Mateus Fernandes | Spurs player

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IrishRedDevil said:
West Ham paid £42m for him. He won't be any less than £65m. Worth it though.
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Surely, it will depend on who goes after him and how much they offer. I don't think West Ham will make a loss on their original outlay either, but if they get relegated they might be pressured to sell and he is one of the few valuable players they have who can be sacrificed to make up for the drop in revenue They will need some money to re-invest in the squad too. I'm also guessing, with suitors from the EPL, Fernandes will not want to spend a year in the Championship, so if West Ham start playing too much hardball they may end up with a rebellious player too. They will want to avoid that.

My guess It could be somewhere in the 50-70m range IMO.
 
IrishRedDevil said:
West Ham paid £42m for him. He won't be any less than £65m. Worth it though.
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It wouldn't be surprising if he has some sort of release clause, possibly one active if they get relegated but even if so West Ham would have ensured that clause recoups their money plus a bit of profit.
 
saivet said:
It wouldn't be surprising if he has some sort of release clause, possibly one active if they get relegated but even if so West Ham would have ensured that clause recoups their money plus a bit of profit.
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It seems that João Gomes also didn’t have a release clause, yet Atlético still paid €45 million for him.
 
MadMike said:
Surely, it will depend on who goes after him and how much they offer. I don't think West Ham will make a loss on their original outlay either, but if they get relegated they might be pressured to sell and he is one of the few valuable players they have who can be sacrificed to make up for the drop in revenue They will need some money to re-invest in the squad too. I'm also guessing, with suitors from the EPL, Fernandes will not want to spend a year in the Championship, so if West Ham start playing too much hardball they may end up with a rebellious player too. They will want to avoid that.

My guess It could be somewhere in the 50-70m range IMO.
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Problem is that we're not the only team looking at him and the competition may also drive up the price regardless of relegation
 
saivet said:
It wouldn't be surprising if he has some sort of release clause, possibly one active if they get relegated but even if so West Ham would have ensured that clause recoups their money plus a bit of profit.
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I'd be surpised. Even if they did, it would be quite high. He would always be one of their most sellable assets and they invested £45m in him. I'd be surprised if they would have accepted the idea they just get their money back.
 
ericcovicc said:
It seems that João Gomes also didn’t have a release clause, yet Atlético still paid €45 million for him.
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Interesting, I suppose making their money back plus some profit would likely be the aim. Wolves signed Gomes for around €20m, so getting €45m for him is a healthy profit
 
Been reading through some of the Mateus Fernandes thread over on Knees Up Mother Brown, the West Ham United forum. No figure mentioned regarding a relegation release clause but understandably, a lot of discussion regarding what his fee could be should he indeed leave the Hammers. Most believe it needs to be above 50 million quid with some claiming it should be closer to 70-75 million. The only team named as a potential destination is PSG - with "top sides" also mentioned in the thread as interested parties.

He was relegated (with Southampton) in 2024/25 and looks like that may be repeated with West Ham this season. Hopefully, he joins United and has a much happier time in 2025/26!

Here are a few quotes from West Ham fans:

I'll be gutted to see him go as I believe he will develop into a fabulous player that graces the stage of one of the European aristocracy for years to come.

I had hoped to get at least one more year out of him, but the modern game being the way it is, I accept the likelihood is he will depart.

In my minds eye I can see him bossing the midfield for Bayern Munich or somebody like that for a decade or more. When he finally hangs up his boots he will have won some medals for sure.
Great player, unlucky today, but love him.

He deserves the highest stage.
There should be a bidding war for him luckily for us.
Lavia went for 58 million when Southampton went down

Fernandes is a few levels above.

He won't be sold cheap.
He was excellent today. Looked every bit as good as Rice. He missed a sitter but it happens. He is going to be a superstar.
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Mateus is a decent player but I hope that the club would do some serious HW before signing him. Unlike most CM linked he's not a no 6/no 8 hybrid. He's more of a no 8 and no 10 hybrid which makes him the most attacking minded of the lot. That comes with perks for example a better long passing rate and a better dribble rate then the rest. However it also come with weaknesses as well. If we're determined to play him in the midfield base then him out of the lot will need a top quality no 6 the most. This is not about him not putting a shift in cause he did. His defensive contributions are off the charts. It's about him thinking and acting more like an attacking minded player then the rest. That means that someone needs to be at his back mopping and making sure that he doesn't over commit. That shouldn't deter us. Scholes was far more attacking minded that Mateus was and he turned up becoming the best deep playing playmaker the EPL had ever seen. But for that to happen he needed Keane. Mateus will need an experienced DM at his back.
 
devilish said:
Mateus is a decent player but I hope that the club would do some serious HW before signing him. Unlike most CM linked he's not a no 6/no 8 hybrid. He's more of a no 8 and no 10 hybrid which makes him the most attacking minded of the lot. That comes with perks for example a better long passing rate and a better dribble rate then the rest. However it also come with weaknesses as well. If we're determined to play him in the midfield base then him out of the lot will need a top quality no 6 the most. This is not about him not putting a shift in cause he did. His defensive contributions are off the charts. It's about him thinking and acting more like an attacking minded player then the rest. That means that someone needs to be at his back mopping and making sure that he doesn't over commit. That shouldn't deter us. Scholes was far more attacking minded that Mateus was and he turned up becoming the best deep playing playmaker the EPL had ever seen. But for that to happen he needed Keane. Mateus will need an experienced DM at his back.
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His versatility is something I like and we are going to need.
 
devilish said:
Mateus is a decent player but I hope that the club would do some serious HW before signing him. Unlike most CM linked he's not a no 6/no 8 hybrid. He's more of a no 8 and no 10 hybrid which makes him the most attacking minded of the lot. That comes with perks for example a better long passing rate and a better dribble rate then the rest. However it also come with weaknesses as well. If we're determined to play him in the midfield base then him out of the lot will need a top quality no 6 the most. This is not about him not putting a shift in cause he did. His defensive contributions are off the charts. It's about him thinking and acting more like an attacking minded player then the rest. That means that someone needs to be at his back mopping and making sure that he doesn't over commit. That shouldn't deter us. Scholes was far more attacking minded that Mateus was and he turned up becoming the best deep playing playmaker the EPL had ever seen. But for that to happen he needed Keane. Mateus will need an experienced DM at his back.
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He should replace Mason Mount. We need 3 midfielders, at least, IMO. We should have 4 options for the 2 deeper mids, having one that could play as part of the 2 and also sub in for Bruno would be fantastic.
 
Me and my mate were just talking about this and we agreed on we need 3 midfielders coming in AND Harry Wilson on a free as he’s a much more trustworthy back up to Bruno than Mount fitness wise.

We agreed on Mateus Fernandes, Carlos Baleba and Alex Scott coming in as the 3 midfielders as Anderson at £100 million isn’t cost effective when we need other positions filled and Tchouameni is unlikely once Mourinho takes over at Real.

Having options of Mainoo, Mateus Fernandes, Baleba and Scott offers absolutely everything and IF fit Mount can play there or as a back up 10 so plenty of depth if Wilson came in on a free too.

Another good thing with those 3 midfielders is they’re not likely to go to the World Cup which makes a deal easier through the summer and Wilson on a free means we only need to deal with his agent rather than a club.
 
Apokalips said:
He should replace Mason Mount. We need 3 midfielders, at least, IMO. We should have 4 options for the 2 deeper mids, having one that could play as part of the 2 and also sub in for Bruno would be fantastic.
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Mason Mount is probably till here till 2028. No-one is going to buy him unless he improves his fitness AND performance. In some ways Mateus gives us options. He can play as a 10 and as a combative 8. It's just he's slightly more attacking minded 8 then the other options which means that he'll need a Tchouameni or a Berge to keep him in line. It's not a form of criticism from my part. My favorite and second favorite deep lying play makers started as forwards. Its just a fact.
 
Tallis said:
His versatility is something I like and we are going to need.
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I do as well. I am simply saying that CM pairs work when the duo strength and weaknesses are taken in consideration. Mateus bring a certain skillset and like any other player whose not prime Roy Keane will require players of a certain skillset to compliment him
 
devilish said:
Mason Mount is probably till here till 2028. No-one is going to buy him unless he improves his fitness AND performance. In some ways Mateus gives us options. He can play as a 10 and as a combative 8. It's just he's slightly more attacking minded 8 then the other options which means that he'll need a Tchouameni or a Berge to keep him in line. It's not a form of criticism from my part. My favorite and second favorite deep lying play makers started as forwards. Its just a fact.
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He could go the Rashford route. I don't think INEOS has a tolerance for keeping a squad player on 250k p/w.

I agree we have options at #10. Cunha could rotate with Bruno at #10 if needed and if we actually sign 3 mids, we might be more 4-3-3 with Mainoo, M. Fernandes, Tchouameni / Baleba in games where Bruno doesn't play.
 
His best position is Mainoos in any 2 currently. I'm not saying they can't work together but I can see that being very lightweight. The elephant in the room is Bruno. If we play 4-3-3 and stick someone like Baleba in behind them I think that could balance nicely but a lot of pressure goes onto our forwards to create chances for each other. I'd still buy him for the future if there's a relegation deal to be done
 
Teja said:
He could go the Rashford route. I don't think INEOS has a tolerance for keeping a squad player on 250k p/w.

I agree we have options at #10. Cunha could rotate with Bruno at #10 if needed and if we actually sign 3 mids, we might be more 4-3-3 with Mainoo, M. Fernandes, Tchouameni / Baleba in games where Bruno doesn't play.
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Rashford is still a decent player as shown by his performances at Barca. His issue was that he needed a change of scenery and he didn't justify the huge salary he is on. Mount is neither good nor available. He's more of a Phil Jones then a Rashy
 
IrishRedDevil said:
West Ham paid £42m for him. He won't be any less than £65m. Worth it though.
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Technically they paid £38m. Unless he managed to hit every contract milestone (5 year contract) in a relegation year.

They probably also paid in installments. With the remaining payments due after they go down (less income).

I hope we offer a reasonable fee without acting like they have us over a barrel.
 
I admit I am no transfer expert, but why would his price drop a lot if WH are relegated? The market is the market for him, right? If another top club is willing to offer more than another, won't that be the way it goes down? Thanks for any thoughts on this. I am sure I am missing something.
 
Cantonagotmehere said:
I admit I am no transfer expert, but why would his price drop a lot if WH are relegated? The market is the market for him, right? If another top club is willing to offer more than another, won't that be the way it goes down? Thanks for any thoughts on this. I am sure I am missing something.
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His price will ultimately be set by the buyer, so if there's a bidding war for him, then his price may not drop at all.

From West Ham's perspective though, their position will be significantly weakened. They'll need money to reinvest in Championship players, and the player will be demanding to leave.

West Ham would be between a rock and a hard place, as keeping Fernandes would be inconceivable in the Championship. If they have to sell, it should be much easier to reach a reasonable agreement
 
AnotherLondonManc said:
His price will ultimately be set by the buyer, so if there's a bidding war for him, then his price may not drop at all.

From West Ham's perspective though, their position will be significantly weakened. They'll need money to reinvest in Championship players, and the player will be demanding to leave.

West Ham would be between a rock and a hard place, as keeping Fernandes would be inconceivable in the Championship. If they have to sell, it should be much easier to reach a reasonable agreement
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Thanks mate. Makes sense
 
Cantonagotmehere said:
I admit I am no transfer expert, but why would his price drop a lot if WH are relegated? The market is the market for him, right? If another top club is willing to offer more than another, won't that be the way it goes down? Thanks for any thoughts on this. I am sure I am missing something.
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I'm not in the know about West Ham's finances, but according to some sources, if they go down they'll have make some sales to balance the books. Of course you'd assume they wouldn't want to sell their best assets, but combined with the player wanting to leave, they won't be in the most ideal position to negotiate some fantastical fee. £40m is unrealistic, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could get the player for around £50/55m + addons.

And that's assuming we'd enact the same strategy as with most of our signings last summer. Which is to get the player to signal exclusive preference for United and then negotiate based on that with the club. That pretty much eliminates the possibility of an auction-style price hike.
 
devilish said:
Mateus is a decent player but I hope that the club would do some serious HW before signing him. Unlike most CM linked he's not a no 6/no 8 hybrid. He's more of a no 8 and no 10 hybrid which makes him the most attacking minded of the lot. That comes with perks for example a better long passing rate and a better dribble rate then the rest. However it also come with weaknesses as well. If we're determined to play him in the midfield base then him out of the lot will need a top quality no 6 the most. This is not about him not putting a shift in cause he did. His defensive contributions are off the charts. It's about him thinking and acting more like an attacking minded player then the rest. That means that someone needs to be at his back mopping and making sure that he doesn't over commit. That shouldn't deter us. Scholes was far more attacking minded that Mateus was and he turned up becoming the best deep playing playmaker the EPL had ever seen. But for that to happen he needed Keane. Mateus will need an experienced DM at his back.
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While I agree, I do also think with the right setup it can work (as Luis Enrique is showing). They use 3 extremely talented all rounders basically in midfield every time, rather than having more specialist "6", "8" or "10". I think Mainoo falls into this boat as well where you could have Mainoo next to Mateus Fernandes, but also Elliot Anderson falls into this as well. You could have that trio together, but Bruno with 2 of them probably means you are too attacking unless Bruno plays more reserved (which he can do of course).

Basically in a 4231, he would compete with Mainoo for a spot next to a 6, behind Bruno. In a 433, you could make 3 of them work where you do something like Mainoo, Fernandes and Anderson, Wharton or Scott, with the right type of coaching (Luis Enrique type, which is also rare, but anyway).
 
bosnian_red said:
While I agree, I do also think with the right setup it can work (as Luis Enrique is showing). They use 3 extremely talented all rounders basically in midfield every time, rather than having more specialist "6", "8" or "10". I think Mainoo falls into this boat as well where you could have Mainoo next to Mateus Fernandes, but also Elliot Anderson falls into this as well. You could have that trio together, but Bruno with 2 of them probably means you are too attacking unless Bruno plays more reserved (which he can do of course).

Basically in a 4231, he would compete with Mainoo for a spot next to a 6, behind Bruno. In a 433, you could make 3 of them work where you do something like Mainoo, Fernandes and Anderson, Wharton or Scott, with the right type of coaching (Luis Enrique type, which is also rare, but anyway).
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We need to have 4 options for the 2 in a 4231 and we should be rotating the options. It would be ideal to have a quality option to rotate with Mainoo and also be able to play alongside each other. Having versatile options rotating would only make us a stronger outfit and ensure we don't have these scenarios of 1 injury giving us an excuse to perform like a relegation team.

Mainoo is very young and still learning, he doesn't need to start every game and he will know that. My ideal is the way Fergie would rotate options pretty regularly and everyone would feel important and be ready to contribute as opposed to randomly chucking Zirkzee and Malacia into the fray after not playing for months/years.
 
ericcovicc said:
It seems that João Gomes also didn’t have a release clause, yet Atlético still paid €45 million for him.
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From what I've read, he's taking a 50% pay cut if they get relegated. So his agent should have negotiated an out for him, as that's a drastic amount of wages vanishing.
 
West Ham bought him for 42m and we think we're just going to cruise in and poach him on the cheap.
Love the redcafe optimism.
 
bosnian_red said:
While I agree, I do also think with the right setup it can work (as Luis Enrique is showing). They use 3 extremely talented all rounders basically in midfield every time, rather than having more specialist "6", "8" or "10". I think Mainoo falls into this boat as well where you could have Mainoo next to Mateus Fernandes, but also Elliot Anderson falls into this as well. You could have that trio together, but Bruno with 2 of them probably means you are too attacking unless Bruno plays more reserved (which he can do of course).

Basically in a 4231, he would compete with Mainoo for a spot next to a 6, behind Bruno. In a 433, you could make 3 of them work where you do something like Mainoo, Fernandes and Anderson, Wharton or Scott, with the right type of coaching (Luis Enrique type, which is also rare, but anyway).
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That's not a new concept. SAF used it as well we won our last CL with Carrick and Scholes in CM. His line of thought was that a 6 does little to help when the team has ball possession which is something Manchester United at his time had for most of the time. However the only way it works is to keep in mind that balance is everything. If a given player doesn't provide a certain skillset then someone, somewhere must provide it on their behalf. To use SAF's 3rd CL side as an example we won the CL with Carrick-Scholes in midfield and an amazing but not hardworking Ronaldo. However we compensated to that by adding work horses such as Rooney, Tevez and Park to the mix.

Back to present time. Our defense is slow. We got two very promising fast CBs in Heaven and Yoro but they are for the future and they won't keep Martinez, Maguire or De Ligt on the bench due to seniority and the fact that neither Yoro nor Heaven are good in air (so either Maguire or De Ligt will play). So unless we add a fast/amazing CB whose also good in air then don't expect loads of support from the defense in helping CM out.

In midfield we're set to lose Casemiro which will make us more vulnerable to aerial duels + we're losing that experience anchor in CM who could ground CM. Mainoo isn't very mobile, his defensive contribution ain't great and he's not the strongest. Mateus is good for an 8 but at 5ft10 he's not the biggest and is yet transitioning into a deeper role and Bruno is amazing when releasing forward. A Mateus-Mainoo CM might work against a smaller side playing low block. A stronger side would rip us into shreds.

A no 6 is therefore a must in a team with Mateus in it. Tchouameni would be amazing as he's a traditional 6 with elite passing ability. Put him, Mateus/Mainoo and Bruno in CM and we'll have a very balanced and elite CM. Berge is a cheaper option. He's not as elite as the French guy but he'll inject experience, height and calmness in CM. Once Bruno leaves a CM of Tchouameni/Berge, Mateus and Mainoo would be amazing as well. It would lack goals but by that time we'd sort the forward line (+ Sesko will be older)

As hinted in the previous paragraph that doesn't mean we shouldn't sign Mateus. There's enough games for Mainoo and Mateus to get their share of games. All I am saying is that if we're taking that option then the two must be aware that they'll be competing for the same position at least until Bruno leaves.
 
Sandikan said:
West Ham bought him for 42m and we think we're just going to cruise in and poach him on the cheap.
Love the redcafe optimism.
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Yeah, I don't think its a guarantee that they sell him at all and if they do it won't be on the cheap.

Sometimes when relatively big clubs go down they just don't sell many players (Fulham sold almost nobody when they last went down) or they sell some older players but convince highly touted young players to stay by promising that they'll invest heavily to go right back up and if they don't then the player can move the following year. Recent examples include Summerville at Leeds, Dewsbury-Hall at Leicester, and a bunch of others I can't remember. Fernandez is more highly regarded but there's no rule that they need to sell him and if they're prioritizing players for sales then they will first be trying to sell guys like Bowen, Todibo, and Mavropanos who have genuine PL markets.
 
On the positive side (for us, not them), their finances are apparently pretty perilous. A factor in Brady going.

On the negative side, there’ll be a lot of clubs interested. Hopefully he has a relegation release clause and picks us.
 
Wrecking ralf said:
Is it just me that thinks Fernandes is a better player than Anderson?
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Very similar level at the moment but Anderson is English so will naturally be overhyped. Seen him have a few stinkers but yet to see one from Fernandes. Think Mateus is potentially the better player longterm.
 
He very well might become a better player. Nobody knows. But Anderson is a more sure bet right now. I don't see much risks around Anderson. Except price. He is or at least will be a very good player. Fernandes floor is maybe a little lower. But I believe in him.
 
Stobzilla said:
Nope. I appreciate Anderson's qualities but I like Fernandes more.
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Big Ron’s Coat said:
Very similar level at the moment but Anderson is English so will naturally be overhyped. Seen him have a few stinkers but yet to see one from Fernandes. Think Mateus is potentially the better player longterm.
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Thanks guys. I think the point of Anderson being English is 100% a reason why he's being hyped up so much. Put both in a top 3 club during a big game though, I think only Fernandes flourishes and makes an impact. Anderson is a good player yes, but he's not 80-100mil good. I see the right mentality in Fernandes though to thrive under the pressure of a top club move. That's a key attribute for any midfielder coming to Utd.
 
Wrecking ralf said:
Is it just me that thinks Fernandes is a better player than Anderson?
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Nope. Anderson has the attributes more appreciated in the PL, high energy, drives forwards etc.However on a technical level, I think Fernandes will end up the superior player in the long run. Fernandes seems better in tighter spaces. That's just an opinion.

Fernandes has been linked with PSG and Luis Campos (best DoF in world football) really has an eye for talent. So those of us who prefer Fernandes are in good company.
 
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