King Van Gaal's Orange Army || 19 games unbeaten

Joined
Nov 5, 2012
Messages
3,103
Location
Learn me a booke
@Bosnian_fan and anyone else who fancies them to win - is Timber much better than De Ligt? I haven't watched any of them play, but De Light really looked like a bit of a weak link yesterday. If I were a Senegal supporter I'd be frustrated that they didn't try to exploit it more, but I suppose lacking the quality of Mané made it difficult for them.
 

BenitoSTARR

Gaspar
Joined
Sep 1, 2015
Messages
7,159
Yeah, I agree completely. Then, if need be, sub in Luuk de Jong after 70 minutes to force the issue.

I have no idea why we selected both Luuk and Weghorst personally. I would've always gone for Danjuma over 1 of these.
Yeah agree with that too.

It seems like overkill absolutely have that plan B desperate times striker but two of them seems odd with other good options.

Must be thinking set pieces play a big role in tournament football.
 

appleman

Full Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2020
Messages
275
Supports
Atletico Madrid
De Ligt starting RCB and Timber on the bench according to these sources.


Don't ever get between a woman and her desire for sweets.
what about MY desire for sweets? I mean, at the moment I have none-ish, but still
 

appleman

Full Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2020
Messages
275
Supports
Atletico Madrid
Yeah agree with that too.

It seems like overkill absolutely have that plan B desperate times striker but two of them seems odd with other good options.

Must be thinking set pieces play a big role in tournament football.
I guess it's understandable to have a Plan B-Plan B, in case one gets injured, especially after Luuk only just returned, but still, Danjuma is just so much better and it's sad to not see him among the squad. :(

@Bosnian_fan and anyone else who fancies them to win - is Timber much better than De Ligt? I haven't watched any of them play, but De Light really looked like a bit of a weak link yesterday. If I were a Senegal supporter I'd be frustrated that they didn't try to exploit it more, but I suppose lacking the quality of Mané made it difficult for them.
De Ligt is probably still better, and at least physically stronger in the back. Timber isn't in the best form right now, either. As a profile for a RCB, Timber fits much, much better, though. Like De Ligt said himself, especially in possession you shift into a fullback like position many times and will have to adapt your play to such responsibilities. Timber is way more natural at the CB-RB shift, and at joining midfield, too. Since Van Dijk is already the CB (or CCB if you will - not to be confused with the chinese communist barty), so in that sense it's probably best (against most oppositions) to play Timber at RCB.

When looking at 3CB it's easy to just try to play the best 3 CB you have, but with the wingbacks often turning into wingers or offensive midfielders for much of the game, the side-center backs often turn into false full backs and imo they have to be able to play in those roles accordingly. Of course it depends on the exact wingbacks and CM types in front of them, but at least in the Dutch NT you can see that it really helps them to play players like Aké and Timber who can play LB and RB respectively, to some degree. Because of that I do think it's a little weird other options like Geertruida or Veltman weren't brought along (at least strategically thinking) for the right side. On the left you can shift Blind to that position if necessary (hopefully not).

But I think De Ligt was a weak link on the ball but kept on to help more against crosses and such, so the offer was Timber's technical and tactical attributions to the 3-4-1-2
 
Last edited:

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
4,730
Predicted line-up vs Ecuador:

Gakpo Bergwijn
Klaassen
FDJ Berghuis
Blind Ake VVD Timber Dumfries
Noppert​
 

KirkDuyt

Full Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2015
Messages
20,934
Location
Dutchland
Supports
Feyenoord
This is the worst international tournament match I've ever seen us play. We didnt deserve a point at all.
 

MackRobinson

Full Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2017
Messages
3,490
Location
Terminal D
Supports
Football
I have no idea what the Dutch strategy was but aside from the early goal they looked absolutely terrible.
 

AshRK

Full Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2017
Messages
10,834
Location
Canada
This brought back some puke worthy memories he used to deliver here while managing United. Funny how people rewrite Van gaal's time as some brilliant time where we were well coached. We were coached to bore everyone
 

Crackers

greasy ginfers
Scout
Joined
May 30, 2012
Messages
27,716
Location
Glazers Out
They looked very uninspiring and structured without any real attacking intent. Filloshophy football only works when you have world class talent in most positions, the Netherlands dont
 

bosnian_red

Worst scout to ever exist
Joined
Aug 13, 2011
Messages
49,449
Location
Canada
That was horrible. Not sure what the hell has happened to them, they've generally been excellent under LvG but these 2 games have been horrible. They'll finish top of their group and have an easy Ro16 draw, but you still want to get some momentum and start playing well for when the big games come. Right now they're limping through and just being ok with the result but that won't help them come the bigger games.

They need to change their front 3 to give them some width. As of now, absolutely no hold up play, link up play, no width, nothing. Need Gakpo left, Bergwijn right, Memphis middle. Blind and Dumfries I get why they play but they've also been quite bad. Malacia and Frimpong could give them more.
 

AndyMUFC

Full Member
Joined
May 28, 2011
Messages
1,360
I definitely don't miss his football! They'll likely get to the quarters or the semis as they've got a strong defence and Gakpo and Depay can produce moments but they're really one paced and pedestrian and have been in both games. More worried about just keeping the ball rather than trying anything which is exactly what we were like.
 

Blood Mage

Full Member
Joined
Aug 25, 2019
Messages
3,618
Van Gaal's football is just pass pass pass and nothing else. What's the point in total football with zero off-the-ball movement other than to bore everyone to death?
 

MiceOnMeth

Full Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2014
Messages
1,280
They looked very uninspiring and structured without any real attacking intent. Filloshophy football only works when you have world class talent in most positions, the Netherlands dont
Could very well get them to a semi or a final though
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
10,458
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
That was horrible. Not sure what the hell has happened to them, they've generally been excellent under LvG but these 2 games have been horrible. They'll finish top of their group and have an easy Ro16 draw, but you still want to get some momentum and start playing well for when the big games come. Right now they're limping through and just being ok with the result but that won't help them come the bigger games.

They need to change their front 3 to give them some width. As of now, absolutely no hold up play, link up play, no width, nothing. Need Gakpo left, Bergwijn right, Memphis middle. Blind and Dumfries I get why they play but they've also been quite bad. Malacia and Frimpong could give them more.
I'm thinking Van Gaal is being too clever here. Playing a system that might work in theory if you get to drill it into the team properly, but which no-one plays at their clubs and hence no-one is actually used to since there was no time for any drilling.

Or at least, from what I saw, it looks like people don't know where to be (see all that space at right-back), where to run (passes into space where no-one's going), or more generally what to do (too much hesitating on the ball followed by a crap pass to nowhere).
You literally could have appointed any manager other than LVG.

Anyone.
Yeah but no. The current generation of Dutch managers is pretty poor as well - especially the more experienced ones that you'd normally think of for a national team. (Ten Hag, Slot, Jansen - all pretty alright but no national team managers right now.)
 
Last edited:

Stadjer

Full Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2013
Messages
5,588
Location
The Netherlands
You literally could have appointed any manager other than LVG.

Anyone.
We tried and that didnt go well. LVG came back and has done well do far. The generation van Basten/Gullit didnt have any good managers. De Boer, Gio and Cocu their generation arent good coaches either.

we only have LVG, ten Hag and Arne Slot as good managers at this moment and two of those dont want to be manager of the national team. Koeman is okay i suppose
 

KirkDuyt

Full Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2015
Messages
20,934
Location
Dutchland
Supports
Feyenoord
Frank de Boer's Oranje was better than this, with the same players. Yet Van Gaal is some sort of God and Frank de Boer is laughed off (which is well deserved, mind you).
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
10,458
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
We tried and that didnt go well. LVG came back and has done well do far. The generation van Basten/Gullit didnt have any good managers. De Boer, Gio and Cocu their generation arent good coaches either.

we only have LVG, ten Hag and Arne Slot as good managers at this moment and two of those dont want to be manager of the national team. Koeman is okay i suppose
Koeman did pretty alright when he was manager. Another train he shouldn't have gotten on when he left for Barcelona!

I wonder if Ron Jans would be a decent national coach. He doesn't have the stature of course, but he seems like the kind of guy who can make the most of a non-ideal situation - which is what coaching a national team is all about.
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
4,730
Van Gaal's football is just pass pass pass and nothing else. What's the point in total football with zero off-the-ball movement other than to bore everyone to death?
Did you watch the game? We didn't "pass, pass, pass", we kept losing the ball.
 

Djemba-Djemba

Full Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2007
Messages
18,894
Location
Manchester
This brought back some puke worthy memories he used to deliver here while managing United. Funny how people rewrite Van gaal's time as some brilliant time where we were well coached. We were coached to bore everyone
Yep, I don't know why you often get people looking back at his time here fondly.

Maybe it's because he could be funny in post match interviews?

The football his teams play is fecking appalling.
 

PepG

Full Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
955
Supports
Ajax
Did you watch the game? We didn't "pass, pass, pass", we kept losing the ball.
Exactly. LVG has been always accused of pointless possession football but today exactly the possession was the problem. It was not enough and the ball was lost far too quick and easy from the Dutch players..very strange game indeed.
 

KirkDuyt

Full Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2015
Messages
20,934
Location
Dutchland
Supports
Feyenoord
We had only 2 shots today which is the worst of any European team in a world cup since 1966 :lol:
 

GMoore23

Full Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2014
Messages
2,464
This brought back some puke worthy memories he used to deliver here while managing United. Funny how people rewrite Van gaal's time as some brilliant time where we were well coached. We were coached to bore everyone
Yes, but we were very well coached to bore everyone.
 

FootballHQ

Full Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2017
Messages
16,351
Supports
Aston Villa
You literally could have appointed any manager other than LVG.

Anyone.
Koeman back in after the World cup so it's quite a limited pool they tend to go for.

Was only following by phone but the betting site I use had their xG at 0.06. :lol: Just three shots all game so very 15/16.
 

Red Pumpkin

Full Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
221
Supports
Bayern Munchen
We had only 2 shots today which is the worst of any European team in a world cup since 1966 :lol:
Yeah, but you are almost guaranteed 7 points and first place in the group which should be an advantage for 1/8. You've got a very limited squad compared to those of the past 20 years.
 

BorisManUtd

Full Member
Joined
Nov 4, 2013
Messages
1,864
Maybe 0.07 is exaggarated but how on earth do you perform such a low xG. Didn't watch the game but comments on here say it all. Netherlands will comfortably finish 1st in their group but will have to improve in knockout stages massively in order to compete with better teams.
Yes, but we were very well coached to bore everyone.
Think some people rewrite history because they tend to remember Fa Cup that was won, record vs rivals (especially Liverpool) and Louis being a lunatic and funny in press conferences. Reality is most games looked like this:

 
X