Nice try there Tuchel
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This is a good point as the manager has been quite opened with everyone that he’s not happy with the forwards since he arrived, except for that 1st game from Ronaldo
Kinda a rubbish argument really. I didn't watch yesterday's match as I was snowboarding but it seems we did a lot better without Rashford on the pitch (in terms of attacking output especially, which we have certainly struggled with under Ralf thus far).
What does Rashford do that Sancho doesn't? Off the ball, Jadon works harder, and on, he's just a lot better with it. He may have given it away a lot the other day, but so did every other player. Maybe if he played the other 45mins, he only gives the ball away 6 times, equalling Rashford? Perhaps giving it away more, was due to him getting involved more? It's really a silly stat without looking further into the details.
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Maybe you should watch the game back, then comment on it because we played just as bad as we have all season. We scored a OG, a scrappy tap in and tbf a nice shot by Scott. Outside of that the entire second half was shite and Burnley could easily have scored once or twice from a set piece on another day.
Like I said I didn't watch it but from the highlights alone we created more clear chances than we have done in Ralf's previous 3. After that we were obviously in a comfortable position, what do you expect, to tire ourselves out pushing for another goal?
The OG was a bit of luck but good play from Sancho and Ronaldo's goal was a poachers goal, had martial been there we wouldn't have scored off the rebound. Stop putting a downer on everything you can think. We could've easily had more, like "Burnley could've scored once or twice", such as Ronaldo's early chance too. Evens out and a very bias approach from yourself.
You watched the highlights which show you know the highlights, not going to see the dead parts of the game which was basically the entire 2nd half are you? Tell you what watch the game back and if you still think we "did a lot better without Rashford" then fair enough because for me that game was just as bad as anything we've seen recently.
You seem strange.
Ronaldo also had a disaster of a miss from a position where he usually scores 99,9% of the time, Cavani planted his shot straight at the goalkeepers face but that might have been called off for offside. We created plenty of chances, but our performance was hardly mint, we also took the foot off the pedal in the second half which is only natural given the result and the fact that we have a lot of fixtures coming up.
Sancho was fine yesterday, he worked hard off the ball and he varied between going for it and playing it to players in better positions. At times he tries to be too clever thinking he has more time on the ball, but hardly the biggest issue.
If Rashford had performed like that, people would be calling it a step in the right direction.
So you're happy with a performance like that against Burnley, a shite Burnley at that and at home? If so then don't think I'm the strange one in this scenario.
Couldn't disagree more about the last part, seems that all you have to do is be not named Rashford for people to consider you to have had a "fine" performance. Rashford deserves nothing more than the bench but seems like people's dislike for him seems to make them rate others performances way higher then what they are actually putting out.
Fingers crossed. At least now we will see him playing ‘completely free of injuries’. If he continues to disappoint from now on, it’ll be quite clear that it’s a problem with the player as a whole.
Given our recent performances, creating a lot of chances and winning the match by half time isn’t exactly something i’m going to be unhappy about and it’s something to build on. Not sure why people keep underestimating the mental side of this, vast difference.
Sancho is a creative player, Rashford is a creative player, creative players will lose the ball but the important thing is where and how. Sancho didn’t constantly ignore better options, he created chances, saw opportunities, was consistently making himself available for Shaw, he did the defensive work when he lost the ball and he covered for Shaw when needed, didn’t have the body language of someone that was forced to be on the pitch while his cat is being tortured. Set up our second goal, on another day McTominay’s shot goes in instead of going off the post and to Ronaldo, on another day Cavani’s shot doesn’t hit the face of the goalkeeper. It’s hardly good enough and you expect him to perform better over time, but it’s miles away from the handicap of having Rashford strut around like everything is beneath him. If it’d been Rashford performing like this, it would’ve been considered a step in the right direction, easily.
Agree. It's time to step up again for Rashford. I'm quite optimistic he will.
2021 was one to forget for him. Bit symptomatic that he ended it as an unused sub. 2022 can be a complete differend story.
Are you saying Rashford hasn't been utterly crap ?
The thing with rashford is, they would never sell him. He’s the golden boy. National sweetheart, local lad, united fan, he’s a marketing dream and just can’t see him leaving.
Didn't mean to quote you, and yes Rashford has been hopeless for a while now. From my perspective I just don't why people are going on like last night was anything to write home about. We played like shit for large portions of the game, pressing was non existent, passing was still shocking overall just a shit team performance.
Guess we see the game differently because I saw Sancho do exactly the same thing Rashford has been critiqued for multiple times. He was sloppy with his passing, refused or was incapable of beating his man, stood over the ball and slowed down play. Will agree on the body language though at least he wasn't miserable but that hardly constitutes a good game imo.
As for the match there was nothing in that game that doesn't point to it being a one off and Burnley just being utter shit. Didn't see anything to give me confidence going forward but if it did for you then fair enough.
exactly, second half, we were comfortably two goals ahead. Like I said, you don't expect the players to go all out for more goals when we have another game in a few days, do you? Sounds like the second half was just neutralized and nothing exciting happened, which is exactly what we would want being ahead 2 goals and another game not long away.
I would tend to agree with you. It wasnt a great performance overall.
Somehow we need to stumble over the line and by some miracle get 4th. Then get the new man in the summer and some new blood whilst getting rid of the celebrity players
That would be fine if the 1st half was good but it wasn't. Feels like I'm the only one who saw the game that way so I will bow out now but if you have time I'm sure the match day thread will reflect my opinion.
I've seen many say the 1st half was an improvement, but the 2nd half was shocking, which going off the highlights it looks exactly that and it was against the run of play when they got their goal according to reports. In summary, I'm quite happy with 3 goals a half if that's not good.
Sancho had a say in 2 goals, caused the OG and would've grabbed the assist for McT had it not been a great save, Ronaldo on the rebound. Just said it in his performance thread, it's like many expect him to play like his highlights video on youtube every time he touches the ball. It's the same with Rashford in this regard really, but Rashford is just more consistently useless on the ball and Sancho more consistently actually does something with it.
Now I'm sure it was nothing spectacular, but it sounds like we were pretty comfortable throughout.
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A slight improvement on shit is still shit, just a little less shitty. Like I said if anyone who watched that last night and came to the conclusion that we'll go on a run now based off last nights performance then more power to you because for me there was literally nothing to suggest that to me.
Meh, not suggesting that at all, I have no grounds. Going back to the original point, seen the highlights and watched a few bits here and there, but imo Sancho was alright from the bits I have seen and not as poor as people are suggesting, definitely does more than Rashford. Like I said, it's like people have watched the youtube vids and expect that 24/7. That's just not how it works. I think you'll see a few more people agreeing with me too in the Sancho thread now too. Initial comments are just knee jerk reactions probably based on a few things he did wrong. At the end of the day, we remember stuff based on emotions, and we feel more emotions when we're angry than happy, so we tend to remember all the poor stuff Sancho did in the game, but not the good stuff. Same goes for the game, people are dwelling on a terrible second half per say, but fail to mention how we got 3 goals in 1 half after struggling attacking-wise in Ralfs first 3 games.
Either way, we got a very comfortable win.
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Sanchos average performance there last night was better than anything Rashford had served up in the last 12 months, especially off the ball and at least he didn’t lose it every time he got on it. Something to work with. That’s how low the bar now is for our wide forwards. I think Rashford will soon be challenging Mason for the spot on the right while Sancho takes over the left, as lots of us said he would last summer.
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Yesterday, we were a poor team with a few great moments and lots of luck.
There was no press what so ever yesterday. All four up front were so lazy. I personally prefer Sancho but can’t say any of the two has been playimg like starting xi material this season.
Yeah you didn't read the rest of the convo.
This is a quote from the Sancho thread:
If thats not starting XI material then I'm not too sure what the other players are?!?!?
Sancho was our highest pressing player yesterday. I’m sure the manager will see that as a positive performance. Without fireworks but himself and Shaw won the second ball a lot and put us on the counter a few times. It’s promising without being anything exceptional.
That will be why he's got 2 goals and 1 assist. I'm sure some people don't actually watch our games. Sancho wasn't even good last night. His cross come shot for the own goal was a bit of fluke. The rest of the game he didn't do much. He wasn't terrible but he wasn't amazing either.
Rashford is in terrible form and needed dropping but Sancho so far has been very poor, especially for 75m.
Swear you don't either. Contributed to 2 goals - Caused the own goal, would've assisted McT if not for a great save, + Ronaldo scores the rebound. 69th minute, puts in a superb cross for Ronaldo to set up Cavani. + this: "Highest presses of any United player. Joint highest number of tackles. Most touches of all our attacking players. Best pass completion % (91.5) Most progressive carries. Most progressive dribbles." - Pogue Mahone - Already quoted above.
Now in a game where we played terribly according to a lot of people, that's a pretty good statistical performance.
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Quoting myself here.
McT was probably our most influential individual. Shaw and Sancho ran him close though. To say he “didn’t do much” is clearly unfair, even if we ignore the goal.
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Thierry Henry:
As you keep saying. We can see you know the stats. That’s cool, there’s currently not much between them I get that. The team game is about more than individual stats which is what I’ve been saying for god knows how long and if you’re going on stats since this time last year it’s all bad. You probably realise I watch all our games because of the amount I post on here, whether you agree with me or not. We disagree on Pogba and Rashford. Ive been outspoken in my view that Rashford got his stats while managing to drag the rest of the team down and make us much more predictable and easy to stop, especially for better organised teams and teams with any bit of fight about them at all.
Unfortunately for me I’ve had to endure watching Rashford struggle to do the basics for however long without any threat to his place. and probably for some on here, realised too quickly this is probably not just a blip anymore. Rashford v Newcastle has been his standard basic performance for at least a year if not longer. Lost looking, scowling body language, walking around, only comes alive on the ball and losing it almost every time he tries anything apart from a back pass or half heartedly getting on the end of something and then back into his shell. That rubs off on others whether people want to admit it or not. He’s become a waste of a place in a team who’s main problem is work rate and aggression and being massively overly predictable (in team selection and play) and pedestrian as hell.
Sancho put in a happier more aggressive and selfless pressing performance there last night and worked well with Shaw. He was our second best player. When was the last time Rashford was our second best player even when he scored? Shaw and Sancho actually turned over possession and got us countering a few times and played some decently fast stuff. They made chances and spaces for others. There’s certainly room for improvement and optimism there
For a young player coming into a new league vs one the leagues supposed best players I can see plenty to be optimistic about with Sancho. Technically he’s going to be on a different level to Rashford and will hopefully offer us something more suitable to build upon if we want to play pressing possession football through the lines. Also laughing at those who said Sancho wasn't coming here to take Rashfords place on the left. Watch and see what happens when Rash is mostly battling for the right wing spot with Greenwood and coming on for Sancho on the left. The writing has been on the wall for a long time. It’s not like Rashford hasn't totally deserved to be dropped for ages. It looks like it only took Ralf a few games to figure that out. I like Rashford and think he could still majorly turn it around but the way Ole was doing it was only dragging us down. Dropping him and drawing attention to the fact he needs to majorly improve was always the next logical step. Hopefully it has the desired effect.
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That's all well and good but humour me a second, Rashford for the Newcastle game was labelled a diva and lazy, correct? Yet going by the stats Rashford had more pressures and was successful more too. He also had 4 more progressive passes to Sancho 3 last night and recovered 11 loose balls to Sancho 6.
IMO Rashford wasn't up to scratch against Newcastle, neither was the whole team tbf but deserved to ride the bench for prior games. Sancho deserves games to find some form but using stats to judge a game shouldn't be a thing.
Stats are good if used in the right way. Not the way you use them, ie instead of watching the match itself. He was ok when we had the ball, but like the rest up front he did not press at all which caused us big problems.
Varane got excellent defensive stats against Newcastle. Most of us who saw the game would not say he was excellent.
Most of time our front players just stood there watching Burnley passing the ball. Also there was no aggressive press at all when they won the ball and they could hit uncountable amount of precision long balls for both counters and out on the wings.
I thought Sancho did well. But for the purposes of this thread if you didn’t think he was any good it’s presumably because… He was injured /recovering from injuries he’s had in the last two years and was being asked to play slightly adrift from his ideal position.
Therefore now considered undroppable?
Therefore now considered undroppable?
Man Utd 0:1 Wolves
He doesn't even play like a professional footballer. Even shitter than I said he was 3 years ago. Pathetic.
Career's gone to shit. Get rid with the rest of them.
Worst player in the Premier league on current form.
He's awful
United legend in the making.
Apparently the only trophy he'll receive is from hands of shitty politicians.
Apparently the only trophy he'll receive is from hands of shitty politicians.
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