[VP89]

I'm saying social habits are absolutely not just about footballers on who are on the edge of the squad. The shopping in London was my poor attempt at irony as this too is a social habit which never went done to well with SAF and Becks especially as he wasn't transparent about it.

I'm not sure about his level, as I'm not about most young players in general. I can think of more young players that didn't forfil their potential than did. No crystal ball and I'll challenge anyone who thought we would 4 years later sign Pogba for 95m more than we sold him? We bought a lad who was the best player in Germany that came into a winning side, and couldn't do it. We signed the best player at Real who couldn't do it. We've signed again the voted best player in Germany who took half the season before coming through. Another Argentinian international who played in WC final only now after 2 seasons seeing some potential. A lad from the north held up by SAF as potentially one of the best players to but on a Utd shirt, only now seeing his potential after a run of games. That's just to name but a few...

Memphis may or may not be good enough but I've not seen him consistently playing enough to know. Jose has already said that the pressures to win games means even Martial is going to struggle was there is players that are playing better in front of him. Rashford is in the same camp

SAF and Becks was in a completely different era to football today, so its unfair to compare.

WRT to your comparisons of Depay to other targets, there is a fair bit wrong in it. Pogba was tipped to be a future world class talent before he left for Juve (there was a fair bit of outrage when SAF let him slip). Mkhitaryan is making it here and would have earlier if not for injuries. Di Maria was not the best player at Real - he was terribly overrated by the caf and only had one good season with the club as a standout talent.

Memphis simply isn't good enough, there are no two ways about it. He's had multiple chances here and failed to show any consistency. He's a 3 trick pony, revolving mainly around cutting in side and shooting on his favoured foot. It got found out quickly in the Premier League and he has little else to offer.

In the case of Martial you can at least point to his 17 goals last season and the fact that he hasn't had a terrible season as of yet. In the case of Rashford you can be reminded he's 19 and playing out of position. With Memphis there is literally nothing to excuse him for. He's been very poor for us.

 

[Litch]

SAF and Becks was in a completely different era to football today, so its unfair to compare.

WRT to your comparisons of Depay to other targets, there is a fair bit wrong in it. Pogba was tipped to be a future world class talent before he left for Juve (there was a fair bit of outrage when SAF let him slip). Mkhitaryan is making it here and would have earlier if not for injuries. Di Maria was not the best player at Real - he was terribly overrated by the caf and only had one good season with the club as a standout talent.

Memphis simply isn't good enough, there are no two ways about it. He's had multiple chances here and failed to show any consistency. He's a 3 trick pony, revolving mainly around cutting in side and shooting on his favoured foot. It got found out quickly in the Premier League and he has little else to offer.

In the case of Martial you can at least point to his 17 goals last season and the fact that he hasn't had a terrible season as of yet. In the case of Rashford you can be reminded he's 19 and playing out of position. With Memphis there is literally nothing to excuse him for. He's been very poor for us.

Sorry but in football we are forever comparing players from different eras fair or not.

Sorry whether Pogba was tipped or not, still didn't stop a retired player or defender playing in front of him in midfield and that in principal why he left as his development was being hindered and he was proven to be right as we then had to pay 96m to get him back. Surely that's about the biggest example in the history of football that young players need to play and you need to trust in your assessment of why you played 26m in the first place for Memphis.

In fact wasnt Memphis tipped to be world class. What's the difference as Pogba didn't show anything in his limited 1st team appearances.

Sorry Jose never played Miki even when fit and that's why we thought he was history.

Sorry when we signed Di Maria he was the best player at Real and CAF didn't sign the 75m cheque for him. Not many on here or in the media thought it was a poor signing.

Memphis has a very limited football, and cutting in is pretty much Martial game and it didn't hurt Henrys either.

Yep, Martial score 17 last season but struggled so far this one. Struggled at the WC too having very limited game time. International manager not been too complimentary either. Sound familiar. Which is the true Martial, last season or this one. How's he done so far coming off the bench? What about some of the comments coming out of the media. How about the stuff in his personal life? Sound familiar?

Rashford has equally got the potential but nothing like the impact last season but he's young. How old is Memphis?

Like I said, young players are all about potential but they need to play regularly to grow and not only play when they are playing well. You learn more when your not, then when you are.

Football is all going the same way, and the pressure to win means we want proven 27 year old players. Utd are going the same way and I predict we may never have the patience to see the lad at Sunderland or the lad currently in Spain, and maybe even Martial or Rashford as when are they going to play regularly and then consistently? I love Ibra but there's no doubt in my mind he's hurting Rashford and Martial's development. This then has a domino effect as they move to the right or left so they are now competing with Mata and Miki....how realistically are any of those young players gonna break through? 2 years on maybe but who's to say we aren't signing a Bale et al by then.

Anyone who thinks it a Memphis isssue is short sighted as it's bigger than that and if you are a 21 year old future star, you might think differently about signing for us.

 

[VP89]

Sorry but in football we are forever comparing players from different eras fair or not.

No, we aren't.

In fact wasnt Memphis tipped to be world class. What's the difference as Pogba didn't show anything in his limited 1st team appearances.

Pogba hardly got any appearances for us. He just got 3 off the bench and was a great talent for the future. Memphis came in further ahead in his career and bombed.

Sorry Jose never played Miki even when fit and that's why we thought he was history.

He started playing him again about a month ago, which makes your point completely moot.

Sorry when we signed Di Maria he was the best player at Real and CAF didn't sign the 75m cheque for him. Not many on here or in the media thought it was a poor signing.

No one said he was a poor signing (on paper). He just wasn't the best player for Real Madrid and was overhyped.

Yep, Martial score 17 last season but struggled so far this one. Struggled at the WC too having very limited game time. International manager not been too complimentary either. Sound familiar. Which is the true Martial, last season or this one. How's he done so far coming off the bench? What about some of the comments coming out of the media. How about the stuff in his personal life? Sound familiar?

There is the key word - struggled. Martial is struggling but Depay was dogshit for a whole year. There is a difference, the latter doesn't cut it and has never shown to cut it in England. Martial has.

Rashford has equally got the potential but nothing like the impact last season but he's young. How old is Memphis?

He's 3 years older than Rashford and played in his best position for us since he joined - and he's still been dogshit.

I didn't read beyond the above. You've swayed off whatever your root point was but I'll repeat mine: Memphis isn't good enough for Manchester United and he's midtable quality.

 

[soad]

What if we don't sell him in January? Do you think Jose's going to give him another chance? Mou have said it numerous times that Memphis is a good player but we have many others playing in his position and he doesn't take him in the group for some of the games (Schneiderlin too) becuase he expects to sell him.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

What if we don't sell him in January? Do you think Jose's going to give him another chance?

Yes.

 

[NinjaZombie]

Yes.

Unless we go through some horrific injuries, I don't see where he'll get the minutes from.

 

[rockerlad]

£13m bid rejected

 

[ghagua]

Very surprised that there are no Premier league teams bidding for him. He can be a really good player under the right system. A team like Spur's or Everton should be all over him.

 

[Stacks]

Very surprised that there are no Premier league teams bidding for him. He can be a really good player under the right system. A team like Spur's or Everton should be all over him.

@GlastonSpur

Even I will admit, this is amusing. Spurs are above us in the league and are title challengers. Why would Memphis be ideal for a title challenging team, yet he has shown he isn't effective at premiership level? Also if Premier league sides aren't that interested, that could be a sign.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Very surprised that there are no Premier league teams bidding for him. He can be a really good player under the right system. A team like Spur's or Everton should be all over him.

So who do you suggest he'd replace in our starting XI?

 

[ghagua]

@GlastonSpur

Even I will admit, this is amusing. Spurs are above us in the league and are title challengers. Why would Memphis be ideal for a title challenging team, yet he has shown he isn't effective at premiership level? Also if Premier league sides aren't that interested, that could be a sign.

Try reading it again, it's not that hard "Under the right system"

 

[ghagua]

So who do you suggest he'd replace in our starting XI?

Take your pick of any player other than Kane and Alli. It's not like you're winning anything with the ones you have now. Remember last season? you lot were about to win the league, but look where you ended up finishing.

 

[K2K]

He's not good enough for Spurs. Not even remotely.

For once I actually agree.He'd struggle to make it to their bench.

 

[Varun]

Yeah, odd to suggest he'd make the Spurs 11. He's just not good enough.

 

[U99ted]

Take your pick of any player other than Kane and Alli. It's not like you're winning anything with the ones you have now. Remember last season? you lot were about to win the league, but look where you ended up finishing.

They could have done with both Premier League goals Depay scored last season.

 

[GlastonSpur]

Take your pick of any player other than Kane and Alli. It's not like you're winning anything with the ones you have now. Remember last season? you lot were about to win the league, but look where you ended up finishing.

With Lamela still not available, the attacking players who most often start (with Kane and Alli) are Son and Eriksen.

It's silly to suggest that Depay would displace either.

 

[Dec9003]

If anyone actually watches Memphis for Holland you'd see there's a good player there somewhere. The problem is there is no way he will get minutes here to show it and he doesn't deserve them now really. If he went to Spurs I could see Poch making something out of him, but I don't see why Spurs would want to do Memphis any favours. If he leaves it won't be to one of the better premier league teams.

 

[VorZakone]

If anyone actually watches Memphis for Holland you'd see there's a good player there somewhere. The problem is there is no way he will get minutes here to show it and he doesn't deserve them now really. If he went to Spurs I could see Poch making something out of him, but I don't see why Spurs would want to do Memphis any favours. If he leaves it won't be to one of the better premier league teams.

Actually, Memphis has been underwhelming for a while now in the Dutch team. Not the same Memphis anymore as against Spain or the 2014 WC.

 

[Dec9003]

Actually, Memphis has been underwhelming for a while now in the Dutch team. Not the same Memphis anymore as against Spain or the 2014 WC.

The Dutch team in general is pretty underwhelming at the minute, but whenever I watch him play for them I generally think he does alright and see potential in him.

 

[Adisa]

If anyone actually watches Memphis for Holland you'd see there's a good player there somewhere. The problem is there is no way he will get minutes here to show it and he doesn't deserve them now really. If he went to Spurs I could see Poch making something out of him, but I don't see why Spurs would want to do Memphis any favours. If he leaves it won't be to one of the better premier league teams.

He's shite for Holland as well.

 

[Dec9003]

He's shite for Holland as well.

You watch Holland often?

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

If he goes, then I want him to stay in England.

 

[Litch]

It's always the same in football, who's the real player? The one that came or the one who's we see now? I read the crap about coming from a lesser league....but this is the same league that's produced some of the best players in the world.

There have also been older and more experienced players that have not worked here, and that will continue. There also be players that start well but don't live up to there potential. Damian looked superb when he first came.

I think there's a player in there but playing at big clubs is as much as having the right mentality. The pressure of wearing this shirt weighs heavy for some but easier for others. Also it's not like he came into a club that was winning things and playing attacking football. Yep, I know Martial came at the same time'ish but his ceiling is higher and price tag reflects that.

Never quite understand why people on here are so negative about players that we have signed that turn out not to be good enough. Let's just wish him well and move on....

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Well put @Wilson Litchmore

 

[Nighteyes]

All this lack of mentality thing is a load of intangible nonsense. If anything, one thing he's never looked to have lacked is confidence. His problem is quite blatantly a severe lack of lack of talent to play for a club as big as United. There's nothing wrong with it either. But all this talk of mentality, attitude, the system, the manager, the position is a just a load of gibberish. Sometimes it's really as simple as a player not being good enough. You saw the same with Schneiderlin as well. People bending over to try and blame anyone but the player himself.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

All this lack of mentality thing is a load of intangible nonsense. If anything, one thing he's never looked to have lacked is confidence. His problem is quite blatantly a severe lack of lack of talent to play for a club as big as United. There's nothing wrong with it either. But all this talk of mentality, attitude, the system, the manager, the position is a just a load of gibberish. Sometimes it's really as simple as a player not being good enough. You saw the same with Schneiderlin as well. People bending over to try and blame anyone but the player himself.

He obviously has only himself to blame but I disagree on the confidence thing, he looked a different player in PSV and he first few matches for United, but after THAT Stoke mistake, everything about the way he looked, acted and played on the pitch looked very different indeed.

 

[Nighteyes]

He obviously has only himself to blame but I disagree on the confidence thing, he looked a different player in PSV and he first few matches for United, but after THAT Stoke mistake, everything about the way he looked, acted and played on the pitch looked very different indeed.

Not really. Revisionism at its finest.

He was crap long before Stoke. He always had confidence as shown when we played rubbish. At which point would chime up on how he's a confidence player.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Not really. Revisionism at its finest.

He was crap long before Stoke. He always had confidence as shown when we played rubbish. At which point would chime up on how he's a confidence player.

Sure mate if you wanna believe that it's purely revisionism, as I say, he's only got himself to blame here.

 

[TwoSheds]

Not really. Revisionism at its finest.

He was crap long before Stoke. He always had confidence as shown when we played rubbish. At which point would chime up on how he's a confidence player.

I agree that he never had more than one good game in a row that I can think of. However, I do think he lacks confidence even though he's brave. He tries spectacular stuff and it gets read as confidence. For me it's him trying to kickstart himself a bit. You can see he really beats himself up when he lets fly and misses or whatever and thereafter his head drops. I really like the lad actually, particularly how brave he is in always wanting the ball, but I think ultimately he lacks a bit of pace to be a Prem winger and perhaps doesn't have the bottle for the very top.

I think he's one of those players who's no chance of success at a big club but when he goes to a mid table team might be able to play his way to the top. I think a Payet style career trajectory is quite likely if he gets a decent move away from us.

 

[Nighteyes]

I agree that he never had more than one good game in a row that I can think of. However, I do think he lacks confidence even though he's brave. He tries spectacular stuff and it gets read as confidence. For me it's him trying to kickstart himself a bit. You can see he really beats himself up when he lets fly and misses or whatever and thereafter his head drops. I really like the lad actually, particularly how brave he is in always wanting the ball, but I think ultimately he lacks a bit of pace to be a Prem winger and perhaps doesn't have the bottle for the very top.

I think he's one of those players who's no chance of success at a big club but when he goes to a mid table team might be able to play his way to the top. I think a Payet style career trajectory is quite likely if he gets a decent move away from us.

So, how do you know he lacks confidence then? Nothing about his actual demeanour suggests a lack of confidence on the pitch. Just a lack of talent. He'll be a decent mid table player probably where you can get away with the odd moment of brilliance.

As a comparison he's not even as good as someone like Bolasie who himself is not good enough for a top 7 team.

 

[MD7]

He's shite for Holland as well.

No he isn't... He was last year, but this year he's been actually playing quite well for the Netherlands. Most of the time one of the 3 best players on the pitch, and against Luxembourg he was just the best one. We really haven't giving him enough games this season, because I'm actually 100% sure he would have done very well this season if he was given the amount of time LVG gave him last season. Not that it matters anymore, he's being sold.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

So, how do you know he lacks confidence then? Nothing about his actual demeanour suggests a lack of confidence on the pitch.

Well some disagree @Akash, why are you struggling with that? For me it's obvious that there was a different demeanour to him at the start than there was post-Stoke.

 

[TwoSheds]

So, how do you know he lacks confidence then? Nothing about his actual demeanour suggests a lack of confidence on the pitch. Just a lack of talent. He'll be a decent mid table player probably where you can get away with the odd moment of brilliance.

As a comparison he's not even as good as someone like Bolasie who himself is not good enough for a top 7 team.

I don't know he lacks confidence, I'm just reading his body language

 

[Nighteyes]

Well some disagree @Akash, why are you struggling with that? For me it's obvious that there was a different demeanour to him at the start than there was post-Stoke.

Struggling with what? If you want to indulge in revisionism and forget all his poor games prior to that I'll leave you to it. And you do realize I hope that you dont need to @ me after you've already quoted my post.

I don't know he lacks confidence, I'm just reading his body language

Well body language reading is complete guess work at the best of times but one would think a lack of confidence would lead to him hiding in games and or not trying to make things happen which you can can't really accuse him of. The fact that his performance levels picked up when we played rubbish suggests that it wasn't really a confidence issue.

Regardless, confidence or no confidence he lacked the ability which was his undoing. There's no real incentive for any manager to stick with him at United.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Struggling with what? If you want to indulge in revisionism and forget all his poor games prior to that I'll leave you to it.

Hang on... when did I say he didn't have any poor games before Stoke @Akash

 

[TwoSheds]

Struggling with what? If you want to indulge in revisionism and forget all his poor games prior to that I'll leave you to it. And you do realize I hope that you dont need to @ me after you've already quoted my post.



Well body language reading is complete guess work at the best of times but one would think a lack of confidence would lead to him hiding in games and or not trying to make things happen which you can can't really accuse him of. The fact that his performance levels picked up when we played rubbish suggests that it wasn't really a confidence issue.

Regardless, confidence or no confidence he lacked the ability which was his undoing. There's no real incentive for any manager to stick with him at United.

I wouldn't think that at all actually but thanks for your input.

 

[Stacks]

No he isn't... He was last year, but this year he's been actually playing quite well for the Netherlands. Most of the time one of the 3 best players on the pitch, and against Luxembourg he was just the best one. We really haven't giving him enough games this season, because I'm actually 100% sure he would have done very well this season if he was given the amount of time LVG gave him last season. Not that it matters anymore, he's being sold.

I'm going to borrow your powers of premonition

 

[Nickosaur]

No he isn't... He was last year, but this year he's been actually playing quite well for the Netherlands. Most of the time one of the 3 best players on the pitch, and against Luxembourg he was just the best one. We really haven't giving him enough games this season, because I'm actually 100% sure he would have done very well this season if he was given the amount of time LVG gave him last season. Not that it matters anymore, he's being sold.

Man. If only he could play Luxembourg and Midtjylland every week.

 

[attack attack]

Bye. Thanks for the couple of good Europa cup performances.