Jose Mourinho - Was He Right?

[bosnian_red]

He was right that we needed reinforcements and the squad wasnt good enough to win titles. Everybody knew that, if you genuinely felt we could win the title without significant additions (and the right players) then that is just pure bias speaking. Nobody argued that. Part of that was his fault because most of his signings were a waste of money and ignored key areas.

What he did though is basically fully gave up, fell out with everyone, made a huge mess just because he didnt get a few of the signings he wanted. What he shouldve done was gone on with his job, still tried to improve and develop the team and in the background work hard to complete transfers.

Ole took over and has us around where we should be based on ability (as in 3rd-6th is pretty close). We want to develop as a side and improve, but you also don't start wars with everyone just because you didn't get 1 player (a lot of his targets were dumb anyway).

 

[Roboc7]

You very clearly don't.

Next time I’m having a bad day i’ll think, hey remember how Jose kept us above Liverpool and it’ll make me laugh and feel better. I’ll share it with others so they can enjoy it as well, thanks for sharing. You summed up how we all felt after that game at Anfield, thanks Jose you kept us above them. Genius.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

Next time I’m having a bad day i’ll think, hey remember how Jose kept us above Liverpool and it’ll make me laugh and feel better. I’ll share it with others so they can enjoy it as well, thanks for sharing. You summed up how we all felt after that game at Anfield, thanks Jose you kept us above them. Genius.

Are you ok man...?

 

[Ban]

Right, but he's had over 20 games to put in place some kind of brand of football with a squad containing some very good players...

Yet, the football is rubbish, as it was with Mourinho.

And his subs are often very weird, and his selections are increasingly daft, and he has no pedigree of delivering decent footy in the PL...

Your crusade against Ole is really tiresome.

 

[DRM]

Yes, yes he was.

Right about Pogba
Right about Martial
Right about the fact our squad is shit/average

Did he go about it the right way? No, but he is a pathological winner and if he feels he doesnt have the tools to win, he goes mental, which we kinda knew anyway.

 

[Roboc7]

Are you ok man...?

Never better, let’s make a pact next time Jose is on tv, we’ll raise a glass and toast ‘thanks Jose you kept us above Liverpool.’ No need to reply we’re on the same page now.

After all as you have rightly and very intelligently picked up its no coincidence that now Jose has gone Liverpool are no longer below us and might even win the league and/or champions league. If only Ole could have kept us above them like Jose.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

Your crusade against Ole is really tiresome.

Not against Ole, for Man Utd.

And against the endless laughable decisions of the Glazers.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Mourinho signed an entire first XI and complained about everything under the sun. The guy deserved to be sacked.

As for the squad's mentality - for me it's more about ability. I actually think in players like Smalling, Jones, Shaw, McT, Fred, Rashford, Lingard you have guys who really care about United but, in most cases, are actually pretty average players. We are not a mid table team, the squad we have is better than most other PL teams, but the gap in quality between us and City is frightening and the gap between us and LPool is still too big.

 

[Buster15]

Your crusade against Ole is really tiresome.

No one makes you read his posts...

 

[Web of Bissaka]

The only thing he was right is questioning and complaining about the mentality, attitude and professionalism of our players.
And the competitiveness and mindset of the people who are managing the club.

Then again, that's nothing new.

Spoiler

It's two problems that have started way early around the seasons roughly surrounding 2010 and the years from then on. The only difference is we got a huge key person/a big game player that time, that that carry all these problems with ease. Now he's retired and the problems escalating even further and continues getting clearer and clearer.

Anyway, therein lies the problem. Instead of focusing on moaning and complaining, he's not solving the problem with the right solutions -- directly addressing the problems to its very sources and work on it. It's his job to fix it, but he didn't take self-responsibility and instead resort to blaming others, shifting responsibilities, deflecting any blames away from him... and apparently still doing.

 

[DSG]

Look, of course he was right. Every team has weaknesses that need to be shored up. It’s like making a convincing argument that the sky is blue.

The signing of a contract extension knowing he was going to sabotage himself, the inability to relate with the younger players, the sour attitude, those were just additional negatives that made the team WORSE than the sum of its parts.

 

[United_We_Stand]

We are lacking in quality because Mourinho failed miserably in the transfer market.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

People may have said this but as time ran on under Mourinho, and indeed in any bad times situation, people tend to become more hyperbolic as they look for the "one solution". I think on reflection most would agree with me.

On the flip side, everything WAS merry once Jose was gone. For about 15 games.

Which tells me, its the players that have been cnuts all along. And now theyve gone back to phoning it in now that the buzz of "beating" jose has worn off. Theyre a bunch of second stringers that only came for the party. The state of the world and hard on for social media darlings has placed them in starting line ups. How lingard got a start last night over anyone else, including fred the mascot, is anyones guess. In the game at west ham he did the same thing, jogged around and did feck all yet stayed on for the 90. How does that happen? In what club, any club, does someone that shit keep their place in a must win game? Something stinks in our club, and for all his faults it was jose.

 

[Red Comet]

He was only right in the sense that the clubs needed reinforcements.

He was wrong in that he was trying to buy players towards the peak end of their careers and willing to sell our young players to do that. It would be the equivalent of him selling KDB, Mo Salah, Lukaku etc. at Chelsea. Even if he was backed all the way, what we will end up with is a squad full of players over 28 bought in a extreme prices with minimal resale value, and a footballing style that is counter to what we are all about. And there is no guarantee of success either - he is on the waned and his football is looking more and more outdated with the emergence of Guardiola, Klopp and Pochettino.

The club was right to sack him.

 

[AshRK]

Yes he was right but he didn't do anything to solve. If ope also encounters si.ilar issue come next season then we must ask seriousl question beyond the manager. The problem with some of our fans is they are so obsessed with some philosophy crap that they don't want to admit that some of the players we have are just not good enough. They always counter with "hey manager must improve players" if that is the case why didn't pep improve sagna, zabaleta, korolov,clichy, nolito, fernando, kelechi ienacho(spelling), bravo, hart etc. The likes of young, rojo, smalling ,jones, mata, lingard, darmian, herrera, matic cannot be improved. Important the deadwoods are let go and we don't have too many squad players.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Right, but he's had over 20 games to put in place some kind of brand of football with a squad containing some very good players...

What's your point here? He should have started implementing a particular brand of football as soon as he began his interim gig (he's been permanent manager for about three weeks) - and then, reasonably, had us playing that brand of football consistently by now (factor in injuries, lack of preseason, lack of a single reinforcement having been brought in)?

If so, you're being extremely demanding for someone seemingly more than willing to cut his predecessor some slack.

 

[Ekeke]

3rd in points since Ole took over and Liverpool is a lot better than last season.

Sure and City were better last season. Liverpool might not be as good next

I'm not saying we cant improve we obviously can, but the idea that these players we currently have cannot do much better than where we are is wrong. They already did. Maybe we'd be 3rd instead of 2nd. Thats still better than now

 

[Fanatic 00237]

You could have gone without a childish 'your favorite manager' part. Crux of the problem is Ed making footballing decisions. He couldn't follow blindly transfer requests? Will be fun if he'll do the same with Ole, following with his famous briefings.. It doesn't matter if Jose fell out with DoFs cause he's not at the club now and we need a DOF and a proper structure. Not a banker who treats the club like real life Disneyland.

Oh sorry dude, it was a bit unnecessary, I admit. (Although for what it’s worth, the “favourite manager” thing wasn’t directed at you)

Concerning the footballing decisions, Ed backed Mounrinho and always backed the previous managers fully. He only put his veto in the last window when, in his view, it didn’t make sense financially. Right or wrong, he did what he thought was in the best interest of the institution. Well, he might do so at some point for Ole but having a DoF can still be an issue because the manager still has to agree with whosoever is DoF.

Again, I’m not saying Ed is doing a great job and having a DoF will be unnecessary. Was responding to the points you made with respect to Ed rejecting Mourinho’s transfer demands even after extending his contract. Even with the benefit of hindsight, I can’t say I disagree with any. Regardless, Ed won’t go anywhere tomorrow anyway, and like I said, with or without DoF, he will still veto the big money signings.

 

[WensleyMU]

Of course he was. Anyone who says other wise should be ignored and considered little more than a low brow wum.

 

[bleedred]

It's easy to complain about the problems, which he did and was right about, than finding solutions for it, which he couldn't after 5 transfer windows.

 

[Velvet Revolver]

Not sure what you think he could have done? He was the manager, or are he said eventually "im just a coach", implying that woodward was playing millionaires football manager. Which would explain why jose didnt seem to have play for some players we brought in.

That's an excuse. Managers should know how to build a team with or without money, thats what they are paid for! how did he manage a team like porto and inter? they didn't have money. Ed was to blame to some extent too, but Jose's ego got the better of him. He had fall outs with almost all of the players in the club (ones he bought too) he benched Pogba and played McT to prove a point. He had some good players at his disposal instead of playing at their strengths he tried to imbibe his defensive tactics which was not what they were bought for. Financial matters were not upto him, but he could have used his acumen and create a tactically driven side to play at their strengths.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

That's an excuse. Managers should know how to build a team with or without money, thats what they are paid for! how did he manage a team like porto and inter? they didn't have money. Ed was to blame to some extent too, but Jose's ego got the better of him. He had fall outs with almost all of the players in the club (ones he bought too) he benched Pogba and played McT to prove a point. He had some good players at his disposal instead of playing at their strengths he tried to imbibe his defensive tactics which was not what they were bought for. Financial matters were not upto him, but he could have used his acumen and create a tactically driven side to play at their strengths.

Jose was given whatever he wanted at inter. The DOF said he just gave it all to jose, and they won a treble. No back seat managing, just let him get on with it. Its not about the money, its about backing the manger. Something woody does not do. He backs his shirt sales, and sponsor revenues.

 

[ti vu]

He was right that we needed reinforcements and the squad wasnt good enough to win titles. Everybody knew that, if you genuinely felt we could win the title without significant additions (and the right players) then that is just pure bias speaking. Nobody argued that. Part of that was his fault because most of his signings were a waste of money and ignored key areas.

What he did though is basically fully gave up, fell out with everyone, made a huge mess just because he didnt get a few of the signings he wanted. What he shouldve done was gone on with his job, still tried to improve and develop the team and in the background work hard to complete transfers.

Ole took over and has us around where we should be based on ability (as in 3rd-6th is pretty close). We want to develop as a side and improve, but you also don't start wars with everyone just because you didn't get 1 player (a lot of his targets were dumb anyway).

This is arguable.

How we played into this season was different than last season. It left us more exposed than last season ever.

The fall out with everyone is questionable too. OGS approach looks right compare to Mourinho public shaming approach, and yet same culprit looks like they have Mourinho stealing their breakfast.

Or one simple example. When Mourinho talked about Valencia came back this season unfit, there were people jumping talking about appearance that Valencia didn't look unfit, how falling out with even him meant Mourinho was just seeking fight. Fast forward, Ole gave lip service to Valencia, played him and everyone could see he's finished and he seemed to disappear since. Or Luke Shaw. Mourinho didn't go about his fitness this season, and Shaw revealed himself Mourinho gave him encouragement during the break to work. This same guy played terribly pre season just to go on to have a decent full season without all these niggling injuries like the past 2.

So is it always Mourinho attacked everyone, and not working hard (in off season) with motivation work with his players?

Time will tell, but some players starting look like reverting to type in front of our own eyes.

Edit: And regarding transfers, DOF before the next permanent manager- didn't happen like that, and doesn't look like there would be a DOF. Noise around winter window about getting some reinforcement, just for OGS to go about happy with the squad. In our recent form, is he really (see Valencia point). Herrera, Martial situation doesn't look like OGS had input. OGS just few months into the job and had Martial wage quadrupled. Nobody can believe that shite, just like any new manager can't fully trust a player during honey moon period.

 

[Ban]

No one makes you read his posts...

Are you his lawyer?

 

[KirkDuyt]

Isnt mentality and attitude something the coach is responsible for? It's not like he's there to teach them how to do an elastico. He's there to create team spirit and motivate the lads.

Putting people in the right position works too obviously.

 

[Champagne Football]

Jose is the type of manager who laughs at the thought of signing a player like Harry Maguire for £17 million from Hull, then cries like a baby to sign him a year later for £80 million. His record for spotting potential to develop is non existent.

Harry Maguire, Virgil Van Dijk, Niklas Sule, Upamecano are just names Jose could have brought in during all the transfer windows he had here.

 

[ti vu]

Isnt mentality and attitude something the coach is responsible for? It's not like he's there to teach them how to do an elastico. He's there to create team spirit and motivate the lads.

Putting people in the right position works too obviously.

Perhaps you mistake for morale as the term. People growing up and develop their mindset, mentality. Some don't have a good mind set and you can't teach change/that. Morale may affect attitude for short term (Mourinho takes full responsibility), but at the same time, the core mindset would mean individual can revert back to type most of the time.

Look at our recent form, unless OGS turned Mourinho secretly behind the scene, some players looks just like how they were playing under Mourinho at the beginning of the season.

Edit: and it's not just the manager/head coach that is the sole responsible for the team spirit as they're not always given full control, players can go behind the coach back to the big boss too. Big boss can spike the team spirit backing his favorite, messing with the manager/head coach plan. Let just try another example: Ancelotti is often known as easy going guy, look at his stint at Bayern. Or how his second season at Madrid turned for the worse with the whole James and Bale situation.

 

[redmanx]

What Mourinho did or didn't do is no longer relevant, but he was right that many of our players don't have the right attitude and skills. We need a major clear out still, Smalling, Jones, Rojo, Valencia, Young, Darmian, are simply not good enough while Fred needs to prove in the rest of this season that he is. Then theres Pogba; nobody doubts he can play and could become a great player but his attitude stinks, its clear he doesnt want to be at United and though his form improved greatly when Ole took over its pretty clear Pogba has been playing to the gallery of those who might buy him, though his performance against Barcelona was woeful; personally, Ive never thought he was worth £89 million but if we can get the same for him it will be good business.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

Football heritage.

Unfortunately, he got a lot of transfers wrong.

 

[AfroBuffalo]

Mourinho in

 

[tjb]

My take on it is that Mourinho was completely right, but neither him nor Van Gaal were fully invested in a rebuild as neither had much too prove or were invested in the club.
Mourinho knew United needed to rebuild, but was more concerned about his image as a winner and so favored signing big players and playing negatively, as opposed to the progressive build that we needed. This is why he was so publically demanding, he wanted to show everyone that this united situation was not his fault. He did not care about the club, the culture or the future of the squad, and this showed in how he treated the people above and below him.
To undergo a successful rebuild, it requires someone seeking to build a legacy or a person with vested interest in that entity, as it can take a lot of time and may have a few rough patches. Mourinho has already achieved everything there is to achieve in the current game, and instead of giving him a team that can strengthen his legacy in the game, we gave him a squad that embarrassed him in relation with his peers, as expectations were still too high. With Ole, we now have a manager that is willing to fully invest in a rebuild and would be willing to get through the brunt and gruff thats required to see it succeed. Of course lots of investment is needed, and he still requires the right helpp in deciding who should be signed and sold over the course of this period. But now for the first time since Moyes, we finally have a manager more concerened about the future of the club than what the public thinks about them, and hopefully this translates to success.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

He was right when talking about the lack of quality and commitment we have.
He ultimately couldn't fix it though, so he needed to go.

Most people knew he was right, and I personally understood him losing his shit about not being backed for a CB last summer when we’re still so fexking shite in that position and haven’t spent “big” there since Rio bloody Ferdinand.
But that said there is way to do things and Mourinho’s dummy spitting and and turning an entire club toxic isn’t it. He sabotaged it for himself.

 

[MackRobinson]

I see the Mourinho Revisionist Defense Force has found their voice. Glad to have you guys back.

Doesn't matter if he was "right' since he bought a lot of the crap that's currently in the squad. Where is @cheeky_backheel to tell us he's not responsible for the players he bought

 

[Velvet Revolver]

Jose was given whatever he wanted at inter. The DOF said he just gave it all to jose, and they won a treble. No back seat managing, just let him get on with it. Its not about the money, its about backing the manger. Something woody does not do. He backs his shirt sales, and sponsor revenues.

Agree to certain extent, the club should have backed Jose. But after 2 full seasons of transfer activity dont you think the CEO/DOF should expect the manager to do something more than just buying more players? forget fighting for the title we were struggling to get into top 4!

So based on your comments the entire blame for our lack of success is Ed and all the mangers before & including Jose are not to blame one bit!

 

[shamans]

Yeah, not quite.

What I've stated is what Mourinho actually achieved, I've also stated that he needed to go, and played rubbish football...

Take a step back and try to understand that not everything is binary, and not everyone who holds slightly different opinion to yourselves is worthy of mockery and rudeness - in doing so, you're showing yourselves up.

I respect Mourinho as a manager for what he's tangibly achieved, same as any other manager - I don't subscribe to tabloid-esque opinions on managers, good or bad, because in reality, I don't care about personalities...

I don't care that Mourinho was the big bad wolf, just as I don't care in the slightest that Olé is a 'nice guy', or even a club legend, I couldn't give a feck in fact.

All I care about, is the best for Manchester United, and that's it.

Mourinho is our most successful manager post-SAF, that is the reality - stating so isn't showing favour to him. And he also took over a flat, lost dressing room and had to implement his own footy after LvG.

My opinion, unpopular as it is, is that Ole will do very well to replicate Mourinho's first 2 seasons here.

The danger is his popularity vs his managerial abilities. Because I assure you right now, he will not be judged to the same standard as Mourinho was / is - in fact some 'fans' are already excusing his failings before they've happened.

All I'm calling for is consistency and fairness in how we judge our managers and what we demand for Man Utd.

He didnt achieve crap for what we got him for. We wanted a league title. He failed. Total failure.

He is a smart man though and manipulated some fans to still think oh poor Mourinho had a bad squad when he was the one who made it so bad

 

[Ronaldo's ego]

Of course he was right, it was just clouded by the way he went about things. He couldn’t fix it and had to go. As much I’d love to be proven wrong, I can’t see Ole taking us back to where we should be

 

[RedIan]

We need someone fully committed as fergie was when he took over. He overhauled the whole club from the canteen to the youth team and upwards. He invested for the future and we later reaped the rewards for many years.
Mourinho and van gal were just passing through, whats more whether they were right or wrong matters not, they were not right for this club and ive never been so bored watching the games in 40 years. It was dire.

Ole has the commitment and character, give him time.

Who else remembers the Fergie out chants and banners? Good job we didn't listen to the moaners then!!!

 

[Random Task]

Jose spent £400 million in player acquisitions over the 2.5 years he managed the club and not a single one of them could you call a success - including Pogba.

So no, he was wrong.

 

[Livvie]

I've been nearly 20 years on the Caf. During that time I've been depressed about United's performances, but never been depressed by the Caf until now.

Thanks to Ole, we had the best few weeks since Fergie retired. Right now that euphoria has worn off but isn't that understandable - at the end of the day, it's still Mourinho's team, not Ole's. I'll reserve judgement until I see what changes he makes in the summer, and how well his buys do. We've been awful for years - not Ole's fault, so why are we expecting the same players to somehow be brilliant? They're not - a lot of them are over-hyped as well as overpaid. There's no guarantee that a different selection last night would have produced a different result - maybe Ole did make mistakes, but we'll never know. Even Fergie made mistakes though. That isn't to say I wasn't nervous the very second I saw Phil Jones name on the list, especially at RB - even though he has had some good games recently, I'm never confident about him. We haven't had a great defence for a long time - our good defensive record in the main has been down to poor finishing and David De Gea.

I will be very disappointed if we don't buy defenders in the summer, but ffs, wait and see before consigning Ole to the rubbish bin. Some of you turn quicker than a figure skater on speed.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

He was always right about our squad holes and reinforcements needed. Regardless of how poor he coached the team in the end.

Solksjaer's stint has put paid to the ludicrous notion that merely replacing him would fix everything. Ole has worked miracles with bare bones