MEN: Fred identifies Manchester United's biggest problem this season

JPRouve

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If you can provide quotes that would be great.

The following quotes I have are as follows:

Deschamps - “Another is that he arrived at the World Cup really prepared and he took on the mantle of leadership, on and off the pitch. He became a bit of a spokesman for the team and he can do that because he’s a good speaker"

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/paul-pogba-puts-the-team-first-and-is-a-born-leader-claims-didier-deschamps-37345878.html

Matuidi - "He is a leader of the game and also a leader outside. When he expresses himself, I can tell you that he is being listened to"

Pavard - "He is a true leader. He is very important for the group".

https://www.goal.com/en-bh/news/pogba-a-natural-leader-for-france-matuidi/cacaax6j1vn11vippm0z78rpo

Mbappe - “He’s important. He’s a great player, and great players are always leaders. Wherever we go, he leads everyone, and you feel like following him too.”

https://ronaldo.com/football-news/mbappe-hails-pogbas-leadership-skills/
As I said Pogba is a different type of leader, I didn't say that he wasn't a leader but the type of leader that I described, he is the "bring everyone together" type not the "set the rule" "give instructions" type and for example the Pavard quote, the journalist first asked if Pogba was a leader and he gave the answer that you quoted, he also gave the example of Pogba giving players confidence by for example telling them that he believes in them. That's the type of leadership that he has and if you read my post again I made the distinction between two type of leadership.

Pogba particularly grew into that role which is mentioned in all the quotes that you quoted and was kind of a surprise. At the end of the day France is the perfect example of the different type of leadership that you need from Lloris, Varane,
Griezmann, Mandanda, Matuidi and now Pogba, they are all different, Griezmann for example is supposed to be insufferable on the training pitch bossing people around while Pogba tries to give confidence to everyone.

In fact Pogba said it as well as I could, there isn't a clear leader for France, he used Evra as an example of a player that had that role, instead there is a group of leaders and he mentioned Lloris, Mandanda and Matuidi as the ones during the World cup, earlier he mentioned Varane and Griezmann if I remember correctly.
 

Class of 63

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Oh so you've seen the interview that was never released??
You don't have to have seen it to come to that conclusion, Roy has often talked about it as only Roy can, as have two of those on the 'receiving end' Darren Fletcher and Kieran Richardson, the sentiment is fine and the players didn't have a problem with it, but it wasn't suitable for MUTV and was rightly pulled.
 

JPRouve

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You don't have to have seen it to come to that conclusion, Roy has often talked about it as only Roy can, as have two of those on the 'receiving end' Darren Fletcher and Kieran Richardson, the sentiment is fine and the players didn't have a problem with it, but it wasn't suitable for MUTV and was rightly pulled.
Neville said that the players didn't had a particular issue with what Keane said and that his interview after the Bayern game in 2001 was worse.
 
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You don't have to have seen it to come to that conclusion, Roy has often talked about it as only Roy can, as have two of those on the 'receiving end' Darren Fletcher and Kieran Richardson, the sentiment is fine and the players didn't have a problem with it, but it wasn't suitable for MUTV and was rightly pulled.
I was responding to you said Keane was a 'ranting lunatic'. When you haven't even seen the footage...

Which accounts from Gary Neville and other players suggests isn't true. Keane was calling players out for not playing to United standards, having been battered by Middlesbrough, rightly so.

The resulting arguement with Ferguson and Querios, was what broke the already strained relationship and why Keane got fired.
 

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Neville said that the players didn't had a particular issue with what Keane said and that his interview after the Bayern game in 2001 was worse.
99% of what Roy said was bang on the money, but there's a time and place, and what's said post match when emotions are running high is different.
 

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I was responding to you said Keane was a 'ranting lunatic'. When you haven't even seen the footage...

Which accounts from Gary Neville and other players suggests isn't true. Keane was calling players out for not playing to United standards, having been battered by Middlesbrough, rightly so.

The resulting arguement with Ferguson and Querios, was what broke the already strained relationship and why Keane got fired.
We all know what Roy is like, he wouldn't have been half the player he was without it, but there's a reason the interview was pulled, if you or anybody else wants to think it was done to try and force Roy out, and he was finished at the top level by the way, fine.
 
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We all know what Roy is like, he wouldn't have been half the player he was without it, but there's a reason the interview was pulled, if you or anybody else wants to think it was done to try and force Roy out, and he was finished at the top level by the way, fine.
Hearing Roy, and Gary Neville talk in depth about it gives a year long back drop to the sacking and i'll just go off what they said.
 

Based Adnan

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Something I've long suspected and needs addressing but this kind of thing should be kept in house.
 

passing-wind

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Does everything to highlight how crap of a manager Solskjaer is. Team cohesion doesn't improve with individual quality, that's why Solskjaer will underachieve irrespective if he spends 300-500 million he's simply not good enough.
 

tenpoless

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Then there's this:

The first thing that popped in mind when I saw that number wasn't 1+8 = 9 but 18+. So I guess He didn't really do that well to get his point across, which made him look like He's dirty rather than idolizing the number 9. :rolleyes:
 

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I find it humerous that people are pointing the finger at Martial when you have feck heads like Jesse Lingard who fits that bill better than anybody running around at the Club. Ashley Young was another player (and wouldnt suprise me given his departure) who thought fell in that category.

In regards to Martial losing the no. 9. Martial's number was 9. He should have never had it taken away from him unless he was asked and said yes. It was pathetic man management by Mourinho and Zlatan should have taken any number he was given.
 

Sky1981

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As I said Pogba is a different type of leader, I didn't say that he wasn't a leader but the type of leader that I described, he is the "bring everyone together" type not the "set the rule" "give instructions" type and for example the Pavard quote, the journalist first asked if Pogba was a leader and he gave the answer that you quoted, he also gave the example of Pogba giving players confidence by for example telling them that he believes in them. That's the type of leadership that he has and if you read my post again I made the distinction between two type of leadership.

Pogba particularly grew into that role which is mentioned in all the quotes that you quoted and was kind of a surprise. At the end of the day France is the perfect example of the different type of leadership that you need from Lloris, Varane,
Griezmann, Mandanda, Matuidi and now Pogba, they are all different, Griezmann for example is supposed to be insufferable on the training pitch bossing people around while Pogba tries to give confidence to everyone.

In fact Pogba said it as well as I could, there isn't a clear leader for France, he used Evra as an example of a player that had that role, instead there is a group of leaders and he mentioned Lloris, Mandanda and Matuidi as the ones during the World cup, earlier he mentioned Varane and Griezmann if I remember correctly.
Pogba problem wasn't that he's not good enough, his problem is he doesn't see us as good enough.

The Pobga in Juventus / France NT would have us moving in the right direction. He has the charisma, the drive, the passion, the likeability of a superstar, just not for us.
 

kouroux

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Pogba problem wasn't that he's not good enough, his problem is he doesn't see us as good enough.

The Pobga in Juventus / France NT would have us moving in the right direction. He has the charisma, the drive, the passion, the likeability of a superstar, just not for us.
This isn't important at all IMHO
 

Tony247

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Serious? With our best two players out injured he's been by far our best player culminating in the player of the month award.
When Fred with his performance so far gets player of the month award then it is not a reflection on him, it is a reflection on the abysmal state of current squad.
 

McGrathsipan

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It could be something misinterpreted-deliberately-) by another click-bait journalist
if that heinous web page is anything to go by then yes its click bait. I actually struggled to find the article with all of the adds
 

Fluctuation0161

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I've always shared the opinions that what footballers do in the spare time has nothing to do with us as fans, as long as they are not putting the club in disrepute and they are performing on the pitch.

Reason Lingard gets more stick than say Mata, Pereira, etc, is because of his social media activity. Rashford doesn't get that abuse because he's been our best player this season.

Ronaldo is vain as feck, but works hard every day and produces. I have no problem with this.

P.S. They do look good, though! :cool:
Lingard does not produce. And he looks like an ediot.
 

RUCK4444

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When Fred with his performance so far gets player of the month award then it is not a reflection on him, it is a reflection on the abysmal state of current squad.
I get your general dim view of the squad however Fred has been excellent recently.

Slowly started to find his feet next to McTominay and has put in some excellent performances since then.

So frustrating we can never seem to have Fred, McTominay and Pogba fit and in form at the same time!
 

Tony247

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I get your general dim view of the squad however Fred has been excellent recently.

Slowly started to find his feet next to McTominay and has put in some excellent performances since then.

So frustrating we can never seem to have Fred, McTominay and Pogba fit and in form at the same time!
I do acknowledge he is doing better than before, which is good and welcome. Hope is keeps improving and makes meaningful contribution to the team.

I was being more general while criticising him. Manchester united's player of the month should be a shining star among rest of the prem league stars of that month. Not necessarliy THE brightest star, but should be there with the rest, such that the opposition managers should warn their team "look that guy is in form, keep an eye on him.. here is how...". I just honestly don't believe any prem manager will actually bother to have a plan for Man Utd's player of the month....Fred...yet.

Its not Fred's fault. The guy must be giving his best.
 

Craig Ward

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We've lacked togetherness for years, we've gone for the wrong type of signings for years and this is the result.

A disjointed bunch of misfits who lack the common aim of actually being part of a winning team.

Ole to his credit is trying to change not only the personnel in the squad, but the mindset and mentality of it.

I think Fred is right in what he's saying and its refreshing to hear. Fred is motivated to improve and wants the club to do well, and is probably frustrated as much as the fans with the attitude of players who dont share that vision.

Why i think Henderson will be our number 1 within a couple of seasons, his recent quotes about players attitude recently were good to hear.

My immediate thought of players here was: Martial/Lingard/Pogba but it doesnt matter really - Ole is culling who he doesnt want and good on him.
 

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Doesn't sit right with me. A player who is pressing for others to be creative yet shows no sign of it himself and gets credit on here for speaking his mind. How crazy is that?
 

lurkingfan

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Hope this doesnt come back to bite Fred, he is really sticking his neck out here with these comments.
 

wolvored

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I find it humerous that people are pointing the finger at Martial when you have feck heads like Jesse Lingard who fits that bill better than anybody running around at the Club. Ashley Young was another player (and wouldnt suprise me given his departure) who thought fell in that category.

In regards to Martial losing the no. 9. Martial's number was 9. He should have never had it taken away from him unless he was asked and said yes. It was pathetic man management by Mourinho and Zlatan should have taken any number he was given.
The manager decides the squad numbers at the start of the season, so if he wants to change someone's number he can. Sometimes a big name player will demand a certain number as one of the reasons to join a club. It is then down to the manager to agree with this request or not
 

M16Red

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so frustrating we can never seem to have Fred, McTominay and Pogba fit and in form at the same time!
I would have really enjoyed seeing that - really is a shame. It has a nice balance to it. Mcfred breaking up the attack and Pog powering forward.
 

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We've lacked togetherness for years, we've gone for the wrong type of signings for years and this is the result.

A disjointed bunch of misfits who lack the common aim of actually being part of a winning team.

I think Fred is right in what he's saying and its refreshing to hear. Fred is motivated to improve and wants the club to do well, and is probably frustrated as much as the fans with the attitude of players who dont share that vision.

Why i think Henderson will be our number 1 within a couple of seasons, his recent quotes about players attitude recently were good to hear.

My immediate thought of players here was: Martial/Lingard/Pogba but it doesnt matter really - Ole is culling who he doesnt want and good on him.
Shhhhh you have to whisper any form of praise around these parts.

I’m forming an underground group called the Enlightened-ones where we can share honest opinions about our manager without the fear of public lynching. I have a secret handshake and everything.
 

Eriku

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Shhhhh you have to whisper any form of praise around these parts.

I’m forming an underground group called the Enlightened-ones where we can share honest opinions about our manager without the fear of public lynching. I have a secret handshake and everything.
I want in on that group.

I don’t mind criticism of Ole, but the constant use of terms like "clueless", and the constant jabs against the supposed Ole cult, or oppo fans and Norwegians, it’s fecking wearing me down. You don’t tend to see that in stand-alone posts from Ole-in folks.
 

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Doesn't sit right with me. A player who is pressing for others to be creative yet shows no sign of it himself and gets credit on here for speaking his mind. How crazy is that?
Just because he can't live up to his own observations doesn't mean what he says isn't true.
 

Steerpike

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I've been tuning into Sky Sports News, and this article hasn't even been mentioned while I've been watching. I can't believe they would miss out on a chance of a 'turmoil at United' headline, so I think this is just another non-story.

For what it's worth, Fred's point regarding creativity is clear enough to see, and his comments about the team not all pulling in the same direction simply reflect the suspicions that I'm sure many of us already had. I don't blame the manager for this, but instead just see it as further evidence that this squad needs a major overhaul. We can all speculate on who Fred may have had in his sights with the 'vanity' comment, but the basic issue is that we can't build a successful and united team around players who don't want to be here.
 

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I want in on that group.

I don’t mind criticism of Ole, but the constant use of terms like "clueless", and the constant jabs against the supposed Ole cult, or oppo fans and Norwegians, it’s fecking wearing me down. You don’t tend to see that in stand-alone posts from Ole-in folks.
Yeah exactly. You will almost certainly find that most ‘Ole-In’ members here are very balanced in their view on things and if anything don’t particularly lavish any sort of praise on Ole.

Any positive opinion/view on anything is spun to be blind following of a club legend by the Ole-Out gang.

I mean we all loved Ole the player, but it’s Ole we are talking about, not exactly Cantona or Charlton ffs.
 

buckooo1978

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Fred probably telling us what we really know.... we are not a good group of players fighting for one another.... that was clearly evident in the last 10 games of last season when players couldn't give a feck

it has to be a sign too that Ole has no influence over the dressing room - the sooner he goes the better

I wonder how he will deal with Fred
 

SAFMUTD

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Eventhough is no surprise to anyone that we have a disjointed squad, the fact that Fred says it is pretty concerning. He is not one of the left out players, if favored out player like lets say Rojo said this I wouldnt take it of much importance but the fact that Fred is saying this means that the problem is deeper than many of us imagine.

Many here say that at least Ole is constructing a team of players with the mentality and attitude, etc well it seems he's not even working that out.
 
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Danillaco

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Just watched the interview. It's been way overblown.

He says things that we already know, about talking much and not showing enough on the pitch. He says it's a normal thing having problems off the field, but United is having a lot. The vanity comment is something the Ale (the one doing the interview) says and he kinda agrees but without even thinking.
He's honest and nothing about throwing people under the bus.

Great interview actually, funny and light.

Even tried to make a joke about his agressive style of play but managed to screw it up. Something like " From the neck up, everything is shin", when it should've been from the neck down...
 

Striker10

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I don't really care whats been said but its intelligent. IF its valid. Because Ole couldnt say it. Theres a lot of bluff and counter bluff. Many of us listened to Ole speak when he was talking about a complete overhaul but then he backed off. Probably not because he changed his mind but it can make you look weak and indecisive as people tend to live in a fairy tale. These issues need to be addressed, not swept under the carpet. So well said Fred.They earn a fortune and many of the performances have lacked the right attitude and determination. As for keanes rant, id love a squad full of Roys. I think many would and his attitude and fight deserves respect.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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There is fight and effort in the team and it is stupid to say otherwise. Although not much more collectivly since we do not work and play as a unit.
Feels like it is the first game our players play together half the time
Martial is probably the player without the full effort though if we should mention one. That is a problem, but he also gets terrible service.
I think since he gets so little to work with he just stops doing the pointless work he should still do.
Hard to blame Pogba this time away from the team.

Not sure Lingard is trying or what he is doing at the moment. His brain doesn't seem to work anymore because he mess almost everything up.
Confidence destroyed at an all time low and terrible coaching from Ole behind that. He will probably not play much more now anyway.
Bruno should hopefully start all games up to the point we get Pogba and Mctominay back.