Keir Starmer Labour Leader

ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
Those MPs probably want cast iron guarantees that Burnham won’t be blocked again, as otherwise it’s a pointless sacrifice.

It’s going to have to be a pretty safe seat as well. Can you imagine if he runs and loses! There’s no guarantee anymore. If Reform didn’t enter a candidate, and it’s a two way battle between him and a Green…
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As future PM it should be pretty straightforward to get elected. Being represented by a PM tends to work out pretty favourably for the constituency. If he cant win in that context he's not a solution to Labour's leadership problem
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
What are the Lib Dem’s plans?
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Are the Lib Dems calling for an election tomorrow? Are the Lib Dems going round saying they are the Government in waiting? Have the Lib Dems been given the insane media attention that Reform have? Reform want to be given the attention of the biggest party, so they have to have some fecking plans if they wish to be the Government. But of course we know its going to be a back of a fag packet stuff.
 
caid said:
As future PM it should be pretty straightforward to get elected. Being represented by a PM tends to work out pretty favourably for the constituency. If he cant win in that context he's not a solution to Labour's leadership problem
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It feels like a great protest vote though! Assume he would want a seat in the Manchester area.
 
TheGame said:
Are the Lib Dems calling for an election tomorrow? Are the Lib Dems going round saying they are the Government in waiting? Have the Lib Dems been given the insane media attention that Reform have? Reform want to be given the attention of the biggest party, so they have to have some fecking plans if they wish to be the Government. But of course we know its going to be a back of a fag packet stuff.
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I don't believe the Lib Dems unveiled their own 'Shadow Cabinet' either. No doubt that braintrust is full of great ideas about how to fix the issues facing the country outside of deporting immigrants...
 
I don't get this, basically setting themselves up for constant election calls from a group of people they are scared of and listen to
 
TheGame said:
Are the Lib Dems calling for an election tomorrow? Are the Lib Dems going round saying they are the Government in waiting? Have the Lib Dems been given the insane media attention that Reform have? Reform want to be given the attention of the biggest party, so they have to have some fecking plans if they wish to be the Government. But of course we know its going to be a back of a fag packet stuff.
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It’s not a requirement for any party to outline effectively their manifesto 3 years before the election. Did Labour do that three years before the last election?

That’s not to say they aren’t full of hot air.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
It feels like a great protest vote though! Assume he would want a seat in the Manchester area.
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Almost certainly would but i'd say he's ran out of time to be selective. He could aim to be prime minister after the next prime minister? Doubt any of Streeting, Rayner or Milliband last too long.
 
caid said:
Almost certainly would but i'd say he's ran out of time to be selective. He could aim to be prime minister after the next prime minister? Doubt any of Streeting, Rayner or Milliband last too long.
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The PM after the next PM is probably where you want to be.

I don’t know whether having someone jettisoned in and almost immediately being installed as a new PM would go down well or not? Can be viewed either way.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
The PM after the next PM is probably where you want to be.

I don’t know whether having someone jettisoned in and almost immediately being installed as a new PM would go down well or not? Can be viewed either way.
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I really dont think so. Maybe if your farage. I think its now or never for Labour. If they dont get this one right then its a much smaller, less significant party for the next candidate.
 
caid said:
I really dont think so. Maybe if your farage. I think its now or never for Labour. If they dont get this one right then its a much smaller, less significant party for the next candidate.
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Fair point. My only counter is that someone needs to come in and move out a lot of the incumbent cabinet - and that’s not going to go well.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
Fair point. My only counter is that someone needs to come in and move out a lot of the incumbent cabinet - and that’s not going to go well.
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Yes, they're a massive liability and look like they'll sabotage anyone outside of their block. Its why i'd give it to Streeting - give him enough rope to hang himself and rebuild without them. Just seems the only way to rid yourself of them and i cant imagine any success with them.
 
Doing this in public is bad. It destabilises the government. People should have told him in private that they needed him to prepare to step down.
 
Honestly, how pathetic and stupid is this. They have shot themselves in the foot in insane style

How can they not see they've basically all out themselves out of a job in the next 12, max 18, months?

They have proven they are weak to right wing media and Reform, those lot will call daily for elections and will eventually cave
 

Senior cabinet ministers urge Starmer to set out timetable for his departure​


Keir Starmer’s grip on power appeared to be slipping away on Monday as cabinet ministers urged him to set out a timetable for his departure and more than 70 Labour MPs publicly called for him to stand down.

The Guardian understands that two senior cabinet ministers – Yvette Cooper, the former secretary, and Shabana Mahmood, the Home Secretary – told the prime minister he should oversee an orderly transition of power after crushing election defeats risked ringing the death knell on his premiership.

At least two others – believed to be John Healey and David Lammy – discussed with Starmer how they should take a “responsible, dignified, orderly” approach to what might follow. Several others – including Richard Hermer and Steve Reed – were defiant, urging him to fight on.

One cabinet minister told the Guardian: “In the end Keir has listened to cabinet ministers – there are differences about where this will go and what is in best interests of party and country. He’ll have to make a decision about what he’s going to do before cabinet tomorrow”.

Several sources said how angry some cabinet ministers were with Andy Burnham and Wes Streeting, who they believed to have precipitated the leadership crisis by sanctioning allies to call for Starmer’s departure. “They’ve got their hands all over this,” one said.
 
The U.K is so fecked. Starmer is done but this is basically where the Tories were in 2022 now. Just a slow death to the next election and then humiliating defeat which will unleash an even worse prospect than we've seen in last decade.
 
LARulz said:
Honestly, how pathetic and stupid is this. They have shot themselves in the foot in insane style

How can they not see they've basically all out themselves out of a job in the next 12, max 18, months?

They have proven they are weak to right wing media and Reform, those lot will call daily for elections and will eventually cave
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Nah. They've done what they need to. Any party suffering the same losses would do the same.

And there's no winning against the right and the media whatever they do, so best not to factor it into any equation. If he stays, they say he's weak and they're all defending him. If they take a stand, they say they're all out for themselves and causing chaos.
 
FootballHQ said:
The U.K is so fecked. Starmer is done but this is basically where the Tories were in 2022 now. Just a slow death to the next election and then humiliating defeat which will unleash an even worse prospect than we've seen in last decade.
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Yes but even then the Tories had managed to be in power for 12 years, implement sweeping economic reforms in austerity, NHS reforms, dozens of other major initiatives Brexit and navigate a pandemic. Let's put aside whether the policies were good or bad, and just accept they did a lot to change the country. By the time Sunak took the reins, people were exhausted and were open to change.

For Labour to have ballsed this up in 22 months, alongside not passing half their manifesto commitments with a stonking majority, is remarkable.
 
I've felt Reform were winning the next election since before Labour even won. Yet I find it strange that those who did have hope, had their hopes tied to Starmer. What gives? He's the dullest man alive.

A change from a remarkably unpopular prime minister isn't a death sentence. It's actually giving yourself a chance at the next election. That's not to say any replacement will improve chances but certainly none of them are worse.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
It’s not a requirement for any party to outline effectively their manifesto 3 years before the election. Did Labour do that three years before the last election?

That’s not to say they aren’t full of hot air.
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I’ve not advocating they outline their manifesto. I fully well know they would want to do that just before an election however they should have some policies for the vocal things they bang on about like their favourite topic of boats and energy. They seem to have feck all.

Even Labour had some policies on some issues in advance.
 
Smores said:
I've felt Reform were winning the next election since before Labour even won. Yet I find it strange that those who did have hope, had their hopes tied to Starmer. What gives? He's the dullest man alive.

A change from a remarkably unpopular prime minister isn't a death sentence. It's actually giving yourself a chance at the next election. That's not to say any replacement will improve chances but certainly none of them are worse.
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I think you’ll find a lot of people agree with you in terms of a change is needed.
 
Smores said:
I've felt Reform were winning the next election since before Labour even won. Yet I find it strange that those who did have hope, had their hopes tied to Starmer. What gives? He's the dullest man alive.

A change from a remarkably unpopular prime minister isn't a death sentence. It's actually giving yourself a chance at the next election. That's not to say any replacement will improve chances but certainly none of them are worse.
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Raynor is far far worse.

As for others like Streeting, Miliband and Burnham, all better politicians, but we will have to see - it can definitely get worse, that’s not to say it will, but no one should say with any sort or conviction it won’t
 
Keir Starmer has made appointments of new Parliamentary Private Secretaries to replace the ones who resigned today, possibly signalling his determination to continue despite calls for him to resign from over 70 of his own MPs.

The following PPS appointments have been made:

David Burton-Sampson – Department for Health and Social Care

Linsey Farnsworth MP – Ministry of Justice

Jayne Kirkham MP – Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs

Michael Payne MP – Home Office

Tim Roca MP – Department for Work and Pensions

Sean Woodcock MP – Cabinet Office
 
Frosty said:
Yes but even then the Tories had managed to be in power for 12 years, implement sweeping economic reforms in austerity, NHS reforms, dozens of other major initiatives Brexit and navigate a pandemic. Let's put aside whether the policies were good or bad, and just accept they did a lot to change the country. By the time Sunak took the reins, people were exhausted and were open to change.

For Labour to have ballsed this up in 22 months, alongside not passing half their manifesto commitments with a stonking majority, is remarkable.
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I think the issue is everyone just been fatigued so much by that era it was simply a bad election for Labour to actually win. I didn't mind Starmer too much but you could tell quite early he didn't have much actual conviction as a PM and I'm afraid the Mandelson affair exposed this to the wider population.

You look back now at what a missed opportunity 2015 election was. I actually didn't mind the coalition but that unique arrangement should've been an open goal for Labour after five years. Instead Ed Milliband was unconvincing and they let that chance slip through their fingers so would be incredible irony if he actually became the next leader.

Just like the Tories all the alternatives to Starmer look wholly unconvincing.
 
Smores said:
Yet I find it strange that those who did have hope, had their hopes tied to Starmer. What gives? He's the dullest man alive.
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There was a lot of mental gymnastics involved. People tried to convince themselves that a dull lying bureaucrat funded by tech capital and indebted to the right wing press was going to fix things.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
Raynor is far far worse.

As for others like Streeting, Miliband and Burnham, all better politicians, but we will have to see - it can definitely get worse, that’s not to say it will, but no one should say with any sort or conviction it won’t
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Ed Miliband - decisively rejected by voters in a General Election.

Andy Burnham - rejected by Labour members twice for leader (and once in favour of Ed Miliband).

Wes Streeting - apparently despised by Labour MPs, Labour members, Labour voters and the electorate at large.
 
Frosty said:
Ed Miliband - decisively rejected by voters in a General Election.

Andy Burnham - rejected by Labour members twice for leader (and once in favour of Ed Miliband).

Wes Streeting - apparently despised by Labour MPs, Labour members, Labour voters and the electorate at large.
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Sunak was rejected by conservative members for Liz Truss. It really doesn't mean anything substantial if that's the sole point.
 
Frosty said:
Ed Miliband - decisively rejected by voters in a General Election.

Andy Burnham - rejected by Labour members twice for leader (and once in favour of Ed Miliband).

Wes Streeting - apparently despised by Labour MPs, Labour members, Labour voters and the electorate at large.
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Burnham is the most popular with the public though and possibly their only hope.
 
Frosty said:
Ed Miliband - decisively rejected by voters in a General Election.

Andy Burnham - rejected by Labour members twice for leader (and once in favour of Ed Miliband).

Wes Streeting - apparently despised by Labour MPs, Labour members, Labour voters and the electorate at large.
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I would say of those meagre options Burnham at least has some gravitas as Manchester mayor for quite a few years now. So you could at least make a credible attempt to get the North West back onside with Labour perhaps?

I've always respected him since he stood infront of the Kop one year at the Hillsborough memorial, he was drowned out by "Justice for the 96" chant, took a minute to listen to the hurt in that and then started the process of inquiry into it that was eventually concluded in September 2012.

So at least a bit of conviction there but slim pickings.

I don't mind Rayner either but the press would just pan here day in day out and I think she'd be better building momentum as opposition leader anyway as Kemi Badenoch is perhaps slowly doing.
 
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