Jadon Sancho| Staying at Dortmund for now

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Mickeza

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A brief from us that we've walked away, or that the window closes.
Even when the window closes I’ll still believe. Deals have been announced 24 hours later. I think many are refusing to accept it because it truly shows how incompetent we are. That’s why I’m still convinced we’ll sign him. We can’t be this useless. If they just briefed too much money in this climate from the start and strengthened elsewhere then the negativity which clearly impacts the club wouldn’t exist. As it is they’ve been briefing Dortmund are bluffing and we’ll sign him for less than 100m. If they don’t do that we just look like fools.
 

cyberman

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And he was. He's gone off the boil since then. But my main point at the time was that Pogba was over-rated and grossly over-priced - and this I believe has been shown to be true.
No he wasnt. Pogba was a multiple Italian league winner, European Championship and CL finalist. Dele scored some good goals against Stoke and Everton.
Pogba has ran a World Cup since!
It was nonsense then and its nonsense now.
 

westmeath

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And he was. He's gone off the boil since then. But my main point at the time was that Pogba was over-rated and grossly over-priced - and this I believe has been shown to be true.
It’s a nonsense debate really because both of them are garbage.
 

Rolaholic

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Thread has seemingly ran it's course now with fecking Spurs fans coming here to take the piss and wum it up :lol: :rolleyes:
 

do.ob

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The problem with Pogba, and probably with Sancho as well if he were to sign at some point, isn't necessarily individual quality, it's that the team as a whole is dysfunctional.
 

amolbhatia50k

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I would guess the club has yet to brief that we will not be signing him this year because they know the reaction will be unsavoury.
Yes I think so. Usually the reaction would be to understandable degrees. This one is a pretty monumental let down so they'll probably just let it run its course into nothing and random future speculation (United may come back etc ). Damage limitation really
 

Fletchageddon

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I think the board are doing this deal right in the sense that Sancho isn't worth the money. However panic signing Dembele is a dreadful move. Also wasting your whole summer trying to sign him from a club who drop their valuation is now a text book Ed move.
 

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Board are clearly avoiding a brief to prevent absolute backlash from fans, not because this is on in any way shape or form.
I'm not sure how you draw that conclusion when the way they're currently treating fans by not killing the story reeks of contempt and is fanning the flames - as well as the ire - to further degrees than saying it's off would.

It's the hope that kills.. so the saying goes. If fans were allowed time to process this, or better yet, not had their expectations raised to untold measures, the backlash won't - or wouldn't - be half as bad as it's going to be if this is drawn out all the way to the end of the window.

Personally, I don't think Woodward or Judge give two figs about the fans (as long as they don't turn up on doorsteps), but the club is taking a battering in terms of image, which is something they are heavily invested in and why I find it incredulous that they've made such an absolute balls up of this whole affair basically from the off - how is it possible to take the euphoria of CL qualification and signs of progress, and turn it into a quagmire of misery in the space of a couple of months? It's unbelievable.
 

groovyalbert

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I'm not sure how you draw that conclusion when the way they're currently treating fans by not killing the story reeks of contempt and is fanning the flames - as well as the ire - to further degrees than saying it's off would.

It's the hope that kills.. so the saying goes. If fans were allowed time to process this, or better yet, not had their expectations raised to untold measures, the backlash won't - or wouldn't - be half as bad as it's going to be if this is drawn out all the way to the end of the window.

Personally, I don't think Woodward or Judge give two figs about the fans (as long as they don't turn up on doorsteps), but the club is taking a battering in terms of image, which is something they are heavily invested in and why I find it incredulous that they've made such an absolute balls up of this whole affair basically from the off - how is it possible to take the euphoria of CL qualification and signs of progress, and turn it into a quagmire of misery in the space of a couple of months? It's unbelievable.
I think the fans opinions are one thing, having it be public knowledge we're simply unable to pay that amount is another. That would have a knock on effect in regards to confidence and value of club shares, plus act as concrete proof of how badly Woodward and the board have run this club into the ground by spending stupid money on non-starting projects/trash players.

The way things are going now allows the board to say they were persistent in their pursuit of Sancho but unable to broker a deal in part because of BVB but equally due to our new, hardline approach to negotiations. Despite this having been disproven by any semi-reliable source, that'll be the message they'll stick to.
 

Fortitude

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I think the fans opinions are one thing, having it be public knowledge we're simply unable to pay that amount is another. That would have a knock on effect in regards to confidence and value of club shares, plus act as concrete proof of how badly Woodward and the board have run this club into the ground by spending stupid money on non-starting projects/trash players.

The way things are going now allows the board to say they were persistent in their pursuit of Sancho but unable to broker a deal in part because of BVB but equally due to our new, hardline approach to negotiations. Despite this having been disproven by any semi-reliable source, that'll be the message they'll stick to.
Killing the story is for the benefit of fans though and doesn't necessarily mean we're done - just has expectations (amongst us) completely quelled. Having the club dragged through the mud in all quarters by keeping the story running (not killing it) looks so much worse and enables social media to make a mockery of the club and its inability to to get anything grandscale done without falling into absolute shambles.

Keeping the story alive allows for so much more conjecture... and digging/investigation into why we are so shambolically run. Evra, Rio, even Neville are generating energy and stoking fires because this story gives them something to work with and tap into. If you put a lid on it, we fall into melancholy as a fanbase and all wallow amongst ourselves.. some may turn to anger, but the backlash has a different kind of energy to what we have now with so much virality via hope to tap into.

Put it this way: I think you'd see a spike in negativity and such for a few days before it subsides and people look at contingency and so forth with the story put to bed. With it alive and kicking, there's literally months of proverbial magma building to the point of eruption. If you're picking your poison, you want to control the narrative, not let it spiral and branch like it has done.
 

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No he wasnt. Pogba was a multiple Italian league winner, European Championship and CL finalist. Dele scored some good goals against Stoke and Everton.
Pogba has ran a World Cup since!
It was nonsense then and its nonsense now.
Pogba's form for us has shown him to be overrated and overpriced for us. Unfortunate but true.
 

Mickeza

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I would guess the club has yet to brief that we will not be signing him this year because they know the reaction will be unsavoury.
This makes no sense though. They’ve constantly briefed he’s our number one target just 6 months after there was major discontent directed at the board and Woodward’s house was attacked due to not backing Ole. We’ve said the deadline was arbitrary and Dortmund will sell for less. These aren’t things you’d do if you think you won’t sign the player. If we’d said he was too expensive/had no interest from
the start everyone would have moved on. The way they’ve done it they’re in for a huge backlash if we don’t sign him.
 

Leethal

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This makes no sense though. They’ve constantly briefed he’s our number one target just 6 months after there was major discontent directed at the board and Woodward’s house was attacked due to not backing Ole. We’ve said the deadline was arbitrary and Dortmund will sell for less. These aren’t things you’d do if you think you won’t sign the player. If we’d said he was too expensive/had no interest from
the start everyone would have moved on. The way they’ve done it they’re in for a huge backlash if we don’t sign him.
This is a figment of supporters imagination.

The club has never briefed anything -at all- in regards to Sancho. That is just reporters and journalists talking. Thing is, United's interested in Sancho has been repeated so much by journalists etc, that the fans have started to believe it and take it as gospel; despite no evidence proving the validity of their information at all from either United or Dortmund.
 

Siorac

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This makes no sense though. They’ve constantly briefed he’s our number one target just 6 months after there was major discontent directed at the board and Woodward’s house was attacked due to not backing Ole. We’ve said the deadline was arbitrary and Dortmund will sell for less. These aren’t things you’d do if you think you won’t sign the player. If we’d said he was too expensive/had no interest from
the start everyone would have moved on. The way they’ve done it they’re in for a huge backlash if we don’t sign him.
Basically every single Dortmund official confirmed Sancho would stay. At this point we can't say that "there would be a huge backlash so it doesn't make sense" because if Dortmund sell him, there leadership will be in for a huge backlash, too. At this stage it comes down to which club is run by more competent people? And we all know the answer to that.
 

cyberman

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Pogba's form for us has shown him to be overrated and overpriced for us. Unfortunate but true.
I honestly dont think so. No pandemic and hes a world champion thats playing for Madrid or Juve, winning titles and/or CLs.
 

Mickeza

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This is a figment of supporters imagination.

The club has never briefed anything -at all- in regards to Sancho. That is just reporters and journalists talking. Thing is, has been repeated so much, that the fans have started to believe it and take it as gospel; despite no evidence proving the validity of their information at all.
Aye. The BBC just made things up at the exact same same as The Athletic, Guardian, Times and Telegraph. Fake news. All sources are equal. All journalists are liars. No such thing as experts. Etc etc.
 

KiD MoYeS

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This makes no sense though. They’ve constantly briefed he’s our number one target just 6 months after there was major discontent directed at the board and Woodward’s house was attacked due to not backing Ole. We’ve said the deadline was arbitrary and Dortmund will sell for less. These aren’t things you’d do if you think you won’t sign the player. If we’d said he was too expensive/had no interest from
the start everyone would have moved on. The way they’ve done it they’re in for a huge backlash if we don’t sign him.
They are not signing him but I would imagine they are desperately seeking to make some sort of signing before briefing on reluctance to meet Dortmund's price. Dortmund, if anything, face more of a backlash from support if they sell him having gone on record numerous times to state he's going nowhere now. It has been radio silence from Manchester United.
 

Murder on Zidane's Floor

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Worse goals stats than Son, but significantly better assist stats. However, all Sancho's stats come from the Bundesliga where opposition teams are of generally lower quality compared to the Prem. And his 13 England appearances so far have been OK, but nothing more than this. Of greater relevance, I'm not arguing that Son is worth £108m.

I've seen it all before. People get carried away with fancy tricks and dribbling ... and ignore many other aspects - including "boring" things like professionalism, character, hard work, dedication (I'm not saying that Sancho lacks these things) - of what combines to make a player truly great. This is why a player like Neymar, for all his dribbling ability, is inferior to a player like Kane IMO.
I, actually agree with this statement. Someone wobble my head.
 

2ndTouch

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This makes no sense though. They’ve constantly briefed he’s our number one target just 6 months after there was major discontent directed at the board and Woodward’s house was attacked due to not backing Ole. We’ve said the deadline was arbitrary and Dortmund will sell for less. These aren’t things you’d do if you think you won’t sign the player. If we’d said he was too expensive/had no interest from
the start everyone would have moved on. The way they’ve done it they’re in for a huge backlash if we don’t sign him.
Woodward strikes me a narcissist type. Those people tend to have a hard time of letting go of their pre-conceived notions. I could totally see him sitting in his monitoring bunker hoping for some kind of last ditch miracle to happen.
As for the backlash, it would be at least equally as huge over here. The german media are in full hype of a potential title challenge by a Dortmund that includes Sancho, and no Dortmund official has said anything even close to indicating that this might change.
This isn't in your clubs hands anymore.
 

Mickeza

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Basically every single Dortmund official confirmed Sancho would stay. At this point we can't say that "there would be a huge backlash so it doesn't make sense" because if Dortmund sell him, there leadership will be in for a huge backlash, too. At this stage it comes down to which club is run by more competent people? And we all know the answer to that.
I don’t agree with that. Dortmund can easily spin it as a win if we pay 100m. They can just say he wanted to leave and we’ve got a shed ton of cash during a global financial meltdown. But that isn’t my point. The argument we aren’t briefing it’s off to avoid a backlash makes no sense. Everything we have done thus far will have helped create the backlash if we don’t sign him. I just refuse to believe they’re that incompetent. Deep down I kinda know we are but I’m just hoping against hope it isn’t the case :lol:
 

Leethal

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Aye. The BBC just made things up at the exact same same as The Athletic, Guardian, Times and Telegraph. Fake news. All sources are equal. All journalists are liars. No such thing as experts. Etc etc.
You said they - as in the club. Don't change your narrative to try to support your argument now.
 

passing-wind

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And he was. He's gone off the boil since then. But my main point at the time was that Pogba was over-rated and grossly over-priced - and this I believe has been shown to be true.
Alli has done absolutely nothing for spurs and has nothing to show for his contribution. Pogba even in his period of inconsistencies at the very least has silverware to his name from his contribution to the team.

When you consider the state of our midfield during his tenure here the problem is not so much Pogba's ability but the expectation to run everything himself singlehandedly.
 

bond19821982

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With fans not coming back until March, this is dead. No one should be paying 120m for any player during this period. He'll, we wont even know if we would have enough money to pay the salaries come next March( exaggeration- yes !)

In short Dortmund can feck off. He won't go for more than 60-70m next year.
 

Leethal

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What are you talking about? The club brief through the media. Obviously I didn’t mean Woodward has released a statement on MUTV.
How do you know that they have briefed anything about Sancho through the media? The media is likely just using United's alleged interest to generate clicks and make money; like they always do. But because the fans want Sancho, they somehow think this is different. If United did have any interest, United's interest likely ended as soon as they realised they weren't getting a pound-stretcher deal on Sancho due to Covid.
 

Summit

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How do you know that they have briefed anything about Sancho through the media? The media is likely just using United's alleged interest to generate clicks and make money; like they always do. But because the fans want Sancho, they somehow think this is different. If United did have any interest, United's interest likely ended as soon as they realised they weren't getting a pound-stretcher deal on Sancho due to Covid.
It is the level of different journalists that report the same thing within the space of about 10 minutes that makes it an obvious brief. If you can't see that, then you're blinkered.
 

Jaqen H'ghar

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I don’t agree with that. Dortmund can easily spin it as a win if we pay 100m. They can just say he wanted to leave and we’ve got a shed ton of cash during a global financial meltdown. But that isn’t my point. The argument we aren’t briefing it’s off to avoid a backlash makes no sense. Everything we have done thus far will have helped create the backlash if we don’t sign him. I just refuse to believe they’re that incompetent. Deep down I kinda know we are but I’m just hoping against hope it isn’t the case :lol:
We've always suspected it. Rio and Evra have talked about it recently. We are, beyond a shadow of a doubt, a club run by people who have no idea what they are doing.
 

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Worse goals stats than Son, but significantly better assist stats. However, all Sancho's stats come from the Bundesliga where opposition teams are of generally lower quality compared to the Prem. And his 13 England appearances so far have been OK, but nothing more than this. Of greater relevance, I'm not arguing that Son is worth £108m.

I've seen it all before. People get carried away with fancy tricks and dribbling ... and ignore many other aspects - including "boring" things like professionalism, character, hard work, dedication (I'm not saying that Sancho lacks these things) - of what combines to make a player truly great. This is why a player like Neymar, for all his dribbling ability, is inferior to a player like Kane IMO.
Son is maintaining higher goal and assist records in the EPL than he did in the Bundesliga. I could go on with Aubameyang, de Bruyne, Sané, ... This argument is a very weak one. Sancho would also play with better players when he moves to an elite club which makes things easier.

That being said, if you think Kane is a superior player to Neymar then this doesn't make much sense. Let's agree to disagree then.
 

Leethal

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It is the level of different journalists that report the same thing within the space of about 10 minutes that makes it an obvious brief. If you can't see that, then you're blinkered.
You're a fool if you don't think that different journalist's don't report off of each other's alleged information - as has been proven many, many times in the past.

People in this thread just want to "believe" too much; when there is nothing to support their hopes, and hasn't been for a good month or so.
 

sammsky1

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With fans not coming back until March, this is dead. No one should be paying 120m for any player during this period. He'll, we wont even know if we would have enough money to pay the salaries come next March( exaggeration- yes !)
In short Dortmund can feck off. He won't go for more than 60-70m next year.
Presumably, Germany will also undergo this restriction too, which makes it an even worse prospect for BVB given how much they depend on stadium income

Trying to Sell next summer scenario, BVB also lose out on size of fee, as I can't see how any club in Europe will generate enough surplus profits to pay more that £108m next summer. Where is that money going to come from at Liverpool, City (FFP), Barcelona, Madrid. Plus one year less on contract.

There is way too much risk for BVB to hold onto such a valuable asset this season. I still think this is on: BVB will blink and lower their demands in the final week.
 
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