Is top 4 enough this season?

[Bilbo]

I'm curious because I keep hearing people say Ole is safe until top 4 is no longer possible , but in my mind we should have moved on from that target now. This is a good team and look at our bench tonight...there's no excuse for such tumescent performances. Relying on the counter and mistakes, it's cowardly. Struggling to break down defensive teams.

For me, good football, and a real sign of progression towards challenging for top honours, should also be expected this season.

I don't care if we get top 4 playing like this. It feels like the only improvement is made by throwing even more good players into the mix.

What exactly is Ole bringing to the table here? What should be the expectations?

Does this look like a team that are ready to do anything better than finish top 4? There are lots of fans all too willing to lay everything at the feet of our staff, but this is a team that turn up sometimes and then shit the bed seemingly at random. They make very, very basic mistakes.

 

[Red00012]

We should expect title challenge, no reason why not. The fact we're in for another top 4 slugfest is really annoying.

Top 4 looks far far away to be honest

 

[pocco]

Does this look like a team that are ready to do anything better than finish top 4? There are lots of fans all too willing to lay everything at the feet of our staff, but this is a team that turn up sometimes and then shit the bed seemingly at random. They make very, very basic mistakes.

I think some people have actually forgotten the impact a good, inspiring coach/ manager can have, it's been that long.

I think we can do a lot better, especially in terms of style of play. A better manager would have won the EL last season. Jose did with a worse team.

 

[Gabagoo]

Nope.

It shouldn't be enough, at all. For the amount of money spent, anything less than a legit title challenge is failure.

Unfortunately, Ole is likely to take us to maximum 5th this season, so he'll be grossly underperforming.

 

[Rood]

I think top 4 is best we can manage with this squad - the board did not invest enough to expect a title challenge

 

[Asger]

With this squad it would be almost like winning the PL!

 

[Green_Red]

To improve on last season we would have needed to realistically improve our points tally by a minimum of 10/12 points. We've already dropped that many this season. We just made top 4 last season. We won't get it this year unless everyone in the top 4 also has a shirt season.

 

[pocco]

what would you expect???

If you expected a title challenge this season, prior to it kicking off, you’re city-level deluded.

I’m past defending Ole but top and excellent cup runs would have been a good season.

Unfortunately, with performances like tonight, I don’t even think that would save Ole’s job

Read what I've said. I never expected a title challenge, but I do expect to see progress. More consistency, a better defence, a more mature attack leading to an all round more dangerous team. Exciting football is a big one for me, we're just boring to watch. All of these things should be achievable, before we even get to actual targets. There so many things we should be seeing that we're not.

When you have a strong team in the pitch, yet still have the likes of De Gea, Pogba, Greenwood & Cavani on the bench, along with some other solid players, there are no excuses.

The worst thing is that, the way the season is going, with just a bit of consistency we could have had a good season.

 

[pocco]

I think top 4 is best we can manage with this squad - the board did not invest enough to expect a title challenge

What about the football we play? Shouldn't we have expected progress there too?

 

[pocco]

With this squad it would be almost like winning the PL!

We got top 4 last season. Look at our bench these days, we're much better equipped now too.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

This squad is capable of challenging specially this year when City and Liverpool look a lot more vulnerable. We have a very good squad we just need a good manager.

 

[passing-wind]

Top four would earmark consistency. The fact we've finished more times out of a European place then in one since SAF retired is a great sense of perspective to how far we've fallen competitively.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

I think top 4 is best we can manage with this squad - the board did not invest enough to expect a title challenge

His targets were Sancho, Grealish & Upamecano - he got £80mil for a CB & £50mil for an RB last season both of whom have underwhelmed then he wanted another £250mil last window. . .

Transfers aside this squad are better than the constant dross we are served. OgS has to take some responsibility in that.

 

[NJM78]

6th at best. In my opinion we certainly will not finish above Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea.

The longer Ole stays, even 6th may be out of the question.

It’s depressing really.

 

[Hawks2008]

Anything less than 3rd is failure to progress and 3rd is stagnation.

We have a good team, we should be closing the gap on the top teams not still trying to claw a top 4 spot.

 

[ghagua]

I would be ecstatic if we managed top 4.

 

[Asger]

We got top 4 last season. Look at our bench these days, we're much better equipped now too.

Other teams like Chelsea spent well, but we have midtable quality defenders. We have no wingers, Rashford is either fantastic or awful.

 

[Mibabalou]

It shouldnt be good enough, but all of us would take it right now.

It at least keeps us moving forward as a club rather than back to 3/4 more years for a title challenge.

 

[Leethal]

As a club, holistically, we've failed from top to bottom. All intertwined with each other, and all having an effect on each other.

From the board, to the coaching team, to the players.

Just one huge shit-show, it pains me to say.

If we manage to finish top 4, it would be a miracle - and honestly, (as ridiculous as this sounds), it may even be counter-productive to our real progress. So long as we achieve top 4, that's "good enough" in the bean counters eyes. There won't be any drastic changes so long as we're making them money.

Twice now, (Jose, and Ole), we've made top 4. And twice now, since doing so, we've not been backed by the board in the transfer market in the season after.

 

[Balotelli's Bib]

Will agree with other people in here that if Ole stays top 4 will be a huge task.

Many of my Manchester United supporting friends and people I play fantasy with are seriously questioning his ability to put out a starting 11 that compliments each others strengths.

Your noticeable victories have come from playing nice counter attacking football. So when teams play a defensive low block why not bait them into your own defensive third and then break at pace? Instead it seems they try play a high line in an effort to get the opposition team to turn it over in their own defensive third where they are already set up because of United's high press.

 

[K Stand Knut]

Well, this thread takes the biscuit for smacked a*se responses!

 

[Bestietom]

With this squad, We should be winning trophies. We are about 3 players from winning the Premiership, but we lost 3 semi finals last season because of bad tactics, and this should not happen.

 

[Sky1981]

Were third last season 66 pts.

We sold no one. Added 5 in.

We should at least expect better than 66 pts. If 66pts gets us 3rd he's still doing a worse job by a small margin.

I'd say 80 pts. If that nets you 7th then ole is still doing a good job regardless progress wise.

Sancho or no sancho. No excuse. We did that last year, if ole cant replicate last season after spending 120m worth of additional players then last year was what? A fluke?

Managers shelf life is only 2-3 years. At top european club very seldom manager last for longer than 3. 5 years tops if they're very good.

Our manager seems to need 3 years and 1 billion spending just to get settled.

 

[OleBoiii]

We sold no one. Added 5 in.

And none of them are sure to start. And the ones that could potentially start are not upgrades in the areas we needed(RW, DM, CB). I have a hard time seeing us get much more points this season, because Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham have strengthened more than us, which means that we are likely to get fewer points from these games. These 6 games are potentially worth as much as 18 points. That is substantial.

I'd say 80 pts. If that nets you 7th then ole is still doing a good job regardless progress wise.

80 points is a title challenge 80% of the time. You can't seriously expect that with this team? And before you bring in Mourinho's 2nd season: I have always firmly believed that he overachieved with that team. I don't like him, but it's a disaster that he wasn't backed in the summer transfer window after that.

 

[Sky1981]

And none of them are sure to start. And the ones that could potentially start are not upgrades in the areas we needed(RW, DM, CB). I have a hard time seeing us get much more points this season, because Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham have strengthened more than us, which means that we are likely to get fewer points from these games. These 6 games are potentially worth as much as 18 points. That is substantial.



80 points is a title challenge 80% of the time. You can't seriously expect that with this team? And before you bring in Mourinho's 2nd season: I have always firmly believed that he overachieved with that team. I don't like him, but it's a disaster that he wasn't backed in the summer transfer window after that.

Why cant i expect 80pts?

We are manchester united are we not? If ole is a good manager material then it's fair i expect something reasonable from him, not even a title. Just 80 pts after 66 pts and 120m new players.

But yeah. More excuses. We're lucky we didnt get relegated, give him 200m to push for 4th next year?

Ole has spend 350m and it's his 3rd year. Tell me what we should expect? Any other manager spend that much and languishing 15th after 7 games would be sacked.

Now go on with a list of excuse why ole should got a blank slate next season. Oh put it on bullet point. It's easier that way.

 

[GlasgowCeltic]

You don't have the window the club has just had if you’re in any way targeting a title challenge

 

[Bestietom]

Were third last season 66 pts.

We sold no one. Added 5 in.

We should at least expect better than 66 pts. If 66pts gets us 3rd he's still doing a worse job by a small margin.

I'd say 80 pts. If that nets you 7th then ole is still doing a good job regardless progress wise.

Sancho or no sancho. No excuse. We did that last year, if ole cant replicate last season after spending 120m worth of additional players then last year was what? A fluke?

Managers shelf life is only 2-3 years. At top european club very seldom manager last for longer than 3. 5 years tops if they're very good.

Our manager seems to need 3 years and 1 billion spending just to get settled.

We prove against some of the big clubs that we can beat anyone, But it's consistency that is our downfall. Our manager and coaches should be getting better out of some players.
Rashford scores a hatrick and then doesn't perform for another 4/5 games.
Martial strolls around, out of position most of the time.
Pogba hasn't played a decent game since last season against City.
Maguire is clumsy and injures his own players most of the time.
Mata loses the ball more than he can hold on to it.
Fernandes has also gone back since last season
Finally Greenwood who is our top prospect, will be ruined playing as a winger.
There is no balance to our side and no consistency and players that should be dropped are not. When other players see this they lose heart.

 

[OleBoiii]

Why cant i expect 80pts?

Of course you can. I just think it's wildly unreasonable.

Just 80 pts after 66 pts and 120m new players.

By this logic, we could sign 5 goalkeepers for 300-400 million and expect to win the treble or something. Money means nothing when there are gaping holes in the team.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Too much external focus. A coach can come in and immediately win the title with unfancied players, as coaches like Conte and Ranieri showed.

Title challenge is expected, either that or good football and high points along with a cup. Anything else is a failure.

 

[Idxomer]

Other teams like Chelsea spent well, but we have midtable quality defenders. We have no wingers, Rashford is either fantastic or awful.

Ah, the 130m defenders who are evidence of the cultural reset Ole has done.

 

[Sky1981]

Of course you can. I just think it's wildly unreasonable.



By this logic, we could sign 5 goalkeepers for 300-400 million and expect to win the treble or something. Money means nothing when there are gaping holes in the team.

Money means nothing? A proper manager like klopp build a league winning team with the same amount while we spend the same amount of money to build a gaping squad and you think the managers doing a good job?

 

[Ajax Forever]

Is it enough?

The way United are playing the last weeks, it will be a miracle to achieve top 4.

I think it puts Mourinho's tenure at United in a better light. Heck even LVG's, compared to Ole.

 

[Denis79]

I don't know, but it starting to feel like LVG's last season all over again.

We go for it!

 

[Murray3007]

at the end of last season it should have been a title challenge with maybe falling off around March/April, still a bit behind city and pool then go again the following season, now top 4 looks a million miles away.

 

[OleBoiii]

Money means nothing? A proper manager like klopp build a league winning team with the same amount while we spend the same amount of money to build a gaping squad and you think the managers doing a good job?

Klopp is the best manager in the game right now and he strengthened the necessary areas. I'd be happy if we could get just one of the two. Seeing as we're never getting Klopp...

Also, I'm not entirely convinced that all the signings are Ole's signings. If I'm not mistaken, both Van Gaal and Mourinho(especially the former) have complained about not getting their targets and having to settle with players they didn't want. There have also been numerous reports and rumors about our club being particularly inept when it comes to transfer deals. This summer window screamed of panic buying. You're not gonna convince me that Ole wanted that.

 

[TJ Reid]

Top 4 will be a superb result after this start.

We've again done what we did after Jose got us 2nd. Not capitalised at all in the summer. Bought a fairly costly midfielder who isn't a sure starter, and not addressed any issue within the team.

History repeating.

To get top 4 you’ll probably need to average around 2 points a game for the remaining 32 matches. That’s a tough ask.

 

[Falcow]

We should have challenged for the title this season or had a half-challenge.

The coaching staff and Ole completely failed. I'd bin them all.

I agree with this. There is no reason that we shouldnt be challenging at this stage. Having lost 3 league games already that doesnt look possible now, not acceptable.

Just getting top 4 this season to begin with wouldn't have been enough for me.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

No, any United manager should be expecting to at least be close enough to a “title race” until mid-late January by his second full year in charge. Jose managed it, but was rightfully sacked after a horror show start to season 3. If Jose can manage it with this board, other managers can too.
Anything less is accepting mediocrity.

 

[Offside]

Obviously not. We finished top 3 last season - where’s the progress?

 

[Bestietom]

I love Ole, but if he and his coaches can't get consistency from this squad of players, then they need to go.