What’s his best position or where should he play
Kobbie Mainoo | Athletic: Ready to leave Manchester United on loan in January
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In the latest edition of the United Hour Podcast, Imran (@Annihilate Now!) & Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to discuss disappointed FA Cup exit at the hands of Brighton - confirming our shortest season in over 100 years. They also discuss the news that Michael Carrick is set to be United's manager until the end of the season.
Because he barely ran, fresh on and looked like one of the most tired players. He should be more energetic than other players.
Thought he did ok but room for improvement
He's just too languid of a player to be a mainstay Premier League midfielder. The game has evolved into being all about athletiscism and pace and he doesn't have it.
He showed a nice piece of upper body strength but what will kill him is his passing. It is underpar for somebody who wants to play there, especially for a team like us who are in dire need for every passer we can get. So badly, that some even hail Casemiro for it.
He was shit today. If you're not better than Casemiro then there's an issue.
He dribbled the ball a couple of times and passed it back. Then he slowly ran somewhere else. Generational talent.
That could have described Fletchers cameos also
So just so I’m correct, his critics want him sold asap rather than having his game developed here?
Should we also sell Heaven because he makes mistakes at the back. How about Yoro we haven’t gotten a good return on investment in one year. Let’s just sell our talented 19/20 year olds because they don’t have fully developed games yet.
Should we also sell Heaven because he makes mistakes at the back. How about Yoro we haven’t gotten a good return on investment in one year. Let’s just sell our talented 19/20 year olds because they don’t have fully developed games yet.
No, just mainoo.
This was always going to happen. With all the noise from fans and the media about getting Kobbie Mainoo back into the team, the second he finally got a game, people were desperate to see something special.
The hype has built so much that anything less than a worldie was always going to be labelled as “disappointing” by some.
But honestly, if you watched his performance tonight, that’s just how Mainoo plays. He’s a short pass, pass and move type of midfielder. He keeps things simple, helps the team keep the ball, and does the basics well. With more games, we’ll probably see him start to take players on more and drive into space but beyond that, I’m not really sure what people were expecting.
I think this is a classic case of a player becoming better in people’s heads because he hasn’t been playing. Mainoo’s still young, he’s still learning, and he’s barely had any minutes. He’s not the finished product yet.
Instead of jumping on him straight away, let’s get behind him. He needs games, patience, and support.
The hype has built so much that anything less than a worldie was always going to be labelled as “disappointing” by some.
But honestly, if you watched his performance tonight, that’s just how Mainoo plays. He’s a short pass, pass and move type of midfielder. He keeps things simple, helps the team keep the ball, and does the basics well. With more games, we’ll probably see him start to take players on more and drive into space but beyond that, I’m not really sure what people were expecting.
I think this is a classic case of a player becoming better in people’s heads because he hasn’t been playing. Mainoo’s still young, he’s still learning, and he’s barely had any minutes. He’s not the finished product yet.
Instead of jumping on him straight away, let’s get behind him. He needs games, patience, and support.
I think if we can get north of 40m for him, absolutely sell, yes.
Did ok, you can tell he has been in and out of the side and overlooked for the majority of the season, but he does well at keeping the ball moving, whether that be forwards himself or simple little lay offs, he had a really good interchange with Yoro that set him away, you can get that happening with Heaven on the left as well and all of a sudden things open up massively.
Why?
You think Mainoo won’t be worth more than £40m to us if we develop him and try and get the best out of him.
I remember a time our own manager Darren Fletcher was given pelters as a 20yo for being shite and being Fergie’s son and our patience in him came good.
I’m not saying keep any old player from the youth team but our most talented prospects have to be given a chance to fully succeed before selling. Some of you are acting like he’s Andrea’s Pereira or Darren Gibson type of talent.
I’ve seen what he’s capable of and that’s what we need to be trying to unleash.
He’s capable of some quick foot work around the penalty area, that’s where he was best when he first came through. But he can’t play that far forward for us. He’s too slow for midfield, his passing forward may improve, but we need some real midfielders
Correct. I think, unfortunately, he's just not all that.
That piece of upper body strength was him holding on to the ball for way too long too, he could have passed the ball to one of his teammates with his marker on top of him and out of position, but only had eyes for trying to complete a dribble.
That slowness is a hallmark of his game, it's not just his lack of pace, the way he plays the game is glacial too.
Tonight he barely passed the ball forwards, when he did it was often unsuccessful and even the successful ones usually meant trouble for the receiver.
I agree with this. People seem to have painted a dichotomy of "Mainoo is great, and not being picked because Amorim is terrible".
It isn't impossible for both to be quite poor.
Then games from years ago will get brought up, some also featuring Garnacho who we were also correct in selling.
I agree with the sentiment of supporting the youth, it's our bread and butter, but bare minimum United players have to put a shift in, and we're already carrying way too many already that don't.
We need to be way more ruthless and the athletic standard of especially the midfield needs massively improving.
Can we at least give him a run in the team before signing his death warrant?
He played 20 mins tonight after being injured / out since mid December. And prior to that he was only getting short cameos.
He played 20 mins tonight after being injured / out since mid December. And prior to that he was only getting short cameos.
Yep, well said. It's a shame as I thought when he broke through that Mainoo would be a top player, but I think he lacks in too many areas to fulfil the promise. Garna is a decent comparison - he's another I thought would be class but I suspect has a lower ceiling than I thought.
Definitely needs a run of minutes, but wasn't exactly inspiring against a god awful team. I assume he'll start against Brighton, let's have a better look there.
100% this.
People expect him to be Zizo in a 15 mins cameo when he just got back from an injury and barely played in a year !! Ridiculous
There is definitely a very good player in there, give him time and support him
I have been critical of his actions in here but some comments are way over the top. It wasn't a good performance but decent after a time out of the team.
He was alright. A lot of rust when he initially came on but grew into it. Maybe lacked a bit of urgency towards the end
It is an unjust game, but it is what it is.
The thing is, when we want to play him in a midfield role, then he has to progress the ball. And that quickly when the situation requires it. A ball passed moves faster than a ball dribbled. I would agree with your description of his game - the issue is, that this requires a certain team around him and a certain approach. And it is unknown whether we'll be able to provide an environment where he can play to his strength. This is not me trying to slag him off - but we also can't just fall into "he needs time". What we see isn't something that goes away with experience. Someones passing range doesn't increase with age. The teams overall passing capacity is already dire, which only makes his deficiencies weigh more.
Then he should be loaned out. United will be a pressure cooker in the foreseeable future. The midfield is crying out for improvements and that in numbers. And Mainoo doesn't seem to be on trajectory to the first team.
This is a bit like with what I said about Garnacho. People point to him at only being 20, but he's had 62 appearances for us and that's part of his game that has not got any better over that time. Garnacho racked up nearly 100 appearances with us and never really improved the things needed for him to be worth being a mainstay in the side, he was still only sub level quality for a top side. Unfortunately, we had played him so much, that there's no way he would go back to being on the bench. I get the same sort of vibe from Mainoo, he wants/thinks he should begetting game time, but also doesn't actually offer the thing our team is crying out for. He's inadvertly expecting us to fit the team around his strengths, which to me, he doesn't deserve and we don't have the personel to.
This sadly all leads back to bad squad construction, because if you wanted to develop Mainoo, he needed a suitable partner to do it with and he doesn't have that.
The issue is he's literally been terrible everytime he's played this year. He was probably our worst player vs grimbsy! He's not earning his place with the minutes he had gotten and considering his and his family's behaviour he most certainly should be scrutinised as he clearly thinks he's all that!
I agree. And I think, it is very understandable even when you consider what kind of praise he received very early on his carreer. It was probably too much and too soon. But then reality hit when he wasn't that unknown entity and opposition came prepared.
Also the timing is quite bad. I think, he doesn't offer enough to be seen as an attacker (like Bellingham a bit). So the most realistic chance is to take over a midfield role - he isn't a defensive midfielder, he isn't a deep lying playing due to passing range and he doesn't seem to fit a b2b midfielder due to intensity. That leaves him as a more attack minded midfielder who connects attack and midfield. But that spot in our team is blocked by Bruno. And I'd say after Bruno it is Mount.
It really feels he is on a similar trajectory (player style wise) as Pogba. And he was also always in the centre of discussions about what his best roles are. And he had miles better passing than Mainoo.
Where do you think he should start? What position?
I'm not even sure what he is to be honest, our only good examples of him playing well are at international level, when we played on the counter and scoring important goals. I wanted him to be that 6 that picks up the ball off defenders and evades the press with his dribbling ability, but that seems to have been abandoned. I almost thing the goals he's scored has pidgeon holed him into fighting for a place with Bruno.
In an ideal world, it would be as described above in that 6 role, but I think he'll have to be one of the CMs in a 4-3-3/4-2-3-1
Is that why were are so desperate to sign another 6? Most of our fans are crying for a CM but rate Mainoo as a CM?
Definitely not, he isn't a 6, and he lacks the required level of passing ability to operate that deep. He should be played in a double pivoit or midfield 3 next to someone who plays the role you described above
In anycase if he stays fit, you would think he will get between now and the end of the season to try and find some form
This is just my opinion where I think he'd work best long term. I think he will be used as CM though.
I don't think he necessarily needs it if he can beat the press through his ball carrying. That's what he's good at. If he had an energetic box to box player ahead of him, I think that role would work for him - just my opinion anyway. I think in a double pivot he lacks the passing and physicality, so I'm not expecting much from him if he plays there. A 3 probably is best, but not sure we'll really play that.
Work for him but not the team, thats the issue, because as a team his limited passing will have us miss plenty of transition opportunities once he beats the press. Also, having him as the deepest midfielder is an obvious defensive transitional issue. He would need to massively improve his passing to excel in that role. For me he is more the player who plays next to a 6 like an Iniesta where his close control and dribbling and composure on the ball helps the side keep and circulate the ball in a posession based system under pressure and beat counter pressing a bit further up the pitch, he is also good enough in winning back posession further up and being effective in the pressing structure himself. Where as you need someone else deeper playng the Busquests role with much better passing and defensive awareness.
Either way he needs to improve his game but he has useful skills/talents
I've been saying for the last 18 months or so that a midfield trio of Mainoo.. Wharton.. Anderson would work well in a 4-3-3.. This would be ideal if Bruno was to leave.
I see him more akin to De Jong. For me his main role would be progressing the ball from deep, if he can do that via passing or carrying - I'm agnostic. I also think the higher you play him in midfield, the more his lack of pace gets exposed. He has to learn how to protect the ball and intercept, Jorginho, Matic, Busquets and lots of others were very slow, but they positionally didn't have to cover as much ground, read the game well and knew how to use their body to protect the ball. I don't think he's anything like Iniesta, personally, bar the dribbling. Remember Iniesta wasn't slow when he first broke through, he adapted as he got slower, so it's not really a good player to model him on.
Agreed and we need to decide as a club what his best role is and just stick with it and go balls to the wall developing him in that role, if we want him to be a success here.
Good at passing
He did just that once last night, and very well, except the other way around. Intercepted a decent and dangerous-looking ball, held off his man very well... and we got possession back. He has it in his armoury.
This...
I don't think he got physicality for the premier League nowadays but he's very technical and that is definitely useful. In a midfield three at home with 2 other physical hard workers here could be a press resistant playmaker.