We still have to remember he was the managers number 1 target. So maybe for all the good we are seeing in Lisandro. This guy could be even better.
Jurriën Timber | Arsenal player
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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The question isn't about how well Varane is doing in that position but how often he will be available. He's shown that he can't be relied upon to play week in week out so we need a capable deputy who has the ability to dislodge him in the coming years as Varane gets older or even more injury prone.
Really it comes down to whether we think ETH will happily use Timber at RB as well. Because a player who covers both RCB and RB would obviously fill a key gap in our squad.
If he would only be used at RCB then much less so, as he'd almost certainly want more gametime than you'd think competition with Varane would get him.
If he would only be used at RCB then much less so, as he'd almost certainly want more gametime than you'd think competition with Varane would get him.
He’s missed 6-7 games through injury out of the 40-odd games we have played so far this season. And he just retired from international football so he’s getting more breaks. I’d say worries about his availability are exaggerated. Last season was a bit of an aberration.
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I've kept reading quite a bit lately that Geertruida from Feyenoord is rated higher and doesn't have the same hang ups in terms of physicality and defending.
There were a load of rumours circulating yesterday that he was house hunting in Liverpool
I see that after Gakpo, Van Dijk has been sprouting weird stuffs to Timber as well.
Geertruida might have a better season but has nowhere near reached the level that Timber has before. Timber is in a slump, and playing in bad coached teams. Geertruida is a good player in his own right, playing in a greatly coached team. Don't fall for it.
Liverpool are weird, stalking Bellingham on international duty etc.
I have no idea who the other player is but the reason you mentioned can be used for Timber also right, he used to play in greatly coached team when his performance was very good.
He isnt tall enough to play in a Klopp team. Klopp is too weak mentally to play a CB under 6F4.
They have enough CBs surely. Or are they binning Konate?
That's a bit opportunistic. Geertruida has developed tremendously over the last 2 years while never being anywhere near as prolific a talent as Timber, but Timber is a much more exciting prospect so far. You obviously never know how their careers might play out, but Geertruida isn't rated higher than Timber, aside from the fact that Geertruida is having a much better season at the moment. On the other hand, Geertuida would probably cost about half of Timber.
The part about physicality is true though and whether Timber is in a slump or Timber's form was in part because he was playing next to a tenacious killer like Martinez is yet to be seen. Timber has been, for lack of a better word, shite, this season.
All of their cb's who aren't named Van Dijk seem to have injury issues.
Yeah he likes tall CBs to dominate in the air when opposition teams try to bypass the midfield press by going long. I cannot imagine him selecting Timber at CB.
Genuinely forgot about this guy because of how well Martinez has been for us.
They already knew that with regard to Konate when they signed him. They can’t keep stock piling and adding to their wage bill
It's not even the height issue only. Timber is not very good aerially. Here and there I am able to see him this season, doesn't look like he has improved. Weird signing because Klopp doesn't look like he has a formation with 5 at the back. So now either Timber would be developed as midfielder, RB (back up), or it would be recipe for disaster as CB in 2 men partnership.
Interesting, 5 at the back may be one possible solution to Klopp's Alexander-Arnold problem. Getting Timber in as the right CB in that formation could help perhaps?
In theory it could. But beside tweaking his 4-3-3, like recently using TAA in central position in some phase of play, Klopp doesn't have have what it takes to use back 5 formation. He's too reliant on how he set up 6 players on top of a back 4 for his gengen pressing to function properly defensive wise and offensive wise.
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If we want a RB/CB hybrid then Pavard is likely available for a fair price this summer. I also think Mohamed Simakan is one who should be monitored for that role. This guy could be the new Thuram.
Geertruida was nowhere near as good as Timber was though, Timber was one of Ajax' best players and even immense for the NT. For longer than a year.
Is backing up Casemiro also a possibility?
#10: Bruno-Eriksen
CM: #8-Eriksen-Fred
DM: Casemiro-Timber
for instance. And Timber also Varane's backup and the defensive option at RB with Frimpong brought in and AWB sold. Timber might get to a normal starter number of games if you give him McTominay's 15-20 starts along with 15-20 behind Varane and then another 5-10 at RB. Same case for Declan Rice if he was willing to play CB, just without the RB cover.
Hey, look, another CM that could be a DM! I don't think Timber has ever actually played in DM though. (At least with Martinez it was tried and rejected.)
Is Pavard not a bit underwhelming at RB though? Seen him a fair bit there and he’s never been that impressive.
Happens a lot in Liverpool....balaclavas are essential
Ajax conceding due to Timber being a leprechaun. Though Luuk is a greater header.
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Think Liverpool will go really hard after Timber and be extremely offensive minded next season.
Without the ball:
Jota-Nunez-Salah
CM-CM
Fabinho
Robertson-VVD-Timber-Trent
But with the ball:
Jota-Nunez-Salah
CM-CM-Trent
Robertson-Fabinho-Timber
VVD
They have played like this lately but with Konaté in “Timber’s role” it doesn’t become the same thing.
Without the ball:
Jota-Nunez-Salah
CM-CM
Fabinho
Robertson-VVD-Timber-Trent
But with the ball:
Jota-Nunez-Salah
CM-CM-Trent
Robertson-Fabinho-Timber
VVD
They have played like this lately but with Konaté in “Timber’s role” it doesn’t become the same thing.
How would VVD be in that with the ball formation?
Actually think we need to also go hard for timber. He covers the cb, rb and dm positions comfortably. Add on a cm like enzo le fee as well rasmus holjund and we are talking buying quality cheaply. For 50m extra we can get a top GK like diogo costa or raya. We dont need to spend extranomical amounts of money to fix us. Harry kane, osihmen, declan rice are just way to pricey for what we can get elsewhere
Very valid point. Ive not seen him this season in what most seem to be calling a slump, but whenever I have seen him and some of those games he was slated, think one was agsinst Liverpool, you could still see great quality and composure.
I guess the counter argument to your point though, is, if he has had a slump does he cost anymore than some of the other targets mentioned like Jae for example.
Personalyl prefer the best player for one position rather than the "so and so is versatile" anyway, and the little I have seen of him, prefer him as a centre back by far....but if the fee is comparable with other players in the market, I think he would be a really good signing alongside a right back, not as being signed for both positions...its really about fees with other players maybe on a short list. I think there are quite a lot of good options for us to sign, think he may still be the wrong end of the scale fee wise compared to others though...and for me personally we really need a quality attacking right back and in that regard he maybe doesnt fit the profile even with the two birds with one stone
Its doubtful. They are bagging Ndicka from Frankfurt on a free barring a major surprise.
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How was the relationship with ten hag? Similar to Lisandro hopefully?
He makes a lot of sense. Can start RB, cover Varane at RCB too.
Is he more RB or CB?
I'd like to think ETH would be in there like a shot of he's available. Last summer it seemed Utd were linked with him before Martinez.
Surely at his young age any downturn in form can just be attributed to a slump/many other factors affecting the whole team.
Surely at his young age any downturn in form can just be attributed to a slump/many other factors affecting the whole team.
He's RCB who can cover RB in a pinch or DM. Comfortable on the ball, aggressive and good at winning 50/50 duels. Ten Hag just thinks aerially you can set up to not be tested as much... We'll need Maignan to cover that IMO as with de Gea it'll be exposed, but also don't completely disagree, as I think it'll only weaken us on set pieces and goal kicks. General play you won't see a negative impact because that's easy to cover for and adjust (and normal crossing is more about positioning and quality of delivery than being 6'3" and out jumping the attacker).
Aye, set-pieces would be a concern, particularly with De Gea in goals as well.
The other concern I'd have is that a Martinez/Timber pairing would have their strengths emphasised and weaknesses minimised in a high possession, high line set up. But as it stands we're not a particularly high possession side and (according to a stat I saw during the week) we had the third lowest average defensive line in the league this season.
Obviously bringing in players suited to that type of system should help shift you closer to it, but I'm not sure we're going to see enough of a shift for that partnership to fully work in this team next season.
On the flip side, it's not like Timber would be starting every week at CB. Varane is still there, so fitness permitting you could rotate them to suit the opposition.
Still, Timber has been linked to Liverpool as well so it might not be us he eventually goes to anyway.
Surely we must be one of the teams in for him?
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