Is our squad average? Yes.

P4rthen0n said:
I really hope not. He's having a great season at Benfica.
He has improved a lot since coming to us last season. He would be a steal for 20M€ (it's his supposed buy back clause).

However, you tell me what you would prefer:
1) spending big on someone who's already at the top level (think Nuno Mendes from PSG who is only 22);
2) gamble 20M€ on someone with great potential and who's still improving but you don't know if he'll become world class.
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It was smart business by United to put the buy back clause in. It gives us a great option in the summer.

I guess the answer depends on money and what we need to prioritise really.
 
Above average individually (that means better than at least 50% players in PL) but below average as a group.
 
Remember the geese said:
I was thinking of White in particular. I assume when everyone is fit Calafiori, Saliba, Gabriel and Timber all start. Partey too to a lesser extent. Does he start over Jorginho or Merino? Maybe. Maybe not.
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This season he has been. Though partey is 31, I'm sure they will phase him out at some point.
 
I’d say it’s a mess as much as it is average

Talented but raw - Amad, Hojlund, Mainoo, Garnacho

Past it/checked out - Eriksen, Casemiro, Rashford

Erratic - Bruno, Dalot, Maguire

Injury prone - Mount, Shaw, Maz (although touch wood he has been fine so far…)

Jury still out - Zirkzee, Ugartee, De Ligt, Yoro (possibly one for the “raw” section given his age)

Not good enough - Antony, would have have Zirkzee in here but his performance yesterday gave me hope, never rated Malacia here before his injury. Bayindir doesn’t look too clever either so we’re massively reliant on Onana staying fit.

Onana and Martinez could go in erratic but the former has been great this season

With the right system I think those “erratics” become solid players.
 
Quite average for me. Especially in advanced areas and midfield. Far too many inconsistent performances and individualism on show. Although there are tentative signs players are now looking up for better alternatives when facing the goal.
 
It's amazing that Amorim transformed them to an extraordinary team last night. Can beat Man City again.
 
It's average if you froze time and just looked at it today but we're clearly looking to build towards something, not just spend big to bring in big names nowadays.

The age of the core players is very good - it's probably the best squad in terms of promise that we've had post Fergie, even if right now it's arguably the worst.
 
Captmfla said:
It's amazing that Amorim transformed them to an extraordinary team last night. Can beat Man City again.
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Let's not go overboard. Until we scored we were a bit out of control and we've outscored our chances by quite some margin. Unless anybody believes Amorim has improved our finishing in 3 weeks time (he has not, it's just how the "luck" factor plays out), we have a long way to go. The positive signs are there but the expectations need to be set for a "transition" season (with a lot of experimenting and failures on the way) rather than "we are back" kind of mentality.
 
Borys said:
Let's not go overboard. Until we scored we were a bit out of control and we've outscored our chances by quite some margin. Unless anybody believes Amorim has improved our finishing in 3 weeks time (he has not, it's just how the "luck" factor plays out), we have a long way to go. The positive signs are there but the expectations need to be set for a "transition" season (with a lot of experimenting and failures on the way) rather than "we are back" kind of mentality.
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Its not that he has improved the finishing... we just create more chances, the higher volume of chances you create, more likelyhood of scoring.

Apart from the Ipswich game, we have created alot more than we did under Ten Hag.

We have scored 5 tap ins under Amorim, which is easier to finish than 1 chance every 60 mins under Ten Hag.
 
No this isn't an average team and nor is it a team that can compete with the top teams in the world. You can have a bunch of good players with a smattering of world class talent ie. Liverpool, but currently we don't have a Salah in the team. With 2-3 excellent additions and if Amorim can truly work his magic on the existing players then we could be in that position in a year or two.

Somewhat unsurprisingly, a bunch of happy players who are winning and seeing improvements in their work are looking miles better than the slugs we had under the last manager.
 
romufc said:
Its not that he has improved the finishing... we just create more chances, the higher volume of chances you create, more likelyhood of scoring.

Apart from the Ipswich game, we have created alot more than we did under Ten Hag.

We have scored 5 tap ins under Amorim, which is easier to finish than 1 chance every 60 mins under Ten Hag.
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This isn't exactly true, against everton we accumulated xG of 1,2 and that is 12th best this season. The biggest difference is we put the chances away and are a lot calmer on the ball (in possession). It doesn't take away any praise from Amorim, we never had so much possession under previous managers and that is definitely his impact. Finishing is not. However, the general "calmness" of the team has gone 2 levels up I agree.
 
Aside from Amad, our attack is below average. It's disgusting how much we've spent, both on fees and wages, to end up with trash like Hojlund, Zirkzee, Rashford and Antony. Garnacho is pretty mediocre too if we're being perfectly honest. Although I'd keep him. The others mentioned should be sold at the first opportunity.
 
Its bang average in the key attribute of scoring goals and winning matches.
 
Our attack is championship level that brings our squad down to below average
 
The attack is genuinely midtable level, albeit lots of young players. We are desperate for some quality up there. Even Lukaku or Juan Mata level would make a massive difference. We’ve currently got a bunch of donkeys.
 
Hojlund is awful and so is Rashford. Zirkzee won’t make it because he is just not good enough, although he has better technical ability than the latter.

Dalot is another that needs to go.

In the past few years there has been more misses than hits in the transfer market.
 
Also Bruno is an average player to be brutally honest. A player who rarely shines in big matches. A one trick pony. If we really want to challenge at the very top then we don't need players like Bruno.
 
We have a pretty ordinary collection of players, wholesale changes are going to be required so it’s a lot of time and money to sort out unfortunately. The
 
I think the goalkeeper, our defenders and our midfielders, in the main, are largely above average.

Our attack, on the other hand, is dire.

Our senior attackers are-.

Mount - always injured
Bruno - good in patches but slow and not a ball carrier
Anthony - more of a ball-retainer / defensive winger
Rashford - appalling

Which are complemented by the likes of Garnacho, Zirkzee, Hojlund and Diallo who are all young and / or learning about the PL.

I'd be seriously thinking about the direction we go in the Summer with some of these young players. With whom do we stick, and with whom do we twist?

I'd actively be looking to take money for any of the senior lads, not because they're all bad or useless, but they don't work at the elite level for one reason or another.

Then its decision time...which of the younger lads is it worth persevering with? If the right offer came in for Garnacho, Hojlund or Amad, for example...could we be tempted?

Look at Liverpool, solid defence, hard working midfield, one superstar attacker. We don't have that. In fact, we don't even have a consistently "good" attacker. We need an overhaul desperately.
 
Absolutely, only players I can see here in 2 or 3 seasons if we’re being successful are Onana (50/50), Dalot (50/50), Maz, Kobbie, Amad, Martinez, Ugarte, and Yoro (given his potential). The list is not long is it? We have a lot to thank to Ole, Ten Hag, and management for such a state of affairs.
 
The strength of any squad is the amount of impact it can get off the bench in matches.

Today at home to Forest, the five subs brought on made zero impact and changes made actually allowed Forest close out the win without much scares.
 
I don’t think many of our players are significantly better than their counterparts at likes of Brighton, Villa, Newcastle and the general standard of mid table. I don’t think anyone is in the top 3 in their position, not consistently.

It’s also a very slow group of players, lacking physicality and technical ability and the squad has to be gutted and rebuilt.
 
If you could start over, which of these players would you consider picking for a squad that could secure top four consistently and build towards a title challenge?

I'd go for Yoro, De Ligt, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, and Diallo. That's six players out of a squad of +25.
 
When you look at this squad you realise how bad recruitment was under John Murtough. This is going to take seasons to fix.

I can’t help but wonder how bad it would have been if the old regime was allowed to continue
 
Mike Smalling said:
If you could start over, which of these players would you consider picking for a squad that could secure top four consistently and build towards a title challenge?

I'd go for Yoro, De Ligt, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, and Diallo. That's six players out of a squad of +25.
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I’d swap De Ligt for Garnacho. I know he can be frustrating but there’s a player there. Personally, I don’t rate De Ligt. We need a whole new squad almost!
 
The league table doesn’t lie. They are an average group of players added with a lack of effort.

Players don’t do the basics. Misplacing passes in dangerous areas, losing 50/50 duals. The last 10 minutes of the game we are losing and there is no urgency to move the ball forward. Did we even test the keeper in stoppage time? The obsession with playing the ball between the CBs is painful. Martinez to De Ligt to Yoro, back to Onana. That happened all the first half whilst I can see several players available in midfield. This got worse in second half when Maguire came on as he loves to stand with the ball at his foot. Move the ball forward!

Even at the end Onana makes a ridiculous decision to throw the ball 10 yards forward for a freekick. That then wastes another 30 seconds to get us back into the game.

They are the most frustrating group of players I’ve ever watched in a United shirt. Can’t wait to see a bunch of them gone.
 
We’ve never had such a poor attack. Not a single top player anywhere to be seen. Some slight talent in the younger ones but no footballing brain. We need to go into the market in January and pray our new gaffer has an eye for talent. Seemed to at Sporting.
 
Roboc7 said:
I don’t think many of our players are significantly better than their counterparts at likes of Brighton, Villa, Newcastle and the general standard of mid table. I don’t think anyone is in the top 3 in their position, not consistently.

It’s also a very slow group of players, lacking physicality and technical ability and the squad has to be gutted and rebuilt.
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Still a lot of fans think we are good enough for top 4. Unbelievable, are they even watching the games?
 
Offside said:
We’ve never had such a poor attack. Not a single top player anywhere to be seen. Some slight talent in the younger ones but no footballing brain. We need to go into the market in January and pray our new gaffer has an eye for talent. Seemed to at Sporting.
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ETH wasted all our money.
 
Only Ugarte, Amad and Mazraoui have looked good under the new system. There's no player I wouldn't sell at this time, that includes Garnacho and Mainoo.

We look such a poor team lacking quality in so many areas, how on earth we end up with such a poor squad after spending so much? Hundreds of millions in useless players. We look like we need 6-7 new starting quality players at the moment.

I trust Amorim and his system, if given the proper quality he'll lead us to success. I dont trust the players though, I don't think he can coach many of them to the level required. So many basic mistakes, weak mentality and prone to stupid errors that wont be fixed with coaching. At this level the players shouldnt be commiting those.

Players that fit the system:

Ugarte
Mazraoui
Amad

Players that I think might fit the system with coaching:

Onana
Yoro
De Ligt
Dalot
Garnacho
Mainoo
Hojlund

Players that I dont think can be coached to be good enough:

Licha
Bruno
Maguire
Malacia
Zirkzee

Hopeless players that need to be sold or released:

Rashford
Mount
Casemiro
Eriksen
Shaw
Antony
Lindelof

I think were going to need a serious rebuild, being extremely precise with the signings. We need to have at least an 80% success ratio if we're to get out of this mess. I dont think 3-4 windows are going to cut it. Specially with our FFP restrictions, we have players that are going to be extremely hard to get rid of because of their wages, contract lenght and their poor performances.

I think its very possible we wont get anything from Rashford, Antony, Casemiro and Shaw. Maybe it'll cost us to get rid of them having to pay off part of their wages for them to move before their contract expires.

We're in a deep deep hole, hopefully the board has enough patience with Amorim as things will get ugly. It's 2 loses and our next games are Viktoria, City, Spurs all away then Bournemouth, Wolves, Newcastle, Liverpool, Arsenal thats a really though calendar. I can see us losing most of those games.
 
Whether Dan Ashworth and Amorim are ruthless enough to kick star players and players we should not rely out of the team like the way Arsenal kick out Obameyong/Ozil.

Rashford
Casemiro
Bruno
Dalot
Martinez
De Light
Shaw
Malacia
Maguire
Lindelof
Evans
Eriksen
Antony

Even young stars, I see each of them lack something that may or maynot be changed.

Garnacho/Hojlund are easy to loose ball, lack technical competency at highest level and lack aggressive fighting.
Mainoo is slow, can't control tempo and lack intensity, aggressive fighting.
Yoro is like Mainoo in term of lacking intensity and aggressive fighting.

That's almost whole team in my opinion.

All past managers already did their best to be able to achieve something from this average team.

Jose (Europa League, 2nd place in EPL)
Van Gaal (FA cup)
Ole (2nd place in EPL)
Ten hag (League cup, FA cup)
 
Players that would get into other teams starting XI:

Spurs: Bruno, Mainoo
Liverpool: may be Bruno
City: None
Arsenal: None
Chelsea: Mazraoui (only because Reece James is injury prone) and may be de Ligt.
 
Mike Smalling said:
If you could start over, which of these players would you consider picking for a squad that could secure top four consistently and build towards a title challenge?

I'd go for Yoro, De Ligt, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, and Diallo. That's six players out of a squad of +25.
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I partially agree but. First of all, Yoro played only a "few minutes" for us, came from the weak french league, he seems really confident on the pitch but judge him a bit too early i think. Secondly, De Ligt still has a question mark next to his name. He seems better than Lindelöf and Maguire but he also seems slow and hesitant in certain situations, no coincidence that he wasn't needed in either Munich or Turin and i can clearly see why. Ugarte is excellent in defense but clueless in offensive play. And i have to say i miss Bruno from the list. He is by far our best player, the only creative one in the squad. Sometimes pains me to see him fighting in this mediocre squad.
 
Our squad is definitely average

our front 4 (Amad, rashford, bruno, hojlund, zirkzee, garnacho, mount, antony) is a standard mid-table quality one
 
Yeah, I'd say its a sensible way of looking at it. We're not good enough to play badly and win, we're not good enough to expect to win every week.
 
Our squad probably isn't as good as it looks on paper. Certainly.we have a tendency of bringing in big names after they've declined or have developed regular injury problems. We've also spent big money on players the club presumed would be top players without any real basis for that assessment. Hojlund might conceivably pan out, Antony there's no chance.
 
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