Jadon Sancho| Staying at Dortmund for now

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dev1l

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Judas said:
Daniel Harris probably needs to give it a rest now. He seemingly got it wrong, and he keeps digging himself more of a hole. The only reason he had an air of trustworthiness was he didn't blabber on often, and now look at him.
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I m under the impression that he was briefed by an insider whom he considered a trusted person. Like him there are other reporters.
Imo someone from the club leaked this info on purpose. Perhaps it was a move to push Sancho asking for a transfer and get him at a lower fee.
The reporters also knew we wanted Sancho and have the money to get him.
So they assumed this is a done deal.
But it seems that Woody have other ideas and is not prepared to fork out the whole transfer fee.
 

Cassidy

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el3mel said:
We ended up paying Leicester what they wanted at the end to get him but that's because we can pay 80m. I'm not sure we have enough funds to pay 120m on one player. Comparing this with other signings is simply off. He costs more than anyone of them and the question is if we can financially pay this sum or not, not that we want to pay it or not.
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Pretty sure they dont want 120m upfront cash. I would guess we also didnt pay 80m upfront for Maguire
 

Terminator

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From Robson's article :

"And their priority remains to reach an agreement over a deal that is likely to be the biggest of a window that has been depressed by the effects of coronavirus.

Solskjaer believes Sancho has the potential to become a superstar at Old Trafford, with the iconic No7 shirt waiting for him.

The Norwegian wants to add the former Manchester City academy graduate to a thrilling attack that already includes Marcus Rashford, Anthony Martial and Mason Greenwood.

And the belief within United is that the player is equally as excited about a move despite this week speaking in glowing terms of life at Dortmund."
 

red thru&thru

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7even said:
The reason I prefer to read Borussia Dortmund’s annual reports instead of following Twitter and listen to the ITK it’s because where you find the money you often also find the answers. There is a reason why Watzke back track today and starts to talk about no money.

I don’t like to speculate when and how much but by reading the reports I can get an idea what’s financially possible or not. But more importantly you often find the right answers in the details.

Borussia Dortmund published information to their shareholders in the end of June 2020. The started by saying that they (the Board) will not make any forecast about future profit/losses regarding fiscal year 2019/20. By experience you know that’s negative news. But here is the interesting part. If you read the report in detail side by side with the Q3 report you can easily se that they forecast a loss of €21m in Q4. (April-June 2020) Nothing spectacular with that because Man United made the same prediction but what is interesting is that the Board of Borussia Dortmund themselves speculate about future transfer incomes. How many players in Borussia Dortmund generate a income above €50m? Well.,, Jadon Sancho is one.

If you read Watzke’s statement closely you see that he mention losses of €4m/ game. OK! Multiple those numbers with 10-15 home game and you start to understand the numbers. Another season without spectators can easily cost Borussia D (and Man United) figures in a region of €40-80m. Borussia has in Mars 31 cash reserves of €19m, United has cash reserves of £90m. Do the maths and Watzkes comments start to make sense.

Sooner or later Borussia Dortmund needs to use their credit of €60m if the Pandemic continue. Ed Woodward knows this. The same way Watzke knows about United‘s finances. It’s all there in Black and White.

Dortmund has done the right things. They put pressure on United and they have made strong statements that selling for a figure below €120m is unlikely. On the other if United don’t bite the “bone”they entering another problem. They need fresh money if they don’t want to use their credit. Keeping Sancho another season benefit them if the transfer market recover, but another season without spectators will send the market in the other direction. If all clubs except Man City, PSG and Chelsea will be without their own cash next season then the market will shrink significantly.

If Dortmund want to play safe they sell him. If they prefer to gamble with when the market will recover then they keep him.

Manchester United desperately needs a right winger and Sancho is by far our best option. Thats our position. I have no idea of the outcome but one thing is certain. Lot’s of bullshit is floating around.
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Hahaha, I love this post.

This is basically it. But I also believe BVB need to invest to finish higher up, or even finish second. Will be interesting to see future developments.
 

ScarleyUtd

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red thru&thru said:
Hahaha, I love this post.

This is basically it. But I also believe BVB need to invest to finish higher up, or even finish second. Will be interesting to see future developments.
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This is good info, and perhaps is a way to see beyond all the nonsense, but it makes (if true) Dortmund's position of wanting all the money now nonsensical.

Say it was at the upper figure of 120 mill, 60/70 mill now would take care of their financial woes for the season and with further tranches to come later also. They also have other brilliant young players in the pipeline to sell if the s**t really hits the fan. I very much doubt with everything going on even Madrid or City will pay something like 150 mill next season.
 

Compton22

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Unbelievable! My tweet with positive(ish) news gets not a single reaction and 3 quotes already on negative news that's already been posted. You guys are such narcissists :lol:
 

el3mel

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Cassidy said:
Pretty sure they dont want 120m upfront cash. I would guess we also didnt pay 80m upfront for Maguire
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Maguire costed 80m upfront. I don't see any other source that says this includes adds on.

Anything from 90m up front gonna be way too much for us imo.
 

Withnail

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#07 said:
Most media stories do not get written unless a journalist gets multiple attestation for a story. For those who don't know, multiple attestation is confirmation of something from more than one credible source. So, for example, in the case of Sancho a decent hack is not going to write that terms have been agreed if they haven't heard this from two good sources. For instance, someone in the player's camp and someone working on the deal etc.

That does not always mean the stories are true though. Sometimes it suits a club and an agent, both of whom have to be taken as credible sources because you'd think a player's club and their agent will know what's going on with them, to claim something is happening when it is not or the opposite. In that position a journalist could think to himself 'this is pure BS I'm not writing it.' However, what if it turns out to be true? Then the journalist has turned down a story, confirmed by the selling club and player's agent, which other journalists will also pick up. How does said hack explain that to his or her editor? 'Yes I had the story but I didn't break it because I didn't believe the sources, even though they were credible.' Once you get to a certain level within the media you might be able to get away with that. However, those are the exception not the rule.

Every report we read will be sourced but it will only be as good as the source and sources have agendas. When Gaitan's camp and his club were telling the whole world he was coming to Man Utd they had an agenda. It wasn't true but it was what they were telling the media and if you're a journalist you are going to report it, just in case.

The people giving reports on Sancho are not all WUMs. They are not writing up stories claiming terms are agreed or this is the price Dortmund want solely for promo. They are writing this stuff because people involved in the situation or close to it are telling them these things. Just because these things don't end up happening it doesn't mean the journalist in question wrote them up for the purpose of misleading people (even if their sources wished to mislead). Also a lot of the time these things are not etched in stone. The intermediaries working on a deal might think they've got an agreement, then they take this back to the clubs and find circumstances have changed or the clubs aren't willing to compromise as much as they originally thought/understood. So to the player, the agents, the negotiators it might seem done, they tell the media, and then suddenly its not done.
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Well said, a lot of people don't seem to understand how journalism works.
 

dev1l

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According to this United are skint, that s why we cannot afford Sancho
 

ChaddyP

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Compton22 said:

We haven't briefed it's off... It's still on! :drool:

Why would Dortmund still be negotiating with us if according to them he is 100% set in stone staying?
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They are just dick teasing us. Giving us a titty flash via video chat .. Telling us how much they want us inside them...then when it's time to get to the part where we come over to smash they tell us they have Boyfriend and that we are just friends
 

Cassidy

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el3mel said:
Maguire costed 80m upfront. I don't see any other source that says this includes adds on.

Anything from 90m up front gonna be way too much for us imo.
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Im not speaking of add ons. I mean cash payment upfront which is not usually how transfers are done anyway
 

el3mel

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Cassidy said:
Im not speaking of add ons. I mean cash payment upfront which is not usually how transfers are done anyway
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I mean if actually couldn't pay 80m upfront for Maguire it's another reflection on the problem with Sancho deal, because most sources say BVB want 90-100m upfront while we're not willing anything more 80m upfront.
 

red thru&thru

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ScarleyUtd said:
This is good info, and perhaps is a way to see beyond all the nonsense, but it makes (if true) Dortmund's position of wanting all the money now nonsensical.

Say it was at the upper figure of 120 mill, 60/70 mill now would take care of their financial woes for the season and with further tranches to come later also. They also have other brilliant young players in the pipeline to sell if the s**t really hits the fan. I very much doubt with everything going on even Madrid or City will pay something like 150 mill next season.
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I guess United are trying to do a guaranteed deal of around £80m and potential add ons for a further £15m or so. But BVB want guaranteed £108m, with a big chunk (£70m - £80m up front) with rest in instalments.
 

Cassidy

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el3mel said:
I mean if actually couldn't pay 80m upfront for Maguire it's another reflection on the problem with Sancho deal, because most sources say BVB want 90-100m upfront while we're not willing anything more 80m upfront.
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Who said couldnt? Im saying thats not how transfers work
 

red thru&thru

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el3mel said:
I mean if actually couldn't pay 80m upfront for Maguire it's another reflection on the problem with Sancho deal, because most sources say BVB want 90-100m upfront while we're not willing anything more 80m upfront.
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Last time the finances were published, we only had £90m in cash reserves. So if BVB do want most of it up front, it will cause us issues and we shouldn't agree to the terms.
 

Nou_Camp99

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dev1l said:
According to this United are skint, that s why we cannot afford Sancho
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Tbf IF this is true then we wouldn't be the only major club who is short of money this year would we? Most elite clubs are crying poverty. Why do our fans on here think we're immune to this financial crisis?
 

el3mel

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Cassidy said:
Who said couldnt? Im saying thats not how transfers work
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I just don't see the correlation between Maguire's deal and this one. Totally different from every single perspective, including the most important one, which is the money involved. Sancho is going to cost us much more and we can't afford that much of a high asking price upfront.
 

Rado_N

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I think it this deal does happen, after Sancho is unveiled and the pics of him signing his deal are released, Zorc will say they’re photoshopped and Sancho will be playing for them next season 100%.
 

el3mel

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red thru&thru said:
Last time the finances were published, we only had £90m in cash reserves. So if BVB do want most of it up front, it will cause us issues and we shouldn't agree to the terms.
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Yeah I don't have anything to blame the club for anyway. It's way too much money.
 
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