Manchester United officials looking at plans to expand Old Trafford capacity to 88,000 | Scrapped?

[Red00012]

Also this, Manchester City plan to increase the capacity of their smart stadium to 60,000 when demand warrants it

Safe to say it won’t be in the immediate future

 

[Infra-red]

The Galzers have frozen ticket prices for the best part of a decade. Matchday revenue is not something they give a shit about atm.

Even if they did, the costs of expanding/upgrading the stadium are so great that they'd be unlikely to see a return on the investment. It just doesn't make economic sense.

I don't think a bigger Old Trafford is on the horizon for us anytime soon.

 

[Sandikan]

How many times is this thread going to get bumped and we go through the below again and again?

1. The railway bridge issue
2. We don't actually need more capacity apart from a few games a year
3. Glazers wouldn't dream of investing so much
4. Refurb needed not a rebuild.

 

[theyneverlearn]

How many times is this thread going to get bumped and we go through the below again and again?

1. The railway bridge issue
2. We don't actually need more capacity apart from a few games a year
3. Glazers wouldn't dream of investing so much
4. Refurb needed not a rebuild.

5. Cheese room

 

[red thru&thru]

Glazers will not refurb OT. Only new owners will do that. There's a separate thread open about that though.

 

[Eire Red United]

How many times is this thread going to get bumped and we go through the below again and again?

1. The railway bridge issue
2. We don't actually need more capacity apart from a few games a year
3. Glazers wouldn't dream of investing so much
4. Refurb needed not a rebuild.

Re point 2, I’m completely ignorant on the subject but is there not a huge waiting list for season ticket holders every year?

 

[Moriarty]

How many times is this thread going to get bumped and we go through the below again and again?

Every time a club opens a smart new stadium. Wasn't there something similar when Arsenal moved into the Emirates?

 

[stevoc]

OT isn't too bad right now it could certainly be improved but it's not the worst in terms of facilities. But the problem for teh club long term is that the longer the stadium goes without expansion/upgrades/refurbishment the more likely it gets that one day it will just be too old and out of date and refurbing it would probably cost more than a new build.

Would be a sad day if United ever had to leave Old Trafford.

 

[clarkydaz]

Re point 2, I’m completely ignorant on the subject but is there not a huge waiting list for season ticket holders every year?

that tends to be the PR pitch. In recent years, you could ring up and pretty much get one

 

[Gator Nate]

Glazers will not refurb OT. Only new owners will do that. There's a separate thread open about that though.

The Glazers (well, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers) put in about $70 mil of $100 mil to refurb Raymond James Stadium, the rest paid by the Tampa Sports Authority, just a few years ago. They've owned the team for 25 years.

I'll go find that other thread, maybe....

 

[SiRed]

Re point 2, I’m completely ignorant on the subject but is there not a huge waiting list for season ticket holders every year?

There was a point not so long ago....Maybe before the quadrants were extended that there wasnt even a waiting list. Literally the only way you could get one was through inheritance.

Nowadays anyone could buy one. Demand is not as high, in my opinion due to 1. The Glazers
2. Entertainment on the pitch
3. Poor atmosphere at most games
4. The auto purchase of cup games and champions league games.
And finally 5. We dont have a bar/lounge with HD TVs that fans can congregate before and after our games. Or a cheese room. Or a Gym. Or Cashless burgers shops.

 

[Trizy]

The Glazers won't spend their money to expand O.T because no club in England has near our capacity. Once someone builds and fills a stadium bigger than ours that's when they will expand.

It's more in their line to get us back to the fecking top of the table.

 

[Reapersoul20]

Re point 2, I’m completely ignorant on the subject but is there not a huge waiting list for season ticket holders every year?

You're not completely ignorant, yer man is just clueless.

 

[Big Andy]

How many times is this thread going to get bumped and we go through the below again and again?

1. The railway bridge issue
2. We don't actually need more capacity apart from a few games a year
3. Glazers wouldn't dream of investing so much
4. Refurb needed not a rebuild.

I actually think a WHL sort of thing where they build a new stadium behind the current stadium, and then flip the Stretford End around so that is the East Stand, would work.

Takes the railway issue away (although that's not a real issue at all other than bigger steel and more concrete), keeps OT as our home, but then allows them to expand the OT "Campus" where the current stadium is to include things like hotels, bars, restaurants, etc where they take a huge cut/all of the profits.

Barcelona and Madrid don't sell out all the time (very rarely infact) but both of those are redeveloping their stadiums to bring them into the 21st century. Something we need to be looking at before we get left behind.

The acoustics are affected due to the haphazard building plan, the roofline is all over the place, views are restricted in the top tier near the back and in the upper quadrants, and the south stand is barely fit for purpose these days. The concourses are shite, the queues are huge, the drinks are rubbish and you can't have a beer in the ground after the game either, so everyone descends on the few pubs around the ground, and they're all rammed.

I actually think an OT upgrade (basically a new stadium on the same site) would be pretty mint...

 

[lysglimt]

Safe to say it won’t be in the immediate future

Oh you never know - a couple of decent Concerts and they might need 75.000

 

[deafepl]

Our debt is going down, I can imagine Glazers and United board would not like us to be debt free, they'll borrow money of which can be invested into the rebuilding of Old Trafford stadium and keep low interests rate.

 

[redshaw]

The roof is probably the worst aspect and with time just gets worse with more modern stadia being built. Really requires a whole new roof as it's like looking through a letterbox higher up and even lower down you can't look at other stands that much.

Perhaps a modest reworking of the south stand and a new roof would be the best way as we'll drop to 73k soon if they still go ahead the with the disabled seats around on half of the ground. See what can be done for 80k otherwise rebuild and replan the lot/area.

It's a real shame the stadium has been designed and built so poorly in recent times. We could've had attractive corners and a better roof. You only have to look at St James's Park which was done yonks ago to see you can have a high roof with flowing corners in an older style stadium.

 

[RedNed77]

that tends to be the PR pitch. In recent years, you could ring up and pretty much get one

Err, not sure thats entirely true. I'm still struggling to get tickets for most games with my crappy membership. I've managed to attend most games this year, but with Ole being here I'm not optimistic about being offered one for next season. We could definitely do with another 10-15k seats.

 

[Red00012]

Err, not sure thats entirely true. I'm still struggling to get tickets for most games with my crappy membership. I've managed to attend most games this year, but with Ole being here I'm not optimistic about being offered one for next season. We could definitely do with another 10-15k seats.

I think he was talking about season tickets. They make out there’s a huge waiting list which there isn’t, I’m on the waiting list and I’ve had calls the last 3 seasons offering me a season ticket but location hasn’t suited.

 

[red thru&thru]

The Glazers (well, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers) put in about $70 mil of $100 mil to refurb Raymond James Stadium, the rest paid by the Tampa Sports Authority, just a few years ago. They've owned the team for 25 years.

I'll go find that other thread, maybe....

It's the thread about the Saudis buying United. The thread isn't far

 

[Eire Red United]

I think he was talking about season tickets. They make out there’s a huge waiting list which there isn’t, I’m on the waiting list and I’ve had calls the last 3 seasons offering me a season ticket but location hasn’t suited.

I did mention season tickets but it was in response to us not needing a larger capacity apart from the odd big game, surely we do need an expansion?

 

[Tiber]

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The South China post? Mitten writes for some weird papers/websites

 

[Red00012]

I did mention season tickets but it was in response to us not needing a larger capacity apart from the odd big game, surely we do need an expansion?

We would sell out 80000 I reckon but it’s probably at the bottom of the Glaziers list right now unfortunately.

 

[RedIan]

To be frank im more interested in the team and building that. The stadium is fine, we could easily sell another 7k seats most games and some games sell another 27k seats.
Investment in the team is the priority for me. we are way behind city and even liverpool not to mention europes top clubs

 

[Adisa]

The biggest money maker in renovating old stadiums is for those executive boxes. I want the stadium renovated but from a neutral financial pov, it doesn't make economic sense at the moment. Especially with the ongoing policy of freezing ticket prices.

 

[Infra-red]

Good piece by the excellent Daniel Taylor on the Glazers' neglect of Old Trafford:

https://amp.theguardian.com/footbal...-glazers-neglect-of-old-trafford-in-spotlight

 

[OnlyTwoDaSilvas]

Good piece by the excellent Daniel Taylor on the Glazers' neglect of Old Trafford:

https://amp.theguardian.com/footbal...-glazers-neglect-of-old-trafford-in-spotlight

That's a good read. The last line is a particularly good summary.

Old Trafford should be the visible symbol of a world‑famous institution. But it’s being allowed to decay.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

That's a good read. The last line is a particularly good summary.

Old Trafford should be the visible symbol of a world‑famous institution. But it’s being allowed to decay.

Can't disagree with anything he has said, most people on here have said the same. It would be awful if we never got a showcase European final because of the stadium's state.

 

[Red4Life_#7]

Good piece by the excellent Daniel Taylor on the Glazers' neglect of Old Trafford:

https://amp.theguardian.com/footbal...-glazers-neglect-of-old-trafford-in-spotlight

Good article. We have so much land around the ground, I've often thought could we build a whole new ground next to Old Trafford while we continue to play.
We need to be rivalling the Elite clubs in every way. 100,000+ futurist stadium should be something in the pipeline.

 

[Buster15]

Good article. We have so much land around the ground, I've often thought could we build a whole new ground next to Old Trafford while we continue to play.
We need to be rivalling the Elite clubs in every way. 100,000+ futurist stadium should be something in the pipeline.

Absolutely right. Manchester United should be aiming to be the best at everything.
The very strong feeling I get is of a business just going through the motions.
Happy to be where they are with zero ambition and zero intentions to make the kind of investment necessary to fulfil its supporters dreams.

These things take ages and I can see nothing different in another decade or more.
Just treading water.

 

[Buster15]

The biggest money maker in renovating old stadiums is for those executive boxes. I want the stadium renovated but from a neutral financial pov, it doesn't make economic sense at the moment. Especially with the ongoing policy of freezing ticket prices.

Not just the boxes, which I agree are lucrative but food and drink.
Just look at what Tottenham have focused on. That being the WHOLE experience. On site brewery and on site baker.

 

[Adisa]

Not just the boxes, which I agree are lucrative but food and drink.
Just look at what Tottenham have focused on. That being the WHOLE experience. On site brewery and on site baker.

I get it. But the people banging on about renovations should be prepared to pay significantly more in ST prices.

 

[Moriarty]

The South China post? Mitten writes for some weird papers/websites

A venerable old newspaper that's been around since the first decade of the 20th century.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Absolutely right. Manchester United should be aiming to be the best at everything.
The very strong feeling I get is of a business just going through the motions.
Happy to be where they are with zero ambition and zero intentions to make the kind of investment necessary to fulfil its supporters dreams.

These things take ages and I can see nothing different in another decade or more.
Just treading water.

No chance can I see the glazers spending 1b on a new stadium. If you really want that, it’ll be the Saudis.

 

[Ballache]

Nothing will happen as long as the Glazers are running the club. They are milking the club dry and will eventually sell it off to the highest bidder, let's just hope whoever comes in will run the club in a way that truly reflects United's standing in world football.

 

[wub1234]

I can't really see the Glazers being willing to compromise their investment so that the fans can have fancy beer pumps and an in-house bakery.

 

[UnitedFan93]

The Glazer debt so far has cost the club over a billion pounds in repayments, interest and professional fees - dead money that has left our club to make the Glazers even richer! In addition, the club is still half a billion in debt! There lies the problem. The debt is the single biggest barrier to any future development of OT. We are not going to spend £500 million redeveloping OT when we are currently £500 million in debt. It's not happening anytime soon. The money spent servicing the debt should have been spent on an OT redevelopment or even a new stadium!

If you don't spend any money on your house for almost 15 years it will start to look run down. This applies to OT but obviously at a much larger scale. At the end of the day we have owners who couldn't care less about the long term future of the club. They want to maximise the clubs value with as little investment as possible. Then they will run off into the sunset with their billions without giving a second thought of the damage that they have caused.

 

[predator]

Agree completely with the article. Our stadium is just outdated. I drive past OT almost daily on my way to work and it looks marvellous from the outside as it's unique but inside it's grim. The seating, the obstructions, the stairs etc. I personally don't go out my way to go there when I can watch it on tv in comfort.
As a fan of architecture and stadiums in general I would prefer us to renovate the stadium (not necessarily demolish it and rebuild) instead of lets say, sign the best player in the world. That's how much I value a stadiums importance.
The railway excuse has always been bollocks. The engineering world has come a along way in the past century. Building over a railway track is now a walk in the park if you have the money.
Taylor is bang on. OT has simply been neglected by our owners.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Agree completely with the article. Our stadium is just outdated. I drive past OT almost daily on my way to work and it looks marvellous from the outside as it's unique but inside it's grim. The seating, the obstructions, the stairs etc. I personally don't go out my way to go there when I can watch it on tv in comfort.
As a fan of architecture and stadiums in general I would prefer us to renovate the stadium (not necessarily demolish it and rebuild) instead of lets say, sign the best player in the world. That's how much I value a stadiums importance.
The railway excuse has always been bollocks. The engineering world has come a along way in the past century. Building over a railway track is now a walk in the park if you have the money.
Taylor is bang on. OT has simply been neglected by our owners.

Well, yes, but the club have spent bucket-loads on transfer fees and wages. So are fans willing to accept a cut-back on these two things so that money can be diverted to stadium renovation? Because this is the key question - which can't be ducked by anyone saying that they want more money for everything.

 

[deafepl]

I can't really see the Glazers being willing to compromise their investment so that the fans can have fancy beer pumps and an in-house bakery.

I think that will happen, I believe they plan to cut our debt down due to the loan was taken on by the Glazers to finance the takeover, it could be finished in the next few years, we pay 20-30m loan payment and still have 200m net debt. If it is finished or close, we could borrow more money to redevelop our new stadium, we could generate 30m+ more in revenue by boasting our capacity to 90K, we'll be paying the same as we did for a loan that was taken by the glazer to finance the takeover.

If the Glazers never have taken over us in 2005 or any potential owner never intend to buy us with a loan, we may have a new stadium of 90K capacity as well before Spurs have their new stadium but we didn't and we continue to finance Glazer's loan that used to purchase us and didn't get a return in anything despite Glazer being our owner, this is sickening