Jarrad Branthwaite | Clubs still far apart in valuation

Reiver

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He’s not a bad player at all. But when you start to get to £50m fees you want pretty much the whole complete package.

We’re in danger of being taken for silly money for someone who is very solid but not necessarily technically proficient.
This is exactly how I feel.
Everton are free to ask for whatever they want. I don't think he's worth over £50 million though.
 

BabySinclair

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My point was not to compare or judge by ability...rather that we already have an older CB who performs for us and our MO this summer appears to be targeting players in the age range of 21-25 and trying to tap into current ability/potential rather than *signing* older players who would be on high wages.
Fair point.
 

mikeyt

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This is exactly how I feel.
Everton are free to ask for whatever they want. I don't think he's worth over £50 million though.
One good, not great season in the PL, being young and English = £70million apparently. How Everton can consider Branthwaite in the bucket of the likes of Gvardiol and Maguire (at that time) is mad but to be expected. We need to leave this one alone and focus elsewhere for now.
 

Cassidy

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One good, not great season in the PL, being young and English = £70million apparently. How Everton can consider Branthwaite in the bucket of the likes of Gvardiol and Maguire (at that time) is mad but to be expected. We need to leave this one alone and focus elsewhere for now.
To be fair he also played in Europa League the previous season whilst on loan at PSV, yes he's not worth 70m but he isn't a one season of senior football player either.
 

Moriarty

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One good, not great season in the PL, being young and English = £70million apparently. How Everton can consider Branthwaite in the bucket of the likes of Gvardiol and Maguire (at that time) is mad but to be expected. We need to leave this one alone and focus elsewhere for now.
Has he asked for a transfer?
 

Andycoleno9

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What are they thinking now? With seeing us in talks with Yoro and De Ligt they all must be panicking. Everton maybe less (if they want to keep him) but Branthwaite is not happy for sure.
 

rimaldo

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What are they thinking now? With seeing us in talks with Yoro and De Ligt they all must be panicking. Everton maybe less (if they want to keep him) but Branthwaite is not happy for sure.
there are rumours they’re offering £5m for us to take him.
 

SilentWitness

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What are they thinking now? With seeing us in talks with Yoro and De Ligt they all must be panicking. Everton maybe less (if they want to keep him) but Branthwaite is not happy for sure.
I'm sure if he's unhappy then he will put in a transfer request.

Why would we be panicking? We don't want to sell him hence why we have said 70m or no deal.
 

Andycoleno9

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I'm sure if he's unhappy then he will put in a transfer request.

Why would we be panicking? We don't want to sell him hence why we have said 70m or no deal.
That is why i said IF Everton want to sell (but tried to get bigger fee). If you are happy with keeping him then all this news is good for you.
Same goes about player; IF he wants transfer then he knows that chance is becoming smaller for it.
 

simonhch

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I'm sure if he's unhappy then he will put in a transfer request.

Why would we be panicking? We don't want to sell him hence why we have said 70m or no deal.
I agree with you that I doubt Everton are panicking. It’s just about risk management for them. They can get a good fee in for a homegrown talent and eradicate any PSR concerns they have for the foreseeable future, if they compromise on the fee and settle at something like 55-60m. On the flip side, they’ll probably skim through PSR without needing to sell him and if he has another good season, someone - if not United - will pay the 70-75m they want next summer. A young, homegrown, high calibre CB talent, who is two footed and physically dominant, is always going to attract a high fee within the PL.

If I was Everton, and I believed in his talent, I would hold out for the 70m, and if I didn’t get it, would hold on to him for another season. If he performs as expected, his value will only go up and there will always be a market for him.

The only circumstances in which Everton could be motivated to compromise on the fee is if (a) they need the funds sooner rather than later in order to bring in other targets they view as essential, (b) they still have PSR concerns, and/or (c) the player pushes really hard for the move and they don’t want to force an unhappy player to stay, and/or they care about the players wishes to take the next step in his career.

There’s no doubt a move to United is a huge opportunity for Branthwaite, one that might not come around again if United make alternative moves in the market, and it would be a shame for him if Everton stood too dogmatically in the way of that. But, at the end of the day, the Everton board have an ethical and fiduciary responsibility to do what is best for the club, not what is best for the player.

Personally, I really rate Branthwaite and think he’d be a great long term signing for United. He’d cover three positions, RCB, LCB and LB, is already playing at a high level and has loads of potential to improve. A 55m(ish) fee seems like a fair price to me, and gives Everton a good chunk of change to refresh their squad, and the player gets a dream move. But I don’t particularly expect them to be reasonable in this negotiation, and nor do they have much reason to be so. They hold all the cards. The only card United hold is the willingness to walk away, which means we have to have an alternative lined up, but of course means we don’t get the player we really wanted.

By way of compromise I could envisage a situation where Branthwaite moves to United for 70m, but Hannibal (10m) and Kambwala (5m), move in the other direction. Two players who are young, high potential, and ready to get a lot more minutes, and would add some decent depth to the Everton squad.
 
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Andycoleno9

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I agree with you that I doubt Everton are panicking. It’s just about risk management for them. They can get a good fee in for a homegrown talent and eradicate any PSR concerns they have for the foreseeable future, if they compromise on the fee and settle at something like 55-60m. On the flip side, they’ll probably skim through PSR without needing to sell him and if he has another good season, someone - if not United - will pay the 70-75m they want next summer. A young, homegrown, high calibre CB talent, who is two footed and physically dominant, is always going to attract a high fee within the PL.

If I was Everton, and I believed in his talent, I would hold out for the 70m, and if I didn’t get it, would hold on to him for another season. If he performs as expected, his value will only go up and there will always be a market for him.

The only circumstances in which Everton could be motivated to compromise on the fee is if (a) they need the funds sooner rather than later in order to bring in other targets they view as essential, (b) they still have PSR concerns, and/or (c) the player pushes really hard for the move and they don’t want to force an unhappy player to stay, and/or they care about the players wishes to take the next step in his career.

There’s no doubt a move to United is a huge opportunity for Branthwaite, one that might not come around again if United make alternative moves in the market, and it would be a shame for him if Everton stood too dogmatically in the way of that. But, at the end of the day, the Everton board have an ethical and fiduciary responsibility to do what is best for the club, not what is best for the player.

Personally, I really rate Branthwaite and think he’d be a great long term signing for United. He’d cover three positions, RCB, LCB and LB, is already playing at a high level and has loads of potential to improve. A 55m(ish) fee seems like a fair price to me, and gives Everton a good chunk of change to refresh their squad, and the player gets a dream move. But I don’t particularly expect them to be reasonable in this negotiation, and nor do they have much reason to be so. They hold all the cards. The only card United hold is the willingness to walk away, which means we have to have an alternative lined up, but of course means we don’t get the player we really wanted.

By way of compromise I could envisage a situation where Branthwaite moves to United for 70m, but Hannibal (10m) and Kambwala (5m), move in the other direction. Two players who are young, high potential, and ready to get a lot more minutes, and would add some decent depth to the Everton squad.
So, you would pay 85 mil for him?
 

simonhch

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So, you would pay 85 mil for him?
Huh? No.

I’d pay 70m for him and have them pay 15m for Hannibal and Kambwala. Meaning 55m net. It would help both teams with PSR and we could get some nice sell on clauses or performance related bonuses attached to the individual deals for Hannibal and Big Willy. You added instead of subtracting.

The only additional cost to United is the opportunity cost associated with potentially negotiating higher fees for Hannibal or Kambwala with other clubs. But getting those two players at very reasonable (low) fees is the added benefit to Everton that could tip this deal in our favour. Kambwala only has a year left on his contract and might well leave for free next summer. Hannibal is high potential but he’s going to struggle for minutes this season and is clearly on the market anyway. Both are, nevertheless, decent players who also have a decent resale value, are young, and have the potential to develop into valuable players for a mid table PL club. They paid us 15m for Garner who had way less first team experience than Hannibal does at this stage.
 
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Andycoleno9

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Huh? No.

I’d pay 70m for him and have them pay 15m for Hannibal and Kambwala. Meaning 55m net. It would help both teams with PSR and we could get some nice sell on clauses or performance related bonuses attached to the individual deals for Hannibal and Big Willy. You added instead of subtracting.

The only additional cost to United is the opportunity cost associated with potentially negotiating higher fees for Hannibal or Kambwala with other clubs. But getting those two players at very reasonable (low) fees is the added benefit to Everton that could tip this deal in our favour. Kambwala only has a year left on his contract and might well leave for free next summer. Hannibal is high potential but he’s going to struggle for minutes this season and is clearly on the market anyway. Both are, nevertheless, decent players who also have a decent resale value, are young, and have the potential to develop into valuable players for a mid table PL club. They paid us 15m for Garner who had way less first team experience than Hannibal does at this stage.
That is not bad idea but you underestimate our players. 15 mil for Willy and Hannibal would be very bad deal, imo.
 

saik

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That is not bad idea but you underestimate our players. 15 mil for Willy and Hannibal would be very bad deal, imo.
The fact is no one will pay that much for them. Hannibal had 1 decent to average loan on Championship before having an utter failure of a loan at Sevilla. Kambwala meanwhile spent most of his time here injured and with the u21s.

I'd rather say you are overestimating how much we can get for them.
 

Giggsyking

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Huh? No.

I’d pay 70m for him and have them pay 15m for Hannibal and Kambwala. Meaning 55m net. It would help both teams with PSR and we could get some nice sell on clauses or performance related bonuses attached to the individual deals for Hannibal and Big Willy. You added instead of subtracting.

The only additional cost to United is the opportunity cost associated with potentially negotiating higher fees for Hannibal or Kambwala with other clubs. But getting those two players at very reasonable (low) fees is the added benefit to Everton that could tip this deal in our favour. Kambwala only has a year left on his contract and might well leave for free next summer. Hannibal is high potential but he’s going to struggle for minutes this season and is clearly on the market anyway. Both are, nevertheless, decent players who also have a decent resale value, are young, and have the potential to develop into valuable players for a mid table PL club. They paid us 15m for Garner who had way less first team experience than Hannibal does at this stage.
70m for fecking Branthwaite :lol: .
 

saik

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If Branthwaite is worth 70m then Kambwala is worth a lot more than 15m
Jesus Christ.. I'm all for overrating our youngsters but Kambwala has done nothing to suggest he is worth anything close to what you are imagining, not yet anyways. He has around 22 appearances for us in like 3 years he's been with us.
 

RedRocket9908

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Jesus Christ.. I'm all for overrating our youngsters but Kambwala has done nothing to suggest he is worth anything close to what you are imagining, not yet anyways. He has around 22 appearances for us in like 3 years he's been with us.
Im just saying that if Branthwaite who was bought for £1m 3 years ago is worth £70m after 1 half decent season then Kambwala is worth a lot more than £15m
 

saik

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Im just saying that if Branthwaite who was bought for £1m 3 years ago is worth £70m after 1 half decent season then Kambwala is worth a lot more than £15m
Their performances matter a lot. Branthwaite performed well enough in the Prem last season and has also impressed in the Dutch league before that on loan. Sure 70m is a lot but that is what he is worth to Everton. Right now Kambwala has proven nothing to attach those kind of fees to him.
 

criticalanalysis

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Actually I think our preference is that both Everton and Yoro accept and we sign both, with De Ligt as backup. But while De Ligt is straightforward where we can pull the trigger whenever, we want answers from these two first before doing so. Branthwaite/Martinez/Yoro is in incredibly good 3 man CB rotation that has potential to be the best in the world if the young ones develop like many think they can.

If not, we sign De Ligt and then move on to potentially cheaper young 3rd CB prospect. But Branthwaite and Yoro seem like priority 1 at the moment (as they should be)
I'll be quite surprised if we don't sign de Ligt (with all the talk from the Tier 1 sources) regardless of what happens with the other transfers. I don't think Utd would go that far with player and club i.e string him along only to say 'we've got our other targets, sorry'. The same thing with Dan Ashworth. Unless I've misunderstood your post :confused:

I think we really are trying to get all three (happy fecking days!) or it will be either Yoro or Branthwaite. My guess it'll be the later by design and we'll end up paying closer to what Everton wants because Yoro is 50/50 at best.
 
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AkaAkuma

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I agree with you that I doubt Everton are panicking. It’s just about risk management for them. They can get a good fee in for a homegrown talent and eradicate any PSR concerns they have for the foreseeable future, if they compromise on the fee and settle at something like 55-60m. On the flip side, they’ll probably skim through PSR without needing to sell him and if he has another good season, someone - if not United - will pay the 70-75m they want next summer. A young, homegrown, high calibre CB talent, who is two footed and physically dominant, is always going to attract a high fee within the PL.

If I was Everton, and I believed in his talent, I would hold out for the 70m, and if I didn’t get it, would hold on to him for another season. If he performs as expected, his value will only go up and there will always be a market for him.

The only circumstances in which Everton could be motivated to compromise on the fee is if (a) they need the funds sooner rather than later in order to bring in other targets they view as essential, (b) they still have PSR concerns, and/or (c) the player pushes really hard for the move and they don’t want to force an unhappy player to stay, and/or they care about the players wishes to take the next step in his career.

There’s no doubt a move to United is a huge opportunity for Branthwaite, one that might not come around again if United make alternative moves in the market, and it would be a shame for him if Everton stood too dogmatically in the way of that. But, at the end of the day, the Everton board have an ethical and fiduciary responsibility to do what is best for the club, not what is best for the player.

Personally, I really rate Branthwaite and think he’d be a great long term signing for United. He’d cover three positions, RCB, LCB and LB, is already playing at a high level and has loads of potential to improve. A 55m(ish) fee seems like a fair price to me, and gives Everton a good chunk of change to refresh their squad, and the player gets a dream move. But I don’t particularly expect them to be reasonable in this negotiation, and nor do they have much reason to be so. They hold all the cards. The only card United hold is the willingness to walk away, which means we have to have an alternative lined up, but of course means we don’t get the player we really wanted.

By way of compromise I could envisage a situation where Branthwaite moves to United for 70m, but Hannibal (10m) and Kambwala (5m), move in the other direction. Two players who are young, high potential, and ready to get a lot more minutes, and would add some decent depth to the Everton squad.
Your last para. is where I get frustrated with Everton. When you read about clubs having good relationships which aid transfer dealings Everton always seem to have selective amnesia.

Howard, Neville are 2 players who moved to you and gave you great service. Both reasonable fees.
Cleverly was due to sign for Villa for a decent fee until you guys destablised it and ended up getting him on a free.
James Garner another more recent transfer.

Hannibal was bought for 10-15m and if he were sold for that it would be seen as a great punt by the team getting him. Kambwala is 15m in this market.

it really would suprise me if after all this posturing and the deal closing Everton would come in with low ball offers for Maguire, Wan Bissaka or Lindelof.
 

December_16

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Your last para. is where I get frustrated with Everton. When you read about clubs having good relationships which aid transfer dealings Everton always seem to have selective amnesia.

Howard, Neville are 2 players who moved to you and gave you great service. Both reasonable fees.
Cleverly was due to sign for Villa for a decent fee until you guys destablised it and ended up getting him on a free.
James Garner another more recent transfer.

Hannibal was bought for 10-15m and if he were sold for that it would be seen as a great punt by the team getting him. Kambwala is 15m in this market.

it really would suprise me if after all this posturing and the deal closing Everton would come in with low ball offers for Maguire, Wan Bissaka or Lindelof.
I don’t buy the “good relationship” between PL clubs, or any non-associated clubs for that matter, when it comes to transfer. Clubs are run by people, and people change. The people who signed Howard and Neville are probably long gone, and even if they are not, those deals of ancient history will have zero impact on today’s transfers. Clubs are well within their rights to look after their financial well-being, especially so for Everton, so I don’t mind them one bit if they try to get the best price for their players.

That being said, I’m also entitled to my opinions that they’re being idiots for valuing Branthwaite at 70m though. I mean, WTF.
 

AkaAkuma

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I don’t buy the “good relationship” between PL clubs, or any non-associated clubs for that matter, when it comes to transfer. Clubs are run by people, and people change. The people who signed Howard and Neville are probably long gone, and even if they are not, those deals of ancient history will have zero impact on today’s transfers. Clubs are well within their rights to look after their financial well-being, especially so for Everton, so I don’t mind them one bit if they try to get the best price for their players.

That being said, I’m also entitled to my opinions that they’re being idiots for valuing Branthwaite at 70m though. I mean, WTF.
Everton will continue to benefit from United.
United keep players for longer which means they settle in the area with family and when the time comes for them to drop a level Everton are a great option for them. We generally don’t hold out for market rates either to facilitate it.

The sample is small and could just include Saha, Howard and Neville. But it will always be an option for Everton.
 

OwlvsFox

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The way I see it is that we also need a cover at LB.

He can play both at center of the defense and LB as well even though he won't contribute as much as Shaw can offensively. I think he did play LB against Fulham and did quite well actually.

Given the injury to Malacia, we must be keen to find a backup for Shaw who hopefully can be our first-choice next season, I can see why Brathwaite is an interesting option even though not ideal.

Perhaps Maguire going the other way + 40m aint a bad option assuming we are getting Deligt and Yoro.
 

cpleigh

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We would have no interest in Maguire, it's not the model we are following now.

It's pretty simple. We don't want to sell him unless you offer a deal that meets our valuation.
People using Saha, Gibson etc as examples are way off the mark.

You wanted them players gone. PSR is done for this year, and btw it sounds like your in a bigger mess than us!

And people saying 'utd is a great move for him' that maybe so... But your are not that attractive ATM. We know, and he knows that come next summer with another great season he could have more attractive moves.

Need I remind you.... You finished 8th last season
 

OwlvsFox

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We would have no interest in Maguire, it's not the model we are following now.

It's pretty simple. We don't want to sell him unless you offer a deal that meets our valuation.
People using Saha, Gibson etc as examples are way off the mark.

You wanted them players gone. PSR is done for this year, and btw it sounds like your in a bigger mess than us!

And people saying 'utd is a great move for him' that maybe so... But your are not that attractive ATM. We know, and he knows that come next summer with another great season he could have more attractive moves.

Need I remind you.... You finished 8th last season
No come on now...Plz don't ever compare Everton with us...Even in the worse of times, we will always be way too ahead of you....

One thing is for certain, we will either get a better prospect than him or we will get him...
 

cpleigh

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No come on now...Plz don't ever compare Everton with us...Even in the worse of times, we will always be way too ahead of you....

One thing is for certain, we will either get a better prospect than him or we will get him...
I haven't compared Utd to Everton? But jeez the arrogance from you... at your worse of times? I grew up in the 80's. Everton were bigger than you. Just as they were in the 00's,10's,20's,30's,40s,50's, etc.

You haven't always been the biggest club in England. Until the start of the PL you were in the arguement, but thats it. Liverpool were far bigger.

Now back to serious talk. Look at the young lad at Hull that we want. Everton are a far bigger club than Palace... but are we more attractive at the minute? Even though we only finished a few points behind them?

probably not.

In the same way you are not as attractive as City, Arsenal, Liverpool etc
 

dinostar77

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I haven't compared Utd to Everton? But jeez the arrogance from you... at your worse of times? I grew up in the 80's. Everton were bigger than you. Just as they were in the 00's,10's,20's,30's,40s,50's, etc.

You haven't always been the biggest club in England. Until the start of the PL you were in the arguement, but thats it. Liverpool were far bigger.

Now back to serious talk. Look at the young lad at Hull that we want. Everton are a far bigger club than Palace... but are we more attractive at the minute? Even though we only finished a few points behind them?

probably not.

In the same way you are not as attractive as City, Arsenal, Liverpool etc
Everton were bigger than Utd during Busby years?

The big three for many many decades have been Utd, Liverpool and arsenal.
 

cpleigh

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Yeah you won more in the Busby years, but pre and after until fergie you didn't.

The big 3 started in the PL era/ Before the PL era Liverpool, Arsenal and Everton were the most succesful.

Things change, 20 years ago nobody would have believed City would be more succesful and more attractive than Utd.

I wasn't getting into a bigger club debate anyway.

i wasn't the one who compared Everton & Utd.
 

adkb

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Yeah you won more in the Busby years, but pre and after until fergie you didn't.

The big 3 started in the PL era/ Before the PL era Liverpool, Arsenal and Everton were the most succesful.

Things change, 20 years ago nobody would have believed City would be more succesful and more attractive than Utd.

I wasn't getting into a bigger club debate anyway.

i wasn't the one who compared Everton & Utd.
But are City really more successful and attractive than United? They have a huge cloud of fraud looming over them. Sure they have collected a crap load of trophies in this span, but they will always come with a huge asterix.

PL keeps changing, once Everton were on top, but that time has long gone. Every club has a chance of being irrelevant. However the goodwill united have accumulated is yet to run out.