Liverpool 2021/2022

B20

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Whats your beef with Jota?
I think he's as great a 4th choice as one could ask for. Really happy we have him.

Just not so happy with how the others have fallen behind him. He'd be 4th choice if Firmino and Mane were their old selves. That's the level we should be aiming at.
 

Klopper76

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I think he's as great a 4th choice as one could ask for. Really happy we have him.

Just not so happy with how the others have fallen behind him. He'd be 4th choice if Firmino and Mane were their old selves. That's the level we should be aiming at.
He’s got something like 15 goals in 34 appearances. I think he’s been great and is up to the required standards.
 

DatIrishFella

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The difference in discourse between this thread and the United thread on RAWK is astounding. Nice to see mostly level headed takes we see on this forum as opposed to the ignorance over there in regard to United
 

Eugenius

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But, like City, Liverpool are finding ways to score goals all around the team. City players have never been anywhere near golden boot awards yet consistently win the league.
That's more because of rotation though? Players like Foden, Mahrez, Bernando etc would probably be breaking 15 goals plus in the league consistently if they played every minute like Mane and Salah. And City also get goals from their 8s - compare Henderson and Thiago to Gundogan & KDB's outputs.
 

Reddevildans

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The one thing they do lack is pace in the middle of the defence and midfield. But thats usually made up with spacial awareness and experience with the likes of van dyk, henderson, thiago and fabinho. They'll be challenging barring major injuries to main personnel because their depth is not as good as Chelsea, us and citys.
 

Redfrog

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The one thing they do lack is pace in the middle of the defence and midfield. But thats usually made up with spacial awareness and experience with the likes of van dyk, henderson, thiago and fabinho. They'll be challenging barring major injuries to main personnel because their depth is not as good as Chelsea, us and citys.
With the lack of depth you can never tell. When the games will come fast and tick they could as well run out of steam.
We will see but it is an aging team with a serious lack of depth.
 

RooneyLegend

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He’s got something like 15 goals in 34 appearances. I think he’s been great and is up to the required standards.
His minutes per goal rate is crazy as well, seems like complaining for the sake of it to me. He looks quality at Pool especially when he plays Manes position.
 

Ayoba

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They'll be challenging, that's for sure. Salah hasn't stopped scoring ever since he joined the PL and doesn't look like he'll stop anytime soon. Defense is strong with vvd back to full fitness and fabinho is just class in midfield. And...they have a WC manager in Klopp.
 

GoonerBear

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The one thing they do lack is pace in the middle of the defence and midfield. But thats usually made up with spacial awareness and experience with the likes of van dyk, henderson, thiago and fabinho. They'll be challenging barring major injuries to main personnel because their depth is not as good as Chelsea, us and citys.
Midfield perhaps, but I don't think they miss pace at centre defence. Van Dijk, Gomez & Konate all really quick & I don't think Matip is a slouch either.
 

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Midfield perhaps, but I don't think they miss pace at centre defence. Van Dijk, Gomez & Konate all really quick & I don't think Matip is a slouch either.
Yeah they’re all pretty quick, but more importantly have great reading and spatial awareness. Matip and VVD in particular.

I think we’re an attacker short, maybe a midfielder too. I definitely think we have more question marks going in to this season than at any point in the last three years. However not having four starters out in one position should help. It’s really going to depend on injuries being kept at bay and Mané or Firmino getting close to the 20 goal mark. I think we’re going to end up short, which is a shame as we have one of the best teams and managers we’ve ever had.
It’s a shame we never invested.
 

Liver_bird

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The difference in discourse between this thread and the United thread on RAWK is astounding. Nice to see mostly level headed takes we see on this forum as opposed to the ignorance over there in regard to United
This forum is the best one out there, but tbf I think that’s meant to be their version of a pisstake thread similar to the RAWK one. They’re also just not capable of having a rational discussion on other teams though.
 

Klopper76

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Yeah they’re all pretty quick, but more importantly have great reading and spatial awareness. Matip and VVD in particular.

I think we’re an attacker short, maybe a midfielder too. I definitely think we have more question marks going in to this season than at any point in the last three years. However not having four starters out in one position should help. It’s really going to depend on injuries being kept at bay and Mané or Firmino getting close to the 20 goal mark. I think we’re going to end up short, which is a shame as we have one of the best teams and managers we’ve ever had.
It’s a shame we never invested.
This is how I’m feeling. We need a midfielder to replace Wijnaldum and a forward but we’ll be up there as long as last season doesn’t repeat itself in terms of injuries. Fabinho is crucial. Thiago plays better next to him.

The big crossroad for the club will be who replaces Klopp.
 

amolbhatia50k

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They have an excellent team that is really well drilled. People expected last season's drop off to continue but I can definitely see a proper title challenge. Their only issue may be a lack of depth in certain areas of the squad. I do think we for example have greater squad depth (barring central midfield) than them but then again they are coached so well that it makes up for that. Also all the top teams have some weaknesses - City don't even have a CF, United's midfield and quality of possession play is not so good, Chelsea 1st full season under Tuchel and no truly top class CB (doesnt seem to matter).
 

mewnew11

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Mane has lost his speed and ruthlessness . Liverpool are very dependent on salah and arnold.

Any injury to either and I can see the tracks falling off.

The chelsea game was telling as they couldn't create much with chelsea a man down.
 

Dumbstar

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Mane has lost his speed and ruthlessness . Liverpool are very dependent on salah and arnold.

Any injury to either and I can see the tracks falling off.

The chelsea game was telling as they couldn't create much with chelsea a man down.
The 10 man Chelsea second half seems to be the all-and-nothing stick to beat Liverpool with. It's literally the only straw for non-LFC fans to fit in with their misguided narrative.

I'm glad that's all they've got. :)
 

B20

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His minutes per goal rate is crazy as well, seems like complaining for the sake of it to me. He looks quality at Pool especially when he plays Manes position.
To be clear, I am not complaining about Jota. I am complaining about the drop from Mane and Firmino.

It's no slight on Jota to say he is not as good as peak Mane and Firmino.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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I would worry about them more than City or Chelsea if two things happen: Mane regains his form and Van Dijk has fully recovered + re-discovers his form prior to project restart.

Mane has been gash for a while now though(even with his goal vs Leeds).

Their starting 11 is better than City's and Chelsea's for me(though I think ours is better than City's and Chelsea's too).
 

largelyworried

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I think Liverpool have the most complete first team of the challengers at the top. However they lack depth compared to the other three, particularly in attacking areas. In previous seasons they got away with that due to unreal appearance numbers by their main players (and the odd fact that they always get knocked out of the FA and EFL early). I think that’ll be the factor that decides how well Liverpool do this season.
 

Football heart

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The 10 man Chelsea second half seems to be the all-and-nothing stick to beat Liverpool with. It's literally the only straw for non-LFC fans to fit in with their misguided narrative.

I'm glad that's all they've got. :)
Not only is it weak points but quite lazy aswell. Chelsea are probably the best defensively drilled team and with 10 men it was always going to be harder. In terms of team cohesion atm only City and Chelsea come close to Liverpool in my opinion as Utd still play like a team of individuals I'm afraid.
 

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We have a world class first eleven.
But we have average options on the bench, baring Tsimikas for LB and the CB options. Everywhere else it's bang average.

Mane and Firmino are a on a visible decline. Jota is an able replacement. And Firmino can go on, because his game is not dependent goals.
Mane needs replacing. The sooner we do that, the better.

But if Salah gets injured, then we are genuinely struggling.
 

Dumbstar

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We have a world class first eleven.
But we have average options on the bench, baring Tsimikas for LB and the CB options. Everywhere else it's bang average.

Mane and Firmino are a on a visible decline. Jota is an able replacement. And Firmino can go on, because his game is not dependent goals.
Mane needs replacing. The sooner we do that, the better.

But if Salah gets injured, then we are genuinely struggling.
True our squad is weaker, and I've done a much detailed run down elsewhere.

However, to keep it short if we lose Salah then our league challenge is over. But we will finish at least fourth.

Similarly, if Chelsea lose Lukaku their league challenge is over. But they will finish top four.

If Utd lose any one of Maguire/Varane/Shaw their league challenge is over. But they will finish top four.

Basically, none of the above squads hold a candle to City who will canter to another league title should the player per team I mentioned above all get injured.
 

RobinLFC

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I would worry about them more than City or Chelsea if two things happen: Mane regains his form and Van Dijk has fully recovered + re-discovers his form prior to project restart.

Mane has been gash for a while now though(even with his goal vs Leeds).

Their starting 11 is better than City's and Chelsea's for me(though I think ours is better than City's and Chelsea's too).
I didn't watch a part against Burnley and yesterday's second half, so could be wrong here, but I thought it was pretty clear that he's already there or thereabouts. Absolutely nullified Lukaku which no other team / defender has been able to do yet (yes circumstances were in our favour but still) and only 1 goal conceded in four games which was a header on a set piece from a man he wasn't marking.

Our stats with Matip - Van Dijk as our centre back pairing are amazing, so if they both stay healthy I figure we'll be hard to score against. And for example, yes Mane has been pretty average, but he did once again have / create 10 shots on target yesterday (or something like that). That patch of form won't continue forever imo.
 

Thunderhead

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True our squad is weaker, and I've done a much detailed run down elsewhere.

However, to keep it short if we lose Salah then our league challenge is over. But we will finish at least fourth.

Similarly, if Chelsea lose Lukaku their league challenge is over. But they will finish top four.

If Utd lose any one of Maguire/Varane/Shaw their league challenge is over. But they will finish top four.

Basically, none of the above squads hold a candle to City who will canter to another league title should the player per team I mentioned above all get injured.
I really think we'll struggle to win the league without having an out and out finisher, there will be occasions this season where we will create chance after chance and not score whereas having a Kane/Lukaku/Haaland would have had a field day. We played great against Leicester, created loads but missed chances teams wanting to win the League should really be scoring then won with a fortunate deflection that fell to Silva.
 

mewnew11

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The 10 man Chelsea second half seems to be the all-and-nothing stick to beat Liverpool with. It's literally the only straw for non-LFC fans to fit in with their misguided narrative.

I'm glad that's all they've got. :)
Misguided ? So many losses last season and games where you couldn't score.

Am I missing something?
 

Hastar

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True our squad is weaker, and I've done a much detailed run down elsewhere.

However, to keep it short if we lose Salah then our league challenge is over. But we will finish at least fourth.

Similarly, if Chelsea lose Lukaku their league challenge is over. But they will finish top four.

If Utd lose any one of Maguire/Varane/Shaw their league challenge is over. But they will finish top four.

Basically, none of the above squads hold a candle to City who will canter to another league title should the player per team I mentioned above all get injured.

Dont really like this line of argument.

It's like a child justifying his bad grades by stating there are others like him. Also, no one can match the topper of class.

All FSG needed to do was refresh the squad and be a tad proactive. Klopp is not gonna be here forever. Players like Van Dijk, our FBs and Salah are not gonna be here forever. We need to maximise their potential.

There was a lack of ambition on the club's part this season. Could have moved on one of Mane or Firmino, and added a forward and midfielder.
 

Pickle85

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Mad to see everyone talking about getting rid of Mane this season. His decline seems to have happened super fast, or did I miss him being shite last season too?
 

Dumbstar

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Dont really like this line of argument.

It's like a child justifying his bad grades by stating there are others like him. Also, no one can match the topper of class.

All FSG needed to do was refresh the squad and be a tad proactive. Klopp is not gonna be here forever. Players like Van Dijk, our FBs and Salah are not gonna be here forever. We need to maximise their potential.

There was a lack of ambition on the club's part this season. Could have moved on one of Mane or Firmino, and added a forward and midfielder.
You clearly have an agenda and your mind made up. I don't wish to be your sounding board.
 

Klopper76

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Mad to see everyone talking about getting rid of Mane this season. His decline seems to have happened super fast, or did I miss him being shite last season too?
His form dipped massively last season. It wasn’t just his goals but his physicality as well. You could see watching him that he’d lost something. He used to be so good in 50/50’s but became very easy to beat in those situations, and he lost some aggression from his game.

I thought he played well yesterday outside of his finishing.
 

laughtersassassin

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People are sleeping on Liverpool. There 11 is still near perfect. There depth isn't as good as others but still fairly good and they have Klopp.

They'll be right up there assuming Salah or Van Dijk don't get long term injuries.
 

Valencia Shin Crosses

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People are sleeping on Liverpool. There 11 is still near perfect. There depth isn't as good as others but still fairly good and they have Klopp.

They'll be right up there assuming Salah or Van Dijk don't get long term injuries.
I think everyone agrees Liverpool have a strong XI, although “near perfect” is hilariously overrating just about any side of the past 20 years barring Madrid and Barca a couple times, much less this Liverpool side.

I still think they lack a reliable threat opposite of Salah and can be a bit exposed in their midfield options. Fabinho is their most important player besides Salah in my opinion, probably the best DM in the world right now. Jota is a nice option but I think the goal tally is a little inflated and he’s probably better off being a supersub, but Mane and Firmino have to pick up their performances or Jota will be starting. Everything would have to go right for them to win the league but I also don’t see them finishing lower than 3rd. We’ll see
 

Nevilles.Wear.Prada

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People are sleeping on Liverpool. There 11 is still near perfect. There depth isn't as good as others but still fairly good and they have Klopp.

They'll be right up there assuming Salah or Van Dijk don't get long term injuries.
No their squad is not near perfect. Agree with everything else. Such a well drilled team. Thats why they collapse when you take one piece out. They will challenge easily. Definately will get at least one of the cups.
 

laughtersassassin

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No their squad is not near perfect. Agree with everything else. Such a well drilled team. Thats why they collapse when you take one piece out. They will challenge easily. Definately will get at least one of the cups.
I didn't say their squad is near perfect

Their 11 is close to it.
 

justsomebloke

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I think I would be reasonably optimistic if I were a Liverpool fan. They've looked mostly back to their old selves in the first games, although the inability to break down a 10-man Chelsea for a full half would perhaps leave a little tinge of worry if they still have that final cutting edge to put them past the top opposition.

First XI compares to anyone, in my view. Maybe the offensive midfield and striker positions could be better, but nobody else are top notch everywhere either. But depth should be a concern - if you compare second XIs, Liverpools is the weakest among the 4 in my opinion, and by a considerable margin too.
 

Hastar

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You clearly have an agenda and your mind made up. I don't wish to be your sounding board.
Calling it an agenda is a bit too much. Let's keep it's friendly, and agree to disagree.
 

laughtersassassin

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You said its close to near perfect? Okay brother ;)
Nope. I said their 11 is near perfect. It doesn't have an obvious flaw like we do in DM or City do at Striker

You said their squad.

That's an entirely different thing.

Liverpool have in my opinion a better or atleast more well rounded 11 than we do. But we have a better squad. City Have a better squad and so do Chelsea. But it's can be argued Liverpool have the best 11 though it is close.

See how those two things are different?
 

Dumbstar

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I think I would be reasonably optimistic if I were a Liverpool fan. They've looked mostly back to their old selves in the first games, although the inability to break down a 10-man Chelsea for a full half would perhaps leave a little tinge of worry if they still have that final cutting edge to put them past the top opposition.

First XI compares to anyone, in my view. Maybe the offensive midfield and striker positions could be better, but nobody else are top notch everywhere either. But depth should be a concern - if you compare second XIs, Liverpools is the weakest among the 4 in my opinion, and by a considerable margin too.
The bit in bold, ahead of you pal. More than just reasonably. :)

Against Milan we could (we won't but we could) see :
Alisson
TAA Gomez Konate Tsimikas
Milner Hendo Keita
Salah Ox Jota

And I would feel incredibly confident. That's SEVEN changes from Sunday and it's still a million times better than any team we could turn out last season post VvD injury.
 

ariveded

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Chelsea were on top and better till that red card. Their defense is past its peak, and that includes Van Dijk. Similarly, Gini in midfield is a big loss, as he did his defensive duty very well. Keita/Ox aren't a match....