We should put a cheeky bid in for him. Let's face it he's already shown he can bang them in at Old Trafford.
Is Salah Finished? | Leaving at the end of the season... so yes.
- Thread starter Berbaclass
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In the latest edition of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) chats to author, Dan Williamson, about his new book 'If I Hadnt Seen Such Riches' which chronicles our 1990/91 European Cup Winners Cup victory, which is a trip down memory lane for those old enough to remember it and a vital history lesson for those who don't.
I feel dirty typing this, but Jamie Carragher is right; Salah is a better Premier League player than Ronaldo.
Of course overall Ronaldo is better, but speaking strictly about their time in England, Salah is better. Ronaldo had 4 and a half good seasons if you’re being generous (2nd half of 05/06, 06/07, 07/08, 08/09 and his return season) whereas Salah has at least 6.
I strongly disagree with Ballon D’or argument. By that logic Rodri is the best premier league midfielder of all time (he isn’t) and is guaranteed a spot in a best premier league X (he’s not).
Of course overall Ronaldo is better, but speaking strictly about their time in England, Salah is better. Ronaldo had 4 and a half good seasons if you’re being generous (2nd half of 05/06, 06/07, 07/08, 08/09 and his return season) whereas Salah has at least 6.
I strongly disagree with Ballon D’or argument. By that logic Rodri is the best premier league midfielder of all time (he isn’t) and is guaranteed a spot in a best premier league X (he’s not).
Was Salah ever considered the best player in the world? I'd say no, not even in one season. Whereas Ronaldo genuinely was.
That Ronaldo went onto better numbers elsewhere or wasn't here as long shouldn't be used against him.
We see Beckham underrated by many now partly because he didn't stay his whole career here, whereas he arguably had the best standout season of any of the 92 gang.
He carried them last season.
Did Liverpool ever play Salah as a false 9 ?
Yes, in 2019, after his injury.
Any all time pl 11 without giggs in it can be immediately discarded.
If you're judging solely on Premier League output then I would agree Salah had the better spell.
Ronaldo left us just as he was hitting his stride, Madrid got his best years.
Whereas Salah was doing it week in, week out for Liverpool for longer than Ronaldo was at his top level for United.
It's no coincidence though that Liverpool are not the force they were last season with Salah's form collapsing.
He was, for half a season in 2021-22 and in last season. He often had much better start of the season than the end. Afcon and Ramadan didn't help I guess.
I agree.
Overseas attacking players in England ranked:
1. Henry
2. Salah
3. C. Ronaldo
4. Cantona
Someone else can continue the list with the likes of Bergkamp, Yorke, Ruud, Drogba, Rooney, Van Persie, D. Silva, Aguero, Hazard, Bale, Suarez, De Bruyne, Bruno and Haaland.
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But Carragher clearly chose the word "overseas" to dodge Law, Charlton, Best and Giggs
Man, we're a great club. More than half the top 20 attacking players of all time in England are United players.
Why would he need to dodge Giggs?But Carragher clearly chose the word "overseas" to dodge Law, Charlton, Best and Giggs
It does dodge Dalglish though.
We were awful in 22/23. Salah scored 30 goals across 51 appearances. We also went on an awful run in 20/21 despite his output. This season it's just a coincidence that both Salah and the club have fallen off.
You can replace output if it's done right.
Van Dijk isn't replaceable.
Any PL all-time team that Giggs is not in isn't an all-time PL team
Salah was at no point considered the best in the world last year, come on.
Pretty sure Benzema had a big season that year too, let alone whoever Madrid and Barcelona's top other boys were that year.
Suspect Mane probably outranked Salah in ballon dor votes too.
In a 4-4-2 it's hard to argue someone gets in over Giggs, though some seemed to think Mane was a better player. I don't agree anyway, but definitely not in a 4-4-2.
But in a 4-3-3 it's hard to argue Giggs would get in, as you'd have the likes of Henry, Ronaldo and even Salah (though i wouldn't have him over either of the 2 before) above him for sure.
Because he's quite clearly in the conversation?
He started playing regular PL football from the age of 17 and kept going for 24 seasons. He got 20 or more G+A in 15 of those seasons. 10 or more in all of them. He reinvented himself as a central midfielder at the age of 35 and won PFA Players' Player of the Year. And while trophies are a team effort, simply winning 13 league titles, 2 CLs and 8 domestic cups and being a key player in most of them, speaks volumes.
Sure, Salah is a more productive player, but I don't think we'll see Giggs' level of consistency combined with longevity in the PL ever again.
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A best pl 11 would be mostly city and united players imo. In terms of consistency it would be mostly united, but in terms of peak and fitting the best system, it would be city , I would say.
If you judge it on longevity in the league, then you could make a case for Salah. However, there's no getting around the fact that the level of Ronaldo's overall performances (not just numbers, but overall performances), in his 3 or so really hot years, was significantly above that of Salah at any point in his tenure.
You reference the Ballon D'Or, which I agree is a very problematic as a metric. But the example you have given is not analogous. Rodri won the Ballon D'Or once after a fantastic year, and never troubled the top 3 before or since. That can happen, a player being a one off contender right at the top.
In 2007, 2008 and 2009, Ronaldo finished second, first, and second in the voting, meaning he was consistently considered in the highest echelon of world footballers whilst still in the Premier League. Salah, on the other hand, has never even been in the top 3. When Liverpool won the CL, multiple of his teammates received more votes than he did.
Cant see Bayern letting Olise go, and hope he doesnt end up replacing Salah if he does leave!
Incredible player under Klopp, and a constant thorn in our arse. Glad to see the back of him.
He was 5th the year before (and really should've been higher but it was an odd year in terms of media coverage, he was City's best player that year and they've had 2 players ahead of him; the amount of votes that Messi got for his WC performance a year after — yes, those who have voted did explain their vote in a hilarious manner — was also farcical). And the year after he tore his ACL.
People in here arguing Salah is better than United Ronaldo are being massively swayed by recency bias. Which player did Madrid come in for with a world record bid? There's your answer.
Think most of the analysis in football is reactionary and has massive recency bias. In 15-20 years people who didn't watch Salah would undermine him as well. My favourite modern argument is how Manchester United won 13 premier league titles (Current City +Liverpool+Arsenal combined total is the same ) and yet all our players are not considered in best player debates.
The debate started with who had the better premier league career not who is the better player (which Ronaldo absolutely smashes Salah in that debate) so yes longevity does come into play. Giggs is a fine example of this. He’s one or the greatest premier league players ever but you’ll easily find players who’ve had better seasons than him.
Also individually Salah beat Ronaldo’s best season with us in goals scored both in the premier league and in all competitions.
If he played when it was legal to throw players around he would struggle. C ronaldo was a physical specimen and even he had to endure all those nasty tackles and body slams.
Egyptian midget wouldnt survive. He is a pace merchant, hard defenders wouldve thrown him around like frisbee. I mean even now we are already seeing how he performs when his pace is.no longer a threat.
Egyptian midget wouldnt survive. He is a pace merchant, hard defenders wouldve thrown him around like frisbee. I mean even now we are already seeing how he performs when his pace is.no longer a threat.
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Such as?
Only a handful of clubs could afford him and most don't need him. There's some speculation that he wants a move back to England and has a release clause.
A year ago nobody expected them to make a massive offer for Wirtz and Isak.
United, Arsenal, City, Chelsea, Real, Barca..
All of those teams already have a first choice player in that position, most have at least one or two decent backups too.
I thought that the debate started with Carragher's comments? Here is what he wrote:
“Ronaldo’s time at Manchester United, both initially and upon his return, was either side of his absolute, Real Madrid-peak years. Salah edges ahead of him when judging strictly on Premier League performance and impact."
The first part is not particularly controversial. The second part is open to interpretation. The only thing Salah has over Ronaldo is that he was in the Premier League for longer. Which is a significant factor in a PL centred debate, no question. However, his actual performances were nowhere near Ronaldo's best. Performances are not just about goals.
Salah the greatest pl player ever according to some morons won a grand total of two titles. Multiply that by 6 and Giggs the real greatest ever pl player still has more.
Ronaldo didn't play in the 80s lad.
Which player did Madrid come in for, Jonathan Woodgate or John Terry? Thomas Gravesen or Paul Scholes? When Salah came into the Premier League, he was already older than Ronaldo was when he left the Premier League. Your argument doesn't make any sense.
You must hold up well in discussions about Bill Russell the GOAT NBA player.
I've also seen no one argue that he's the greatest PL player ever.
There was a debate on this very forum about who is the best player among Salah, Rafinha and Yamal and I remember quite a few people voted for Salah. I watch almost exclusively PL (and CL), so I’m not in a position to make that judgment. And of course Salah faded quite badly at some point in the spring.
Benzema was huge in the spring, probably having the best Champions League campaigns ever. But in the autumn and winter, I’m pretty sure Salah was better. He scored his best goal against City during this period and had sth like 40 goals and assists in the PL and CL by the end of the year.
It's just typical of the scousers to elevate their players to "best ever" even when it takes two seconds to dismantle the argument. It's criminal how underrated our sides in the 90s/2000s are today.
Well, I’d argue that Salah has also scored more goals and had more assists in a single season. Ronaldo scored 20+ goals once, Salah - five times. Ronaldo had one season with 10+ assists, Salah - 6. At his very best Ronaldo was better than peak Salah - that’s quite obvious, but whether that makes Ronaldo a greater PL player than Salah, I think it's up for debate.
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Ronaldo had a total of 7 years in the PL, 6 in his first stint, 1 during his return.
Salah will have had 9 all be it consecutive.
It’s not a huge difference when you look at it like that so if the main argument for Salah is time spent it’s easily balanced out by what Ronaldo achieved on a personal and team level during his spell at the club.
For me personally seeing Ronaldo come through and develop at the club as a teenager to winning the lot and a Ballon d’Or is pretty special. Hard to bump up Salah above this despite the fact he’s undoubtedly been a phenomenal player in his own right.
Salah will have had 9 all be it consecutive.
It’s not a huge difference when you look at it like that so if the main argument for Salah is time spent it’s easily balanced out by what Ronaldo achieved on a personal and team level during his spell at the club.
For me personally seeing Ronaldo come through and develop at the club as a teenager to winning the lot and a Ballon d’Or is pretty special. Hard to bump up Salah above this despite the fact he’s undoubtedly been a phenomenal player in his own right.
Yeah, it's a fallacy to use the longevity argument to try comparing Ronaldo's time in the Premier League to Suarez at Liverpool. Ronaldo had 3 outstanding seasons in a row. Suarez had 1.
He was a great player. Definitely one of the most prominent forwards in the Premier League era. Even in his prime you could sometimes watch him in a game and think "he doesn't really do much", but then he would pop up with a goal or an assist. He was just super sharp in the final third, when at his best.
But Ronaldo had that one season, Salah did a similar season to that multiple times (usually better).
His average season is just better by a reason amount.
His return season doesn't shift anything, he was past his prime back then and it added little to his PL legacy.
Not a huge difference indeed. What Ronaldo has in his favor is that he was genuinely the best player in the world for a time alongside Messi, during his period at United, as evidenced by winning the Ballon d'Or, that's the big one where Salah comes up short. Team level success is comparable when counting trophies, although Ronaldo has one more league title, that's fine margins for me given the way Liverpool lost out against City a few times (you'll disagree here, fair enough). What Salah has going for him is his extreme consistency, he's eclipsed 25 G+A total in the league in every one of his eight full seasons so far, something that Ronaldo only did in 2 of is 8 seasons. Salah almost scored as many goals in his first league season than Ronaldo did in his first four seasons. I know age and experience comes into play here, but we can't remember Ronaldo in the PL as only his 2006-2009 spell either, his first three seasons were a learning curve on an upwards trajectory, which is obviously to be expected from a teenager.
For me personally seeing Salah as the catalyst of our turnaround under Klopp winning the lot was also pretty special, so that's down to club allegiance imo.
They are both in that same top tier for me where only a select few can be put. It seems crystal clear that most Utd fans will still prefer Ronaldo to Salah, but I do believe that most fans without a preference towards Liverpool or United will consider Salah as a bigger PL legend than Ronaldo, although I think a part (or a lot) of that is down to what Ronaldo achieved in La Liga with Real.