Ive seen mention of it before in river chatrooms etc its a 'myth' that gets passed on. It could be lifting, it could be using a resistance band or something like that. But he obviously trains his arms in some form or fashion. There are people who have to do less, or are naturally leaner so you can see the definition more but they'd still need to use their arms to get a pump like he has.
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 18
- Clean sheets
- 6
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 5
Ive seen mention of it before in river chatrooms etc its a 'myth' that gets passed on. It could be lifting, it could be using a resistance band or something like that. But he obviously trains his arms in some form or fashion. There are people who have to do less, or are naturally leaner so you can see the definition more but they'd still need to use their arms to get a pump like he has.
No doubt. I cannot believe people actually think that he doesn't. As you say, it is in some form or another. He's got one helluva physique though, but I think he definitely works best to put on when defenders are tiring a little. He must be hell to play against, but at the same time, his end product is so poor.
Fun player to watch when on song though - same as Doku. Football is entertainment, so we also need flair players and not just robots on the pitch.
Makes sense
Made the PL Team of the week. Its seemingly only on here where people are having a go at him. Everyone else has raved about him.
The clues are there. Constantly coated in Vaseline, both biceps bursting and only good in rapid bursts early in the game before he fades, hinting at less cardio and more anaerobic activities. The guy is an ambidextrous w*nker.
An absolute beast of a footballer. Not at his best against Fulham but still slammed the door on menacing intrusions into our final third.
What's the transparency issue? Do you think Lentwood is somehow related to Harry Maguire?
It’s not just him, but there’s a weird group on here who massively underrate him, which I guess is understandable because he was injured for a long time and people have ridiculously short memories in football. But plenty of posts with thin veiled bollocks about him eventually being replaced etc. the only thing that will get him replaced is his injury record, because his performances when fit are amongst the best in the league in his position.
The people who “massively underrate him” mostly think that others massively overrate him. “Top 5 in the world” etc.
He started awfully at United but pulled his shit together and had a good autumn 2022, 7-8 PL matches where I thought he did very well. After that, it has mostly been ok to good with some occasional great games (and occasional bad games). Sure, injuries play a big part in that but still he needs to perform at that autumn 2022 level for a few seasons to claim he is among the best in the league.
Personally I would say he’s good in possession but not that good in defence. I don’t like him with Maguire since they both leave huge holes behind them when they burst out, but it worked ok last game. On paper it could work very well with Yoro even if we would be weak in the air. It will be interesting to see him pairing with de Ligt.
This is a massive season for him. Let’s see how he performs.
I'm a big fan of the fella, I love the dude since a long time even before Ajax and while I still he think he is sometimes overconfident in his anticipation and his ball skills, he still is a fantastic player with not only talent and a big personality to boot.
His size will be always sthg that people would point at him and as good as he can compensate by reading the ball in the air, he still will be in a lesser place regarding those regarding comparisons with taller defenders.
Yet what the other poster it's saying it's not that far form truth. Some critics even the Carragher one since day 0, are way over the top, this last game is quite an example of that.
And BTW, you are tidy, you are not obviuosly obnoxius, but you are not the beacon of objectivity here, he started "awuful" meaning: his debut game and the following, where BTW he wasn't even as awful as many others defenders in recent times in United where for way larger periods of times.
The narrative that he was too small and too expensive for a Ducthie League fella was already established before he even put a foot in the field, even before "his awuful starting".
Later you gave him only 7 to 8 matches were he did very well and quite frankly this doesn't seem that fair either.
I absolutely agree that United as whole needs to win and him to be among the best players to gain a bigger status, talent alone (that you don't give him enough credit at all) isn't enough, yet since day one he had to deal with adversities including a very unfair treatment by the Press by default and United as whole playing so bad as team. Not precisly the greatest of scenarios, still getting himself being noticed and giving his all.
BTW let's hope the "let's see how he perfoms" it's as long as the Lindelöf period, more or less 7 seasons, so let's agree to give Licha at least 130+ games to be more fair, objective and tidy
That's an incredible assessment of his time here.
To clarify:
Yes awful start means the start, in this case the two first matches.
I didn’t write 7-8 matches; I wrote 7-8 PL matches. There were also some EL where he was good. Maybe it was a few more than 7-8 PL matches. After the poor start, he played 12 more PL matches in total before WC and all were not great in my opinion but we can of course have different view on that (city 6 goals conceded and Villa 3 goals come to mind). My point is that he has only played several great games after another during this period, which in time span was of about two months, max three.
After World Cup I thought he never reached the same level and then he got injured. Last season he never had a period with consecutive matches at that level, either.
For me this is not enough to be top 5 in the world etc.
It’s not about being tidy or objective; it’s a forum where we should be allowed to express our own opinions. If you were in love with him already when he was a teenager maybe you are not the “beacon of objectivity”, either. Personally I don’t see why anybody should be objective when we talk about football which is all about feelings and emotion.
Name your 5 best PL centre backs @A-man.
Do you think the same problems you mentioned with Maguire won't be there with De Ligt? They're pretty similar centre halves.
Yes I think there could potentially be some problems, but if de Ligt and Martinez both reach high levels it will work. It also depends on the performances of defensive midfield and full backs of course.
The best compliment I can give Butcher is that I recall games of old where there were certain players, whom were they in the starting lineup I felt confident no matter the opponent.
Keane
Stam
Schmeichel
Vidic
I get the same vibes from Martinez
Keane
Stam
Schmeichel
Vidic
I get the same vibes from Martinez
I think we might see Martínez at left-back when Yoro returns to the team. If we switch to a back 3 in possession with the right-back inverting into midfield, we can still make good use of Martínez's in-possession qualities. And defensively the duo of Yoro and de Ligt could be better IMO than Martínez+anyone else...but Yoro has shown he's still raw on occasions, so it won't be an elite pairing instantly.
Who said you aren't allowed?, come on, don't be silly.
My "I love the fella", was precisly to come clean and clear to the point that of course I have a background of supporting the player, way before his United tenure, just to clarify that I'm not in the let's see what this fella can do bandwagon, that I already rate him very high, no matter what happens in Man Utd or not.
And exactly, nobody has to be objective, that's why I've said "I love the fella" in first place. Yet mostly I've quoted your post talking about people going to extremes and not being grounded or objective, because at the same time since minute one you always had a Bible of excuses and atributes for Lindelof and rate just good to not that much the fella of this thread. You pretty much belong to the group TrustInJanuzaj was talking about and there is no problem with that, but quoting a post like the the one you did putting yourself in some sort of middle ground, you know it's not true.
Your debates with @criticalanalysis regarding Licha and Lindelof speaks volume of what I'm pointing out, even some details from your post here that I've quoted in my prior post too, come one man.
Like I've said before, you do not tend to go over the top, or insult, or be extremely obnoxious, but you are always finding an excuse to give the more control praise regarding or underrate the fella in this thread that doesn't come even close when comes to your approach with Lindelof for a lot of time.
Last edited:
I think you are right. We haven’t seen much from Martinez at left back but I could imagine that is something ETH would like go for at some point. If all those three players are fit and available, that is…
Yoro and de Ligt have a great potential together but only if de Ligt reaches his higher level and Yoro turns out to be what we hoped and payed for
Sorry I have no interest in you reviewing me, but I wish you a good life.
Same for you mate
Pep Guardiola literally said that in May. As far as I'm aware, people on here are referencing that quote as evidence that it's not just biased United fans who rate him highly.
This WUM is very coy about his bias and is basically contrarian on pretty much every other defender not named Lindelof. The Swede has been getting a lot of shit recently in some threads and just like clockwork they chime in to post a 'well ACTUALLY guys, as a neutral, Martinez wasn't that good'. Below is the game they're citing where we shipped 3 goals against Villa. Martinez had a bad game but just watch Lindelof's involvement in the first and third goal.
If this is the example of 'criticism' and 'objectivity' of Martinez's first season to say he wasn't all that, someone who was widely regarded as one of our best players of the season up until his injury, I wonder where that objectivity went for a certain Swedish defender at the club for 7 years of performances threads (where said WUM has literally probably close to or over 1000 of posts). Oh wait I can show you:
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/victor-lindelöf-2022-23-performances.471408/page-16
Same game. First they say Lindelof had a bad game but then up against the universal criticism from everybody else, goes on to defend the player with 8 separate posts arguing against different posters replying with annotated screenshots and excuses of 'well maybe ETH told him to push up', 'he shouldn't have conceded a foul in the first goal because maybe he could have got a yellow', 'even if he didn't tackle him, other players were out of position' etc ad nauseum. It's Ronaldo vs Messi fan levels of delusion but for Lindelof (?!) in one game where he was widely agreed as horrendous by the general consensus. If you can defend with that level of granularity and opposition, then your impartiality for other players like Martinez goes out the window.
Martinez is very good to excellent when fit and on form, we haven't seen that player for Utd since his first season, hopefully he gets a good run to return to those levels. There are limitations in his game that have to be taken into account, general lack of speed and aerial abilities and the nature of the league means those can be exploited on occasion if he is not properly on it.
His absence last season had his reputation build to somewhat unrealistic levels, Utd were thrashed plenty of times with him in the team during his first season. His ball playing ability is more influential than his pure defensive impact in my opinion, a leader but not an elite pure defender, on the ball he is among the best in the game from that position.
De Ligt and Martinez is going to be interesting viewing, both aggressive front foot defenders, if Ugarte does come in you are going to have a central trio who look to swarm attackers, certainly a major change from the passiveness of the likes of Lindelof but might leave space in behind at times.
His absence last season had his reputation build to somewhat unrealistic levels, Utd were thrashed plenty of times with him in the team during his first season. His ball playing ability is more influential than his pure defensive impact in my opinion, a leader but not an elite pure defender, on the ball he is among the best in the game from that position.
De Ligt and Martinez is going to be interesting viewing, both aggressive front foot defenders, if Ugarte does come in you are going to have a central trio who look to swarm attackers, certainly a major change from the passiveness of the likes of Lindelof but might leave space in behind at times.
Pep rates Harry highly as well.
Lindelof is one of the worst defenders I have seen in the Premier league and it amazes me how he has stayed at our club.
There are different levels of rating a player. Pep never said Maguire was in the top 5 CBs in the world.
He dropped out of the bidding for him at about 60mil I think before we bought him so I think he rated him pretty highly.
Brighton 2:1 Man Utd
Mediocre again.
I miss him being a good defender. That was a fun couple of months.
Crap at defending. He was good for a few months in his first season and been injured/poor ever since. Another player turning into deadwood.
Unpopular take.. this guy needs upgrading. He’s going to cost us games all season at this rate.
Had an awful start to the season. Poor on the ball, much worse than that defensively.
Seems to be a player who needs matches to get up to speed.
Seems to be a player who needs matches to get up to speed.
If he is not fully fit and sharp it can be a struggle for him due to his lack of pace and aerial ability. I know fans don't want to admit it after the hyper focus on his height but having a CB with limited aerial presence is not ideal.
Really need him to get back to where he was but it may take a few months.
Really need him to get back to where he was but it may take a few months.
What was he doing for the second Brighton goal? Positionally very suspect...really poor start to the season
How can a player be so good and then so bad? He was amazing vs city and now he can’t pass.
His place in the team will be under threat soon if he keeps being as sloppy as he's been. Awful positioning for the winner, in no man's land.
To be fair I once said he was overrated (note, never said he was bad just not as good as the cafe thinks) and got pelters for it. He gets rinsed far too often for someone who we believe would have saved us by himself last season.
I think he will eventually lose his place in the team. That said he's probably my favourite player still
I think he will eventually lose his place in the team. That said he's probably my favourite player still
Take away his passing, and he's basically Rojo. Which isn't that bad as Marcos was pretty solid for that brief period when he stayed fit and formed a partnership with Bailly.