I wouldn't have put it past Big H to have won 99% of his arial challenges though!
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 16
- Clean sheets
- 3
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 0
- Red cards
- 1
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In the latest edition of the United Hour Podcast, we interview Duncan Drasdo of MUST - covering ticket prices, new stadium, INEOS and what fans should be demanding from our club.
Also, due to technical issues we couldn't put a notice up for the previous episode which was about the game against Bournemouth and other stuff. If you'd like to listen to it, click here.
cant go to battle with a broken spine
He’s got a world cup to be fit for…..
How are you suggesting this when none of those clubs have a replacement?
They have the normal CBs that can replace a Maguire or De Ligt. A fairly tall CB good in the air with the occasional goal is something most teams have.
Finding someone who can playmake from the back is going to be much harder. And without it we'll need to change our system as our midfield and attack will be greatly affected. We'll need more ball players in midfield and attack, with less players working off the ball to be found by the ball players. Thats what Lisandro's distribution and ability to find our most creative player in pockets of space allows us to forgo currently.
We can sign a normal CB but then we'll need to sign one of the top tier midfield playmakers just to continue at the same level we're at. So now you need a CB and a midfielder, both at Lisandro's level which is going to cost a lot
Number of league matches he has played in for us so far:
22/23: 27 matches
23/24: 11 matches
24/25: 20 matches
25/26: unlikely to hit 20 matches now
He cannot be counted on, simple as. Nice to have when he's fit, but we shouldn't go into next season expecting him to be first choice.
22/23: 27 matches
23/24: 11 matches
24/25: 20 matches
25/26: unlikely to hit 20 matches now
He cannot be counted on, simple as. Nice to have when he's fit, but we shouldn't go into next season expecting him to be first choice.
Great player when fit & available.
Not fit & available enough, unfortunately.
Not fit & available enough, unfortunately.
His greatest attribute has shown how immeasurably better we are when we've got a centre back who can play. Hence, we should look to buy an actual centre back who can actually play and stay fit. And depending on what the situation is with de Ligt, maybe two of them.
Surely there are centre backs out there that can carry the ball and pass through the lines, no?
Surely there are centre backs out there that can carry the ball and pass through the lines, no?
As said before his passing/forward runs are exquisite yet he seriously lack on the core aspects that makes a successful EPL CB. He's not the quickest so he can't cover the 'fast' CB role, he's terrible in air so he can't be the stopper type of CB and his lack of physicality doesn't make him good enough to be the 'Rio' type of CB let alone the 'Vidic' type. He's now 28 and he piled injuries whenever asked to play more then 1 game a week. Martinez can probably do well in the EPL as a CB in a 3 men CB were he would be partnered with a fast CB on one side and a powerful 'good in air' CB on the other side. Yet we're not reverting to that system anytime soon.
This is the ball playing GK all over again. Sure having a GK whose comfortable with the ball at his feet is great but not at the expense of him being a sitting duck whenever there's a shot on goal or there's a cross to defend
We played the top 2 teams in the league with him in a back 4 and coped just fine.
The idea that Licha can only be a ‘PL CB’ in a back 3 flies in the face of available evidence. Our best string of defensive records since he’s been here all involved him starting, including the run that won DDG the Golden Glove in 22/23. It’s fair game to criticize his fitness record and it’s more than good enough as a reason if you want a replacement, but a fit Licha is at minimum a top 5 CB in this league, whatever formation you employ at the back.
He is definitely a successful EPL. His only issue is his fitness.
Needs replacing, along with Mount. Will go down as another poor buy under ETH, regardless of some half decent performances. Ever present in our mailings to City and Liverpool, and missed half his games here.
Fitness is part of a bigger problem. He might be the butcher of Amsterdam but in the EPL his 5ft9 frame he is too small for a CB. Playing 2 games a week against players who are vastly taller, stronger and more physical then you do in a league that hardly protect smaller players will leave a toil. Martinez will pick injuries and at age 28 this can only get worse.
Regarding his performance with United Martinez best partners came in the form of Varane and Maguire. Injuries aside Varane was the perfect CB. He was great in air (90 percentile of aerial duel won), he provided pace, he provided experience and he was relatively physical. Maguire on the other hand lacked Varane's pace but he is built like a truck. He's extremely physical and he sits in the 99 percentile in aerial duel won. Then we switched to a 3 CB system which could work for Martinez as we could play him with a pacey CB and a traditional stopper. I doubt we're going to play that system again.
Varane had since left and Maguire's career with United is close to an end. On top of that we're also losing Casemiro whose excellent in air as well.
Assuming Maguire leave, our next best player in terms of aerial duels is De Ligt who sits around the 55 percentile, Yoro is currently at the 40 percentile and Heaven is even worse then that. I am not too concerned about the youngsters. They'll improve with time (Yoro is 6ft3 and Heaven is 6ft2) and they do provide pace but they'll nowhere ready yet. De Ligt on his own won't provide the aerial cover our CB pair need and Martinez can't provide the pace, the ball playing CB in modern football need. At age 28 CBs are expected to provide certainty and solutions not headaches on whom should partner him and how to circumvent his evident weaknesses
Gentile destroyed Maradona, Stiles kept Eusebio in his pocket while Park barely allowed Pirlo to touch the ball. Don't underestimate the player's will to rise to occasion and to prove everyone wrong. Luckily stats and the eye test permit a deeper analysis. How would Martinez perform when he's constantly play week in week out against opposition whose vastly taller and more physical then him? How United's defense react in corners with a CB whose basically a liability in terms of aerial duels? Will he do well? Will he end up picking injuries on a regular basis? Can our team cover for a CB whose neither fast nor good in air + who will break if played too much?
I don't think we necessarily need to play Licha in a 3rd CB system. It's proven that someone like Varane can cover for all his weaknesses (pace, height, aerial duels etc). There again how many Varanes do you think will be available next summer? Also at a senior player Licha should be providing solutions rather then more headaches on who should play alongside him to cover for his glaring weaknesses. I mean I can't recall us asking that about a 28 year old Stam, a 28 year old Rio or a 28 year old Vidic.
I think its good for both the club and the player to part ways. Licha would be immense in La Liga or the Serie A were there is far less emphasis on pace and physicality. United on the other hand need to build a center back pair with the characteristics of being successful and who can endure through time
Lisandro was currently once again proving hes a very good CB in the premier league with our winning run starting once he had an experienced partner instead of Yoro and Heaven. Now hes injured, which is the only actual concern
You live in a fantasy
So you’re saying two successive matches isn’t enough to draw any conclusions but one match (each from different decades) is?
And I hope you’re not suggesting Gentile, Stiles and Park were average players who simply “rose to the occasion”… because they weren’t.
I am saying that players do rise to occasion when playing against the bigger teams. However there's more games then simply Arsenal/Liverpool. The stats and the eye test do not lie. Martinez is indeed not the quickest, he is weak in air and he struggles with the physicality of the EPL. His injuries are a consequence of that
Regarding your second comment. Average players? no. Worse then the players they faced in that list? Definitely yes
So Maguire and De Ligt also struggle with the physicality of the premier league according to this
He does not struggle with the physicality of the PL FFS. Broke his foot in a freak injury (in the EL), re-injured it after coming back too soon and then did his MCL in another freak accident of someone falling awkwardly on his knee.
It’s not like he’s been picking up muscle injuries here, there and everywhere. It’s pretty much 2 injuries that’s kept him out for long periods, and both were very unfortunate occurrences.
It’s not like he’s been picking up muscle injuries here, there and everywhere. It’s pretty much 2 injuries that’s kept him out for long periods, and both were very unfortunate occurrences.
No news on his return from the pre match press conference today? Thought it was a sure thing
Team news on the official site says he’s still out. Very frustrating.
Yeah that first injury was the turning point sadly
So frustrating! This dude is vital…up there with Bruno for the teamplay
This reminds me on that Seinfeld episode where Jerry explains to Elaine how "5 days are 2 days basically".
Lisandro had 7 injuries so far in United. Metatarsal injury, foot injury, calf injury, knee injury, back injury, cruciate ligament injury and now calf injury. Missed 50% of games since we bought him.
That is definition of injury prone player.
Is this the Shaw thread?
Licha's biggest contributing is showing us how much a CB playmaker can add to the team. We need to identify this profile of CB and add one to our team. And ideally someone taller and faster.
I love the guy but his fitness record is absymal. Hopefully the club can find a permanent solution for that because he gives us so much when he's fully fit.
I would go as far to say if he stayed fit he would be perfect captain material.
I would go as far to say if he stayed fit he would be perfect captain material.
When is he due back?
If he can’t get back for Leeds, then he should be done.
We might get a few quid for him, but he’s no good to us if he’s never fit.
Think Carrick said this week they reckon he’ll be back for Leeds. We need him to be now.
Between him, an ageing Maguire and de Ligt, United have plenty of experience but it is no good sat in the physio's room or in the stand. Hopefully, he'll be able to contribute toward the run in, especially now that Harry will be missed.
Maguire is only out for a game. But we cannot have Martinez, Maguire and De Ligt at the club. Two of them need to go.
Players who can’t get on the pitch are useless to us.
100%, Martinez is a waste of time, he’s the epitome of an absent player. Yes he’s a good player but not much use if he’s never actually available. I’d definitely sell him. He’s had a few years now. De Ligt is not as straight forward I think, I’d give him next season and if he’s still struggling then let him go at the end of next season. We don’t half get stuck with injury prone players
Been out for a worryingly long period for what was initially thought to be a 1-2 week recovery period. Is he not going to be back for the next match which is in over 3 weeks?
We should get a pool going on if he's back or not for next game. Be fun to see since you'd think 3 weeks plenty of time but man just got that feeling he doesn't make it
Contract expiring next year. Do wonder what happens with him, maybe not this summer but afterwards. We all love him but can't have him injured all the time.
Think we need to plan beyond him. Sure it’s great when he’s fit and looking like Pirlo at CB, but he can’t stay fit and even then he’s still limited as a true CB.
Is what it is. I’d like to see us look to replace with a top level CB
Is what it is. I’d like to see us look to replace with a top level CB
Availability is the best ability.
A cliche that’s patently untrue, just look at Ugarte.
It isn't perfect, depends on the context.