Kobbie Mainoo

[klayton88]

Constantly moved into positions to receive and was looked off by Yoro, Maguire and Lammens constantly.

Then was the only one I saw gesticulating to others to get the ball moving quicker.

Probably because they knew the pass was coming straight back and he wasn't going to progress the ball.

 

[Hammondo]

Wilfully missing the point I’m making. Centre midfielders take time to mature. Since you didn’t want to answer my question, Modric was playing at Inter Zapresic on loan. Xavi and Iniesta hadnt even made a Spain national team appearance yet.
Kobbie has already played in a euros final and scored in an FA Cup final for a struggling United team (he did this when he was actually 18 btw)
To answer your question. Fabregas had only just made it into the Arsenal first team at 20, Seedorf had just moved from Ajax to Real Madrid and Davids had just won a UEFA cup with Ajax.
Pretty similar to Kobbie those last 3 tbh, not sure what point you’re making?
Have some patience ffs

Why though? Why is mainoo so important that he gets so many chances without improvement.

If xavi, iniesta, modric, and fabregas were not given special treatment without showing performance, why should Mainoo?

 

[Ole'sattheWheel]

Why though? Why is mainoo so important that he gets so many chances without improvement.

If xavi, iniesta, modric, and fabregas were not given special treatment without showing performance, why should Mainoo?

Because right now after Casemiro he is the best midfielder at the club.
I would also say he is a top 10 player in his position at U21. Young players are inconsistent and can be frustrating, I get that, but you have to remember he’s been benched for nearly a year by an idiot coach who decided to play our best playmaking 10 at CDM instead of him.
I just think its mental to expect a 20 year old to be so consistent when I can’t think of a single CM, EVER to have done that before

 

[Hammondo]

Because right now after Casemiro he is the best midfielder at the club.
I would also say he is a top 10 player in his position at U21. Young players are inconsistent and can be frustrating, I get that, but you have to remember he’s been benched for nearly a year by an idiot coach who decided to play our best playmaking 10 at CDM instead of him.
I just think its mental to expect a 20 year old to be so consistent when I can’t think of a single CM, EVER to have done that before

Its not about being consistent, it's about being good enough which he hasn't been.

Only because of our dire midfield situation is he being played, otherwise he shouldn't be close to starting.

 

[Jund]

Hopefully you realise that your question is a bit stupid? The whole point of what he’s saying is that it’s much much more common for a CM career trajectory to be similar to Modric et al than the likes of Fabrgas or Pedri. Which is just stating the obvious. His list is going to be a hell of a lot longer than yours, that’s for sure.

If we are comparing Kobbie to some of the greatest who've played the game - let's include all of them? Or are we picking only the ones that suit our narrative best?

Also - most commonly you'll get a Renato Sanches, Anderson, Wilshere, Ravel Morrison, not Modric, Xavi or Iniesta. And that's a list that is going to be WAY longer than the one you mentioned earlier.

My point is - don't bring in the conversation some of the best players that have ever played the game.. Speaking strictly in percentages Kobbie is far more likely to be a Jonjo Shelvey than a Toni Kroos.

Maybe my question is stupid, but comparing a 20-year old with 5 good games to Modric, Iniesta or Xavi to me seems more outlandish.

 

[ManhattanRed]

I think technically he’s brilliant but I’ve said before and gotten stick for it, he’s a bit of a highlights player. He does a few things a game that are brilliant but then he’s anonymous for large parts of the game. Can definitely be fixed but I’m not sure he should be a guaranteed starter for us right now.

 

[Ole'sattheWheel]

Its not about being consistent, it's about being good enough which he hasn't been.

Only because of our dire midfield situation is he being played, otherwise he shouldn't be close to starting.

I agree we should get in a more experienced midfielder so Kobbie can rotate and learn from them. But we don’t, so he deserves to play. Thats not “special treatment” or delusion that’s just us playing our best players.
I think he’s been fine personally, but is just having a dip in form.
He has a bright future and has shown glimpses of a high potential. Nobody should be starting every game at that age, the only ones that have done that in the past have been absolute monsters. Like I said, the 3 best midfielders in his “mould” that I can think of weren’t doing that at his age either

 

[Pogue Mahone]

If we are comparing Kobbie to some of the greatest who've played the game - let's include all of them? Or are we picking only the ones that suit our narrative best?

Also - most commonly you'll get a Renato Sanches, Anderson, Wilshere, Ravel Morrison, not Modric, Xavi or Iniesta. And that's a list that is going to be WAY longer than the one you mentioned earlier.

My point is - don't bring in the conversation some of the best players that have ever played the game.. Speaking strictly in percentages Kobbie is far more likely to be a Jonjo Shelvey than a Toni Kroos.

Maybe my question is stupid, but comparing a 20-year old with 5 good games to Modric, Iniesta or Xavi to me seems more outlandish.

You've already missed his point once. Are you really doing it again?

The point is lots of top central midfielders (in fact, almost all top central midfielders) are miles off the finished article when they're 20. I have no idea why you need to bring up midfielders who didn't make it at the top (or why you include Morrison - not a CM - and Wilshere in your list - but let's not go there) as they're not relevant to the issue of the age at which a top CM usually starts to look the real deal. The fact that there are a few precocious freaks who develop way quicker than the norm is neither here nor there. Mainoo's performances/achievements put him closer to that category than most CMs but that's besides the point.

 

[Lash]

Difference is Jorginho and Matic had qualites Kobbie doesn’t have. Jorginho was a good passer of the ball that could up the pace and make more risky passes to gain ground on the opposition, Matic was a true midfielder with some stand out qualities. While Kobbie is a 5 a side player.

Kobbie has his own qualities though that they didn't have. He needs to hone them and improve his weaknesses and he needs to be appropriately paired. For what it's worth, I would have sold him last season and invested the money in midfield. Now I think we're going to get CL and with Casemiro leaving, I think we should have enough funds to invest in midfield that he can stay and play a rotation role over a long season, or step up into being a first XI starter. I don't think that can happen without pairing him with someone who can cover for his lack of aggressive and physicality.

This forum bewilders me, the guy is 20 and has generally been good under Carrick and it seems many posters are coiled like springs, salivating for the games he's not so good in to shoot out of their lairs to tell the world.

Bruno was toilet yesterday and opened the entire midfield up to get overrun, Case was shocking as well, but because one got an assist and one got a goal Mainoo seems to catch the flak.

He's just a lightening rod for our midfield woes and general squad construction. He was the centre of a big fallout from the last manager on playing time and now he's not really having the impact everyone thought he would, it's obvious he's gonna cop some. Much like how Dalot is now a braindead loser after being arguably one of our best players since Carrick came in.

 

[r0663664]

What type of midfielder is Mainoo? I think that is an important. Is he our next Cleverly or Carrick or Scholes? I don't think he shouldn't be starting all games at this age. I think he can be easily replaced with better quality. If he is still playing like this at 24-25, then we have another Rashford on our hands. An average player on high salary, If he doesn't start improving e.g. assist, attempts and shots of target, I think he will be back on the bench next season when we buy a better midfielders.

 

[Freak]

What type of midfielder is Mainoo? I think that is an important. Is he our next Cleverly or Carrick or Scholes? I don't think he shouldn't be starting all games at this age. I think he can be easily replaced with better quality. If he is still playing like this at 24-25, then we have another Rashford on our hands. An average player on high salary, If he doesn't start improving e.g. assist, attempts and shots of target, I think he will be back on the bench next season when we buy a better midfielders.

At the moment he’s more Cleverly than Carrick or Scholes in his style of play. Someone who just keeps things ticking over but does nothing really substantial in terms of progressing our play.

 

[Drainy]

What type of midfielder is Mainoo? I think that is an important. Is he our next Cleverly or Carrick or Scholes? I don't think he shouldn't be starting all games at this age. I think he can be easily replaced with better quality. If he is still playing like this at 24-25, then we have another Rashford on our hands. An average player on high salary, If he doesn't start improving e.g. assist, attempts and shots of target, I think he will be back on the bench next season when we buy a better midfielders.

Its a big question. He doesn't have the creative chops for the 10, the legs for the 8, or to doggedness and concentration for the 6 or the ling passing for any at United standards.

His best bet is the more attacking position once Bruno moves on but he's got to up the production

 

[Ali Dia]

He better in tight spaces than most when he's on form. Athletically he's not really at the races at the minute compared to the brutes he'd be coming up against but I dont think he gets as much protection from Bruno or Casemiro as is ideal either. As other posters have said it would be prudent to bring in a player a few years older to rotate with and I'm sure we will

 

[Bright_Eyes]

What type of midfielder is Mainoo? I think that is an important. Is he our next Cleverly or Carrick or Scholes? I don't think he shouldn't be starting all games at this age. I think he can be easily replaced with better quality. If he is still playing like this at 24-25, then we have another Rashford on our hands. An average player on high salary, If he doesn't start improving e.g. assist, attempts and shots of target, I think he will be back on the bench next season when we buy a better midfielders.

That's a simple fix though. When it's time to renew, offer him a salary that we think he's worth. If he's here at 24-25 on a higher salary than he's worth, that's the club's fault for offering him too much.

He's only on £25k a week at the moment and is contracted for two more years if we take the extension. He's 21 next month. So 24-25 is his next contract. If we offer him £350k like Rashford is on, or anywhere near it, for his next contract, I think that's on the club..

 

[Hammondo]

He better in tight spaces than most when he's on form. Athletically he's not really at the races at the minute compared to the brutes he'd be coming up against but I dont think he gets as much protection from Bruno or Casemiro as is ideal either. As other posters have said it would be prudent to bring in a player a few years older to rotate with and I'm sure we will

Why would he be getting protection? Isn't he supposed to be protecting?

 

[redw]

Wouldn't be starting for many of the top sides and would be a squad player but unfortunately he wants to be starting more often than not otherwise we get into the drama from the first half of the season.

 

[lex talionis]

If one were to only know Kobbie Mainoo from reading posts here, the only logical conclusion one could reach is that United should cash in on him during the summer and pick up a real midfielder, and not allow this fraud to continuing soiling the name Manchester United Football Club.

 

[Fenômeno]

Confused with the criticism he's done well since Carrick brought him back into the team.

 

[Winrar]

He had a poor game yesterday but some of the comments I’ve read calling him a 5-a-side player and only good enough for paralympics… beggars belief the lengths some of our so-called supporters go on to write off our academy product this early in his career just because of that.

 

[Champ]

As someone who has been critical of Mainoo (fairly I might add) in the past, I feel he has been one of the more consistent players since being brought back into the team.
He definitely has limitations but looks to have worked on them in training.

 

[Frank White]

If one were to only know Kobbie Mainoo from reading posts here, the only logical conclusion one could reach is that United should cash in on him during the summer and pick up a real midfielder, and not allow this fraud to continuing soiling the name Manchester United Football Club.

If the fee was right I personally wouldn't be against it. Would benefit everyone concerned, we get funds for a ready made midfielder, Mainoo gets to perfect his game in a less demanding league/environment. Win/win. Would obviously prefer if he was here to become the player most think he'll be but wonder how long that will take and do we have the patience for that?

 

[Leftback99]

We were better with Bruno at CM. We now have Amad out of the team instead.

 

[Frank White]

I don't think we have the depth in that position to make this kind of decision even if we were to get in another midfielder in his place.

Oh I know we need 2 starters minimum this summer imo. Mainoo ideally would be their back up, don't know if we'd have the funds available but personally I'm sick of are midfield being so shite. I'd take 1 more year of sub par full backs if it meant finally fixing are midfield. When I said I'd sell if the fee was right, I'm talking £60m plus.

 

[UnitedRepublic]

He had a poor game yesterday but some of the comments I’ve read calling him a 5-a-side player and only good enough for paralympics… beggars belief the lengths some of our so-called supporters go on to write off our academy product this early in his career just because of that.

Yes I called him a 5 a side player. He passes the ball backwards and looks cute on the ball at times but he never has any impact on the game all he does is pass the ball sideways and backwards in defense he’s easy to get past and in attacking phases it’s nothing of note it’s just playing it safe. We got Amad on the bench when Amad can do Kobbies job better than Kobbie can do it.

 

[Anustart89]

The flogging of Kobbie Mainoo here is ridiculous. I'd like to know the names of all the other 20 year old midfielders, anywhere in the world, who are better than he. There must be one somewhere, so anyone here who knows who that is please speak up.

Who’s saying that we have to buy a 20 year old to take his place in the starting eleven? Do we need to buy a 34 year old to replace Casemiro as well?

 

[Raoul]

We were better with Bruno at CM. We now have Amad out of the team instead.

This was always the tradeoff for going to 4-2-3-1 . We need two good midfielders in Carrick's formation and currently only have one that is 33 and on his way out. So if we're going to continue, we probably need a nuclear reboot of CM this summer.

 

[lex talionis]

Who’s saying that we have to buy a 20 year old to take his place in the starting eleven? Do we need to buy a 34 year old to replace Casemiro as well?

Nice strawman! No one is suggesting that "we have to buy another 20 year old to take his place in the starting eleven" as that is not the issue. The issue, many argue here, is whether Mainoo is or ever will be good enough for United, not whether if it's the case that he isn't that we must buy another 20 year old to replace him. I am aware of no one who argues, or anyone who claims that someone else has argued, that we must buy another 34 year to replace our current 34 year old Casemiro.

 

[Anustart89]

Nice strawman! No one is suggesting that "we have to buy another 20 year old to take his place in the starting eleven" as that is not the issue. The issue, many argue here, is whether Mainoo is or ever will be good enough for United, not whether if it's the case that he isn't that we must buy another 20 year old to replace him. I am aware of no one who argues, or anyone who claims that someone else has argued, that we must buy another 34 year to replace our current 34 year old Casemiro.

The point is that the ’flogging’ of Mainoo is people not really seeing what he brings to the team that motivates him being the centrepiece of our midfield rebuild or being a starting player after the summer window. You can of course ignore the idiots who come up with soundbites like 5 aside player because that means nothing.

The fact that there are 20 yo players who are worse than him and 20 yo players that are better than him is neither here nor there because most people don’t think our rebuild needs to consist of having a 20 yo player in midfield for the hell of it.

Just because most midfielder aren’t the finished article at 20 (nobody is, most players reach their prime much later than that regardless of position) doesn’t mean people can’t look at his attributes and make an opinion on whether he’ll make it to the absolute top (consistent and effective starter in a team with ambitions of competing on multiple fronts), just like they did with Kiko Macheda, Adnan Januzaj and others who broke through and then didn’t do much to become mainstays in the long term.

 

[Jeffthered]

I think technically he’s brilliant but I’ve said before and gotten stick for it, he’s a bit of a highlights player. He does a few things a game that are brilliant but then he’s anonymous for large parts of the game. Can definitely be fixed but I’m not sure he should be a guaranteed starter for us right now.

I rarely see Kobie Mainoo do anything brilliant.

De Bruyne was on occasion, brilliant, and consistently very v v good.

I don't get the Mainoo hype. But that's how things are now, someone must be hyped up.

Mainoo needs to sit down with Carrick. He can get better, but he is missing something right now. He plays like he is the complete article, and he is not the complete article.

 

[Lord Baltimore]

Probably because they knew the pass was coming straight back and he wasn't going to progress the ball.

Agree entirely, Mainoo has been a real disappointment since his return the side. I can accept that he is not a speed merchant but his inability to progress the ball forwards is dragging the team down.

 

[lex talionis]

The point is that the ’flogging’ of Mainoo is people not really seeing what he brings to the team that motivates him being the centrepiece of our midfield rebuild or being a starting player after the summer window. You can of course ignore the idiots who come up with soundbites like 5 aside player because that means nothing.

The fact that there are 20 yo players who are worse than him and 20 yo players that are better than him is neither here nor there because most people don’t think our rebuild needs to consist of having a 20 yo player in midfield for the hell of it.

Just because most midfielder aren’t the finished article at 20 (nobody is, most players reach their prime much later than that regardless of position) doesn’t mean people can’t look at his attributes and make an opinion on whether he’ll make it to the absolute top (consistent and effective starter in a team with ambitions of competing on multiple fronts), just like they did with Kiko Macheda, Adnan Januzaj and others who broke through and then didn’t do much to become mainstays in the long term.

I think we need to back up the truck a bit. Manchester United is known for bringing up its promising young players to the first team. We've had an academy player in every squad lineup since 1937. A quick fact check says since October 30, 1937. The Busby Babes. The Class of 92. It's a cliche now, but giving our young players a genuine chance is a massive part of United's DNA, if not the defining feature of United's DNA. Enduring the growing pains of young players like Scholes, who was a brilliant scorer of goals at 20 but was raw and hardly gave one the impression that he would someday become one of the top midfielders of his generation, is part of the United experience. This is what we do.

But none of our young players over the ages, with the possible exception of Duncan Edwards, broke into the first team as the finished article. Promising young players like Charlton and Giggs -- and no, I'm not suggesting that Mainoo is the next Charlton or Giggs -- breaks into the first team as the finished article. There will be days when Mainoo is brilliant and days when he is not, which can also be said of players in their prime such as Keane and Beckham -- and actually can be said of every footballer who never becomes a recognized world class footballer. That's just reality. A 20 year old midfielder, however, brilliant he is on some days will disappoint us on other days. Young forwards such as Messi and Ronaldo, and the other Ronaldo, can excel if they have the pace to beat defenders, but the craft of a midfielder is rarely about athleticism first and rarely do we ever see a midfielder attain world class status at 20. Not Zidane, not Keane, not Scholes, not Pirlo. It would be shocking in the extreme if Mainoo maintained the outstanding form over many months that he has shown in flashes, as a very young player, under ten Hag and under Carrick. And as you surely must remember, Amorim didn't even give young Kobbie crumbs for the better part of 13 months, so to expect more than what we've seen from him so far, when he has shown flashes of brilliance under Carrick, although undeniably off it for three matches now, is absurd. It's nights like last night, when young players like Mainoo are off peak and the team suffers defeat, that become the foundation for his growth as a footballer.

But on the point that some people can't see the massive difference Mainoo has made since Carrick has brought him back into the starting XI after we were a sinking ship under Amorim while Mainoo was banished from the pitch, what a pity that there are those who cannot see the obvious.

 

[Ole'sattheWheel]

I think we need to back up the truck a bit. Manchester United is known for bringing up its promising young players to the first team. We've had an academy player in every squad lineup since 1937. A quick fact check says since October 30, 1937. The Busby Babes. The Class of 92. It's a cliche now, but giving our young players a genuine chance is a massive part of United's DNA, if not the defining feature of United's DNA. Enduring the growing pains of young players like Scholes, who was a brilliant scorer of goals at 20 but was raw and hardly gave one the impression that he would someday become one of the top midfielders of his generation, is part of the United experience. This is what we do.

But none of our young players over the ages, with the possible exception of Duncan Edwards, broke into the first team as the finished article. Promising young players like Charlton and Giggs -- and no, I'm not suggesting that Mainoo is the next Charlton or Giggs -- breaks into the first team as the finished article. There will be days when Mainoo is brilliant and days when he is not, which can also be said of players in their prime such as Keane and Beckham -- and actually can be said of every footballer who never becomes a recognized world class footballer. That's just reality. A 20 year old midfielder, however, brilliant he is on some days will disappoint us on other days. Young forwards such as Messi and Ronaldo, and the other Ronaldo, can excel if they have the pace to beat defenders, but the craft of a midfielder is rarely about athleticism first and rarely do we ever see a midfielder attain world class status at 20. Not Zidane, not Keane, not Scholes, not Pirlo. It would be shocking in the extreme if Mainoo maintained the outstanding form over many months that he has shown in flashes, as a very young player, under ten Hag and under Carrick. And as you surely must remember, Amorim didn't even give young Kobbie crumbs for the better part of 13 months, so to expect more than what we've seen from him so far, when he has shown flashes of brilliance under Carrick, although undeniably off it for three matches now, is absurd. It's nights like last night, when young players like Mainoo are off peak and the team suffers defeat, that become the foundation for his growth as a footballer.

But on the point that some people can't see the massive difference Mainoo has made since Carrick has brought him back into the starting XI after we were a sinking ship under Amorim while Mainoo was banished from the pitch, what a pity that there are those who cannot see the obvious.

Completely agree with everything you just said - and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but for anyone with any common sense this should be completely obvious. The fact you’re having to spell this out just shows everything that is wrong with modern football and social media in general

 

[Bondi77]

Completely agree with everything you just said - and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but for anyone with any common sense this should be completely obvious. The fact you’re having to spell this out just shows everything that is wrong with modern football and social media in general

Anyone with any common sense can see that his game is more suited to other less physical leagues in Europe.
He was completely lost yesterday with the pace of the game and coupled with Casemiro it was easy for Newcastle to stroll through our midfield at will.

 

[pacifictheme]

Anyone with any common sense can see that his game is more suited to other less physical leagues in Europe.
He was completely lost yesterday with the pace of the game and coupled with Casemiro it was easy for Newcastle to stroll through our midfield at will.

He is 20 years old.

 

[Bondi77]

He is 20 years old.

I support Manchester United
I do not know all of our players birth dates but I am well aware of their ages.

 

[Stig]

Because right now after Casemiro he is the best midfielder at the club.
I would also say he is a top 10 player in his position at U21. Young players are inconsistent and can be frustrating, I get that, but you have to remember he’s been benched for nearly a year by an idiot coach who decided to play our best playmaking 10 at CDM instead of him.
I just think its mental to expect a 20 year old to be so consistent when I can’t think of a single CM, EVER to have done that before

You are right in what you say.

 

[Teja]

I fear he's going the Garnacho route where the hype around him (see the free Mainoo T-shirts and such) is greater than his actual ability. At this point in his development, I think he's a decent rotation option and the contract should reflect that (~100-120k p/w). If he doesn't want to sign it then I would sell this summer and raise some cash.

 

[Ali Dia]

We were better with Bruno at CM. We now have Amad out of the team instead.

Were we? We were mostly shite with 5 at the back and Bruno in midfield. Bruno was always better closer to goal and Mainoo still needs experience. Just because something isn't instantly working out doesn't really mean anything as long as it's part of a longer term vision. Mainoo is already at least good enough to be a squad player in a winning team but he should also be getting lots of minutes for his own game. There should be better competition and cover for such a vital position at a really big club.

 

[SungSam7]

We were better with Bruno at CM. We now have Amad out of the team instead.

No we were not.

Go back and look at our highlight on YouTube under Amorim, the amount of goals we conceded because Bruno lost his man in the box, or his Hollywood passes just giving the team back possession.

Or his daft tackling in and around the box. The penalty against Newcastle is a fresh reminder on why Bruno is not in fact a CM.

 

[Ole'sattheWheel]

Were we? We were mostly shite with 5 at the back and Bruno in midfield. Bruno was always better closer to goal and Mainoo still needs experience. Just because something isn't instantly working out doesn't really mean anything as long as it's part of a longer term vision. Mainoo is already at least good enough to be a squad player in a winning team but he should also be getting lots of minutes for his own game. There should be better competition and cover for such a vital position at a really big club.

Yeah wtf is that poster on about? With Bruno at CM we finished 15th and were in relegation form again this season. Hopefully they were being ironic