@Rozay has absolutely owned this thread over the last few pages...
Better writing than most footy journos can manage.
Better writing than most footy journos can manage.
Is Pogba as good as gone?
- Thread starter Irrational.
- Start date
i was getting confused in this thread, thanks. its like his agent never said he wants to leave and everyone at the club knows his wishes, or his brother giving interviews about the same. instead its how hard done by he is and is too good for us, so we dont like him
What a post, take a bow lad, would feel self indulgent adding to this, I take my hat off to to you sir.
He’s 27 and spending his prime out the Champions League. Makes zero sense for him to stay. He actually does love our club but we are just not a good fit.
On the field he is the least of our problems. Wonderful player. Twice the player McTomminay will ever become on his day for example but our fans will never love him.
Maybe after Ronaldo left our club we struggle to trust any superstar now? He left for greener pastures which I doubt ever happened before? He’s a true United legend too and then you have some fans now saying he’s just a Real Madrid legend which is insane. He spent 6 years at our club and was the best player we’ve probs ever seen grace the field at Old Trafford.
Rooney also got similar treatment despite him scoring probably the most impressive collection of goals any player has ever managed at our club and the most too.
Pogba would have been a great in a top United side it’s just sad we haven’t been able to utilise him correctly on our down turn.
On the field he is the least of our problems. Wonderful player. Twice the player McTomminay will ever become on his day for example but our fans will never love him.
Maybe after Ronaldo left our club we struggle to trust any superstar now? He left for greener pastures which I doubt ever happened before? He’s a true United legend too and then you have some fans now saying he’s just a Real Madrid legend which is insane. He spent 6 years at our club and was the best player we’ve probs ever seen grace the field at Old Trafford.
Rooney also got similar treatment despite him scoring probably the most impressive collection of goals any player has ever managed at our club and the most too.
Pogba would have been a great in a top United side it’s just sad we haven’t been able to utilise him correctly on our down turn.
Good post apart from the bolded part.
Are we conveniently overlooking the way he engineered his way out of the club in 2012 when it was obvious to anybody that follows the junior sides that he was nowhere ready for the first-team, certainly not as a starter, and he had the cheek to blame his agent for it, saying that he really wanted to stay but there was nothing he could do - erm yeah Paul, tell your agent to do one for starters.
But he was ready to play at a higher level. He did with Juventus who had a way better midfield then ours (Pirlo, prime Vidal and Marchisio).
Don't take me wrong, clubs do mismanage players at times. I can list a horde of players other clubs mismanaged including Juventus itself (ex Thierry Henry and Fabrizio Ravanelli) who left Juventus way before their expiry date and proved to be excellent players elsewhere and better options to what Juventus had. However lets be honest here, Pogba was being mismanaged at United. Our CM was weak and yet Sir Alex preferred Cleverley and even Rafael in midfield then him. He had to leave and such decision proved to be the best decision he has taken so far.
The way pundits bash him because of it is beyond ridiculous. They should celebrate the courage shown by a young 18 year old kid to risk it all by moving to another country and making it there. We certainly praise the likes of Jadon Sancho who pretty much did the same thing Pogba did.
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Which has little to do with Pogba being bound to join Real Madrid, they were an option but they weren't the only option, it's only the french and spanish press who went with that certitude. His agent did his job and created the situation where Pogba went where he wanted to go in the better conditions possible.
Tom Cleverley was 22/23 and earned his place in the team after 3 successful loan spells and on performance, Pogba couldn't even get a game in central midfield for the reserves at the time so that was a no brainer, and Rafael played one match in midfield so no Pogba didn't have to leave, he'd had a few tasters in the first-team so should have stayed and proved he was good enough, not do a runner the first opportunity he got.
The guy who couldn't get in our reserves CM ended up in Juventus first team CM almost immediately. Give me a break
Its evident that Pogba was frozen out of the team the moment he refused to sign the contract on United's terms. The guy was mismanaged and we paid the price for it
Get the feeling a large amount of our fanbase doesn't actually want world class players who know they're world class players, because with that comes ego, and I notice a lot of people hate that confidence. They'd rather have your hard working gritty types like McTomminay.
He had two very experienced talented midfielders holding his hand which helped him at Juve, the near walking pace in comparison to the Premier League helped him as well, and as somebody who follows both Leagues closely I thought you may have picked up on that.
Sorry but how was he frozen out of the team, he wasn't even in it?
No one held his hand there. He started very well with them and he nearly pushed Marcisio out who was, at the time, the fan's favourite and a WC player. Pogba would later on become one of Juventus best players
The moment Pogba brought Raiola in, Sir Alex froze him out both at first team level and the reserves. Its a shame as we spent shit loads of money to bring him back
I think we want lauded World Class players to actually play like the the hype/price tag would suggest they would.
People don't dislike Pogba because he's confident...it's because he's been largely medocire for over 3 years despite frankly ludicrous claims he's been brilliant. McTominay succeeds, despite limited talent and has proven doubters wrong, despite being far less talented. Pogba? Meh.
I can only speak for myself but I don't even dislike Pogba - he's our most creative player but he's also massively overrated and nowhere near as good as people seem to think he is or has at least underperformed. And I don't blame him wholly...he's in a crap team and I can see why you'd be unmotivated but when supporters come in here and claim he's been great when I can clearly see that's not the case, that's what I protest...not Pogba but his cult army.
This is pretty ridiculous. You're making it sound like Pogba wasn't performing well in CM for the reserves. Pogba was moved out wide to accommodate Gibson, and that is when his performances dropped. Even so, the talent was clearly in his favor compared to his peers. And yes, I know how many youth watchers feel about Pogba at that point in time. I just feel that it's something that is often overlooked when discussing Pogba's final time with the reserves.
This is another crazy point. Yeah he had two midfielders holding his hand. He was starting over Marchisio, who was benched for Pogba. When he went to Juve all of us thought he was crazy for thinking he would win a starting spot when Juve had Vidal, Pirlo, and Marchisio. Pogba won Golden Boy award, then proceeded to boss the u20 world cup, winning the league as an integral part of Juve. This was before they started winning league after league.
I don't know why you're trying to downplay that. And besides, he was 19 years old. What's wrong with having players guide him through the season. That's what happened to all of our young players too, and when it doesn't happen, we moan that it should happen. Don't know why you're trying to spin this in a negative manner.
If I was Pogba I'd leave in the summer. The club cannot match his ambition anymore. Why spend your prime years here playing for 4th place?
Living in Spain I was obviously following closely what was happening with Pogba and Madrid and everything pointed to him being a Madrid player until Raiola started with his outrageous demands for Pogbas wages and his cut from the transfer.
https://en.as.com/en/2019/03/20/football/1553107037_287340.html
We probably will never know the truth so we make up our own. Being bombarded with the Spanish version makes me believe that side and watching Pogba since day one doesn't make me change my mind. For someone who had unfinished business I haven't really seen that attitude from him. He's been flirting with an exit for a long time now and quite frankly the sooner he goes the better, for all involved.
@Rozay Nice to see there's still some intelligent and reasonable posters on this forum. You've got it spot on.
If Pogba played for City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs - the press would love him and the league would rave about him.
Nobody ever talked this badly about him until he fell out with Mourinho and got labelled a Virus. Ever since then you've got a section of fans (I like to label them the Brexit boys) going for his neck.
Yes Pogba didn't help himself in the summer with the comments, but let's remember this was just after the last home game where he got picked on by that idiot in the crowd. He had a good season and while the team let us down, it wasn't down to him alone. Pogba is a proud guy and that clearly hurt him. Evra said similar comments too not long after.
No doubt at some point he thought "do I deserve to put up with this?" but since this season he's come back and tried really hard to turn that around. The home fans signing the one Paul Pogba song would have really helped.
It's a shame his injury is worse than we expected, but we don't know their situations, he could have been playing injured for a while.
Look at Kante, he's missed more games than Pogba yet nobody bats an eyelid because they've got 2 good others.
If Pogba played for City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs - the press would love him and the league would rave about him.
Nobody ever talked this badly about him until he fell out with Mourinho and got labelled a Virus. Ever since then you've got a section of fans (I like to label them the Brexit boys) going for his neck.
Yes Pogba didn't help himself in the summer with the comments, but let's remember this was just after the last home game where he got picked on by that idiot in the crowd. He had a good season and while the team let us down, it wasn't down to him alone. Pogba is a proud guy and that clearly hurt him. Evra said similar comments too not long after.
No doubt at some point he thought "do I deserve to put up with this?" but since this season he's come back and tried really hard to turn that around. The home fans signing the one Paul Pogba song would have really helped.
It's a shame his injury is worse than we expected, but we don't know their situations, he could have been playing injured for a while.
Look at Kante, he's missed more games than Pogba yet nobody bats an eyelid because they've got 2 good others.
I thought he made it abundantly clear that he wanted to leave in the summer?
Pogba was never bound to Madrid and history showed that it was the case, the Madrid press is good at making you believe their own narrative but Pogba was linked to many clubs and was also supposed to be Barcelona bound at some point. Pogba had the choice to go wherever he wanted and he picked United.
How could that make him one of football’s bad guys? He didn’t ‘engineer’ anything, he simply didn’t renew his contract. He went straight from our reserves to being given the #6 shirt at Juve and being a regular the very next season. He is entitled to leave at the end of his deal. The fact is, he did not go on strike or anything, he saw out his contract professionally, as always, and if anything - we are the ones who acted foul about it as he was ostracised as soon as it became evident he would not sign a new deal.
We should have marched him out the club during the summer.
He's a disgrace.
He's a disgrace.
Thank you all for your kind words
Add in the fact that despite being a world cup winner he is still here and not complained about playing with trash around him. If any of us was Pogba, would we want to be here? Sancho rejected us because we are unstable. We are not a world class club anymore and do not have the right to have players like pogba here. Very good post mate.
There is a euro upcoming. Pogba won't refuse to play, Pogba knows if he doesn't play then he won't get the chance to play in Euro. The club is not stupid enough not to play him with the current options in midfield. Lukaku wanted to leave because he wasn't guaranteed to start and he must fight for his spot with Martial & Rashford. So the case with Pogba is a slightly different and it's too risky for Pogba to ask to leave right now because both Real & Juve can't afford him and need to wait in the summer.
When did Pogba blame his agent for that? A few months after the move, he said that he chose to leave because he thought that the club didn't believe in him and used the game against Blackburn as an example.
Pogba’s case is more than ‘slightly’ different. There is no suggestion at all that he is refusing to play, the suggestion is one of the most ridiculous I’ve read on here for a long time. And he has, himself, said that he expects to be back well in advance of the January window. Not to mention that he would never be sold in January regardless. It’s all just more anti-Pogba propaganda.
The reason the media are negative and fans are negative is because he is our most talented player.
How can you say if he played for Spurs or Arsenal the league would rave about him. He had a good run of form when Ole took over like the rest of the squad, other than that Pogba has not done anything near his talent levels.
The reason the league raves about players from Liverpool and City is the world class players in their team perform when the team needs them.
I have also seen another argument about he is in a shit team.. give me a break, Aubameyang is a world class striker in a shit team and he still performs.
Finally, do you think if Real Madrid or Juventus actually wanted Pogba they would have not put a concrete offer in? Why didn't Real put a bid in ?
He has tried hard to turn it around how? he plays well when the team plays well when we play counter attacking football. When has Pogba played well when the team is crap? When was the last time Pogba picked up the pieces and drove the team on?
I think he will leave next summer but I would be surprised if we sold him in January.
judging by some posts here apparentely not
Couldn't be any clearer. He doesn't seem to care.
On the pitch when he makes a mistake, looks to blame others.
This tinpot theory starts and ends with Pogba playing against Roachdale of all teams.
There usually isn't a lot of info about ANY players injury other than "He's injured, this is the general problem, he's recovering". - So that is also out the window.
Anyway, Pogba was on France TV very recently and gave an update himself. He stated he's in plaster for the next 10 days, and then he needs another two weeks of rehab before he can start thinking about making a comeback. He even posted pictures of himself in plaster.
That's from the horses mouth, so I guess there's no need to speculate anymore. Paul Pogba has been injured, and he will be back.
"It's not easy to see my teammates go to training or on the field, but I have to take the time to come back." - Paul Pogba
Reading this thread is grim as a United fan.
We don't deserve Pogba etc etc.
Seriously he came for a world record fee and has been very inconsistent. The fact he effortlessly upped his game for a long period after Mourinho left before reverting back shows he hasnt been putting 100% in for most if his time here.
He has also been making it 100% clear he wants out for a very long time.
He had a bust up with Mourinho (no doubt Mourinho at fault too given his record) but ultimately the fans and board backed him over the manager and got rewarded at the end of the season by his agent and brother mouthing off about how he desperately wants out.
The sooner him and the circus are gone the better. It really isnt great to want your best players to be sold but given the circumstances we need a clean slate to carry on rebuilding.
We don't deserve Pogba etc etc.
Seriously he came for a world record fee and has been very inconsistent. The fact he effortlessly upped his game for a long period after Mourinho left before reverting back shows he hasnt been putting 100% in for most if his time here.
He has also been making it 100% clear he wants out for a very long time.
He had a bust up with Mourinho (no doubt Mourinho at fault too given his record) but ultimately the fans and board backed him over the manager and got rewarded at the end of the season by his agent and brother mouthing off about how he desperately wants out.
The sooner him and the circus are gone the better. It really isnt great to want your best players to be sold but given the circumstances we need a clean slate to carry on rebuilding.
That's you're own narrative and it very well might be true but another narrative that can't be discounted was that Pogba was offered to the big clubs and we ended up offering the better package. Raiolas claims about being in talks with Madrid can't be discounted even if you say it was only to get the best deal for his client.
Raiola is a scumball. I will always have doubts if Pogba is here because he has United in his "heart" or because he was offered the best deal and not forgetting that £40m Raiola received as part of that deal which is a ridiculous amount to pay if Pogba only wanted to play for United. Everyone has to eat but £40m says to me, if you don't pay then Pogba doesn't come.
It's not my narrative, it's what actually happened. Unless you believe that reality and facts are my invention. If Pogba's destination was based on the better package then he wasn't bound to join a specific club, it's not really that hard to understand.
Has the cast on for another 10 days before 2 weeks of rehabilitation.
https://www.90min.com/posts/6491032...s-to-recover-from-ankle-injury?utm_source=RSS
https://www.90min.com/posts/6491032...s-to-recover-from-ankle-injury?utm_source=RSS
So, lets start with Eriksen.
His output has been similar in a much better team than ours. He's supported by a better defence and midfield and allowed pretty much a free reign.
The press love him, hardly ever say a bad word about him.
He's ran his contract down to 6 months, sulked and whinged ever since the summer where he begged to leave for.... Madrid!
He's been awful ever since then, not looked bothered one bit. Have you heard a peep out of the press? god no. They aren't interested as he doesn't play for United.
This mythical "drive the team on and win it by yourself" is so cliche. There is a VERY SMALL pool of players that can do this.
Is Pogba capable of it? maybe, maybe not. I think he actually tries to do that at times but that's when people get even more annoyed with him.
"release the ball, stop holding onto it and dribbling, stop doing tricks" etc.
Pogba has been playing a more playmaker role this season from deep and been doing perfectly fine.
Why didn't Madrid or Juve pay 150m+ that we requested? well they had bigger holes to fill, simple. Juve don't need him, Madrid could do with him now but they spent lots on Hazard, Jovic and Mendy.
We will see what happens this summer. If Zidane survives I wouldn't be surprised to see him there this summer if the team doesn't improve.
Like Milner and Henderson?
To say the press don't talk about Erikson being crap is a load of rubbish, its spoken about at length. Of course it doesn't get the level of attention as Pogba as we're a bigger story than Spurs.
Of course it's your narrative. You believe 100% that Pogba only wanted to come to us and no one else. Just because he's here doesn't prove reality or facts that money may have been the over riding factor on why he's a United player and not a Madrid one.
I never said that, I said that he wasn't Madrid bound. I believe that he had several interesting options and that ultimately he chose us, nothing else.