Matic dropping into defence

hubbuh

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I really think it is as simple as Matic avoiding the midfield pressure, and not having the legs to get around the pitch.
Yeah, it's a lot easier to just drop and receive the ball in the last line of defence than it is to actually do the job of a CM which requires a lot more effort and combativeness. But that's basically become Matic's game, so it was either a tactical decision which makes no fecking sense, or Ole naively thought Matic wouldn't drop deep which makes no fecking sense. Matic is a bit useful when we want to run the clock down and bring a bit of nous in there to see a game out, but he can't start in the vast majority of games anymore.
 

Adam-Utd

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We essentially played with 3 centre backs yesterday. No idea why Ole didnt put Tuanzebe out at half time and pulled Matic back completely. It wasn't like they were attacking us anyway and we could have used that extra man in midfield or up front.
That's exactly what I expected - thought Cavani would be on at HT and push Bruno a bit deeper with Pogba, proper go for it.

Ole was far too slow with his subs.
 

MadDogg

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matic drops back, invariably towards the left which enables Shaw/Telles to push up effectively playing as a winger which then enables Rashford more space. Throw Bruno into that area of the pitch supported by Pogba and Martial and we start to have our most dangerous players in the same vicinity and subsequently making things happen.
Shaw gets forward plenty when Fred and/or McTominay are in there instead though. They both still drop into the defence when needed, but nowhere near as much as Matic does.

In saying that, I didn't feel he dropped into the defence as much today as what he has in quite a few other games this season. Still more than the others normally would, but I can't say I noticed Pogba being completely alone as often. I felt it was more just that Matic was poor in general.
 

arnie_ni

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Bump..

Everytime he plays he does this and its maddening.

why isn't ole roaring at him to play higher up.
 
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11101

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Every time. We've been saying it since Mourinho was here. If Matic plays in the PL in midfield it's like we are a man down. It doesn't matter who he plays with, they have to do the job of two players.
 

Giant Midget

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It’s alright, it’s not like we have an inconsistent, technical dodgy midfielder as his partner who will struggle by himself.

The way Matic drops and then takes a few touches to slows down the game and passes to our CBs, can anyone else do that? He’s making Southampton play at his pace, running the game with each play. Fantastic.
 

Shinjch

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He is such a burden to the team any time that he plays. Can't understand why he is ever picked, let alone against a pressing team.
 

MadDogg

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That first half was absolutely atrocious. Normally he's bad at it, but I don't think I've ever seen him as bad as he was tonight. Time after time after bloody time he just ran straight out of his position to randomly position himself in the defence when we had the ball and were trying to play it out, and then we wonder why we find it more difficult to find someone when we are literally playing with a man down. We may as well be playing with 10 men most of the time he does it.

Second half he was a bit better at keeping his position and we did play better. Well, until we took Fred off and completely surrendered the midfield and let Southampton control the match.
 

Garethw

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Blame the manager. Matic does it every fecking game. It’s obviously an instruction from our negative manager.
 

Raoul

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Liked him in his first year as he was still in pretty good form, but he's become increasingly pointless these days and frankly its infuriating to see him anywhere in the team sheet, much less on the pitch.
 

Ollie Derbyshire

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We should only use him in an injury crisis, as bad as Fred was Matic was worse for me, offered nothing but slowing the game down to a walking pace every time.
 

PoTMS

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He should be dropping all the way down to the bench. Better yet, just leave him out of the squad.
 

Foxbatt

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The puzzling issue is that why does he drop into central defense? Neither Fred nor do McTominay when they play?
Sometimes he was dropping into left back. If it's a way we play then I would understand. But non of the other midfield players do that.
 

sullydnl

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The puzzling issue is that why does he drop into central defense? Neither Fred nor do McTominay when they play?
Sometimes he was dropping into left back. If it's a way we play then I would understand. But non of the other midfield players do that.
They did in quite a few games last season. It's obviously an instruction, just one that applies more regularly to Matic when he plays.
 

noodlehair

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The problem is our manager is too dumb to see it.

If he can't recognise a problem as obvious as this, against a pressing team, where it is also obvious that it will be an even bigger problem, and after having made the same mistake, against the same team, in the recent past, then there is no hope of him ever noticing anything really.

The only reasonable explanation at this point is that Ole is completely oblivious, which makes you wonder what he isn't oblivious to because it is very clear to anyone who spends any time watching United
 

noodlehair

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They did in quite a few games last season. It's obviously an instruction, just one that applies more regularly to Matic when he plays.
He does it because he is too slow and doesn't want to risk opposition midfielders running past him (in that it isn't a risk it would just clearly happen).

It then means we don't have a midfield so if we play Matic we have to set up on the break and just not press teams. Except we don't do that either because ole doesn't seem to recognise it is happening.

So I don't think it is tactical because if it is it's a self destructive tactic
 

MadDogg

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They did in quite a few games last season. It's obviously an instruction, just one that applies more regularly to Matic when he plays.
All midfielders will drop into the defence at times. Fred does it, Scott does it, even Pogba does it when he plays in midfield. Carrick used to do it, so did Scholes.

The difference is that they will drop into defence when the time is right or when a defender has actually pushed forward. Off the top of my head I can't think of any other midfielder I've ever seen who does it for completely no reason as much as Matic does. It's basically his default action. We get the ball, he drops into the backline, we're suddenly a man down in advanced areas which makes it that much easier for the opposition to get close to every other player. Especially the one midfielder we have actually playing.
 

Ace of Spades

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The problem is he does it too much, as he has no confidence to have the ability to receive the ball in tight spaces.
 

SAFMUTD

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It's tactical, I think Ole instructs him to do it so we play a back 5 kind of formation when in possession, it doesn't work. But there's no other explanation for it.

If Matic is doing it by choice and not instruction there's no way Ole wouldnt have call it off. Must be a, really poor, coaching instruction.
 

Borys

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It's tactical, I think Ole instructs him to do it so we play a back 5 kind of formation when in possession, it doesn't work. But there's no other explanation for it.

If Matic is doing it by choice and not instruction there's no way Ole wouldnt have call it off. Must be a, really poor, coaching instruction.
That is my view as well. Bizarre. He's so unpredictable too, sitting deep, then dribbling through midfield the next minute. It feels like a surprise for opponents but also for his team mates.
 

arnie_ni

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It would be ok (just ok) if pogba was then instructed to slide into mf to help out Fred and then Shaw and awb push way up wide to supply width, but the whole team doesn't react to it for me to believe it is a pre discussed and agreed tactic.

You can't just have one player doing some tactical decision and not have everyone else coached on how to react to it.
 

Bwuk

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It’s clearly tactical otherwise he wouldn’t be getting picked if he kept doing it.

If I was at CB I’d hate him doing it. Stops them pushing forward.
 

Mcking

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It's tactical, I think Ole instructs him to do it so we play a back 5 kind of formation when in possession, it doesn't work. But there's no other explanation for it.

If Matic is doing it by choice and not instruction there's no way Ole wouldnt have call it off. Must be a, really poor, coaching instruction.
It is the opposite I think. He does it under no one's instructions in other to avoid the midfield pressure, and Ole is completely oblivious to it and to it's implications.

Matic was the problem today. He was continually stepping on Maguire and Lindelof's toes, getting in their way when we had the ball, and leaving Fred isolated in midfied, meaning we couldn't build. If we started Mctominay with Fred, I'm convinced we'd have performed so much better.
 

Sandikan

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Do people really think Matic is dropping into defence totally off his own back, and to take a breather? :lol:

We have some truly dreadful internet fans.
 

Mcking

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You don't think him getting on the ball deeper may just be tactics?
It could be, but in this case, I don't think it is. Players on the field do move where they feel more comfortable without any particular instructions for them to be doing so, and I think moving away from midfield and dropping into the defensive line is what makes Matic comfortable.
 

Green_Red

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It's hard to know who the blame, him for not being up to the task, or Ole for continuing to play him when we have other options.
 

FreakyJim

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The problem is our manager is too dumb to see it.

If he can't recognise a problem as obvious as this, against a pressing team, where it is also obvious that it will be an even bigger problem, and after having made the same mistake, against the same team, in the recent past, then there is no hope of him ever noticing anything really.

The only reasonable explanation at this point is that Ole is completely oblivious, which makes you wonder what he isn't oblivious to because it is very clear to anyone who spends any time watching United
He's not a coach, apparently. So I'm not sure what he does and doesn't notice. Makes you wonder indeed.
 

SAFMUTD

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It is the opposite I think. He does it under no one's instructions in other to avoid the midfield pressure, and Ole is completely oblivious to it and to it's implications.

Matic was the problem today. He was continually stepping on Maguire and Lindelof's toes, getting in their way when we had the ball, and leaving Fred isolated in midfied, meaning we couldn't build. If we started Mctominay with Fred, I'm convinced we'd have performed so much better.
It's way too obvious for Ole to not see it, it's not that Matic falls a little deep I mean he literally is on the same line as the CBs.

Anyway it doesn't look good for Ole either way, instructed or not.