Is Jose Mourinho still our best manager post Fergie?

[Resch]

Was Mou the best at keeping the players happy? Hell no!
Was Mou the best at building a team with future? Hell no!
Was Mou the best at playing attractive football? Hell no!

But he was still the best manager at winning. He knew how to win. Ole just do not know this, he can buy players, he can be Prince Charming, but as a manager he is no winner. LVG was more of a winner.

 

[Sylar]

Are we giving Ole now credit for u21 team results ?

Not the results but the articles on how the acemedy was neglected under previous managers but a bit more emphasis on producing since Ole took over

Again, this I can't verify as I dont work at the club but that's been said how Ole has done a lot of work behind the scenes
I won't make excuses for him but I think there's a lot of disrespect to him. He probably isn't good enough to take us to the next level but he's taken us to a level where fans now expect us to compete for all major trophies

 

[The Firestarter]

Are we giving Ole now credit for u21 team results ?

That's what happens when you run out of tangible achievements to state. People smiling around OT is also mentioned .

 

[tentan]

1. Jose Mourinho - Europa League and League Cup
2. Louis Van Gaal - FA Cup
3. David Moyes - Community Shield

4. Ole Gunnar Solskjaer - 0 Trophies

 

[Womp]

Yes. He won the most amount of trophies, everything else is irrelevant. He had a lesser squad than Ole, had less time, spent less money and you could argue was competing against a more dominant City side and won silverware, whilst finishing on more points than Ole is even yet to accumulate.

Also won the trophy that Ole bottled.

Ole is a more likeable bloke and has built a team for the future better though, I'd say

 

[frostbite]

Definitely.

Do you think that Spurs or Roma will ever consider hiring Ole?

 

[Acheron]

Mourinho can win the EL and it's all its a Mickey Mouse Cup we should be in the CL. Ole can lose the EL Final and he's just one penalty kick away from his first trophy!

Mourinho can win 3 Semi-Finals out of 3, standard we're Manchester United. Ole can lose 4 in a row and he's just unlucky.

Mourinho can finish 2nd on 80+ points for the first time in 4 years and he gets stick for not winning it with the amount he's spent. Ole can finish 2nd on 74 points spending more than Mourinho, playing in front of empty stadiums, and he's brought United back from despair.

Oh yeah and Ole can keep using Mourinho's midfield for 3 years and get credit for his amazing transfer business.

The football we're seeing right now is also as dire as anything under Mourinho.

People really dislike Mourinho in here.

 

[beer&grill]

Yes. He won the most amount of trophies, everything else is irrelevant. He had a lesser squad than Ole, had less time, spent less money and you could argue was competing against a more dominant City side and won silverware, whilst finishing on more points than Ole is even yet to accumulate.

Also won the trophy that Ole bottled.

Ole is a more likeable bloke and has built a team for the future better though, I'd say

Too bad the vibes were bad so that’s enough for me to rate Ole higher. How did he dare to call out Pogba and Martial who are tearing it up now under Ole?

 

[Sviken]

Absolutely. Shame that he imploded. I do believe he would have won the title last season if he had Ole's team.

 

[EatableTea]

If we’re going with success then yes obviously he is, some people really think it’s ole because everyone smiles in training though.

 

[DRJosh]

Not the results but the articles on how the acemedy was neglected under previous managers but a bit more emphasis on producing since Ole took over

Again, this I can't verify as I dont work at the club but that's been said how Ole has done a lot of work behind the scenes
I won't make excuses for him but I think there's a lot of disrespect to him. He probably isn't good enough to take us to the next level but he's taken us to a level where fans now expect us to compete for all major trophies

Agreed although a club like United shouldn’t have one manager to do the ground work and another to win trophies. Ideally the process would be continuous under the helm of a single manager. It ensures continuity and resilience amongst the players.

Ole was the wrong appointment from the start.

 

[steffyr2]

Too bad the vibes were bad so that’s enough for me to rate Ole higher. How did he dare to call out Pogba and Martial who are tearing it up now under Ole?

Yeah, my main memory of Jose's time was posters who were so so so concerned about the feelings of poor Pogba and poor Martial, who were both destined to become all-time greats.
I had some sympathy wrt Pogba, because he was obviously phenomenally talented and also obviously the player the media loved to hate. Martial? Wasn't he the player who wanted to take a few weeks of paternity leave at the start of a season when all the other players were injured?
Anyway, those were the days. We wanted a nice manager. We have a nice manager.

 

[ExoduS]

Well it's not like Jose had any competition. Moyes has not proved himself as elite manager, LvG was on a steep decline and got totally unlucky with Di Maria, Falcao and Depay. Got us Shaw and Martial who we still have. We should have kept Herrera as I think he would be much better midfield than most we have right now. Ole just doesn't have it. It was a leap of faith. I totally don't mind that we have tried it. It made sense as two proven managers did not bring us anything special.
My fear is that we are keeping Ole far too long and thus we will erase everything well Ole has done and we might hate him. We will forget what a prolific striker he was for us and remember what a sh1t manager he was. I don't want that. Ole brought us so many memorable late goals. He was a super sub, baby assassin. I don't want to remember him as a sh1t manager.

 

[ExoduS]

Yeah, my main memory of Jose's time was posters who were so so so concerned about the feelings of poor Pogba and poor Martial, who were both destined to become all-time greats.
I had some sympathy wrt Pogba, because he was obviously phenomenally talented and also obviously the player the media loved to hate. Martial? Wasn't he the player who wanted to take a few weeks of paternity leave at the start of a season when all the other players were injured?
Anyway, those were the days. We wanted a nice manager. We have a nice manager.

If Jose succeeded at Spurs your post would make some sense. Yeah, Ole isn't working but keeping Jose was not an option. We actually kept him far too long, sorta long as we are doing right now with Ole. Yeah, I am against sacking managers quickly but what was happening under Jose and now under Ole is abysmal. It's not under-archiving, it's being absolutely ridiculously pathetic out there.

 

[Roane]

Ole is a more likeable bloke and has built a team for the future better though, I'd say

Not convinced personally.

Ole is a legend and things get overlooked. His personality currently is one of cluelessness. There has been criticism of his pre and post match interviews. Also his personality pitch side, the most recent being smiling at Everton.

The future of the team was something which looked viable initially. But not so sure now. Signing young players initially who don't get played, likes of matic, Mata, Ronaldo and Cavani who are the wrong side for the future. Likes of Pogba and Lingard not signing new contracts. Meaning big money needs spending and a rebuild needed despite big money being spent.

The longer this goes on the worse it's getting, any positives Ole bought with him, and there are/were positives, are/will lessen it seems.

 

[Eli Zee]

Which had the better win to loss ratio? Points per game?

 

[Siezard]

In terms of results, Mourinho us best

In terms of team assembling, ole.

Which had the better win to loss ratio? Points per game?

Ole had the best points per game.

 

[Godfather]

In terms of results, Mourinho us best

In terms of team assembling, ole.


Ole had the best points per game.

Mourinho's on 1.89. Ole on 1.84. Mou's ppg is better.

 

[Josep Dowling]

Mourinho saying something that makes him look better in retrospective? Yeah, that never happened. The sources for this is Daily Mail & Metro by the way:

Jose Mourinho 'never wanted Fred' at Manchester United and only accepted the £52m midfielder out of fear the club would not sign anyone else.

The original interview came from the Athletic.

 

[roonster09]

Mourinho saying something that makes him look better in retrospective? Yeah, that never happened. The sources for this is Daily Mail & Metro by the way:

Jose Mourinho 'never wanted Fred' at Manchester United and only accepted the £52m midfielder out of fear the club would not sign anyone else.

He also said "Team without a Brazilian isn't a team at all" before signing Fred.

Wish we had Jose, we would have had players like Toby, Rose, Dier, Willian, Perisic.

 

[Stacks]

Yes but I didn't like it and glad he is gone. The Sevilla shit pissed me off. It is sad that he performed the best and shows we make shite choices. We are still yet to win something or break the 80pt barrier since. Jose tried to destroy our squad but he had the best results.

 

[afatzp]

People tends to have short-term memory and forget about how terrible our games under Jose were. Would be interested to see those threads back then in his 3rd year.

Ole of course is no world class manager at all, but at least he gave some good games in last two years. Under Jose , I would like to forget everything but the results.

 

[Shark]

He also said "Team without a Brazilian isn't a team at all" before signing Fred.

Wish we had Jose, we would have had players like Toby, Rose, Dier, Willian, Perisic.

Somehow having them and playing shit on a stick football still sounds better than watching Sancho, Greenwood, Bruno, Pogba and Ronaldo playing together producing terrible football.

 

[Foxbatt]

People tends to have short-term memory and forget about how terrible our games under Jose were. Would be interested to see those threads back then in his 3rd year.

Ole of course is no world class manager at all, but at least he gave some good games in last two years. Under Jose , I would like to forget everything but the results.

We had some good games under Jose of course. The EL Final was a Jose master class. Ajax never had a prayer. No Zlatan for us as well.

 

[frostbite]

Of course he is!

From Ole's press conference today vs Atalanta:

Ole:

"We've progressed over the years. Sixth when I was here for half a season, then third, second, you can see the progress, the development, the improvement.

Even by Ole's standards, progress is the table position. Mourinho was 2nd with 81 points, that's the most we got post-Fergie. And he won two trophies, again more that anyone else.

There is no question that Mourinho is still our best manager post-Fergie.

 

[roonster09]

Somehow having them and playing shit on a stick football still sounds better than having Sancho, Greenwood, Bruno, Pogba and Ronaldo playing together producing terrible football.

Not really. Good manager will get lot from that attackers. We have good team, with the players Jose wanted, we would have had shit team. IMO new manager will have much easier task as we have very good team.

 

[Flytan]

He also said "Team without a Brazilian isn't a team at all" before signing Fred.

Wish we had Jose, we would have had players like Toby, Rose, Dier, Willian, Perisic.

I mean is it any better than saying DVB can play midfield and then never giving him a shot at it? At least we didn't waste the money on Mourinho's supposed targets.

Jose deserved to be fired and made the club toxic. But his years here were far better than Ole and there were some "tactical masterclass" moments with him that we haven't seen under Ole. It's clear he was a better manager than ole by anyone with a brain. Jose was trending downwards since he was fired from Madrid but even in his downward-self-alienating-spiral he was able to give us a few trophies. Ole gives us vibes and a happy squad. Personally would rather see a squad with a little edge.

Ole's "good football" is attributed to us having little to no identity so the games look better on the eyes. If that's all you care about, then sure his football is better than Mourinho I guess. LVG's last year here was the most boring of anything but at least he left us with a FA Cup.

With Ole, the transfers have been largely okay, but that's expected when you pay 80M for a defender. You shouldn't get a dud. If he was fired now before he continues to do lasting damage to players like Sancho, Rashford, Maguire, DVB etc. then I would go: Mourinho ---> (massive gap) Ole --> (small gap) LVG ------------> (universe sized gap) Moyes (Moyes is a better manager than Ole but not at United and Moyes undid so much of the success United had in his year here that it set the club back years, at least Ole is passive enough that pretty much all his damage can be fixed by quickly ridding of him and the coaching staff).

If Ole stays the rest of this season or god forbid longer, he will inch closer to doing the same damage Moyes has done.

 

[roonster09]

I mean is it any better than saying DVB can play midfield and then never giving him a shot at it? At least we didn't waste the money on Mourinho's supposed targets.

Yeah, we only wasted money on his actual targets/signings.

Rest of the post I have no idea why you even posted it. If you somehow came up with "Posting against Jose means supporting Ole" then you couldn't be more wrong.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Not really. Good manager will get lot from that attackers. We have good team, with the players Jose wanted, we would have had shit team. IMO new manager will have much easier task as we have very good team.

We don't have a good team, we have a talented group of players that struggle to play together. Jose built a better team regardless of how people rate those players individually.

 

[roonster09]

We don't have a good team, we have a talented group of players that struggle to play together. Jose built a better team regardless of how people rate those players individually.

I disagree with the first part.

People just don't give importance to how important proper set up is.

 

[Flytan]

Yeah, we only wasted money on his actual targets/signings.

Rest of the post I have no idea why you even posted it. If you somehow came up with "Posting against Jose means supporting Ole" then you couldn't be more wrong.

You mean the same players Ole has either bought/been linked to (Maguire) or given new contracts to for no reason (Bailly)? He imploded because we refused to spend money on his targets (even though we bought a CB the next year anyways).

I posted the rest because this is a topic discussing whether or not Mourinho was our best manager post Fergie, it's literally the discussion.

 

[Tomuś]

Van Gaal was as bad as Ole but at least his pressers were fun at times.

 

[roonster09]

You mean the same players Ole has either bought/been linked to (Maguire) or given new contracts to for no reason (Bailly)? He imploded because we refused to spend money on his targets (even though we bought a CB the next year anyways).

I posted the rest because this is a topic discussing whether or not Mourinho was our best manager post Fergie, it's literally the discussion.

Its not relevant to my post. How Jose did in his first season has nothing to do with my post. It was about the transfer targets and whether Fred was his signing.

He imploded because he was a twat, a toxic one too. We spent shit loads of money on his signings, Van Gaal signings, Ole signings. No ManUtd manager should moan about spending. We spent under every manager.

Jose wanted Boateng, Godin and both rejected him. Maguire himself said he refused move that year as Leicester owner asked for one more year. It's not club's problem it players actively avoided the club because of toxic atmosphere at the club or for other reasons. Glad none of those players were signed. Would have been hilarious though, watching Willian, Perisic, Toby, Dier, Rose play for us and then ManUtd fans moaning about spending.

 

[FriedClams]

This may be a case of the end results not telling the full story. As football fans, I believe the experience to be better when your team plays attractive football that keeps you on the edge of your seat. The pragmatic approach might win some games, but the older you get, you realize there are more important things than your club winning trophies. So far, I have enjoyed watching Oles team pound for pound more than I enjoyed watching us under Mourinho. Would Mourinho do even better with the current group of players? Maybe. Would he maybe have won the Europa league again last season for us? Maybe. But there is no question that he would have played a more defensive brand of football to get us there and you only get to revel in the result, rather than all 90 minutes of an exciting game.

As a more "mature" fan, I think if you gave me the choice of dire football that wins trophies, versus exciting football every week but not winning a thing, I'd probably choose the latter. Bragging rights don't last forever, but the knowledge that every game you're going to enjoy yourself, that's worth a lot to me and that could never be the case with Mourinho.

 

[Flytan]

Its not relevant to my post. How Jose did in his first season has nothing to do with my post. It was about the transfer targets and whether Fred was his signing.

He imploded because he was a twat, a toxic one too. We spent shit loads of money on his signings, Van Gaal signings, Ole signings. No ManUtd manager should moan about spending. We spent under every manager.

Jose wanted Boateng, Godin and both rejected him. Maguire himself said he refused move that year as Leicester owner asked for one more year. It's not club's problem it players actively avoided the club because of toxic atmosphere at the club or for other reasons. Glad none of those players were signed. Would have been hilarious though, watching Willian, Perisic, Toby, Dier, Rose play for us and then ManUtd fans moaning about spending.

My whole post wasn't a reply to yours, just the first sentence. Didn't realize I'd have to separate it without someone getting on my ass, next time I will.

Would take those players signing for us if we won something at least. Better than our current situation of just throwing unlimited funds towards a glorified motivational speaker.

 

[Andycoleno9]

This may be a case of the end results not telling the full story. As football fans, I believe the experience to be better when your team plays attractive football that keeps you on the edge of your seat. The pragmatic approach might win some games, but the older you get, you realize there are more important things than your club winning trophies. So far, I have enjoyed watching Oles team pound for pound more than I enjoyed watching us under Mourinho. Would Mourinho do even better with the current group of players? Maybe. Would he maybe have won the Europa league again last season for us? Maybe. But there is no question that he would have played a more defensive brand of football to get us there and you only get to revel in the result, rather than all 90 minutes of an exciting game.

As a more "mature" fan, I think if you gave me the choice of dire football that wins trophies, versus exciting football every week but not winning a thing, I'd probably choose the latter. Bragging rights don't last forever, but the knowledge that every game you're going to enjoy yourself, that's worth a lot to me and that could never be the case with Mourinho.

Again that myth about our our attacking football under Ole. Ole is more defensive than Jose ffs. His approach is typical small club mentality. Jose was defensive in big games but in other games he was not. Ole plays deep against nearly every club.

 

[roonster09]

My whole post wasn't a reply to yours, just the first sentence. Didn't realize I'd have to separate it without someone getting on my ass, next time I will.

Would take those players signing for us if we won something at least. Better than our current situation of just throwing unlimited funds towards a glorified motivational speaker.

So you think Fred wasn't his signing?

Any player who plays well is a Jose signing, any player who plays well and we never signed were legit targets. Any player who doesn't play well is obviously wasn't his signing. But when the said player plays well now and then, the tune is changed to "Jose's gift to this club"

Glad the toxic cnut was sacked and none of those players were signed.

 

[roonster09]

Again that myth about our our attacking football under Ole. Ole is more defensive than Jose ffs. His approach is typical small club mentality. Jose was defensive in big games but in other games he was not. Ole plays deep against nearly every club.

Do you want to watch the game vs Middlesbrough? 30+ possession vs relegation team, also we used to play so defensive that even West Ham fullback felt bad for our wingers.

 

[Buster15]

Of course he is!

From Ole's press conference today vs Atalanta:



Even by Ole's standards, progress is the table position. Mourinho was 2nd with 81 points, that's the most we got post-Fergie. And he won two trophies, again more that anyone else.

There is no question that Mourinho is still our best manager post-Fergie.

What you say is factually correct, even though many on here hate to admit that. I would definitely agree that Mourinho was our most successful manager since Sir Alex. But probably not our best. In the end, things were getting out of hand.

 

[Red Shorts]

As he stated, his greatest achievement was getting that United team 2nd. Looking back at what he had, there were a lot of bloody gaps in that squad, yet he managed to grind out that finish.

Also knew how to win trophies and get Europa & Carabao, something Ole got close to with much more at his disposal but not enough to cross the line.