Jack Grenglish

[Redo91]

Doesn't change the fact he's English. I can understand that Ireland have given the kid a chance to impress but at the end of the day if he does choose to switch to England, you'd have to say fair enough. Not sure why you'd be 'very upset' with him choosing to play for his country. He's English at the end of the day, and perhaps thought he had a better chance of making it internationally with Ireland.

His dad and both grandparents on that side of his family are Irish. He isn't one of those cases of a player with one Irish grandparent who has never been in the country before in his life. He has even played GAA in Birmingham so he has clearly very strong Irish ties. I don't like when an English born player decides in their mid-twenties that they want to play for Ireland when it dawns on them that they aren't good enough for England. For example I want Mark Noble nowhere near the Irish jersey. This isn't the case with Grealish or even players like McGeady or McCarthy who were more than good enough to play for Scotland but played for Ireland because they wanted to.

England have approached him a number of times to join up with their youth teams so I'm sure he knows he is good enough to play for them but so far has chosen not to.

 

[Getsme]

We're a tiny nation and competing with rugby and gaelic games for football players. We're dead right to cast our net far and wide, it's worked successfully in the past.

As is Northern Ireland, only we have a few other issues to deal with too, that's not my point though. The IFA pump alot of money into grassroots football, it's a shame that the FAI don't do the same, from what I've been told there is very little money being invested in grassroots football in the Republic, therefore the talent that is in the country will be lost to Gaelic, Rugby or Hurling.
It can't be good for the Association in the long run.

 

[Redo91]

Mo Farah lives in Britain though and has done since he was 8, Mo Farah the athlete is result of British coaching and British funded money, so why shouldn't he represent Britain?

Grealish doesn't live in Ireland, Ireland have contributed nothing to Jack Greenlish the man or footballer and i can't see Ireland have done for him to warrant Grealish representing them.

He was born in England/grown in England/educated in England/lives in England/coached by an English club which was funded by English money and plays for an English club, English as English come if you ask me.

What about the role his IRISH father and grandparents played in his upbringing. Or the training he received from the IRISH coaches involved in the IRISH youth teams he played in.

 

[Redo91]

They do? Show me some examples of associations pestering kids who aren't even footballers yet - Don't say England with Januzaj, Januzaj was 19 years old/played for Manchester United and impressed for Manchester United before England 'looked into' the possibility of him representing England and i highlight the word 'looked into' Ireland certainly don't look into eligibility in their approach of youngsters and old non-professionals and as said it's wrong what they do.

I don't care what anyone says, the grandparent rule (or should i say how Ireland use it) is a joke and approaching 16 year old kids at school (or just left) who aren't even footballers yet is wrong on so many levels.

I'm all for footballers representing nations of non-birth due to immigration and if that particular nation as done something in the development of the man/the footballer of said player. The only other way i believe footballers should represent a country they wasn't born in is if a footballer is not good enough for their country of birthday/has got to 25 and want to play international football (ie Phil Bardsley) i believe that's what the grandparent rule was designed for, it shouldn't be abused for taping-up the best young talents before they've made it and as said there should be a rule against it.

Your ignorance really is astonishing. How do you know that we approach 16 year olds asking them to play for Ireland? Not only are you saying this but you are criticising us for doing something when you have no idea whether it is in fact true.

 

[sizzling sausages]

I like how NoWinNoFee has went from speculating to now being certain that the FAI are tapping up schoolkids.

 

[sizzling sausages]

Ah feck off Redo.

 

[Mr Anderson]

What about the role his IRISH father and grandparents played in his upbringing. Or the training he received from the IRISH coaches involved in the IRISH youth teams he played in.

It is focal vision. If he bothered to look into it or actually knew anything about the Grealish situation, he plays with Ireland as he and his father felt it was the best place to develop. England offered u 19 and he is given u 21 with Ireland last year. Always considering what is best for him and not us forcing anything .

Villa always had a big irish connection, Villa and Forrest have ties with teams here in Ireland for my hometown club for example, so the irish community is well linked and known not as suggested "googling ancestral history". He declared for us at 14, it is all his own and family decision so far. Simple as that.

 

[Maxii]

They do? Show me some examples of associations pestering kids who aren't even footballers yet - Don't say England with Januzaj, Januzaj was 19 years old/played for Manchester United and impressed for Manchester United before England 'looked into' the possibility of him representing England and i highlight the word 'looked into' Ireland certainly don't look into eligibility in their approach of youngsters and old non-professionals and as said it's wrong what they do.

I don't care what anyone says, the grandparent rule (or should i say how Ireland use it) is a joke and approaching 16 year old kids at school (or just left) who aren't even footballers yet is wrong on so many levels.

I'm all for footballers representing nations of non-birth due to immigration and if that particular nation as done something in the development of the man/the footballer of said player. The only other way i believe footballers should represent a country they wasn't born in is if a footballer is not good enough for their country of birthday/has got to 25 and want to play international football (ie Phil Bardsley) i believe that's what the grandparent rule was designed for, it shouldn't be abused for taping-up the best young talents before they've made it and as said there should be a rule against it.

You make it sound like he is being made to play for the Irish youth team against his will, and you're completely dismissing the fact that maybe he actually wants to play for Ireland ahead of England. He's a big boy and I'm pretty sure he could tell the child snatchers at the FAI to piss off if he really wanted to.

The truth is, none of us actually know what he wants so we'll just have to wait and see. I can't see how anyone can have a problem with the way the Irish recruit players from England who have Irish family. Can you honestly tell me even one of those players over the years would have ever got into the English team?

 

[Redo91]

It is focal vision. If he bothered to look into it or actually knew anything about the Grealish situation, he plays with Ireland as he and his father felt it was the best place to develop. England offered u 19 and he is given u 21 with Ireland last year. Always considering what is best for him and not us forcing anything .

Villa always had a big irish connection, Villa and Forrest have ties with teams here in Ireland for my hometown club for example, so the irish community is well linked and known not as suggested "googling ancestral history". He declared for us at 14, it is all his own and family decision so far. Simple as that.

That's what pisses me off with posters like him. They come along and make ridiculous acquisitions about something they know nothing about. It's ignorance simple as.

 

[Ringo 07]

This kid's Irish, albeit born in England. His upbringing, playing Gaelic football from the age of 8-14, has immersed him in the Irish culture. His Da is a Dub - there is no chance he'll declare for Ingerlund over Eire.

What nonsense.....same thing was being said about Michael Keane a couple of years ago as his dad is from Dublin too. From most recent reports I read about a week ago in the papers it was saying Grealish's preference is England......Maybe the article was BS...he'd be a major coup for Ireland but I think it would be stupid to count your chickens just yet

 

[NoWinNoFee]

You make it sound like he is being made to play for the Irish youth team against his will, and you're completely dismissing the fact that maybe he actually wants to play for Ireland ahead of England. He's a big boy and I'm pretty sure he could tell the child snatchers at the FAI to piss off if he really wanted to.

The truth is, none of us actually know what he wants so we'll just have to wait and see. I can't see how anyone can have a problem with the way the Irish recruit players from England who have Irish family. Can you honestly tell me even one of those players over the years would have ever got into the English team?

I'm not saying that, I'm saying they are targeting them at a vulnerable age/before they are footballers and that is wrong.

Maybe he does want to play for Ireland and if he does that's fair enough, personally i have no opinions of Greanlish, I've never saw him play, I'm on about what the Irish FA do in general, the other week i remember Martin O'Neil sat infront of the camera's going through a bunch of English born kids 16-18 (i believe Greanlish and Crowley was mentioned) and Connor Wickham who's a bit older, it disturbed me, not because they are English, it just felt wrong and what made it even more wrong is why no one ever mentions that its wrong, it just seems to be the norm 'that's what Ireland do' and people turn a blind eye to it.

I just think how can proud nation (Ireland) whole future be logging onto ancestry.co.uk non-Irish born nationals, its like they are the only nation who 'scout' rather than 'develop' does that not bother Irish people here?

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I'm not saying that, I'm saying they are targeting them at a vulnerable age/before they are footballers and that is wrong.

Maybe he does want to play for Ireland and if he does that's fair enough, personally i have no opinions of Greanlish, I've never saw him play, I'm on about what the Irish FA do in general, the other week i remember Martin O'Neil sat infront of the camera's going through a bunch of English born kids 16-18 (i believe Greanlish and Crowley was mentioned) and Connor Wickham who's a bit older, it disturbed me, not because they are English, it just felt wrong and what made it even more wrong is why no one ever mentions that its wrong, it just seems to be the norm 'that's what Ireland do' and people turn a blind eye to it.

I just think how can proud nation (Ireland) whole future be logging onto ancestry.co.uk non-Irish born nationals, its like they are the only nation who 'scout' rather than 'develop' does that not bother Irish people here?

Does it bother the Irish that our football association does it upmost to secure it's best possible talent?

 

[KiD MoYeS]

Look at the Germany side, they're world champions with quite a few non Germans. Does it bother them?

 

[Mr Anderson]

I'm not saying that, I'm saying they are targeting them at a vulnerable age/before they are footballers and that is wrong.

Maybe he does want to play for Ireland and if he does that's fair enough, personally i have no opinions of Greanlish, I've never saw him play, I'm on about what the Irish FA do in general, the other week i remember Martin O'Neil sat infront of the camera's going through a bunch of English born kids 16-18 (i believe Greanlish and Crowley was mentioned) and Connor Wickham who's a bit older, it disturbed me, not because they are English, it just felt wrong and what made it even more wrong is why no one ever mentions that its wrong, it just seems to be the norm 'that's what Ireland do' and people turn a blind eye to it.

I just think how can proud nation (Ireland) whole future be logging onto ancestry.co.uk non-Irish born nationals, its like they are the only nation who 'scout' rather than 'develop' does that not bother Irish people here?

Again, English clubs have ties with a lot of irish clubs. Irish communities abroad are all linked together and take pride in their irish ties. It isn't a case of the fai going off and checking for irish heritage, it is often known from quite a young age who a lot of these players are.

You know nothing about the irish set up or how clubs and coaches in England affiliate with those here.

 

[Redo91]

I'm not saying that, I'm saying they are targeting them at a vulnerable age/before they are footballers and that is wrong.

Maybe he does want to play for Ireland and if he does that's fair enough, personally i have no opinions of Greanlish, I've never saw him play, I'm on about what the Irish FA do in general, the other week i remember Martin O'Neil sat infront of the camera's going through a bunch of English born kids 16-18 (i believe Greanlish and Crowley was mentioned) and Connor Wickham who's a bit older, it disturbed me, not because they are English, it just felt wrong and what made it even more wrong is why no one ever mentions that its wrong, it just seems to be the norm 'that's what Ireland do' and people turn a blind eye to it.

I just think how can proud nation (Ireland) whole future be logging onto ancestry.co.uk non-Irish born nationals, its like they are the only nation who 'scout' rather than 'develop' does that not bother Irish people here?

Will anybody please think of the children?!

 

[FlawlessThaw]

Look at the Germany side, they're world champions with quite a few non Germans. Does it bother them?

Well majority of the "non Germans" grew up in Germany from a young age so it's a bit of a different comparison (a bit similar to how someone brought up Mo Farah when it's the opposite discussion here which was a ludicrous comparison as Farah like Grealish grew up in England).

I think in general NoWinNoFee is talking bollocks, if a player wants to play for the country of his grandparents/parents then fair enough. What I feel slightly uncomfortable is when the National Team manager openly discusses convincing youngsters to switch sides. I'm sure it happens in the back channels whichever country but just something I'm not personally keen on.

 

[Mr Anderson]

Oblivious to the fact clubs all around the world target kids even younger than the age of 16.

Grealish and his father always stated ireland was best for his development. And that is the main factor right there. His dad Kevin isn't pushing him to rep Ireland, fai made their feelings known but not forcing anything. We could do a France, call him up and if he rejects then get him banned as plating suggested regarding Ribery

 

[limerickcitykid]

His dad and both grandparents on that side of his family are Irish. He isn't one of those cases of a player with one Irish grandparent who has never been in the country before in his life. He has even played GAA in Birmingham so he has clearly very strong Irish ties. I don't like when an English born player decides in their mid-twenties that they want to play for Ireland when it dawns on them that they aren't good enough for England. For example I want Mark Noble nowhere near the Irish jersey. This isn't the case with Grealish or even players like McGeady or McCarthy who were more than good enough to play for Scotland but played for Ireland because they wanted to.

England have approached him a number of times to join up with their youth teams so I'm sure he knows he is good enough to play for them but so far has chosen not to.

He scored a point at Croker too.

 

[Redo91]

He scored a point at Croker too.

Wow that's pretty good going! Hopefully he is given all the time he needs to make this decision as it is obviously a very important one.

 

[limerickcitykid]

They do? Show me some examples of associations pestering kids who aren't even footballers yet - Don't say England with Januzaj, Januzaj was 19 years old/played for Manchester United and impressed for Manchester United before England 'looked into' the possibility of him representing England and i highlight the word 'looked into' Ireland certainly don't look into eligibility in their approach of youngsters and old non-professionals and as said it's wrong what they do.

I don't care what anyone says, the grandparent rule (or should i say how Ireland use it) is a joke and approaching 16 year old kids at school (or just left) who aren't even footballers yet is wrong on so many levels.

I'm all for footballers representing nations of non-birth due to immigration and if that particular nation as done something in the development of the man/the footballer of said player. The only other way i believe footballers should represent a country they wasn't born in is if a footballer is not good enough for their country of birthday/has got to 25 and want to play international football (ie Phil Bardsley) i believe that's what the grandparent rule was designed for, it shouldn't be abused for taping-up the best young talents before they've made it and as said there should be a rule against it.

I have already said that the English FA have pestered the Grealish's about Jack trying to get him to represent them despite him already representing Ireland. It doesn't matter if he was born in England, he has decided to play for Ireland's youth sides and England are pestering him with promises of game time. All while Jack has never made a senior appearance so isn't a footballer. England going on about Januzaj is even worse as he isn't and won't be eligible for England. Just another example of the English FA with their head up their ass.

Have to wait until they are 25? That is fecking stupid. I am Irish-Canadian, born and raised in Canada and if I were good enough and had to wait until 25 to play for Ireland it would be the dumbest thing ever. I'm Irish, I want to play for Ireland and there is no reason I shouldn't be able to play for Ireland, same goes for the lads that are born in England.

We also don't want players that just aren't good enough for England. We aren't England B, we are Ireland. We want people who want to play for Ireland not those who realize they aren't good enough for England and think feck it I'll play for Ireland. If a 20 year old no matter how good wants to play for Ireland then they should be allowed to play for Ireland. Making them wait until 25 is stupid.

 

[204Red]

Was his Dad Tony Grealish who played for Brighton vs United back in the 83 Cup final?

 

[RexHamilton]

I'm not saying that, I'm saying they are targeting them at a vulnerable age/before they are footballers and that is wrong.

England has an under 16's team. I think it's unfair to have players representing their country at that age without knowing all the options available to them. It's a disgrace I tell ya. Why are England forcing them to play at such a young vulnerable age.

Maybe he does want to play for Ireland and if he does that's fair enough, personally i have no opinions of Greanlish, I've never saw him play, I'm on about what the Irish FA do in general, the other week i remember Martin O'Neil sat infront of the camera's going through a bunch of English born kids 16-18 (i believe Greanlish and Crowley was mentioned) and Connor Wickham who's a bit older, it disturbed me, not because they are English, it just felt wrong and what made it even more wrong is why no one ever mentions that its wrong, it just seems to be the norm 'that's what Ireland do' and people turn a blind eye to it.

Yes, the manager of a nation is wrong to look at the possibility of recruiting players that are eligible to play for us. We should show no interest in them and then they will not feel pressurised into playing for us.

I just think how can proud nation (Ireland) whole future be logging onto ancestry.co.uk non-Irish born nationals, its like they are the only nation who 'scout' rather than 'develop' does that not bother Irish people here?

Developing soccer in Ireland is incredibly difficult. It's the fourth most popular sport. Most kids will play either Gaelic football or hurling, or both as their primary sport. In Limerick, parts of Dublin, parts of Cork, Rugby would rival the GAA sports, but even in Dublin, where soccer is strongest, there is nowhere where it is the primary sport for young children. I'm sure Martin O'Neill would love to field a team of all Irish born and bred players, but it's not possible. There are many people in Britain of Irish descent and he is/the FAI are approaching these lads to let them know they would be appreciated in the Irish set up. There is no one forcing them to represent Ireland.

No one has ever played for Ireland and come out and complain that they wanted to play for England but were forced into togging out for Ireland. Of course the FAI let players know of their eligibility and tell them they would be welcome but the players make the choice at the end of the day. They may only be 16/17 but they have family and friends to advise them and they don't have to make up their mind until they are going to play senior level.

You're having a nightmare in this thread. You're making no sense at all. Probably best for you to leave it here.

 

[Getsme]

Oblivious to the fact clubs all around the world target kids even younger than the age of 16.

Grealish and his father always stated ireland was best for his development. And that is the main factor right there. His dad Kevin isn't pushing him to rep Ireland, fai made their feelings known but not forcing anything. We could do a France, call him up and if he rejects then get him banned as plating suggested regarding Ribery

I dont believe you can. Anyway it would be a silly move on the FAI's part to even try.

 

[RexHamilton]

I have already said that the English FA have pestered the Grealish's about Jack trying to get him to represent them despite him already representing Ireland. It doesn't matter if he was born in England, he has decided to play for Ireland's youth sides and England are pestering him with promises of game time. All while Jack has never made a senior appearance so isn't a footballer.

This is a great point. Why are England sniffing around him at all? He has chosen to represent Ireland at youth level. Why are the FA pestering him?

 

[Mr Anderson]

I dont believe you can. Anyway it would be a silly move on the FAI's part to even try.

Of course, I was jesting. Just highlighting that if we are as pestering as suggested, things would happen differently

 

[limerickcitykid]

This is a great point. Why are England sniffing around him at all? He has chosen to represent Ireland at youth level. Why are the FA pestering him?

It is a disgrace really. FAs shouldn't be allowed to talk to kids, the kids should decide if they are on the youth teams or not.

 

[Reds-of-Ulster]

As is Northern Ireland, only we have a few other issues to deal with too, that's not my point though. The IFA pump alot of money into grassroots football, it's a shame that the FAI don't do the same, from what I've been told there is very little money being invested in grassroots football in the Republic, therefore the talent that is in the country will be lost to Gaelic, Rugby or Hurling.
It can't be good for the Association in the long run.

They (The FAI) put their money into youth scouting it would seem... It isn't odd to see scouts at Northern Ireland youth games according to what I have heard.

 

[Acole9]

Dodgy hair do.

 

[Cockney-Red]

Your ignorance really is astonishing. How do you know that we approach 16 year olds asking them to play for Ireland? Not only are you saying this but you are criticising us for doing something when you have no idea whether it is in fact true.

Believe it or not, there are actually people from Ireland who scour across English academies looking for English youth players who are eligible to play for them. Some posters on here appear to be getting a bit funny about it, but it does happen, they've been doing it for years now. My Dad was approached at an academy game, and asked whether my younger brother would be interested in representing Ireland at under 15's level, he was on the books at the West Ham academy at the time (and would qualify for Ireland on my mothers side).

It's not that far fetched either, because even if Irish scouts wanted to scour their own academies instead, there simply aren't any football academies in Ireland for them to actually look at.

 

[Maxii]

Believe it or not, there are actually people from Ireland who scour across English academies looking for English youth players who are eligible to play for them. Some posters on here appear to be getting a bit funny about it, but it does happen, they've been doing it for years now. My Dad was approached at an academy game, and asked whether my younger brother would be interested in representing Ireland at under 15's level, he was on the books at the West Ham academy at the time (and would qualify for Ireland on my mothers side).

It's not that far fetched either, because even if Irish scouts wanted to scour their own academies instead, there simply aren't any football academies in Ireland for them to actually look at.

So what you're saying is, Irish scouts ignore Irish academies to exclusively scout in different countries instead? Ahh, makes sense I guess....

 

[Cockney-Red]

So what you're saying is, Irish scouts ignore Irish academies to exclusively scout in different countries instead? Ahh, makes sense I guess....

Well a person can't be in two places at once, so I'm going to try and answer your question with an intelligent guess, and say yes.

 

[Maxii]

Well a person can't be in two places at once, so I'm going to try and answer your question with an intelligent guess, and say yes.

Do you realise how ridiculous that sounds? You're basically saying that Irish scouts completely ignore schoolboy football in Ireland, and use all of their resources to "steal" players from other countries who have Irish heritage. Do you actually believe that?

 

[limerickcitykid]

Well a person can't be in two places at once, so I'm going to try and answer your question with an intelligent guess, and say yes.

So the FAI consists of 1 scout for every age group? English club scouts are at Irish club matches, national scouts are going to be there too.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

Scouting isn't as black and white as some of you appear to believe anyway. There's many ways a player can be brought to the attention of a footballing association, if a player is making noise he'll be watched, regardless of where he's located.

 

[Nickosaur]

Can we keep the politics out of this please? The thread will descend into chaos otherwise.

It was worth a try mate...

 

[Keeps It tidy]

Look at the Germany side, they're world champions with quite a few non Germans. Does it bother them?

Where does this myth come from? Who are the non-Germans on the Germany's World Cup winning side?

 

[Cockney-Red]

Do you realise how ridiculous that sounds? You're basically saying that Irish scouts completely ignore schoolboy football in Ireland,

They don't 'completely' ignore schoolboy football in Ireland, they just do it to a certain extent. Hence why I highlighted earlier the dilemma of how a person can't be in two places at once.

and use all of their resources to "steal" players from other countries who have Irish heritage. Do you actually believe that?

Yes I do actually believe that. Because if you steal something, than there isn't many resources being used up to begin with. At least for the person doing the stealing that is.

In fact, it's probably a major incentive for why the FAI would want to use that kind of youth development strategy in the first place, as opposed to producing/coaching players at their own academies. Why use up all your own resources, when you can just get other countries to use theirs instead?

 

[jb8521]

The best part of this argument is he was actually brought to the FAI's attention by a member of the Villa under age coaching staff

 

[KiD MoYeS]

Where does this myth come from? Who are the non-Germans on the Germany's World Cup winning side?

Players like Boateng, Ozil, Khedira and Podolski are as much German as Grealish is Irish.

 

[limerickcitykid]

The best part of this argument is he was actually brought to the FAI's attention by a member of the Villa under age coaching staff

Brilliant