Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance

Messi or Ronaldo

  • Messi

  • Ronaldo


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Kinsella

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Seen too many just uninspiring displays from Messi at the NT level for him to be my GOAT(still better than CR7 for me though).

He's never needed to win with Argentina for me, but he's had to perform to a standard. Show something. Inspire. I'm not expecting '86 Maradona out there, but just something at a NT level.

Not play lazily and sulk about on the field.
I get this viewpoint on paper, but when you actually watch Argentina play then these expectations really have to be tempered with reality.
 

The holy trinity 68

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Seen too many just uninspiring displays from Messi at the NT level for him to be my GOAT(still better than CR7 for me though).

He's never needed to win with Argentina for me, but he's had to perform to a standard. Show something. Inspire. I'm not expecting '86 Maradona out there, but just something at a NT level.

Not play lazily and sulk about on the field.
Who is the GOAT in your opinion and what is your reasoning?
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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They've been this horrible for the past 3-4 years
They were clearly a better team back in 2015.

This currently is a whole new level.
 

Bruno Marques

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Yap, it's really hard for Messi to play with Aguero, Di Maria, Dybala and company.

Ronaldo has better support like Eder and Guedes. :D:D:D
 

Adisa

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I am in the Messi is better camp but the "Argentina teammates are too shit" argument is bollocks. His displays are lazy bodering on pathetic. He can afford to loiter with Barcelona but doing that with Argentina is unacceptable. Simply refuses to run.
 

mdvmia

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Seen too many just uninspiring displays from Messi at the NT level for him to be my GOAT(still better than CR7 for me though).

He's never needed to win with Argentina for me, but he's had to perform to a standard. Show something. Inspire. I'm not expecting '86 Maradona out there, but just something at a NT level.

Not play lazily and sulk about on the field.
I agree, Messi is ahead of Ronaldo but neither is a GOAT equivalent to athletes like Jordan or Brady. Ronaldo doesn't have the ability for it and Messi doesn't have the mentality.
 

BlackShark_80

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I am in the Messi is better camp but the "Argentina teammates are too shit" argument is bollocks. His displays are lazy bodering on pathetic. He can afford to loiter with Barcelona but doing that with Argentina is unacceptable. Simply refuses to run.
agree he is just not a GOAT materials for me, very outstanding at club level but nothing special at national level.
 
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kouroux

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I am in the Messi is better camp but the "Argentina teammates are too shit" argument is bollocks. His displays are lazy bodering on pathetic. He can afford to loiter with Barcelona but doing that with Argentina is unacceptable. Simply refuses to run.
I'm in the middle, he could and should be doing much much better individually yeah but something is broken with this Argentina team full of average players. He really should have retired after 2014 for good.
 

Adisa

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I'm in the middle, he could and should be doing much much better individually yeah but something is broken with this Argentina team full of average players. He really should have retired after 2014 for good.
Whatever is broken, the argument is made redundant by his poor work ethic. You get the impression he is feeling sorry for himself with this woe is me attitude. That said, I have never considered him captain material.
 

Aloysius's Back 3

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And we are supposed to believe that he would be able to pull off the same standard of performances for other clubs playing with a different ethos & with different players.

Struggles against some of the easiest teams. Can't replicate his play style with Argentina because his play style is directly influenced by Barcelona.

That is not the same as Ronaldo.
 

JBD-dane

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As a football fan I have to ask: has the Ronaldo/Messi debate diveded two camps that cannot enjoy the other player? I have a feeling of that and think it is a seems that whenever one play plays good or bad you post it here to the long list of proofs that one is better than the other?
 

kouroux

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And we are supposed to believe that he would be able to pull off the same standard of performances for other clubs playing with a different ethos & with different players.

Struggles against some of the easiest teams. Can't replicate his play style with Argentina because his play style is directly influenced by Barcelona.

That is not the same as Ronaldo.
International is weird like that, plenty of average players are very good for their national teams just like the opposite too.
Whatever is broken, the argument is made redundant by his poor work ethic. You get the impression he is feeling sorry for himself with this woe is me attitude. That said, I have never considered him captain material.
I don't deny it. It feels like he's forcing himself to play to please the Argie fans or something rather than doing it out of his own volition.
 

Hala Madrid

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I agree, Messi is ahead of Ronaldo but neither is a GOAT equivalent to athletes like Jordan or Brady. Ronaldo doesn't have the ability for it and Messi doesn't have the mentality.
On the contrary, I consider Ronaldo better than Messi, not everything is dribbles and key passes.
I agree though that no player ever is perfect to the tee, but as far as I'm concerned, in my lifetime, Ronaldo is the closest even though he's not also a perfect footballer
 

wub1234

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As a football fan I have to ask: has the Ronaldo/Messi debate diveded two camps that cannot enjoy the other player?
Yes, it has.

In the real world, Messi is universally regarded as one of the best three players of all-time. On this thread, you have people arguing that he's a liability.

I've always acknowledged that Ronaldo is the second best player of the last 15 years, and probably ranks somewhere in the top 20 players of all-time. I watched him play dozens of times for Man United, and he's undoubtedly the best Man United player I've seen.

However, he's not close to being as good as Messi. This quite honestly is easily observable, and this is why that journalists, professionals, ex-professionals, pundits, commentators - ie. anyone professional who makes their money from football - recognises Messi as the best in the world, and, at worst, one of the best three ever, and increasingly the best player ever.

In every statistical category, Messi is superior. In virtually every technical aspect of the game, Messi is superior. When they came up against each other in the Spanish League, Messi emphatically had the better of it, and dominated that division. When they came up against each other in the Champions League, Messi came out on top every time.

The only thing that can be brought up on here is Ronaldo winning certain trophies (although Messi has won more overall), which is quite obviously a highly inadequate metric by which to compare two players in a team game!

Obviously the people who 'support' Ronaldo, have decided that he's their favourite for some reason, and so then they have to try to convince themselves that he's the best, which does require some mental gymnastics considering Messi is clearly the better footballer, and it's virtually impossible to turn on the TV without someone proclaiming him to be the best in the world, and one of the best ever.

I consider myself fortunate that I don't support either player, or any team, I just like to observe greatness in sport. In fact, I don't even really like football that much any more, it's been destroyed by money, and is massively over-hyped.

However, I enjoy watching Messi because of his obvious greatness and genius, just as I admire Roger Federer, Ronnie O' Sullivan, Tiger Woods (even though I hate golf!), Magnus Carlsen, and anyone who can do what they do to the highest level possible.

When their careers are finished, the same people I've just mentioned, journalists, professionals, ex-professionals, pundits, commentators, will say Ronaldo was a highly effective forward, a clinical goalscorer, a fantastic athlete, and made himself the best he could be. And they'll say that Messi is a genius, and the only player from the last 30 years to rank alongside Pele and Maradona, in a unique triad of the greatest player ever.

Nothing that anyone says on this thread is ever going to change that. You can literally sit here all day, every day, posting whatever you want, and it will still be the case.
 

2mufc0

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I'm in the middle, he could and should be doing much much better individually yeah but something is broken with this Argentina team full of average players. He really should have retired after 2014 for good.
He's just not an inspiring figure for the rest of the team, when things aren't going well or outside his comfort zone he appears to just give up.
 
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Messi is simply unbelievable for Barça, Ronaldo is just fecking awesome for any side in any league.

Messi should join United and take them back to the top, that’s the way to cement a legacy and be known as the best player ever.

As @2mufc0 says, Messi more often than not seems to give up when the going gets tough (Liverpool away, all too often for Argies). It’d be a true test of his “best of all time” status to see him for example take United back to the top, or give Liverpool their first title in 3 decades etc.
 

Aloysius's Back 3

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Yes, it has.

In the real world, Messi is universally regarded as one of the best three players of all-time. On this thread, you have people arguing that he's a liability.

I've always acknowledged that Ronaldo is the second best player of the last 15 years, and probably ranks somewhere in the top 20 players of all-time.
I watched him play dozens of times for Man United, and he's undoubtedly the best Man United player I've seen.

However, he's not close to being as good as Messi. This quite honestly is easily observable, and this is why that journalists, professionals, ex-professionals, pundits, commentators - ie. anyone professional who makes their money from football - recognises Messi as the best in the world, and, at worst, one of the best three ever, and increasingly the best player ever.

In every statistical category, Messi is superior. In virtually every technical aspect of the game, Messi is superior. When they came up against each other in the Spanish League, Messi emphatically had the better of it, and dominated that division. When they came up against each other in the Champions League, Messi came out on top every time.

The only thing that can be brought up on here is Ronaldo winning certain trophies (although Messi has won more overall), which is quite obviously a highly inadequate metric by which to compare two players in a team game!

Obviously the people who 'support' Ronaldo, have decided that he's their favourite for some reason, and so then they have to try to convince themselves that he's the best, which does require some mental gymnastics considering Messi is clearly the better footballer, and it's virtually impossible to turn on the TV without someone proclaiming him to be the best in the world, and one of the best ever.

I consider myself fortunate that I don't support either player, or any team, I just like to observe greatness in sport. In fact, I don't even really like football that much any more, it's been destroyed by money, and is massively over-hyped.

However, I enjoy watching Messi because of his obvious greatness and genius, just as I admire Roger Federer, Ronnie O' Sullivan, Tiger Woods (even though I hate golf!), Magnus Carlsen, and anyone who can do what they do to the highest level possible.

When their careers are finished, the same people I've just mentioned, journalists, professionals, ex-professionals, pundits, commentators, will say Ronaldo was a highly effective forward, a clinical goalscorer, a fantastic athlete, and made himself the best he could be. And they'll say that Messi is a genius, and the only player from the last 30 years to rank alongside Pele and Maradona, in a unique triad of the greatest player ever.

Nothing that anyone says on this thread is ever going to change that. You can literally sit here all day, every day, posting whatever you want, and it will still be the case.
:lol:
 

K13

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Argentina's wc record with Messi - 2006 - 6th, 2010 5th, 2014 2nd & 2018 16th
Portugal's wc record with Ronaldo - 2006 4th, 2010 11th, 2014 18th & 2018 13th

So great players in the modern era where there is so much attention to diet, fitness and tactics can no longer win an International tournament single handed. Neither can do it on their own. Portugal won the European cup final with Ronaldo off the pitch injured for the majority of the game. They also won the Nations league final in a team where Ronaldo is no longer the key man - that title now goes to Bernardo De Silva. Argentina have the excellent Aguero to support Messi but that is it. Argentina as a team are not good enough - they can not defend and they struggle to get any quality ball to their potential match winners.

My only allegiance to either is that Ronaldo is one of our own and did amazing things for many years.

In my opinion ...
Messi ranks alongside Pele, Maradona and Brazilian Ronaldo
Ronaldo - ranks alongside Figo, Kaka, Zidane, Del Piero, Socrates, Ronaldinho, Zico, Garrincha, Gasgoigne and Best
 

Vialli_92

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I didn't watch the game last night but generally from the little I seen of them they are too static for Messi to play anywhere near his usual level.

Ronaldo is a lot easier to play with because he's not a player who needs to find space in midfield he just needs to stay close to goal and will make something happen with his movement or heading ability

If I needed a player to win a WC final I would pick Ronaldo because you know what you will get with him where as Messi is a much superior player but his game just doesn't suit that type of football and struggles to lead a team

For me there is no comparison who the better player is, Messi is on another level to Ronaldo
 

RedRonaldo

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Argentina's wc record with Messi - 2006 - 6th, 2010 5th, 2014 2nd & 2018 16th
Portugal's wc record with Ronaldo - 2006 4th, 2010 11th, 2014 18th & 2018 13th

So great players in the modern era where there is so much attention to diet, fitness and tactics can no longer win an International tournament single handed. Neither can do it on their own. Portugal won the European cup final with Ronaldo off the pitch injured for the majority of the game. They also won the Nations league final in a team where Ronaldo is no longer the key man - that title now goes to Bernardo De Silva. Argentina have the excellent Aguero to support Messi but that is it. Argentina as a team are not good enough - they can not defend and they struggle to get any quality ball to their potential match winners.

My only allegiance to either is that Ronaldo is one of our own and did amazing things for many years.

In my opinion ...
Messi ranks alongside Pele, Maradona and Brazilian Ronaldo
Ronaldo
- ranks alongside Figo, Kaka, Zidane, Del Piero, Socrates, Ronaldinho, Zico, Garrincha, Gasgoigne and Best
Is that suppose to be a joke?
I know football fans are all bias, but swap Brazilian Ronaldo with Ronaldo, that will make much more sense.
I mean, at least try to be 50% objective. I know its hard, but try to see beyond your own personal favouritism.
 

ayushreddevil9

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Is that suppose to be a joke?
I know football fans are all bias, but swap Brazilian Ronaldo with Ronaldo, that will make much more sense.
I mean, at least try to be 50% objective. I know its hard.
Most of them are trying. That's why they class cr7 in a tier below Messi. One of them didn't and said that cr7 probably makes it to the top 20 list.
 

2mufc0

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Is that suppose to be a joke?
I know football fans are all bias, but swap Brazilian Ronaldo with Ronaldo, that will make much more sense.
I mean, at least try to be 50% objective. I know its hard, but try to see beyond your own personal favouritism.
Yeah that list was a joke, Gazza :lol:

Just shows how insecure they are
 

BlackShark_80

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Argentina's wc record with Messi - 2006 - 6th, 2010 5th, 2014 2nd & 2018 16th
Portugal's wc record with Ronaldo - 2006 4th, 2010 11th, 2014 18th & 2018 13th

So great players in the modern era where there is so much attention to diet, fitness and tactics can no longer win an International tournament single handed. Neither can do it on their own. Portugal won the European cup final with Ronaldo off the pitch injured for the majority of the game. They also won the Nations league final in a team where Ronaldo is no longer the key man - that title now goes to Bernardo De Silva. Argentina have the excellent Aguero to support Messi but that is it. Argentina as a team are not good enough - they can not defend and they struggle to get any quality ball to their potential match winners.

My only allegiance to either is that Ronaldo is one of our own and did amazing things for many years.

In my opinion ...
Messi ranks alongside Pele, Maradona and Brazilian Ronaldo
Ronaldo - ranks alongside Figo, Kaka, Zidane, Del Piero, Socrates, Ronaldinho, Zico, Garrincha, Gasgoigne and Best
putting Figo, Kaka, Del Piero, and Gasgoigne in the same ranks like Zico, Garrincha, Best, and Zidane are really funny.
 

RedRonaldo

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Most of them are trying. That's why they class cr7 in a tier below Messi. One of them didn't and said that cr7 probably makes it to the top 20 list.
Its ok favouring Messi over Ronaldo, nothing wrong with it. But putting Ronaldo top 20 or ranking him alongside with Gazza, Kaka, Figo, Del Perio etc and below Fat Ronaldo is really a disgrace. We are talking about a player who had won 5 Ballon D'or, 5 CL, scored 689 goals, made 219 assists, all time top scorer/assist in CL, all time top international goal scorer in Europe+South America, and holding over 150 individual records in football. This is the type of CV for player at GOAT level. If can't recognise that, at least rank him somewhere more appropriate.
 

SirAF

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Its ok favouring Messi over Ronaldo, nothing wrong with it. But putting Ronaldo top 20 or ranking him alongside with Gazza, Del Perio etc and below Fat Ronaldo is really a disgrace. We are talking about a player who had won 5 Ballon D'or, 5CL, scored 689 goals, made 219 assists, all time top scorer/assist in CL, all time top international goal scorer in Europe+South America, and holding over 150 records in football. This is the type of CV for player at GOAT level. If can't recognise that, at least rank him somewhere more appropriate.
I just looked up that he’s got 917 first team apps. He’s going to break 1000.
 

Hala Madrid

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Yes, it has.

In the real world, Messi is universally regarded as one of the best three players of all-time. On this thread, you have people arguing that he's a liability.

I've always acknowledged that Ronaldo is the second best player of the last 15 years, and probably ranks somewhere in the top 20 players of all-time. I watched him play dozens of times for Man United, and he's undoubtedly the best Man United player I've seen.

However, he's not close to being as good as Messi. This quite honestly is easily observable, and this is why that journalists, professionals, ex-professionals, pundits, commentators - ie. anyone professional who makes their money from football - recognises Messi as the best in the world, and, at worst, one of the best three ever, and increasingly the best player ever.

In every statistical category, Messi is superior. In virtually every technical aspect of the game, Messi is superior. When they came up against each other in the Spanish League, Messi emphatically had the better of it, and dominated that division. When they came up against each other in the Champions League, Messi came out on top every time.

The only thing that can be brought up on here is Ronaldo winning certain trophies (although Messi has won more overall), which is quite obviously a highly inadequate metric by which to compare two players in a team game!

Obviously the people who 'support' Ronaldo, have decided that he's their favourite for some reason, and so then they have to try to convince themselves that he's the best, which does require some mental gymnastics considering Messi is clearly the better footballer, and it's virtually impossible to turn on the TV without someone proclaiming him to be the best in the world, and one of the best ever.

I consider myself fortunate that I don't support either player, or any team, I just like to observe greatness in sport. In fact, I don't even really like football that much any more, it's been destroyed by money, and is massively over-hyped.

However, I enjoy watching Messi because of his obvious greatness and genius, just as I admire Roger Federer, Ronnie O' Sullivan, Tiger Woods (even though I hate golf!), Magnus Carlsen, and anyone who can do what they do to the highest level possible.

When their careers are finished, the same people I've just mentioned, journalists, professionals, ex-professionals, pundits, commentators, will say Ronaldo was a highly effective forward, a clinical goalscorer, a fantastic athlete, and made himself the best he could be. And they'll say that Messi is a genius, and the only player from the last 30 years to rank alongside Pele and Maradona, in a unique triad of the greatest player ever.

Nothing that anyone says on this thread is ever going to change that. You can literally sit here all day, every day, posting whatever you want, and it will still be the case.
Just like you, the people who've decided messi is their favourite automatically write off Ronaldo as somewhere in top 20, what the hell...that's the peak of delusiuon,
Ronaldo can e argued to be better than messi and vice versa, they are both easily top 5 greatest ever and if you can't even come to terms with that, I'm sorry...you don't know anything about football.
By the way, there are as much people who prefer Ronaldo just as messi, so don't deceive yourself.