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Jude Bellingham | Signed for Madrid
- Thread starter davidmichael
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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I’m saying they occupy the same positions, there’s been a few times this season where De Bruyne has been in that Right advance Cm position, in fact that’s where he plays a lot of his football.
Also he isn’t any less careless with the ball, for example he has 79% pass accuracy this season in the league and last season or the season before was the player who was the most dispossessed in the league. This is due to him constantly looking to exploit gaps with his crossing and creative passing, the flip side of this is that he will never be the Uber elite playmaker the likes of Xavi were who would rarely have pass accuracy less than 85% in his peak years.
So if you’re making that argument for Gerrard and Bellingham the same exact thing applies to De Bruyne. Personally I think they are all great Cms and Bellingham has the potential to be one as well, the notion that a great CM has to fit one way or style is a notion that like I said even Guardiola doesn’t agree with.
There is more than one way to skin a cat and more than one way to be a great CM, it’s all about making a system and adapting a system to get the best out of your players.
I’m not saying you have to be a Xavi-style metronome to be a good CM, I’m saying Gerrard wasn’t a very good one and Bellingham reminds me a bit of him.
And for what it’s worth, De Bruyne is a far better passer of the ball than Gerrard ever was. He generally doesn’t charge around the pitch like a one-man army like Gerrard did, either.
I just don’t see him signing for them
Sounds like Liverpool are in the lead, but I'd be really surprised if City didn't get involved.
He’s not a better passer than he was, at least certainly not in what you value in a playmaker, he loses the ball just as much and he actually does charge up and down the pitch, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing at all, a player like Valverde gets praised on here for doing the same thing.
To say Gerrard wasn’t a good CM is basically to say he had two three good seasons in his whole career which doesn’t really reflect with the opinion at the time either in Uk or Europe. A more nuanced argument is that he isn’t a top playmaker like the likes of Xavi Veratti or Pirlo, but they also don’t score goals or had an impact in the final third as much as hun either(you could make an argument for Xavi). If you had a midfield of Xavi Pirlo and Busquets for example it wouldn’t really make sense, you need someone to add the extra penetration running and creativity in the final third, some players are better than this at others I.e Lampard Gerrard Gullit, and some players are better at the playmaking part. In a three man midfield you need a balance of all types of these players to be great, Barcelona was maybe an outlier but they are generally not the template.
A attacking midfielder that can exploit spaces and do the most important thing in football which is to score goals, isn’t any less intelligent than an Alonso who specialises in defending playmaking and influence games with his passing. You can’t just look at football iq through the lens of being defensively inclined as if the other part isn’t just as important.
I really don’t get this. He’s nothing like Gerrard on the pitch. He’s akin to Ashley Cole or Frank Lampard. One thing for one club but trainable to become anything. He could be a 6 or an 8. Or a weird 8/10 hybrid like Lampard.
He’ll be the best complete English Midfielder since Robson. Probably inside two years.
He’s 19 years old and can do everything that Rice, Phillips, & Henderson can do, in his sleep.
His next move is key. I hope it’s not to City. Personally, I think two or three years at Bayern would be incredible for him. Same country and culture, great coaching, win league titles and perhaps a CL. Get that shit out the way.
Then 3-5 years at the best English club, win a lot, and he’s then still only 26 ffs.
One thing is certain, he’s not coming to United.
Iniesta fulfilled that role for Barcelona, he didn't score that many goals himself, but was assisting a lot, and Messi dropped deep and supported him. So all aspects of the "Gerrard role" were covered in that team as well.
Yes agree.
When xavi played AM he got 31 assists in 1 season, I really don't think you realise what these type of players can do.
This is exactly why I said you can make an argument for Xavi in my post, he was very creative but as @stefan92 said it was Iniesta who performed the role of an 8/10 in that team, with his dribbling passing and at times his late entries into the box scoring important goals.
Xavi was probably a more creative player than Iniesta but apart from 11/12 he never really scored any goals, the point is a midfield with all the same types is a one paced midfield, for example Madrid without Valverde or Camavinga last season do not win the CL regardless of how good Modric or Kroos playmaking was, in the past they had Di Maria to fufill that role, who was in certain Cl runs one of their most important players.
Sure, and then Benitez saw he was wasted as a CM and moved him up
The same thing is gonna happen with Bellingham imo, though in 2022 he's likely to be partneted up with another attacking mid who complements him rather than the pure destroyer-ball progressor double pivot typical or Gerrard's era
He's barely ever played like one, so, who knows
"he's not a central midfielder, he just plays in that position (and only that position)".
don’t think this is true and if he starts being asked to do things he can’t like play as a 6 he’ll end up getting the Pogba treatment. watched him in a midfield two a couple of games for dortmund and the midfield was getting walked through, he needs two behind him (which Klopp would give him)
Agree to disagree. You seem to be twisting the argument a bit.
Personally, I didn't see Gerrard as much of a CM at his peak as he generally had more of a free role in which he liked to get forward. If you wanted to control the midfield, Gerrard wasn't really the man to do it and personally I see that as one of the reasons why England underperformed so badly at international tournaments during that time. I saw Lampard as a similar player. Two CMs playing CM, who weren't particularly great CMs, which is why England often became unstuck against decent opposition (even if Lampard or Gerrard individually would have a decent game). It was a problem then, and would be an even bigger problem in the modern game with the need for players to be more specialised and brought in to do a job in a system. I'm not saying there isn't a place for attacking midfielders, I'm saying there's a difference between a CM and an AM. I see Bellingham ultimately becoming the latter, albeit with a bit of freedom.
He's very clearly a final third playmaker, and played like one his entire career. If you want to call that CM, go ahead. It's all academic anyways, players roles are defined by what they do and where they do it, not some arbitrary name for a position
Scholes and Lampard wouldn’t have been much better as a midfield two, neither would Scholes and Gerrard, you would most likely need a Butt Keane or Mascherano type player next to them to get the best out of them.
Agreed. Scholes & Carrick would have worked with one of Gerrard or Lampard in front, but that ship sailed long ago unfortunately. Bellingham would excel in a similar setup, however we don't really have the Scholes/Carrick types to sit behind.
Given the hype around Bellingham now, he’s picking his own club and I don’t see it being United. And unless our new owner has unlimited wealth I don’t see us spending 100m on a midfielder. Prime Casemiro came in for something like 60m.Superb talent. I still hope ETH won't loose his head too much over this and continue to build squad with mentality of likes such as Lisandro.
Our right side of defense was vulnerable for 10 years and somewhat still is after Darmian and Bissaka fiasco. There are some serious priorities to address, but midfield could definitely use better players than McTom or Fred.
Spend only if we have some serious extra amounts in the bank. If we get a good fee for Maguire, we'd still need to find no BS defender in his place. So far can't see Bellingham on the horizon, but then again I called BS the news about possibility of Casemiro heading to United...
This one will cost absurd amounts, could be more taxing deal than Maguire and Bissaka combined fee.
If we’re going to break the bank right now it absolutely must be for a striker, not a position which we’re reasonably covered with for the moment.
Indeed. Bump the price and force Pool, Madrid or whoever to spend and overkill their budgets. There could be more available gems on the market that way for United.
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We should move away from old midfielders like Eriksen and Fred and concentrate younger midfielders like Bellingham who are faster and eager to prove themselves.
It's not that Eriksen isn't good. It's just that one extra bit of speed or desire to win games that's missing.
It's not that Eriksen isn't good. It's just that one extra bit of speed or desire to win games that's missing.
I seriously hope we don't drop £150M on him and I don't believe Liverpool have the budget to do that either.
You should see the absolute nonsense coming out on social media about them forking out for Bellingham, Enzo Fernandez, and now Cody Gakpo... all in January.
I love it when people say stuff like this. "We should stop signing midfielders on a free and focus on the ones that cost £150m instead", no shit mate.
I don't see them affording him either
He’s been liking random Liverpool posts on social media for a while. We missed our chance on him
He ain't signing for us 
If we get CL ahead of Liverpool I believe there’s a good chance he joins us.
Exciting talent but don’t want to be dropping circa £150m on him.
"Tell me Jude, what do you think of DisneyLand?"
I was once confident the tooth fairy existed.
He's going to Liverpool unless they don't get cl next year. Then it could be open season.
the Mirror might be making a mountain out of a molehill but...
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/jude-bellingham-transfer-manutd-liverpool-28768608
https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/jude-bellingham-transfer-manutd-liverpool-28768608
How about a sneaky 100m + Sancho bid for Bellingham?
Absolutely not. Didn’t see Bellingham play that role for England. We all know what Fernandes can do, now Ronaldo is gone I hope we see the best of him again. With Rashford and him taking the free kicks which will boost his confidence and hopefully if he bangs some in we’ll see him score a lot more from open play again.
I cannot see why Fernandes cannot play with Bellingham and Casemeiro in behind him. Bellingham is young and fit enough to be a ball carrying box to box midfielder and a massive upgrade on McT. Erickson will still get game time and can fight for a place, competition is a great thing.
I cannot see why Fernandes cannot play with Bellingham and Casemeiro in behind him. Bellingham is young and fit enough to be a ball carrying box to box midfielder and a massive upgrade on McT. Erickson will still get game time and can fight for a place, competition is a great thing.
Good. He can feck off to the scousers. He isn’t fit enough to tie Kamingvinga’s laces, and he can’t even get into the French team.He ain't signing for us
Another British media hyped up player like Sancho!
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