Ivan Toney | Arrested on suspicion of two counts of assault and one count of affray.

Lash said:
While I totally agree with the idea of your safety, headbutting someone is rarely ever proportional to that. In general it makes no sense, as you're literally throwing your head towards your potential threat. You only ever headbutt someone to inflict maximum damage, so I think he would have to feel in serious danger to really ever justify it.
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I’m going to assume Toney is a normal guy on a night out with little real combat/engagement experience, so under that proviso, I would expect proportional response to be low on his list of priorities in a heightened situation where he’s not entirely sure of what is and isn’t a threat to him. Besides, if someone who you haven’t given permission to be in your personal space is in such proximity to be headbutted in the first place, there’s a serious breach of boundaries enough to warrant a panicked response.

On another note, an informed person would strike with something more dangerous in that proximity… a headbutt startles or breaks a nose, it’s better that than an unannounced uppercut or elbow strike to the temple etc. I’d say a headbutt might have the greater short-term showy effect (blood etc.) but the others could potentially cause far more serious harm. I’d also say other strikes show more premeditation (you’re not going to randomly through the aforementioned; they much more informed strikes), so funnily enough, Ivan Toney headbutts someone who is all over him doesn’t sound half as bad as Ivan Toney uppercuts fan!
 
Fortitude said:
I’m going to assume Toney is a normal guy on a night out with little real combat/engagement experience, so under that proviso, I would expect proportional response to be low on his list of priorities in a heightened situation where he’s not entirely sure of what is and isn’t a threat to him. Besides, if someone who you haven’t given permission to be in your personal space is in such proximity to be headbutted in the first place, there’s a serious breach of boundaries enough to warrant a panicked response.

On another note, an informed person would strike with something more dangerous in that proximity… a headbutt startles or breaks a nose, it’s better that than an unannounced uppercut or elbow strike to the temple etc. I’d say a headbutt might have the greater short-term showy effect (blood etc.) but the others could potentially cause far more serious harm. I’d also say other strikes show more premeditation (you’re not going to randomly through the aforementioned; they much more informed strikes), so funnily enough, Ivan Toney headbutts someone who is all over him doesn’t sound half as bad as Ivan Toney uppercuts fan!
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Yeah, I think we'd both need to know a bit more detail about it, but I don't think anyone's ever done a panicked headbutt :lol: .

I think it makes sense when you're squaring up to someone, but I don't know how you can claim self-defence or being in imminent danger if you are able to line up a headbutt - especially if the claim is they grabbed you by the neck (I am assuming from behind, otherwise you'd say throat, but more detail needed).
 
Lash said:
Yeah, I think we'd both need to know a bit more detail about it, but I don't think anyone's ever done a panicked headbutt :lol: .

I think it makes sense when you're squaring up to someone, but I don't know how you can claim self-defence or being in imminent danger if you are able to line up a headbutt - especially if the claim is they grabbed you by the neck (I am assuming from behind, otherwise you'd say throat, but more detail needed).
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For whatever it's worth. Hands around neck (if true), but it's all up in the air until more is known.

From the sound of things, it's an easy one.
 
He's a good lad is Toney, and a good striker. We should have bought him 3 years ago when he was running over our CBs for Brentford.

He clearly doesn't take any shit, exactly what we need up front. Instead, we've had Wout, Hojlund and Sesko. That game when they scored 4 and three of them were goals as embarrassing to concede as the first last night against Wolves...

Some drunken knobhead sounds like he got exactly what he deserved.
 
T00lsh3d said:
Gerard got off with battering someone because the guy looked at him the wrong way….im sure Toney will be fine
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erm actually Gerrard was defending the honour of Philip Collins; a proportionate and justified response I'll have you know.
 
Fortitude said:


For whatever it's worth. Hands around neck (if true), but it's all up in the air until more is known.

From the sound of things, it's an easy one.
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Yeah to be fair, especially wearing a chain and watch, you could easily think you're about to be robbed. Still not entirely sure how he's headbutting him in the bridge of the nose, when he's got his arm round his neck and he's telling him to get off.
 
dumbo said:
erm actually Gerrard was defending the honour of Philip Collins; a proportionate and justified response I'll have you know.
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Gerrard obviously an American psycho fan. Which is fair enough
 
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