Mason Mount | Confirmed

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Idxomer

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From Chelsea fans:


Runs around a lot, high amount of final third presses albeit with a low success rate but he's another slow, weak player to add to our collection.

Standard Mason Mount performance:

Yep, he has a lot of games where he basically does nothing which is also a frequent occurrence with England. He's a slightly better version of Jesse Lingard.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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This was posted last year in April. I reckon, if this is still 2022, people wouldn’t have any issue about us signing Mount.

 

UNITED ACADEMY

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I found this on google and made by arsenal fan. Gundogan has 88% passing accuracy while Mount 21/22 had 85% passing accuracy with more progressive passes.
 

TheLord

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Friend of a mine who's a football analyst for various clubs and a journalist told me a year ago Mount is as close as England has to Modrić in the sense of the way he plays. We were talking about how England doesn't produce those kind of players, technically sound players with a good passing and defensive skill too, but is more about pace and wingers, for various reasons, and mentioned Mount.
Oh my God. Comparing Mount, who can't even get into the worst Chelsea side in 25 years, with arguably the greatest midfielder of the past 25 years just because he runs around like crazy is a joke of the highest order.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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We're going in circles as I don't think you understand my argument or I'm not explaining myself well enough.

The position we tend to see assumes there isn't a player with the profile we're looking for because people can't name them. You can see there are players out there who perform in the metrics for what we're looking for. I don't have a preference of who, it's all about profile in terms of what they bring to the group.

Back to Mount - he is the right profile of player, but he clearly is extremely expensive, especially as he doesn't really excel in the areas we're crying out for.
When I asked you, it wasn’t meant that I asked your own preference, I was referring which ones you think fits ETH’s profile. What makes you think based on the metrics you showed me there are players we’re looking for?

You only said it’s there but you can’t tell me why some of those players in that metric fits ETH’s profile. I could also using your method of discussion or criticisms by telling you that based on the metrics that you showed me, none of those players fit the profile but just like you I don’t want to tell you why.

Do you see now why this is going circle? A statement or stats without context is meaningless. So I don’t know why are you persistent to criticise my points by giving me a statement and stats without giving me a context.
 

Kush

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Don't want, he is average as feck.
 

cyberman

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Oh my God. Comparing Mount, who can't even get into the worst Chelsea side in 25 years, with arguably the greatest midfielder of the past 25 years just because he runs around like crazy is a joke of the highest order.
Meanwhile nothing but top clubs are seemingly after Mount?
 

Powderfinger

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I found this on google and made by arsenal fan. Gundogan has 88% passing accuracy while Mount 21/22 had 85% passing accuracy with more progressive passes.
I think Mount is a pretty good player when put into the right role. But this is a good example of stats being misleading without context.

Mount 21-22 was played as an attacking/midfielder in a 3-4-2-1, his job was to be one of the top corners in a midfield box, first wave of the press, stay relatively high when building up, only minimal responsibilities in settled defensive shape. In total over the course of the season he had 1564 touches, of which 928 (59%) came in the attacking third.

Gundogan 22-23 can sometimes move into the top left of midfield box in settled possession, but is a crucial player in buildup, dropping deep next to Rodri (and occasionally actually deputizing for Rodri), and then in settled defense is a critical cog playing next to Rodri once Stones (or whoever else is playing that role) backs out of midfield and into the four man back line. Almost the exact same amount of minutes as Mount, but 1806 touches, of which only 596 (33%) came in the attacking third.

Basically, Mount isn't producing any more offensive output than Gundogan despite having far fewer responsibilities in buildup, settled defense, or stopping transitions and despite having a much higher number of touches and much higher percentage of touches in the attacking third. Final third contribution is like a side gig for Gundogan, yet he's doing it just as well as Mount while still shouldering all the main midfield responsibilities. Of course Gundogan is part of a very well oiled City machine. But Mount's Chelsea was a pretty good team as well.
 

Giggsyking

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This was posted last year in April. I reckon, if this is still 2022, people wouldn’t have any issue about us signing Mount.

He played near the goal that season. He will not be doing this with us, therefor he is not going to show stats for his overall play that is painfully average. Stats is not everything.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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I think Mount is a pretty good player when put into the right role. But this is a good example of stats being misleading without context.

Mount 21-22 was played as an attacking/midfielder in a 3-4-2-1, his job was to be one of the top corners in a midfield box, first wave of the press, stay relatively high when building up, only minimal responsibilities in settled defensive shape. In total over the course of the season he had 1564 touches, of which 928 (59%) came in the attacking third.

Gundogan 22-23 can sometimes move into the top left of midfield box in settled possession, but is a crucial player in buildup, dropping deep next to Rodri (and occasionally actually deputizing for Rodri), and then in settled defense is a critical cog playing next to Rodri once Stones (or whoever else is playing that role) backs out of midfield and into the four man back line. Almost the exact same amount of minutes as Mount, but 1806 touches, of which only 596 (33%) came in the attacking third.

Basically, Mount isn't producing any more offensive output than Gundogan despite having far fewer responsibilities in buildup, settled defense, or stopping transitions and despite having a much higher number of touches and much higher percentage of touches in the attacking third. Final third contribution is like a side gig for Gundogan, yet he's doing it just as well as Mount while still shouldering all the main midfield responsibilities. Of course Gundogan is part of a very well oiled City machine. But Mount's Chelsea was a pretty good team as well.
The purpose I put the stats wasn’t because I want to compare gundogan with Mount. But it’s to show what is Mount‘s strength and what he can offer to the team. If I give his own stats alone, we will not be able to make estimate of measurement of the stats. I just have to find the one that has comparison with other player.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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He played near the goal that season. He will not be doing this with us, therefor he is not going to show stats for his overall play that is painfully average. Stats is not everything.
Stats is not everything. The only reason why I posted the goals and assists isn’t to show everything about Mason Mount but it’s to show Mason Mount has the talent to offer good amount of end product. That’s something what he can offer and I’ll be very surprised if we don’t play in his strength but playing him deep.
 

NRg

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Is he injured? Why isn’t he in their squad?
I guess they do not want to play a guy that does not want to sign a new contract, and its one foot out the door, if we trust the rumors. I'd take him as a squad player for no more than 25m, he can be a good option to have
 

luke511

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From Chelsea fans:


Runs around a lot, high amount of final third presses albeit with a low success rate but he's another slow, weak player to add to our collection.

Standard Mason Mount performance:

Looks like a JLingz special
 

GifLord

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Stats is not everything. The only reason why I posted the goals and assists isn’t to show everything about Mason Mount but it’s to show Mason Mount has the talent to offer good amount of end product. That’s something what he can offer and I’ll be very surprised if we don’t play in his strength but playing him deep.
Mount is Chelsea's main set piece taker yet he only managed 1 season where he had more than 10 assists in all comps.
2019-20 6 assists in 53 games
2020-21 9 assists in 54 games
2022-21 16 assists in 53 games most of them coming from set pieces
2022-23 6 assists in 35 games
 

NoPace

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Mount is Chelsea's main set piece taker yet he only managed 1 season where he had more than 10 assists in all comps.
2019-20 6 assists in 53 games
2020-21 9 assists in 54 games
2022-21 16 assists in 53 games most of them coming from set pieces
2022-23 6 assists in 35 games
His set pieces lack whip and power, just floated balls. I don't think he'll end up taking them for us if we sign him.
 

jesperjaap

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He is a good player. Thik lack of action and international form counting against him. But I dont think he is the right player for us. Think the probable fee is about right. Similar to Maddison and Mount has been just as good as Maddison over the last 2/3years if you forget recently.

Saying that I think Maddisons ability on the ball gives us something we dont have in the middle (though I think we have a few players could play there), Mount is more a clever runner, has a good shot but not aything super great....I get get the Lingard comparisons, though he is a better player.

Personally if we are talking £50m I wouldnt take either player, but they are both good. A number 8 is the priority where as those two really are number 10s....would rather a back up for Casemeiro if we were to sign two midfielders but either player could be excellent signings for a few sides in the top half of the table, I just dont think we are one of them
 

NoPace

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I'm a little concerned that this Hall kid might just be a better midfielder even if he is being forced to play LB.
 

Bastian

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So there was a theory bandied around, mostly by that Muppetiers account I think, that ETH has kind of switched his setup in the sense of how he wants us to play, which kind of makes sense when you see the difference between this summer and last summer and the kind of midfielders we're reportedly targetting

So before we basically wanted De Jong, this was even before Casemiro, akin to the original setup he had at Ajax, but now he's switching it more to his second Ajax setup, which is essentially one 6 and two 8's, which makes sense when you can see the type of midfielder we seemingly are after are the Mount's and Mac Allister types.
That's certainly a possibility. If he's a replacement for Eriksen, he's obviously got energy the former doesn't possess.

Ten Hag likes dropping Bruno deeper and out wide, instead of signing an 8 to replace Eriksen it opens up Mount for 10 who will add legs and work rate that would help us stop every top 8 side walking through us away from home. We might miss a bit of creativity through Mount but that would be negated by the world class 9/10 hybrid play signing Kane would bring so I’m guessing it’s a big picture signing.
I'm not sold on Bruno from deep, and I can't really imagine he'll shunt him wide right after spending so much on Antony. But this would give him more options certainly.

Cheers, will watch that.

@Bastian I wasn't going to respond but as you've asked, then signing him makes sense imo.

The likes of Bruno and Fred etc play with a lot of energy but they're easily bypassed by quick and agile players. Mount not only matches the aforementioned two for intensity but is also physically and athletically gifted hence he's stronger in defensive transition and tactically he's a superior player for a team that wants to sacrifice defensive stability for goals. It's why the likes of Liverpool and Arsenal want him, aswell as Tuchel rating him highly. All our forwards with the exception of Antony aren't very intelligent when it comes to defensive duties in defensive transition. And previously the likes of Pogba and Matic were also easily bypassed in midfield. So you can't control games without controlling both what you do in possession and also what you do out of possession. And what you do out of possession isn't very popular amongst some fans but it's absolutely imperative if one wants to implement a proactive attacking brand of football by playing the game in the opponent's half.

Also if we end up signing Harry Kane with him dropping deeper with Mount behind him, it makes more sense for a player with Mounts skillset to be behind him centrally, rather than Bruno imo. Mount is a proper systems player and hence a positional play coach like Tuchel was able to get his ideas across quickly to the player. Mount can also be used as a pressing trigger and is technically good, aswell as tactically clever.

And I hope we can get the deals done quickly because for me the most important positions to target to dominate games is a keeper, CM and RB. And those three positions are key to exerting control in possession and play through the press and raise the defensive line.
Cheers Adnan, this is logical in the sense of improving the tactical shape and ability of the team in and out of possession (similar to how Antony is important, despite his having a pretty shoddy final ball/decision). What I do wonder about is him being English and very hyped, which will of course affect the price. And he's got leverage with Chelsea now so it's not as if he won't command very high wages. Maybe he's the player we were hoping Donny could be (but most definitely isn't).

Another question mark is where does ETH see Bruno. Beforehand I thought Bruno would be an anti-ETH player, what with his gung-ho approach and sometimes pretty sloppy ball retention, and like I said previously, I am not convinced by him playing deeper with his inclination for high risk passes, even at the edge of his own box. I don't dislike him wide right, he's certainly got the work ethic and like you say, it offers him a bit more liberation, but again, what about Antony?

We certainly need to shore up this midfield and I'd rather see us sign two (or promote Mejbri) and shed all of McTominay, Fred, Donny and not sign Sabitzer. If we'd have to keep one I'd retain Fred for the last year of contract, just for his energy.

We'll likely send Mainoo out on loan and Iqbal. Hopefully very thoughtfully considered loans too.

Cheers for the replies guys.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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Mount is Chelsea's main set piece taker yet he only managed 1 season where he had more than 10 assists in all comps.
2019-20 6 assists in 53 games
2020-21 9 assists in 54 games
2022-21 16 assists in 53 games most of them coming from set pieces
2022-23 6 assists in 35 games
May be that’s down to some players had poor finishing ability because based on his xA, he should have gotten much more.



 

bucky

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I really don't get the disdain for him at all.

Compared to the general standard of attacking midfielders across the league, he's above average in pretty much every aspect of on the ball play. Touch, passing, shooting, carrying, etc. The base level of technicality in our squad goes up if he's added.

And off the ball, he's a pressing machine. All that combined makes for a very good player for a side who want to play technical, pressing football. Certainly a stylistic fit for the team if not a positional one.

I can understand people thinking he isn't a particularly good fit position-wise (I don't either), or that he doesn't impose himself on games enough, or having concerns that he isn't creative enough if we actually played him instead of Bruno. But some of the posts make him sound far less than the at worst perfectly fine, technically sound, hard-working player he is.

Someone above saying he fails the eye test whenever you look at him, when in reality he's generally looked like the highly competent player the statistics suggest he is when I've watched Chelsea. I can only think his England performances have addled people's perception of his somewhat, because based on the previous three seasons of his actual performances for his club he's obviously a fine player at our level and someone other top English clubs would inevitably look to sign.
Good post.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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If we sign Mason Mount, I believe there will be changing of tactic next season. And this is mainly because ten Hag and the scouting teams couldn’t find a deep-playmaker that has similar profile as FDJ (Someone with press resistance who can be ball carrier and progressive passer). Instead of playing with 4231, he will play 433. We see this changing formation in his Ajax team when FDJ left.

The following below is Ajax attacking transition vs Dortmund in 2021/2022 season. You can see that Gravenberch is nowhere near in Ajax build up play phase. It‘s the keeper, two CB, a DM, and the two full backs the ones who got involved in this. Among these 6 players, Alvarez is the one being assigned to play more simple passes and doesn’t get involved on the ball often (see below stats), this suitable to Casemiro who is not a press resistance so I think we will see a different role in Casemiro next season in comparison to this season.

I think our build up and attacking transition will be something like this:

GK
Varane Martinez
Casemiro
RB —————— Shaw
Antony - Mount - Bruno - Rashford
ST
Bruno will play in Gravenberch position while Mount will play next to him. Our full backs will cover the half space and sometime swap position with the wingers.

Mount will be perfect to play in this set up and system because we will get to utilise his strength to do high press, scoring goals and assists.



I took pictures of these FBref end of last season so this is based on 21/22 season.

 

croadyman

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If we sign Mason Mount, I believe there will be changing of tactic next season. And this is mainly because ten Hag and the scouting teams couldn’t find a deep-playmaker that has similar profile as FDJ (Someone with press resistance who can be ball carrier and progressive passer). Instead of playing with 4231, he will play 433. We see this changing formation in his Ajax team when FDJ left.

The following below is Ajax attacking transition vs Dortmund in 2021/2022 season. You can see that Gravenberch is nowhere near in Ajax build up play phase. It‘s the keeper, two CB, a DM, and the two full backs the ones who got involved in this. Among these 6 players, Alvarez is the one being assigned to play more simple passes and doesn’t get involved on the ball often (see below stats), this suitable to Casemiro who is not a press resistance so I think we will see a different role in Casemiro next season in comparison to this season.

I think our build up and attacking transition will be something like this:

GK
Varane Martinez
Casemiro
RB —————— Shaw
Antony - Mount - Bruno - Rashford
ST
Bruno will play in Gravenberch position while Mount will play next to him. Our full backs will cover the half space and sometime swap position with the wingers.

Mount will be perfect to play in this set up and system because we will get to utilise his strength to do high press, scoring goals and assists.



I took pictures of these FBref end of last season so this is based on 21/22 season.

Yeah maybe he is looking at a different profile of midfielder now he can't get De Jong hence Utd stepping up their interest in this guy
 

edcunited1878

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Someone convince me where he fits into team
The reason why the match against Chelsea was really open was because United had Casemiro on his own, with Eriksen ahead of him and Bruno dropping deep, so more of a 4-3-3 or 4-1-2-3.

Eriksen was bypassed so easily today and you saw Bruno running his ass off tracking back numerous times. Someone like Mount can take up similar positions as Eriksen, but not get bypassed so easily through midfield, but also can press high up the pitch like Eriksen has been asked to do. Fred can't pass or shoot as good as Mount, but both players like to work hard off the ball, retrieve it, and can start transitions well.

I feel like EtH is going to continue to develop and change the squad so they can deploy different tactical systems and try to hurt opponents differently throughout a match, something they were unable to do this year and maybe why United struggled at times in the 2nd half of matches. In addition, Mount would be better than VdB, plus he is a versatile player.

The fee is the weird thing, unless McTominay, Maguire, Henderson, Telles, and someone else are going to raise near 75M+, in addition to the usual 100M overall.
 

bringbackbebe

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He doesn't get picked unless there's injuries/suspensions, does he?
That's only recently. He was a regular and rated highly under Rangnick, Ole and Mourinho. In fact, ETH chose McTominay and kept Casemiro out of the initial games till that wretched City game when it became apparent.
 
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