Lisandro Martinez, renew or sell?

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Bastian

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His contract has a year left, with the club having a 1 year option. Mitten just said on TOTD pod that he might be looking for an upgrade on his deal being one of the lowest paid defenders at the club, but he's obviously had major injury issues.

Do we bank on his availability or take the opportunity to sell while he's a first XI player at the World Cup for the current champions?

He's top class when fit, but for my money it's the availability issue. I think the club needs to find a first XI centre back and move on. Whether De Ligt will get over his back issues is an open question. Maguire is starting to pick up niggles too (I'd sell him, if Serie A is calling).
 
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Love him, but we may not get an opportunity like this again. Has to be for the right price of course. I saw Mount was linked with Milan too. If that’s true, we surely take that too.

EDIT: Or renew with something that factors in injuries.
 
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If the deal is good and permanent and the player is injury prone you have to sell. I really like Martinez and Mount I think both have world class ability but it's a business and they've misssed way too much football for it just to be bad luck
 
The problem is, he was a massive part of when we played best under Carrick last season, there was a visible hole in the team when he got injured. How do you reliably replace that passing ability in a center back?

But yeah, his injuries are a massive worry, it's definitely a predicament, we'd have to buy if we sold him.
 
When he's fit and has his head on, he's top class. However a lot of the time he's missing one or the other. Could cash in depending on price, but would need replacing.
 
Frivolous clickbait. He’s our player and barring something completely unexpected, will remain our player just as all the other CBs will next year.
 
Look at the poor quality passing of the current England centre back pairing, what prices have they gone for? Martinez is quality and should be renewed if the price is right.
 
Really not an easy decision. If his past injury record is a solid predictor of the future, we would be stupid not to sell, but that is not necessarily the case.

I would lean towards not selling. We aren't getting a massive fee anyway, and we have De Ligt and Yoro that have also struggled a bit with injuries. If we go into next season with Maguire, De Ligt, Yoro, Heaven and Martinez as the main CBs and then have the likes of Shaw and Mazraoui who can line up there in a pinch, I think that's fairly solid.
 
Raoul said:
Frivolous clickbait. He’s out player and barring something completely unexpected, will remain our player just as all the other CBs will next year.
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It’s not though is it? He’ll likely be looking for a new contract given the length left and it is a genuine question as to whether we bank on him being able to play enough.
 
Keep.

Injury issues aside, he’s our best defender. Our goal should be to keep our best players. We also have to look at Maguire is on borrowed time and De Ligt has injury issues as well. If we sell him we’re going to need another CB and someone of his quality is going to cost a lot. We’re struggling to get the midfielder we desperately need this summer. Do we really want to add a CB to the list?
 
Why sell Lisandro Martinez? he is an excellent player... has good personality, is fantastic on the ball, provides a vital left-footed option at the back.. can play in a three, or a four.. and I think could play as a deep, ball-playing defensive midfielder.

He is gutsy, likes to impose himself on the game, knows Manchester United and has loads of experience. We need to rotate our players, and he can also help Heaven develop. Yes he is injury prone, but comparisons with Mason Mount are silly. He is fit now, right?

How do you replace all that?
 
Bastian said:
It’s not though is it? He’ll likely be looking for a new contract given the length left and it is a genuine question as to whether we bank on him being able to play enough.
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As would all the others when their current deals are set to expire. He’s a quality player and I can’t see any reason why United would want to sell him given he’s one of our best and most influential defenders - especially given Maguire’s age, Heaven and Yoro’s youth and inexperience, and the fact that Martinez himself is starting games for Argentina. Those aren’t “lets get rid of him” credentials.
 
He’s played less than 50% of games. Clearly can’t be having a pay increase!

100% sell him. Hopefully the WC puts him in the shop window.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
He’s played less than 50% of games. Clearly can’t be having a pay increase!

100% sell him. Hopefully the WC puts him in the shop window.
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De Ligt played in 32% of our games last year, is a year younger than Martinez, and is on 75k a week more than Martinez. By your logic, we should be looking to sell him as well yes ?
 
Sell him then cry when he plays 50 games a season for the rest of his career
 
Raoul said:
De Ligt played in 32% of our games last year, is a year younger than Martinez, and is on 75k a week more than Martinez. By your logic, we should be looking to sell him as well yes ?
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Yes. But currently he’s not sellable.

Martinez’s record of less than 50% of games is over a 4 year period.

Do you think we should keep injury prone players?
 
Raoul said:
De Ligt played in 32% of our games last year, is a year younger than Martinez, and is on 75k a week more than Martinez. By your logic, we should be looking to sell him as well yes ?
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Yes we should be looking to move on from both as and when we can in all honesty. Neither can stay fit and we are effectively paying them to be our first choice pairing.

Part of the reason we are in this constant cycle though is we often don’t have the luxury of doing this so we end up retaining players. I doubt we can sell Martinez this summer and replace him whilst trying to address other problems but also can’t extend with a pay rise as he doesn’t even play half our games, it will have to be kicked down the road until next summer.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
Yes. But currently he’s not sellable.

Martinez’s record of less than 50% of games is over a 4 year period.

Do you think we should keep injury prone players?
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It depends if they’re injured or playing now. I expect both De Ligt and Martinez to be healthy and starting next season (after De Ligt completes his recovery in a month or two), as they are our best and most influential defenders.
 
You shouldn't keep injury prone players unless they are on very cheap contracts. When you can't depend on a player you have to have a replacement. If that replacement isn't first team level then you are playing with a weakened squad whenever the player is injured. If they are first XI quality then whats the point of the injury prone player. If the replacement is better than them then the only time they play is when the replacement is injured and you still run the big risk that both of them end up injured at the same time.

When have we ever kept an injury prone player and 5 years later said "god that was lucky we held onto them". Perhaps I am missing some great players with this issue but I can't think of any. Shaw should have been sold years ago. If De Ligt can't stay fit this season he should be moved on. Mount is another one on a last chance this season.

Top players cost you huge amounts in wages. Injury prone players don't usually cost you less and have all the other associated costs and problems they bring. Very few teams that are winning things have players in their teams who have long term injury issues.
 
Roboc7 said:
Yes we should be looking to move on from both as and when we can in all honesty. Neither can stay fit and we are effectively paying them to be our first choice pairing.

Part of the reason we are in this constant cycle though is we often don’t have the luxury of doing this so we end up retaining players. I doubt we can sell Martinez this summer and replace him whilst trying to address other problems but also can’t extend with a pay rise as he doesn’t even play half our games, it will have to be kicked down the road until next summer.
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The obvious solution would be to get them back to fitness, not throw them under the bus because of past issues that have nothing to do with their present predicaments.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
He’s played less than 50% of games. Clearly can’t be having a pay increase!

100% sell him. Hopefully the WC puts him in the shop window.
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Ok. Another way of viewing this is that we have a quality player, who we have to manage his workload. If he is happy at Old Trafford, why sell him? We need at least four-centre halves (I worry about Yoro for example..).

The second question is, who do you replace him with? because Martinez, if fit, starts for Manchester United. Any replacement has to go straight in. You're looking for a finished article, so I would be interested in any thoughts. It is not easy to find players and get them settled.
 
Either he or De Ligt should be moved on. Ideally move both on, bring in an experienced CL defender and have Maguire, New CB, Yoro and Heaven challenge for 2 spots, with Shaw + youth able to cover in an emergency. Any incoming signing needs to be mobile and a ball playing CB who can bypass midfield when needed.
 
Raoul said:
It depends if they’re injured or playing now. I expect both De Ligt and Martinez to be healthy and starting next season (after De Ligt completes his recovery in a month or two), as they are our best and most influential defenders.
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So after 4 years of consistently being injured - you now expect Martinez to be able to play 50+ games a season for the next 2-3 years?

MDL will get another season, as clearly no one would buy him now. He may, or may not be fit, but he’s coming off of back injuries that have kept him out most of the season - you can’t have any confidence he will be fit at the start of the season, and then have no issues.

I like you optimism, but it’s seriously misplaced.
 
The problem is his injuries. Otherwise he's a build your defence around him type player.

If we get a really good fee (in his prime, having a good WC) then sell. But if the Italians are just being cheap and putting in 20m offers then no thanks, much rather have him.
 
Jeffthered said:
Ok. Another way of viewing this is that we have a quality player, who we have to manage his workload. If he is happy at Old Trafford, why sell him? We need at least four-centre halves (I worry about Yoro for example..).

The second question is, who do you replace him with? because Martinez, if fit, starts for Manchester United. Any replacement has to go straight in. Your're looking for a finished article, so I would be interested in any thoughts. It is not easy to find players and get them settled.
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Those who want to sell are just assuaging the dopamine hit of a transfer fantasy and haven’t thought that far ahead.
 
Jeffthered said:
Ok. Another way of viewing this is that we have a quality player, who we have to manage his workload. If he is happy at Old Trafford, why sell him? We need at least four-centre halves (I worry about Yoro for example..).

The second question is, who do you replace him with? because Martinez, if fit, starts for Manchester United. Any replacement has to go straight in. You're looking for a finished article, so I would be interested in any thoughts. It is not easy to find players and get them settled.
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Given he misses most games, we already have mostly replaced him.

No, it’s not easy to find replacements, but a player who we can’t get on the pitch is no good to us.
 
Raoul said:
Those who want to sell are just assuaging the dopamine hit of a transfer fantasy and haven’t thought that far ahead.
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Why can’t people disagree with you, without you making things up?

It’s a perfectly valid argument to suggest we get rid of a player with his record. There’s no need to take it in some strange direction by criticising people for an opinion that’s different from yours. What’s the point in discussion?
 
Players in the final year are going for standard prices nowadays. I think we need all hands on deck next season even if we only get 50% games from him. can activate the extension next summer and sell.
 
Raoul said:
The obvious solution would be to get them back to fitness, not throw them under the bus because of past issues that have nothing to do with their present predicaments.
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It’s not throwing them under the bus it is facing reality, Martinez has played 76 league games in 4 seasons, he’s never been fit enough. De Ligt has only played 42 league games in two seasons and has suffered a serious injury that may impact him for rest of his career.

These are not the players you build around but we ar paying similar wages for these two as Arsenal pay for Saliba and Gabriel who are better players and play a lot more games.
 
I don’t mind keeping him but not as first choice. When he’s playing at his absolute best he’s worth having as a starter but he’s injured too often or spending time trying to get back into form after injuries. Both him and De Ligt should be phased out but not this summer.
 
Raoul said:
De Ligt played in 32% of our games last year, is a year younger than Martinez, and is on 75k a week more than Martinez. By your logic, we should be looking to sell him as well yes ?
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If a good offer came in, obviously. But it won’t. Just have to hope he gets fit.
 
ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg said:
So after 4 years of consistently being injured - you now expect Martinez to be able to play 50+ games a season for the next 2-3 years?

MDL will get another season, as clearly no one would buy him now. He may, or may not be fit, but he’s coming off of back injuries that have kept him out most of the season - you can’t have any confidence he will be fit at the start of the season, and then have no issues.

I like you optimism, but it’s seriously misplaced.
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On Martinez, if it’s the same injury then that could be a factor. If on the other hand he was simply unlucky (there’s no such thing as ‘injury prone’ - players simply get injured from time to time and some are simply unluckier than others) then it would be highly counterproductive to sell an experienced World Cup winner who is starting games for Argentina at the moment. If this was Van de Beek then it would make sense- but when you have highly accomplished players get injured, you don’t throw them overboard- instead you support them to return to full fitness in the starting XI.
 
Injury prone - therefore sell. I love him, but it is frustrating that every time he gets back into top form, it doesn't take long before he gets injured again.
 
Renew, he is class. Martinez injuries have been separate incidents and very unlucky. There are not many in the world that offer what he does and he should absolutely be in our squad of CBs. He is also the right character and we don't get good prices for players, so would spend more on someone worse.
 
I'd renew, surely he can't expect to be on mega money given all the games he doesn't play
 
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