Man Utd set to appoint Director of Football (when hell freezes over)

sunama

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If VDS is brought in it has to be as some form of joint CEO position
If VDS is signed up, I will look out of my window to finally see pgs fly.

It really does shock me that posters on here have not learned their lesson.
This is the equivalent of a wife who repeatedly cheats on her husband, but the husband keeps forgiving her and believes her when she says she won't cheat again.

The thread title explains perfectly, my position on the DoF role. And let's not forget that bringing in a DoF, does not necessarily mean that we will achieve success. We could hire somebody and 10 years late, still be finishing 6th in the league.
Now, if Woodward were to relieved of his footballing duties, I think we could see real progress.
 

Mainoldo

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Here are the details of Man United’s offer
Ian McGarry claims that Man United believe there have been “positive” developments in their chase to secure Van der Sar.


At Ajax, it’s reported that Van der Sar earns around 250,000 euros a season at Ajax.

Man United are reportedly willing to offer him “nearer to 1.5 million euros.”

Duncan Castles labelled Man United’s offer as “sizeable and substantial”.

The length of the contract offer to Van der Sar wasn’t clarified.

So will Edwin van der Sar return to Old Trafford?
Ian McGarry stated that Van der Sar has some “reservations” about taking the position.

They include a “scepticism about the current setup – there are supposedly five heads of recruitment operating, and also (he) has doubts about his exact remit and authority.”

Those hold-ups on Van der Sar’s end all point towards Ed Woodward.

Duncan Castles commented that Woodward has remained reluctant to offer any director of football candidate clear assurance that he’s willing to give up power on signing players.

Yet, with all that said, Duncan Castles believes Van der Sar is ready to take the Man United job.
https://www.101greatgoals.com/news/ajaxs-edwin-van-der-sar-has-spoken-to-ed-woodward-here-are-the-details-of-man-uniteds-offer/

Executive vice-chairman Ed Woodward has been at the helm since 2013. His stock is battered among fans because so many bought in on his watch have failed. Despite that, the Glazers rate him and he’s going nowhere right now. Woodward is the man who signs every transfer off, who can negotiate some of the big deals, but he’s not the one identifying players any more than his predecessor David Gill – a finance, not a football man – was.

This is because United now have one of the largest scouting networks in the world, including key figures such as chief scout Jim Lawlor and technical chief scout Mick Court, who’ve been there since Ferguson’s time. Court was a recruitment analyst for a decade before his current role. Steve Brown, formerly of Everton, oversees the scouting network.

They work with analysts to make technical assessments based on data. United have reports from matches globally as they watch up to 15,000 players, most of them emerging talents. That number is whittled to 50 names in the autumn, and then narrowed to 15. The managerial team can take out more names, while the identified players are subject to more scouting and background checks. It’s a good idea to find out if Dan James is a decent lad from multiple sources, as opposed to the one or two self-interested types who said Angel Di Maria was.

When targets have been agreed, Matt Judge will get involved. His job title is head of corporate development, and his role is to negotiate with agents and to lay the foundations for those negotiations. He plays no part in the football evaluation, which is right since he has no football background.

An agent may name a player to Judge, who may even meet him before feeding names back to the recruitment department, but United’s signings are now being driven by themselves. Could the same have been said when Radamel Falcao or Bastian Schweinsteiger arrived? Or was that the agent approaching United knowing that they were one of the few clubs in the world able to pay their vast wages?

Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and Mike Phelan will be involved at almost every stage. The playing philosophy must come from them, but while a new technical director will have a voice, it must be a significant one. Otherwise, what’s the point in appointing somebody? They must have power.

There are a lot of people with exceptionally good CVs working on the recruitment side of things at United. Marcel Bout, the head of global scouting, was brought in by Louis van Gaal.

United are adamant that they don’t sign players based on their commercial value, but these suspicions stick because of their commercial success. They’re often wrong.


Read more at https://www.fourfourtwo.com/features/manchester-united-man-utd-sporting-director-ed-woodward-van-der-sar#KCWYlfpwf65kogmz.99
When it states give up his power on signing players. That has to just be the final say on transfer fees for said player X. Which is quite normal. He’d be the middle man between the Glazers and releasing the cash.
 

TrueRed79

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Like VDS will leave a position of power to work under someone like Woodward. Definitely not happening.
 

Ikon

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Like VDS will leave a position of power to work under someone like Woodward. Definitely not happening.
DoF role is actually a demotion on the CEO that he currently has, added to that, United are apparently not looking to offer a full DoF role, merely a go-between and advisor.
Which explains why we've only been linked with ex-players with no experience of a DoF role....:rolleyes:
 

Bloedrood

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I remember Van der Sar being asked about becoming DoF at United some months ago on Dutch tv, and saying he's not interested. That Overmars just extended for 5 years, and that together they're committed to the club long term, want to win many prizes with the club and make the club future proof. The amount of work they've done these last years at Ajax is pretty incredible, especially from a financial standpoint. And they have so much money coming in now, it's time for them to reap what they have sown. He invested years in learning the CEO role at Ajax just so he could take over, would be surprised if he left that already.

From Manchester United's side it also does not make a lot of sense to me to get Van der Sar for the DoF role, when it's primarily Overmars who has handled transfers and is responsible for the technical side of things at Ajax.
 
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Alabaster Codify7

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I still don't believe a word of this.

We've just picked up 2pts out of 9, in supposedly winnable games. One of our new signings appears to be injured already and Ashley Young is back in the starting 11.

The club is leaking 'positive news' again, it seems.
 

Waynne

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Sooner or later this card will also be overplayed and the fans will see this BS for what it really is.
I for one hope the club tries to keep playing this card only for the fans to start to take notice of the nonsense.
 

Adnan

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As long as the Glazer's are there, I don't think it matters who we get as technical director. The only thing it will do, is shift all or some of the power the manager currently has over to the technical director and redefine their role more towards first team coach.

There's no way in hell that the Glazer's and whoever else is involved with them in approving and managing signings is going to give up that power and bestow it all upon Van Der Sar and his team.
Fixed that for you mate..:D
 

Cnaiür urs Skiötha

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I do not really get the idea. What we would need is a manager with enough power and skills to more or less build his own team from scratch.
What exactly would a DoF add?
With Klopp and Guardiola out of reach I think Tuchel might be a good candidate for such a job.
 

Bloedrood

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I do not really get the idea. What we would need is a manager with enough power and skills to more or less build his own team from scratch.
What exactly would a DoF add?
With Klopp and Guardiola out of reach I think Tuchel might be a good candidate for such a job.
It's funny, because City have Guardiola because of their DoF. Both Klopp and Guardiola prefer working with a DoF or sporting director, like they have been at their current and previous clubs.

Football clubs have become massive nowadays, especially a club the size of Man United. Making it increasingly difficult for a manager to focus on running the first team, and also guarding club cohesion and developing football policy throughout the rest of the club. All the staff, contracts, scouting, transfers, agents. Managers don't want to deal with that on a consistent basis, it takes away the focus from the first team performance. And who would you rather that hired the manager, head of academy, or head scout? A DoF who understands football and the club, or someone like Ed Woodward who has a bussiness background? One thing that's very clear from the past 4 United managers, the club has no consistent direction or vision. You expect a manager to give that to a club? Managers in modern football are passengers, rarely stick around longer than a few years.
 
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davidmichael

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Why not just fix the structure of the footballing side of things by bringing in BOTH of Van Der Sar and Overmars and give them the EXACT job for us that they do at Ajax ?

I’m all for Van Der Sar coming in but his current role is NOT as a Director Of Football or Technical Director or Sporting Director which is the role Overmars has, I know Overmars is ex Arsenal but he’s not an Arsenal through and through type who’d turn us down because he’s ex Arsenal.

As a duo Van Der Sar and Overmars have transformed Ajax and overseen a huge group of highly talented young players come through or recruited like De Jong, De Ligt, Ziyech, Gravenberch, Van De Beek, Neres and Onana whilst Sanchez and Kluivert also came through as well.

Bringing both in would effectively (or hopefully) mean Woodward having zero need to be involved in anything at all on the on pitch side of things other than giving the green light on deals that Van Der Sar and Overmars have decided on. Solskjær or whoever is in charge (Pocchettino ?) can concentrate on things on the pitch and in training, Van Der Sar and Overmars focus on recruitment and scouting targets to fit a certain tactic and profile and Woodward seals commercial deals with whoever he wants that brings in money.
 

Mark Pawelek

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Why Manchester United have not appointed Edwin van der Sar as technical director

Edwin van der Sar has flirted with the prospect of returning to Man Utd as a technical director but there are steep obstacles.
By Samuel Luckhurst

The trouble is the technical director remit at United has hitherto been off-putting for credible candidates. One tasked an intermediary to speak with the club and gauge their plans for the post only to discover they would chair a committee, likely made up of former players, who would recommend transfer targets and take decisions on current players’ futures.

The shortlist would then be submitted to Woodward and head of corporate development Matt Judge, who would have the final say. A source connected with said candidate said: "It may explain why anyone with any credibility has walked away from the role." Another applicant was interviewed by the club, only for United to insist he was never in the running.

Woodward would not relish handling another authoritative figure who might challenge him after his experiences with Louis van Gaal and Jose Mourinho. Van der Sar has been described as - and it is a compliment - difficult and, like most Dutch footballers past and present, arrogant.​
 

NJM78

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Why Manchester United have not appointed Edwin van der Sar as technical director

Edwin van der Sar has flirted with the prospect of returning to Man Utd as a technical director but there are steep obstacles.
By Samuel Luckhurst

The trouble is the technical director remit at United has hitherto been off-putting for credible candidates. One tasked an intermediary to speak with the club and gauge their plans for the post only to discover they would chair a committee, likely made up of former players, who would recommend transfer targets and take decisions on current players’ futures.

The shortlist would then be submitted to Woodward and head of corporate development Matt Judge, who would have the final say. A source connected with said candidate said: "It may explain why anyone with any credibility has walked away from the role." Another applicant was interviewed by the club, only for United to insist he was never in the running.

Woodward would not relish handling another authoritative figure who might challenge him after his experiences with Louis van Gaal and Jose Mourinho. Van der Sar has been described as - and it is a compliment - difficult and, like most Dutch footballers past and present, arrogant.​
This club eh?
 

AFC NimbleThumb

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If that story is true [I take everything written by ‘journalists’ with a pinch of salt] then I’m struggling to get any kind of perspective on Woodward.

At this point surely he’d just have hired a patsy to take the blame instead of himself.

Somethings afoot for the club, it just feels like the Glazers are bleeding the last drops before an exit.
 

roonster09

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Would be so good if VDS returns and heads the football operations. Dream would be him heading the football operations and VDS appointing suitable DoF and other roles like people who leads the academy.

It will like head of various verticals reporting to VDS. Won't happen though.
 

Mark Pawelek

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In his defence:

Woodward would not relish handling another authoritative figure who might challenge him after his experiences with Louis van Gaal and Jose Mourinho.
I can understand Woodward's wary attitude: LVG signings were basically too ordinary to win a PL title. Mourinho's signings almost wrecked United. But if you appoint a DoF, it has to be someone you trust to make good signings on the basis of their previous experience. VDS has a great record which should allow him the kind of control over transfers he has at Ajax. United must change their DoF job description.
 

JPRouve

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I'll say it again, the person that will lose power is the current manager not the CEO. That narrative is stupid, has always been stupid and always will be stupid.
 

Cassidy

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CEO always has final say at any club...
 

oz insomniac

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If VDS is really apprehensive about the authority he would have , that tells us all what a ego maniac and control freak Woody is. When someone of the status of VDS understands how the DOF would have to cede decsisons to the money man, it starts to show why the club continues to fall apart.

Well , at least Johan and Keefy think Ed is doing a good job and we are all in denial and can't see it.
 

pocco

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I'll say it again, the person that will lose power is the current manager not the CEO. That narrative is stupid, has always been stupid and always will be stupid.
By all accounts Woodward enjoys being involved in transfers, people that have met him have said he sees himself as the DoF. Hence why he's keeping the final say on transfers and the watered down version of the role that we are offering.

I don't think anybody in the club would oppose the version of a DoF that we're looking for, but the problem seems to be attracting people to a role with less influence and probably more liability in the press.
 

pocco

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If VDS is really apprehensive about the authority he would have , that tells us all what a ego maniac and control freak Woody is. When someone of the status of VDS understands how the DOF would have to cede decsisons to the money man, it starts to show why the club continues to fall apart.

Well , at least Johan and Keefy think Ed is doing a good job and we are all in denial and can't see it.
Nothing we've not known for a long time now. We've turned down all the top DoFs because we don't want somebody to have the level of influence they're seeking. We've apparently interviewed ex players for the role but, word on the grapevine has been that they walked away due to the job description.

I remember Stephen Howson talking about it in one of his videos. He'd spoke to somebody that had recently been interviewed and was an ex player. Reading between the lines, it more or less sounded like this person slated the whole thing to Howson. Iirc, they said they left being more unclear about what the role actually entails.

Woodward is looking for his fall guy. Nothing more and nothing less. If he can put a whole committee of people in the firing line then even better, but he is still the man making the final calls.
 

pocco

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In his defence:

Woodward would not relish handling another authoritative figure who might challenge him after his experiences with Louis van Gaal and Jose Mourinho.
I can understand Woodward's wary attitude: LVG signings were basically too ordinary to win a PL title. Mourinho's signings almost wrecked United. But if you appoint a DoF, it has to be someone you trust to make good signings on the basis of their previous experience. VDS has a great record which should allow him the kind of control over transfers he has at Ajax. United must change their DoF job description.
There's a big grey area in all that. There have been a lot of rumors and allusions to this by LVG and JM, that some of the signings were made by Woodward. He apparently knows people that work identifying players and he will often turn to them for ideas, or so the story goes.

And, if I'm honest, I can believe it. There were players brought in under Jose that he inexplicably didn't seem to rate from the first day. It left us scratching our heads, but the above puts that into a whole new context and explains a hell of a lot that has been going on with our managers.
 

JPRouve

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By all accounts Woodward enjoys being involved in transfers, people that have met him have said he sees himself as the DoF. Hence why he's keeping the final say on transfers and the watered down version of the role that we are offering.

I don't think anybody in the club would oppose the version of a DoF that we're looking for, but the problem seems to be attracting people to a role with less influence and probably more liability in the press.
No, Woodward would be involved in transfers no matter what the DOF job remits are and he will always have the final say, you can make that statement for every CEOs in the world. I agree with your last point though, the issue is to attract the correct people and also identify them. Personally I don't trust Woodward and everyone else including SAF to identify a good DOF, their decisions and the ones that have allegedly been supported by SAF and SBC have been shortsighted and lacked inspiration.

Funnily enough the template in football is always the same and always been like that. It's basically SAF at Aberdeen, you look at someone young in a smaller club who is objectively overachieving, the same is true for DOFs, scouts and coaches.