Keane joins Sky Sports

DVG7

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Can someone post a link to this if and when it becomes available
 

Vidyoyo

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The only reason I can see people picking Mane over Giggs is because Liverpool are about to win their first league trophy in about half a century and they can't think straight.
 
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Rozay

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I mean it as their overall contributions in their careers. Giggs was also a pure winger that transitioned into a midfielder.
I thought that’s where you were taking it. So because Mané hasn’t played for 20 years basically?

In all of Giggs’ 23 years he was never as good as Mané is.
 

Rozay

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Opinions I guess, I think Becks and Scholes were better overall. As a winger in the PL Giggs is top 3/4 ever along with Pires Ronaldo and Hazard
Giggs is in that conversation simply due to him hanging around for longer than the rest. Every other player you listed has won Player of the Year. Apart from his first couple of years, Giggs was never close to being that.
 

DoomSlayer

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I thought that’s where you were taking it. So because Mané hasn’t played for 20 years basically?

In all of Giggs’ 23 years he was never as good as Mané is.
I'll let the older fans debate that because I have seen the younger version of Giggs only on replays and highlights. :lol:
 

DVG7

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I thought that’s where you were taking it. So because Mané hasn’t played for 20 years basically?

In all of Giggs’ 23 years he was never as good as Mané is.
Completely obvious WUM but some people seem to be falling for it :lol:
 

Vidyoyo

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I thought that’s where you were taking it. So because Mané hasn’t played for 20 years basically?

In all of Giggs’ 23 years he was never as good as Mané is.
It's tricky because of how football has evolved. Giggs would have never been expected to record the amount of goals Mane is getting on account of playing most of his career supporting 2 strikers as an attacking left midfielder. In many respects, Mane has a lot more in common with a striker than he does the position Giggs played..

That said, I do get that it makes sense to say Mane > Giggs judging football by today's metrics and favoured formations (eg 451/433).

In terms of sheer overall quality though? I'd give it Giggsy (until the end of the season).
 

Rozay

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Lee Trundle is better than Mane tbh.
Mane was phenomenal as a young player but Lee Trundle in shorter spurts, of about 10-15 seconds, was better.
Haha. Perhaps we can’t really say Mané is better than Trundle until we look back on his whole career after he retires. As of now, doesn’t match Trundle for longevity.
 

BestRed

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Gas man Roy, that was hilarious. Only one pool player in his team, and imo he's spot on.
 

Rozay

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Any iteration of Giggs > Mane

Jesus christ, the recency bias of the internet is off the fecking chain.
No more so than the revisionism legacy bias, which airbrushes all inconsistencies, poor form etc out of history and summarises retired players as a 10 minute YouTube clips of the ‘best bits’.

During Giggs’ career, Figo won World Player of the Year, more than once, Ronaldo, and Pires won PL player of the year all from the wing. Giggs was never as good as you are making out, apart from when he was very young. He was extremely inconsistent and while magically gifted, didn’t hit the heights he could have.
 

Cassidy

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Giggs is in that conversation simply due to him hanging around for longer than the rest. Every other player you listed has won Player of the Year. Apart from his first couple of years, Giggs was never close to being that.
Or because he was an incredible player and a record assister before they starter counting them properly. I think maybe you just dont remember early Giggs
 

Rozay

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It's tricky because of how football has evolved. Giggs would have never been expected to record the amount of goals Mane is getting on account of playing most of his career supporting 2 strikers as an attacking left midfielder. In many respects, Mane has a lot more in common with a striker than he does the position Giggs played..

That said, I do get that it makes sense to say Mane > Giggs judging football by today's metrics and favoured formations (eg 451/433).

In terms of sheer overall quality though? I'd give it Giggsy (until the end of the season).
George Best was putting up ridiculous numbers from wide well before this current wave. The man Giggs was supposed to be the reincarnation of.
 

Rozay

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Or because he was an incredible player and a record assister before they starter counting them properly. I think maybe you just dont remember early Giggs
I do remember early Giggs. As I have said repeatedly, that was the best Giggs. Current Mané is a better player. Balloon level good. We’ve won the CL twice in Giggs’ career, and the PL multiple times. He had every opportunity to be recognised as that guy, but he just wasn’t that guy. Very good player, but was never amongst the best few players in the world. And not very often amongst the best very few in the PL, and he hung around for more than long enough to be at some point, beyond his first few years before other teams started catching up.
 

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A Mané is better than Giggs discussion is never going to end well here. A Manchester United forum filled with Manchester United fans wearing Manchester United tinted goggles where a Manchester United legend is compared to a player who is winning Liverpool the league.

Im too young to have seen the early Giggs and while i do think Giggs was an excellent player (you cant really disagree with that) but he was never the best or talked about as the best. There was always a better player, not because Giggs was bad but because the other player was even better. Right now Mané is being talked about as one of the best.... this season he is better than Salah and could very well win the POTY award.

Edit : im not saying Mané is better. I would be crazy and branded as a heretic but.... i can understand the discussion about it.
 

cyberman

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Giggs is better simply because of longevity and quality at the top. Mane isnt even a winger, hes an inside forward. He would have been lost out there in another era.
 

TheReligion

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Mané is far better than Giggs tbh.
Bebe is far better than Mane tbh.

A Mané is better than Giggs discussion is never going to end well here. A Manchester United forum filled with Manchester United fans wearing Manchester United tinted goggles where a Manchester United legend is compared to a player who is winning Liverpool the league.

Im too young to have seen the early Giggs and while i do think Giggs was an excellent player (you cant really disagree with that) but he was never the best or talked about as the best. There was always a better player, not because Giggs was bad but because the other player was even better. Right now Mané is being talked about as one of the best.... this season he is better than Salah and could very well win the POTY award.

Edit : im not saying Mané is better. I would be crazy and branded as a heretic but.... i can understand the discussion about it.
And it's at that point that everything you just said became totally irrelevant and pointless.
 

Vidyoyo

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A Mané is better than Giggs discussion is never going to end well here. A Manchester United forum filled with Manchester United fans wearing Manchester United tinted goggles where a Manchester United legend is compared to a player who is winning Liverpool the league.

Im too young to have seen the early Giggs and while i do think Giggs was an excellent player (you cant really disagree with that) but he was never the best or talked about as the best. There was always a better player, not because Giggs was bad but because the other player was even better. Right now Mané is being talked about as one of the best.... this season he is better than Salah and could very well win the POTY award.

Edit : im not saying Mané is better. I would be crazy and branded as a heretic but.... i can understand the discussion about it.
I think that's fair. It's tricky because we're comparing a player who's had a wonderfully magnificent couple of seasons (Mane) to one who had a ridiculously long and established career consistently winning trophies with a single top flight club (20 years playing 25+ league games a season!)*

No argument that Mane's heights have certainly eclipsed any individual season from Giggs but in terms of their respective careers, they have to be judged by different metrics.

*Yes I know he moved into midfield later in his career..
 

DVG7

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Just watched the full segment where they discussed the combined united 99 team and the current Liverpool team and they honestly got it spot on between them. Carragher said that this seasons Mane is better than 99 Giggs and I think that’s hard to argue, I bet you not many united fans remember the other goals Giggs scored that season that weren’t the one in the FA cup semi final.

Keane and Carragher really gel well. You can tell there’s respect for each other.
 

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Just watched the full segment where they discussed the combined united 99 team and the current Liverpool team and they honestly got it spot on between them. Carragher said that this seasons Mane is better than 99 Giggs and I think that’s hard to argue, I bet you not many united fans remember the other goals Giggs scored that season that weren’t the one in the FA cup semi final.

Keane and Carragher really gel well. You can tell there’s respect for each other.
Yeah but Carragher also referred to Salah's first season at Liverpool as reasoning for him getting in. So either you stick rigidly to the rule of it being based on a singular season (like Carragher wanted to do) or you look at a number of seasons (like Carragher did selectively when the argument suited).
 

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I’m glad I watched the clip before responding or I’d be hopping mad too at any united fan choosing Mane over Giggs. After seeing the choice was strictly 99 Giggs or today’s Mane in his current form it makes sense, Mane is the right choice. Of course if you’re looking at overall contribution Giggs will win this now and I’m certain we’ll say the same 10 years from now.
 

CognitiveNeuro

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Carragher was making the decision based on one season. Mane had a better season.

Roy's argument was that Giggs scored more important goals even though it was only 3 goals/2 assists and another factor was loyalty (which shouldn't even be used as it should be an objective decision)
For the first one, Mane scored two goals against Chelsea in the Super Cup to win it. Also, Mane has scored 5 winners already this season already in the league. He won Liverpool 10 points alone this season.
 
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Andersonson

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Keane is fun to watch.

But I think Carra is right. Mane's season is alot better than Giggs in 99'.

Those two seasons isolated, Mane has been better. And thats whats the discussion is about.
 

Mr Smith

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I thought that’s where you were taking it. So because Mané hasn’t played for 20 years basically?

In all of Giggs’ 23 years he was never as good as Mané is.
I know fans have short memories, but this is a different level. Giggs in his teens/early 20's was so good that he was seriously compared to George Best.
 

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Mane is not as good as Giggs but better than Beckham, so he does make a combined XI, but on the right.

VVD was a Lionel Messi away from winning the Ballon D’Or so he makes it in automatically.

Salah is a better player than Yorke ever was.

Those three would make a combined XI for sure.

Trent vs Neville is debatable.
 

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I thought that’s where you were taking it. So because Mané hasn’t played for 20 years basically?

In all of Giggs’ 23 years he was never as good as Mané is.
Just wow
 

youngrell

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Just what exactly is Mane better at? Heading the ball, and finishing maybe (very debatable). Nothing else.