Jordan Henderson : voices player welfare fears | Rice: Obscene schedule of games

Josep Dowling

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Everything being said by Henderson, and now Klopp has nothing to do with player welfare, it’s about Liverpool Football Club.

The gap between them and City has widened, games are piling up and City have better squad depth. All of this is orchestrated by Liverpool. The last couple of years they had very favourable gaps between games over the Xmas period compared to title rivals. This year they don’t, alongside AFCON, so now they’re crying about it, as they always do.
 
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Devil’s Trident

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So you think we should care less about players' welfare because they earn lots? What about lower league players?

They are obviously fortunate in the sense they can earn vast fortunes, but the crap about 'gratitude', 'have a duty' and 'more than a game' makes having a sensible discussion on this impossible.
Try to read again to understand it and this time pay attention because it completely flew over your head.
 

Lentwood

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Employee’s welfare secondary to employer’s need to generate income. Hold the front door. Won’t somebody think about these poor multi millionaires? Do me a favour.
So at what point them is it acceptable for an employer to needlessly put their employees at risk? £50K per annum? £100K per annum? £1m per annum? Just so I know.
 

Zen86

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Has a charity or outreach program been set up for these poor footballers yet? It's definitely a cause I can get onboard with!
 

Abraxas

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It's the same every year. Somebody out of Liverpool moaning and groaning.

The competition is how it is. There are commercial reasons, but whatever the reasons are, you know they exist. So perhaps, rather than continue to moan about the same thing you should setup your squad to have the depth to rotate heavily while also competing.

Or you accept that every other club is in the same position, so if they don't rotate and you do, you may have a lesser quality of player but you should have the edge in fitness. If it's so bad for the players you should have a key advantage.

As for Covid, isn't it just a case of get on with things like every other worker? It's not ideal for anyone. The virus isnt going to magically disappear after Christmas, what is the realistic expectation? You can only ever kick the can down the road at the moment. So pretty much...get on with it. It's bugger all to do with money, it's to do with the fact that we all have a duty to get on with things to the best of out ability otherwise what happens?
 

thegregster

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You can only really catch covid indoors. So players are catching it in the dressing rooms or outside football. So the solution is vaccines,reduce social contacts and temporary individual dressing rooms.
 

MackRobinson

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https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...n-henderson-voices-player-welfare-fears-covid

As a working class adult earning peanuts compared to his salary, I do not understand his outburst here. In this covid era, there are more people out there sacrificing more than footballers. Playing a few more matches and he start complaining about welfare for him and his family.

How about those healthcare workers who sacrifice day and night, not only during this December period. He is paid more than them or rather the workers deserved his salary more than he does. Even those people working at supermarkets are more worthy of a shout than him kicking a few balls.
You making peanuts compared to a footballer is irrelevant. Quit counting other people’s money and creating false equivalencies. Absolutely tired of these contextless, red herring arguments about how much athletes make. Go read a labor economics book ffs
 

MackRobinson

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I don't get what exactly is his point? Does he want a medal for providing for his family?
Maybe they are not getting enough respect from their family, and not people around them? He can apways skip games if he wants to, I am pretty sure many player do that.

Poor footballers, having to work 3-4 hours a day in one of best facilites in the world with small group of people. While their entire family is protected, doesn't have to work anything, having everything they need in their house in this covid period so having less possibility of catching the covid than average person.

How about families where entire household has to work for 8-10 hours every day in crowded places, poor conditions, etc., and only for not being able to pay covid threatment once they get it.
Another ignorant post
 

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RuudTom83

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Any fringe players at these big clubs must love the Christmas period as it gives them more chances to play.

All season the top teams fight for the european place, take the money for doing so, then moan endlessly about having to play the extra games.

It’s the clubs outside the big 6 that should be moaning but we hear less from them.
 

dwd

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The last couple of years they had very favourable gaps between games over the Xmas period compared to title rivals. This year they don’t, alongside AFCON, so now they’re crying about it, as they always do.
Haven't they got the longest rest over Christmas again? I may be wrong.
 

Mr Pigeon

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I think the opening post is an example of why footballers tend to stay away from public discussion. Even if they make a good point, most of the time they're always met with "you earn a gazillion a week, so stop crying".
Nonsense. They are paid millions to dance for our entertainment. If they're ever out with their families I also barge past their youngest, usually knocking them to the ground, and demand several selfies. If the player doesn't accept then I tell them that my taxes pay their salaries and keep shouting it until I'm blue in the face.

The moment they sign their contract is the moment they give up the right to be treated like a human.
 

ShinjiNinja26

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If that’s the case Jordan then maybe Liverpool should just forfeit their remaining games if you don’t want to continue playing. You won’t to that though will you? Sick of these cnuts making out like everything’s for the greater good when in fact it’s only ever to benefit Liverpool.
 

Cascarino

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If that’s the case Jordan then maybe Liverpool should just forfeit their remaining games if you don’t want to continue playing. You won’t to that though will you? Sick of these cnuts making out like everything’s for the greater good when in fact it’s only ever to benefit Liverpool.
That’s a bit of a false dichotomy isn’t it?

“The volume of games players have to play in a short space of time is concerning and it’d be good to have a discussion and hear from other players”

“Well then if you believe that quit the league now, you won’t do that though will you heh?”
 

ShinjiNinja26

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That’s a bit of a false dichotomy isn’t it?

“The volume of games players have to play in a short space of time is concerning and it’d be good to have a discussion and hear from other players”

“Well then if you believe that quit the league now, you won’t do that though will you heh?”
Maybe he should have a word with his own manager then who just the other day was advocating the league carry on and doesn’t temporarily postpone as he didn’t think it would change anything.
 

Cascarino

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Maybe he should have a word with his own manager then who just the other day was advocating the league carry on and doesn’t temporarily postpone as he didn’t think it would change anything.
When Klopp said that, plenty said that he was doing so to give Liverpool an advantage. When Henderson advocates for the inverse, many in this thread claim he’s doing so to benefit Liverpool. Could it be that they’re both just giving their opinion earnestly?
 

90 + 5min

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https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...n-henderson-voices-player-welfare-fears-covid

As a working class adult earning peanuts compared to his salary, I do not understand his outburst here. In this covid era, there are more people out there sacrificing more than footballers. Playing a few more matches and he start complaining about welfare for him and his family.

How about those healthcare workers who sacrifice day and night, not only during this December period. He is paid more than them or rather the workers deserved his salary more than he does. Even those people working at supermarkets are more worthy of a shout than him kicking a few balls.
Agree with Henderson. Don't pay players their saleries and send them all to early vacation. Give ManCIty title and start planing for next season. I guess that is what he means.
 

ShinjiNinja26

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When Klopp said that, plenty said that he was doing so to give Liverpool an advantage. When Henderson advocates for the inverse, many in this thread claim he’s doing so to benefit Liverpool. Could it be that they’re both just giving their opinion earnestly?
Or maybe Klopp said that when the Liverpool squad was relatively unaffected at the time, now they seem to be getting a few cases the captain’s coming out wanting to put the brakes on the whole thing.
 

Amar__

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How does that have anything with winter break and Henderson fighting against tiredness?

I am having a mare because you don't agree with my opinion? That's great communication from the staff member of this forum, no wonder that the quality dropped so much in recent years and older members generally don't bother spend so much time here posting anymore.
 
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B20

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Some incredibly bitter and petty people in this thread.
 

SilentWitness

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How does that have anything with winter break and Henderson fighting against tiredness?

I am having a mare because you don't agree with my opinion? That's great communication from the staff member of this forum, no wonder that the quality dropped so much in recent years and older members generally don't bother spend so much time here posting anymore.
you’re having a mare because you’re posting ignorant rubbish, yeah.
 

Withnail

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https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...n-henderson-voices-player-welfare-fears-covid

As a working class adult earning peanuts compared to his salary, I do not understand his outburst here. In this covid era, there are more people out there sacrificing more than footballers. Playing a few more matches and he start complaining about welfare for him and his family.

How about those healthcare workers who sacrifice day and night, not only during this December period. He is paid more than them or rather the workers deserved his salary more than he does. Even those people working at supermarkets are more worthy of a shout than him kicking a few balls.
This strange correlation between how much money a person makes and their ability to complain about how they are being treated or what they are expected to put up with. It's absolutely baffling. If there's something objectively wrong with your working conditions then you have a right to complain and have your voice heard by the powers that be.

Half the post is irrelevant whataboutery.
 

Posh Red

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Players and managers have been complaining about the scheduling of fixtures long before Covid. We have a voracious appetite to consume live sport, especially football in this country and with the hundreds of millions of pounds invested by TV and when you think about the global tv audience too, the pressure has never been higher on players - ultimately it’s them that have to be fit to play.
Modern sport science has highlighted and honed the recovery process after matches - we’ve heard about mangers complaints because they can’t train new systems or practise certain tactics because the players are just constantly doing recovery work. The more they play, the bigger the risk of breaking down with injury. English Football is intense physical labour, and players are only human. Covid on top of that is an extra worry. Everybody on the planet is at risk from catching this awful virus, working or not and once you have it you then you risk bringing it home to family and friends.
The amount that footballers earn is kinda irrelevant here - all the money in the world can’t stop you getting injured or sick. You can kinda see his point, and comparing to health workers to tug the heart strings is a little disingenuous.
Not sure if this is absolutely correct. The fixture pile up on one hand is hard on the players, but on the other hand it generates lots of income via broadcasting deals, which ultimately ends up being paid to the players, no? Would Klopp, Henderson, and any other player or manager be happy to accept a pay cut if it meant a less congested fixture?
 

Plant0x84

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Not sure if this is absolutely correct. The fixture pile up on one hand is hard on the players, but on the other hand it generates lots of income via broadcasting deals, which ultimately ends up being paid to the players, no? Would Klopp, Henderson, and any other player or manager be happy to accept a pay cut if it meant a less congested fixture?
I take your point but that’s not what I meant, you’ve taken it out of context slightly.
I meant it doesn’t matter how much you earn - you are still at risk from Covid, and moreover you are still entitled to certain working conditions. When your body is your tool of the trade so to speak, and you’re being pushed to and sometimes past breaking point through no fault of your own then you are entitled to raise a grievance.
 

Amar__

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you’re having a mare because you’re posting ignorant rubbish, yeah.
Whether we like it or not, the life of a footballer is very different to a 'normal' occupation and thus should be treated as such.

Being a footballer gives you immense priviliges that other members of society don't have.

If skipping games during Xmas end up being a detriment to their career then of course it is an issue but I honestly don't think it will be to any of them.
 

Devil’s Trident

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Sorry, your highly intelligent points are just too much for my little brain:lol:
My points were not highly intelligent but you might not be as smart as you think you are so I don’t know why are you laughing and what for because quite clearly you missed the point I was raising.

Also it irks me when people say football is just entertainment. Really ? Just entertainment ? Bollocks. Its demeaning and insulting to the fans who has supported the club through generations and have put their hard earned money and time and follow them all around the world no matter what. It’s a part of your identity embedded in your culture giving a purpose to your life. These are not hollow or crap words, they mean something. The club becomes a part of you becomes a part of your family. The love the support the loyalty you show to your football team only leaves you the day you die. You don’t follow a football team from your grandad to your father then passing on to your children just because it’s fecking entertainment.
 

Cheimoon

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It's funny how Guardiola and Henderson are basically making the same point, yet, Guardiola's thread mostly has bitter posts in it and this one mostly understanding posts (until the current page, maybe). I wish some posters could temporarily shut off their anti-Pool and anti-City mindsets and consider the points made for their merit, but I guess that's too much to ask for.
Don't have a problem with his viewpoint although others may not have the luxury to demand such working conditions of their employers. Yes knowledge workers are incredibly lucky to be able to keep making money through this crisis right from the comfort of their homes without having to put themselves or their families at risk.

Other's don't have that luxury whether or not they provide an essential service. They need to earn to make ends meet so the choice really is death by covid or by hunger.

I personally would be much more supportive of Henderson's demands if he also promised to donate his salary during the lockdown weeks to a charity working to help families impacted by the pandemic.
Footballers might help set precedent though. The argument 'they're privileged so can't complain' is destructive, as eventually virtually everyone has some level of privilege over others - if not inside the UK, then outside of it. ('Think flipping burgers for 10 hours straight without minimal breaks is hard? Try being a farmer in North Korea!') The opposite is much better: no matter your pay and benefits, you still need to have healthy and humane work conditions.

It's a bit of a stretch maybe, but ultimately, the more common that attitude is in society, the more likely it is to spread to every workplace.
Maybe he should have a word with his own manager then who just the other day was advocating the league carry on and doesn’t temporarily postpone as he didn’t think it would change anything.
It's different subjects. Klopp was arguing that there is no point in a COVID-19 break if COVID-19 is still around just as much right after the break. Henderson is talking about player welfare in general. For that matter, Klopp has also since his arrival in England criticized the congested schedule, especially concerning the matches around the holidays and the lack of a winter break.
Whether we like it or not, the life of a footballer is very different to a 'normal' occupation and thus should be treated as such.

Being a footballer gives you immense priviliges that other members of society don't have.

If skipping games during Xmas end up being a detriment to their career then of course it is an issue but I honestly don't think it will be to any of them.
I agree with @Silent Witness's replies to your posts in this thread. My opinion is above: just because they're in a privileged job doesn't mean that they shouldn't have a healthy workplace.

And no, footballers can't just say that they're tired today. Except if the club physio agrees, but then it's the same as any injury.
 
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Carl

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https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...n-henderson-voices-player-welfare-fears-covid

As a working class adult earning peanuts compared to his salary, I do not understand his outburst here. In this covid era, there are more people out there sacrificing more than footballers. Playing a few more matches and he start complaining about welfare for him and his family.

How about those healthcare workers who sacrifice day and night, not only during this December period. He is paid more than them or rather the workers deserved his salary more than he does. Even those people working at supermarkets are more worthy of a shout than him kicking a few balls.
So because they're paid loads of money they're not allowed to have legitimate concerns about their health? Weird take.
 

Withnail

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How does that have anything with winter break and Henderson fighting against tiredness?

I am having a mare because you don't agree with my opinion? That's great communication from the staff member of this forum, no wonder that the quality dropped so much in recent years and older members generally don't bother spend so much time here posting anymore.
Oh dear :lol:
 

T00lsh3d

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I'm not sure what you get paid should have to do with your welfare?

Anyone care to explain?
Well the argument will say that the more you’re paid the more gruelling a job you should be able to endure. Your directors and exec board should work a 65+ hour week because they get paid loads etc etc Not saying it’s right but that’s the argument and it’s just being applied to footballers playing through winter/injuries/pandemic
 

TheReligion

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Well the argument will say that the more you’re paid the more gruelling a job you should be able to endure. Your directors and exec board should work a 65+ hour week because they get paid loads etc etc Not saying it’s right but that’s the argument and it’s just being applied to footballers playing through winter/injuries/pandemic
Well we all know that that's not the case though don't we?

Nor is it right and proper.
 

padr81

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I'm not sure what you get paid should have to do with your welfare?

Anyone care to explain?
Because in planet deluded people, they believe that having money means you body is immune to being overworked or overstressed, also immune to a disease that 90 players currently have and you push away any mental health issues or worries by crying in a Ferrari. Mostly the people posting this are idiots, who believe their 9-5 job is somehow harder on their health and mental state than that of a footballer.
 

Baneofthegame

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Why can’t we just do what other leagues do and have a winter break? December 12th-25th and resume on Boxing Day.