Dortmund side in a relegation position in February of his final year before he got the arse.
Getting close doesn't mean youre successful
It's going to depend on his record against the sides that finish in the top 6.
For me unfortunately top 4 itself isn't enough, don't get me wrong it'd be a fantastic achievement but we need something special to get back up to the top and compete with the teams ahead of us. For me the big issue is we have no idea how Solsjkaer deals with player recruitment, that's been a huge issue for us over the past few years and it's a strength of the top top managers like Pep and Klopp (and Mourinho pre-meltdowns).
It's a harsh situation for me because to really convince me it would require Ole getting results against the big teams and in the CL, i.e. showing something really special, which is a tough ask obviously against PSG and the teams in the big 6 given our team is weaker than a lot of those teams.
But at the same time who knows how the alternative in Poch would work out, so idk. I wouldn't envy Ed Woodward having to make that choice that's for sure.
It's a harsh situation for me because to really convince me it would require Ole getting results against the big teams and in the CL, i.e. showing something really special, which is a tough ask obviously against PSG and the teams in the big 6 given our team is weaker than a lot of those teams.
But at the same time who knows how the alternative in Poch would work out, so idk. I wouldn't envy Ed Woodward having to make that choice that's for sure.
I'm not sure about that. Chelsea absolutely collapsing over the next 3 games could give us 4th. I'd wait to see the team we look like we're becoming towards the fag end of the season before deciding.
We need to see how he does against teams with a similar quality to ourselves. This is where a manager earns his wage. Let’s see how he does against the top 6 and judge from there. Personally I thought he was tactically out thought by Rafa against Newcastle but they simply didn’t have the players to finish the chances. However time will tell.
He beat City in the CL with Liverpool to get them to the finals. They were heavy favorites against the rest of the opponents on route to final (of which he won half the matches).
They've also won half their matches this season and lost the other half. Sometimes in a cup competition that's good enough but most of the times it isn't.
As for Ole..there's a gap in the Tippeligaen where Rosenborg didn't win. That's what Ole has done.
I don't think it's a good idea to codify exactly what we need to do in the league for Ole to get the job because our league position at this stage will be determined be a myriad of factors from different teams. Not just us.
If we win every single game and the top two lose/draw 6 or 7 more, it’s possible we can win the title. It’s highly unlikely , but a man can dream right?
I'm not talking of what they have won non league sides.
As a manager many years ago I won the pub league five years on the bounce does that make me a candidate for the richest/ best club in the world? Hardly not.Ole isnt proven tactically so young into his management career. He needs time at other clubs just the way plenty of our ex players have tried and yet to achieve. Fans getting carried away with a exception start at United.
Please let's not forget the teams he's beaten so far. Newcastle, Bournemouth, Huddersfield, Cardiff. It's not exactly got my pulse buzzing with excitement. Come back when we can beat Barcelona, Real Madrid, Juv, City, Liverpool etc etc. Then I might start to believe Ole the right man.
For the time being will enjoy are new attacking formation under Ole and thank him for lifting the team spirit back into the players and fans. The bigger picture is all to come.
I would say only if Phelan is part of the deal as well. I love OLE(hes my favorite United player after Cantona) but Phelan has had a lot to do with this turn around as well(at least on the football side, not sure on the player attitude side but probably a bit of influence there and absolutely none on the outlook from the press/fans/etc as i hardly see his name mentioned)
Irrational you say?? If that's the case same applies with your comments with Zidane. He went to a team (Madrid) full of world class players, think I could of done that too. He didn't build a team, it was put on a silver spoon for him.
For his 3 CL didn't get him very far did it? The goals are always winning your respective leagues not cup competitions. Yes the CL is the Ultimate in Cup competitions but my first choice is nearly always the Premier League because it's about consistency over a longer period of time.
I for one would be gutted if Zidane was first choice over Poch.
Ah, so you could have won 3 CL titles too. Gotcha.
I’m sorry I called you irrational. You’re not. You’re a lunatic.
Two games you mentioned in a decade for his management roll, one very recent one. Did the greatest manager who ever lived get it right all the time??.
Poch turned his season round when near impossible to qualify for CL with a great draw against the mighty Barcelona. You have to remember with a limited budget at Spurs the job he's done there is quite remarkable. Defensively he's definitely more appt than Ole. Given the funds ( which he will ) he's the only manager possibly available to get us back where we belong.
Of course he should
Don't get fooled by that baby face and sweet smile. He is as sharp as a striker he was. 5 months is good period to judge. Even if we don't finish top 4 or win any cup still if we show excellent progress as a unit with entertaining football then united should keep him as manager.
Undecided. Poch’s availability will be a key factor.
This is a good post. He may look/act as a cheerleader but IMHO there is a very strong personality in there. I like watching him on the bench when geta serious from time to time. I can tell that he gets pissed at times. I like his commnet on Jones post-Newcastle. Ole said something like "it was a great recovery tackle but Phil should have never allowed it to happen". Clear message/warning but wrapped in a very digestable form.
I want him to stay but if the results are not good enough then im sure Ole will admit that himself.
I vote yes. He wants to stay as well. If he doesn't get the job, he should be given a full time role a OT for sure.
Don't matter if we lose against top sides away because it is not easy as it seems but If Ole can beat top sides at Old Trafford then I'd be okay with it as long as we can mainstream title-winning form into next season assuming he wins 2.50+ points per game for rest of the season and play nice football.
He brought good spirit and gave players freedom to play plus he wants from his team to play football. So far he is excellent.
But it is way to early to say anything. I personally think that many managers would have this kind of results because players were happy that Jose left and in this moment they are flying but lets see what will happen after couple of months. Jose started like this also. Everything was perfect. Also lets see how he will perform in big matches. We must not feck up this time with manager.
My first pick is Poch. But if Ole keeps doing this good and Poch is not available then why not? Give him 3 year contract and try with him.
But it is way to early to say anything. I personally think that many managers would have this kind of results because players were happy that Jose left and in this moment they are flying but lets see what will happen after couple of months. Jose started like this also. Everything was perfect. Also lets see how he will perform in big matches. We must not feck up this time with manager.
My first pick is Poch. But if Ole keeps doing this good and Poch is not available then why not? Give him 3 year contract and try with him.
There should be another option in the poll.
"Spurs will beat us on the 13th and then this poll will be pointless"
:-p
"Spurs will beat us on the 13th and then this poll will be pointless"
:-p
If he gets top four give it to him. It means he got United playing to a title challenging form from December with no or little preparation at all. And that's also show that Ole can get the best out of what he's given, which is crucial if United are going to go to the DoF route. And DoF means Ole is not going to be bothered by recruiting players much.
If Ole is smart (and everything I've heard of him points to that he is) he'll know that Ferguson biggest strength is his ability to delegate and man management. He already done those two to great effect right now. I think all the doubters in this thread will be pleasantly surprised by Ole by the end of the season
If Ole is smart (and everything I've heard of him points to that he is) he'll know that Ferguson biggest strength is his ability to delegate and man management. He already done those two to great effect right now. I think all the doubters in this thread will be pleasantly surprised by Ole by the end of the season
"IF we finish 4th, should Ole get the full time job" That's the Question being asked in here, yet I am seeing replies such as "Too early to tell", "Need to see how he does against bigger teams", "I'm undecided". Do people not read before posting?
You'd expect Liverpool to normally be heavy favourites against Porto, but a very good Roma side who just beat Barcelona? A big part of why Liverpool were favourites is that Klopp has made them into a very, very good side.
Pep's philosophy in Barca was built by Dutch managers before him, he just made the players working harder and harder to get the ball.
Klopp's philosophy is something new in football, but don't forget he took years to find the formula. He also once failed when most of the team finally found the 'cure' of his tactics.
I agree they are top managers in the world, but Ole is not far from them like you said. Pep was winning the league with youth team, Ole did it too. Klopp was winning the league and beating the most dominant team in his country, Ole did it too. Just put Pep or Klopp in Cardiff, I would be amazed if they saved them from relegation. People forget that poor Cardiff was bottom of the league before Ole took over, and they had terrible owner even worst than Newcastle's.
If Ole take us to the top 4, He would be the most wanted manager in the summer, even Arsenal and Chelsea would love to sign him and sack their current manager.
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