Jens Lehmann sacked for racist text

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Without derailing the thread, I went on a date with a German girl a few weeks back. She kept banging on about covid and the masks not working etc. What's going on over there? Sounds nuts.
There's loads of crackpots radicalized by the internet here in Ireland too. Apparently hating masks goes hand in hand with hating immigration.
 

Frasbul

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everclear is a cool band. yeah they still exist.
Actually it is not racist at all. He did not put down Aogo because of his race but because of his words as a pundit. When you say someone is a "quoten sth" than you are saying that he is not qualified for the job but only gets it because of a special personal quality/background.

So in this case it means that Lehman thinks that Aogo only got the job because he is black. This does not mean that he looks down on Aogo because of him being black, but because he does not agree with his opinion/work as a pundit.

Of course, Lehman could have actually meant it in a sarcastic way. Maybe he really likes Aogo. Could be possible, as well.
Was it a clever comment?

Well obviously not. However, the way he said it it is not racist. Of course, in today`s world it is too much to ask from people to understand the difference and he`ll be cancelled for the rest of his life.
Of course Lehman`s explanation is totally stupid and makes no sense.
Das ist Alltagsrassismus. Schäm dich.
 

UweBein

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Actually it is not racist at all. He did not put down Aogo because of his race but because of his words as a pundit. When you say someone is a "quoten sth" than you are saying that he is not qualified for the job but only gets it because of a special personal quality/background.

So in this case it means that Lehman thinks that Aogo only got the job because he is black. This does not mean that he looks down on Aogo because of him being black, but because he does not agree with his opinion/work as a pundit.

Of course, Lehman could have actually meant it in a sarcastic way. Maybe he really likes Aogo. Could be possible, as well.
Was it a clever comment?

Well obviously not. However, the way he said it it is not racist. Of course, in today`s world it is too much to ask from people to understand the difference and he`ll be cancelled for the rest of his life.
Of course Lehman`s explanation is totally stupid and makes no sense.
what ?! :lol::eek::lol:
There is not a shred of ambivalence in Lehmann's message. 100% textbook racism - even worse, he seems to have friends/counterparts who can laugh about that!
 

fck

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what ?! :lol::eek::lol:
There is not a shred of ambivalence in Lehmann's message. 100% textbook racism - even worse, he seems to have friends/counterparts who can laugh about that!
Yes he won the moron post of the day award. Well done "slow clap".
 

Zehner

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I only know far right conspiracy theorists and have read about them having connections mostly to the far right, so I assumed this was actually the case. There will be more diversity for sure, but I still think conspiracy theorists more or less tend to be far right. And as far as I know, most conspiracy theories have some kind of rightwing context or a large amount of followers on the right. QAnon, Holocaust deniers, Reichsbürger for example are definitely right wing conspiracies. Lizard people conspiracies and others show a close and obvious resemblance to antisemitism.

I'd also say having doubts about 9/11 and the likes is - at least to me - less crazy than say being a Reichsbürger or corona denier (there are different shades of craziness). What I'm trying to say is, many of the true conspiracy theory believers are most likely actually people suffer from mental illnesses who should be treated, while the far right are far more people and do not get the "get out of jail free card" due to mental illness, they're assholes, not patients. Also, the conspiracy theorists I know about are absolute losers in life, like, have no job, no proper education, started substance abuse and so on, but not neccessarily stupid, which leads to them having too much time in a bad environment to think about things. They often find refuge in these conspiracy constructs and are able to still feel some kind of superiority due to their extensive youtube knowledge. Main problem is their own brain, I'd say, at least in many cases.
Yes, in general there's a great overlap of conspiracy theorists and far rights. As I said, I believe they use those ideas as recruitment funnels to gradually radicalize people. But there are so many subcultures who have nothing to do with right wing ideology and still buy into it. For instance, a friend of mine of Turkish heritage one day started sending me conspiracy articles about the 9/11 staging, the Gulf war, etc. It made sense because he literally hated the US due to it's actions in the Middle East. At some point, he also started despising Israel for its settlement politics and not soon after he sent me articles about George Soros, the Rothschilds, Bilderberger etc. Further down the road, he finally got to qanon stuff. And that guy was someone who always despised the AfD, supported refugees and so forth.

I know many people like the friend described above, maybe not as "extreme", but still believing some of this nonsense. And they never became right wingers, they just believed that there's truth in these stories. There are so many influences regarding these conspiracy theories.I also believe that's the reason why those corona deniers are such a heterogenous bunch. Just look at the protests, you'll find so many different subcultures there.
 

Pagh Wraith

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Now Aogo himself is in the news for claiming Man City are hard to defend against because "they train until gasification" while doing punditry for Sky. :lol: There is growing evidence that heading the ball may indeed have to be banned.
 

Rektsanwalt

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Now Aogo himself is in the news for claiming Man City are hard to defend against because "they train until gasification" while doing punditry for Sky. :lol: There is growing evidence that heading the ball may indeed have to be banned.
Can't believe these people are not much more cautious as they are professionals in the media business...the shit they spout is absolutely insane sometimes. Are they not following the news and the currenct climate regarding political correctness at all? Jeez
 

stefan92

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Can't believe these people are not much more cautious as they are professionals in the media business...the shit they spout is absolutely insane sometimes. Are they not following the news and the currenct climate regarding political correctness at all? Jeez
It's really unbelievable how stupid and questionable both act in the last days. Of course what Lehmann wrote to him was racist and stupid, making it public and now stating that he believes Lehmann and he should get a second chance after Lehmanns contracts were terminated was already a dick move from Aogo, and now this "gasification" quote. Something you in general should never say, and especially not if you are just these days part of a racism controversy...
 

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I don't think it was a nice thing to say by any stretch of imagination firstly, but racism

( prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized).

We know that ethnic quotas in position exist, so people do need to fill quotas on ethnicity, claiming Aogo was there just because he was black is putting down his abilities definitely, claiming he is employed purely to fill the ethnic quota but I don't see him drawing any link to his lack of ability and colour of his skin in terms of a relation I.e. he isn't claiming he is lesser of ability due to the colour of his skin.

What am I missing?
 

stefan92

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I don't think it was a nice thing to say by any stretch of imagination firstly, but racism

( prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized).

We know that ethnic quotas in position exist, so people do need to fill quotas on ethnicity, claiming Aogo was there just because he was black is putting down his abilities definitely, claiming he is employed purely to fill the ethnic quota but I don't see him drawing any link to his lack of ability and colour of his skin in terms of a relation I.e. he isn't claiming he is lesser of ability due to the colour of his skin.

What am I missing?
Nothing. The fact that Aogo accepted his apology and talked publicly about meeting Lehmann and that he should have a second chance proves that he also sees that message from Lehmann more as a stupid thing than as a real heavy insult.

But those things get out of hand quickly in the current climate of twitter shitstorms etc...

But the thing with Lehmann is - he is a proven idiot, and this story further confirmed it.
 

AngeloHenriquez

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Nothing. The fact that Aogo accepted his apology and talked publicly about meeting Lehmann and that he should have a second chance proves that he also sees that message from Lehmann more as a stupid thing than as a real heavy insult.

But those things get out of hand quickly in the current climate of twitter shitstorms etc...

But the thing with Lehmann is - he is a proven idiot, and this story further confirmed it.
Don't disagree with that :lol:
 

do.ob

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Now Aogo himself is in the news for claiming Man City are hard to defend against because "they train until gasification" while doing punditry for Sky. :lol: There is growing evidence that heading the ball may indeed have to be banned.
While it definitely was a stupid phrase to use on TV, it's perhaps worth pointing out, at least to non German users, that this is a saying that as far as I know predates the Nazi era. And I think it's quite wrong to weigh this up against what Lehmann wrote.
 

Pogue Mahone

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I don't think it was a nice thing to say by any stretch of imagination firstly, but racism

( prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized).

We know that ethnic quotas in position exist, so people do need to fill quotas on ethnicity, claiming Aogo was there just because he was black is putting down his abilities definitely, claiming he is employed purely to fill the ethnic quota but I don't see him drawing any link to his lack of ability and colour of his skin in terms of a relation I.e. he isn't claiming he is lesser of ability due to the colour of his skin.

What am I missing?
You’re missing the context. He seems to think Aogo said something stupid and used the “token black guy” line as a reason for him saying something stupid. Ethnic quotas aren’t about giving stupid people jobs they’re not competent to do. Implying that happens is clearly a dodgy to say.
 

AngeloHenriquez

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You’re missing the context. He seems to think Aogo said something stupid and used the “token black guy” line as a reason for him saying something stupid. Ethnic quotas aren’t about giving stupid people jobs they’re not competent to do. Implying that happens is clearly a dodgy to say.
No doubt it's dodgy and with the world how it is with social media, it was a stupid comment. I just don't like the obsession with labelling things as "Racist", no doubt it was a silly comment and it wasn't nice, just don't think it's racist. Due to racism being a serious problem though, labelling things like this as racism gives it more views. For what it's worth, I fully acknowledge racism is real and a real problem but the fact I have to point that out speaks to the issue; the fear of being labelled racist if you don't agree that something was.

However, on topic, he is known for his antics and stupid comments, fully deserved letting go.
 

DoomSlayer

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He mistakenly sent the message directly to Aogo instead of another party. His intention was to be racist behind Aogo's back, but his imbecility knows no bounds and he accidentally sent it directly to Aogo.
How is that even possible? It would mean he actually knows Aogo or previously communicated with him. :confused:
 

Nickelodeon

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Just for understanding, had Lehmann used the phrase that "Aogo is a "diversity" hire", would it still have been racist?

Please don't kill me.
 

OL29

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Just for understanding, had Lehmann used the phrase that "Aogo is a "diversity" hire", would it still have been racist?

Please don't kill me.
The definition of racism is pretty narrow so people can argue that either way but the fact of the matter is by making comments like that you’re reducing Aogo to his race, something that wouldn’t be done to white counterparts. Strictly speaking, you could argue that it’s not racist but it’s certainly indicative prejudice.
 

Acrobat7

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How is that even possible? It would mean he actually knows Aogo or previously communicated with him. :confused:
Both played for Germany and Schalke. Both work(ed) for German broadcasts. It is pretty certain that they know each other personally
 

Hansi Fick

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How is that even possible? It would mean he actually knows Aogo or previously communicated with him. :confused:
Apparently the Whatsapp screenshot Aogo posted on Instagram of the message contained the information that they've last been messaging in 2019
 

Wibble

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Just for understanding, had Lehmann used the phrase that "Aogo is a "diversity" hire", would it still have been racist?
Yes. Just slightly less insulting but the racism is just as obvious. Both are saying he got hired for his skin colour and not his abilities.
 

Isotope

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The definition of racism is pretty narrow so people can argue that either way but the fact of the matter is by making comments like that you’re reducing Aogo to his race, something that wouldn’t be done to white counterparts. Strictly speaking, you could argue that it’s not racist but it’s certainly indicative prejudice.
Diversity includes gender, age, and sexual orientation also; not exclusive to race or skin color.