Maybe I just don't take the intricacies of football rivalries as personally as some, but I don't see the big deal and this doesn't bother me at all.
Michael Owen, Manchester United PL winner...
- Thread starter Rozay
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It’s not a big deal. He was dirt cheap and did a passable job when needed.
Of course as a Liverpool ambassador he can’t wax lyrical about his time in a title winning side and he’s always been a bit of a knob but for a brief moment he was our knob and whilst he was ours he scored an important and memorable goal.
Really?!!! What were his alternatives? He was shopping brochures around to the likes of Hull City if I’m not mistaken. He couldn’t believe his luck that any top club wanted him, even Liverpool didn’t want him back at the time, yet United should take him?! He’s a scouse cnut who has one PL medal because of an act of generosity from Manchester United of all clubs, who didn’t really need him but took him on and kept him around like he was some sort of United legend. There’s probably tens of other strikers who could have offered what that version of Michael Owen offered us. If we had taken him off the Scousers instead of Real, great. We tried to sign Vieira for ages at his Arsenal peak despite him being a great adversary. Thankfully, we left it to City to give him a farewell tour rather than stoop to have a player who was opposed to us for hears do a job that a bunch of converted defenders could have done in midfield by the time he was almost done.
Oh please.
He pissed off the scousers and the berties when he scored the derby winner. He pissed off the scousers when he won the title and celebrated. He pissed off the scousers when he rubbed salt to their wounds and became their ambassador. I'd happily sign Slippy in January next year and give him 5 minutes in the final game just to piss off the scousers even more with his winner's medal.
Yeah this is how I feel as well. He's dull as bricks to listen to, and obviously he won't speak adoringly about us now that he's a Liverpool ambassador, but I really don't see this as something worth getting so worked up about.
I love it.
The only downside is that the prick won the league, but it isn't even that important since many players have the medal, and he was important as Kusczcak was.
However, there are many positives:
- he must hate it because the only title he won was with United, it must be eating him inside even if he is happy with having the medal
- He constantly licks arse of Liverpool fans but yet they hate him because he played for us, and he won the league with us so they hate him even more
- that winner against City
- Gerrard not winning it and Michael Owen winning it - for Manchester United!
...
The only downside is that the prick won the league, but it isn't even that important since many players have the medal, and he was important as Kusczcak was.
However, there are many positives:
- he must hate it because the only title he won was with United, it must be eating him inside even if he is happy with having the medal
- He constantly licks arse of Liverpool fans but yet they hate him because he played for us, and he won the league with us so they hate him even more
- that winner against City
- Gerrard not winning it and Michael Owen winning it - for Manchester United!
...
I never forgave him for his tackle on Johnsen.
You could make a huge list of players that have won medals that you didn't feel deserved them and a huge list of players that didn't win medals that probably did deserve them. It's pretty irrelevant.
As annoying as Owen might seem he had a pretty great career and there would be much more obvious candidates for undeserving premier league medal winners.
As annoying as Owen might seem he had a pretty great career and there would be much more obvious candidates for undeserving premier league medal winners.
He was a very good player back in the day. His goal vs Argentina was sensational and it’s a shame that injuries were a hinderance to him. His brief stint at Real shows he could hang with Raúl and Ronaldo. Sir Alex was probably a huge fan of him and probably wanted to sign him up if it wasn’t for the Liverpool connection.
Sir Alex got a tune out of him when he joined. Obviously he was a shadow of the 1998-2002 version but you could see quick flashes of that in that 2 or so year stint here.
Sir Alex got a tune out of him when he joined. Obviously he was a shadow of the 1998-2002 version but you could see quick flashes of that in that 2 or so year stint here.
Exactly!
I might understand you better if all these happened...
Free and low pay-as-you-play wages because of his injury proneness and for that, his contributions are more than enough. Goals scored, while actually showing he still has his good link-up play (either one of Berba or Rooney play best with him than with each other), scoring instincts, CF plays and very good off-the-ball movements which helped the team. He doesn't hinder the developments of other younger players either eg. Chicharito later on.
My biggest concern is his injury, may meant he's a waste, but he managed through and SAF managed him well (must be the player's high motivation) so no complaints from me.
The goal against City is awesome and he helped us winning trophy, those are enough.
So I don't get it, sounds too trivial to say he's doesn't deserve it or couldn't forgive him just because of the Liverpool connection, or other reasons such as not in op, the #7 shirt.
There are plenty of other players who doesn't "deserve" it, but then those are their lucks in life. Plus, there are other who receive it yet are plentifully disappointing later on eg. Tevez saying bad things about SAF and our club.
- he made minimal or rubbish overall contributions
- high wages
- high transfer fee
- missing many games because of injuries but still receive medal
- criticised SAF and United harshly
- behave unprofessionally
Free and low pay-as-you-play wages because of his injury proneness and for that, his contributions are more than enough. Goals scored, while actually showing he still has his good link-up play (either one of Berba or Rooney play best with him than with each other), scoring instincts, CF plays and very good off-the-ball movements which helped the team. He doesn't hinder the developments of other younger players either eg. Chicharito later on.
My biggest concern is his injury, may meant he's a waste, but he managed through and SAF managed him well (must be the player's high motivation) so no complaints from me.
The goal against City is awesome and he helped us winning trophy, those are enough.
So I don't get it, sounds too trivial to say he's doesn't deserve it or couldn't forgive him just because of the Liverpool connection, or other reasons such as not in op, the #7 shirt.
There are plenty of other players who doesn't "deserve" it, but then those are their lucks in life. Plus, there are other who receive it yet are plentifully disappointing later on eg. Tevez saying bad things about SAF and our club.
United took their boy, their crown jewel and made him a Champion. Something they've yet to accomplish.
I don't know, that sounds pretty good to me.
I don't know, that sounds pretty good to me.
He was all compliments about us until he got the Liverpool ambassador job. Even referred to us as "we" as a pundit!
Positives:
- The Derby goal
- He won one more PL than Gerrard
- He cost nothing
Negatives:
- He's a Liverpool "legend"... Not really a negative
- The Derby goal
- He won one more PL than Gerrard
- He cost nothing
Negatives:
- He's a Liverpool "legend"... Not really a negative
I always got the impression that Liverpool fans were not that fond of Owen even before 2005, for some reason that I've never quite understood (or really looked into). I should say I never thought he was disliked by them and they regarded him as world class but they didn't seem to have that level of affection you'd expect for such a talent.
Must be weird having played for a lot of clubs and not really be all that loved by any of them (and in the case of Newcastle fans, hated.)
Must be weird having played for a lot of clubs and not really be all that loved by any of them (and in the case of Newcastle fans, hated.)
Fact.
I saw his father playing in the 1970s - he started at Everton - wonder if they were an Everton family?
Yeah.. better than over-hyped Fowler and Gerrard who never won any PL
Do you really mind that much that we've taken an ex-Liverpool player and he won the title with us? I've never understood why fans take "bitter rivalries" to the extent that you should automatically hate/condemn anything that has to do with the rival.
So what if Owen was a Liverpool academy graduate and their super star? We needed a stop-gap striker. Sir Alex deemed it acceptable to get him. It worked out well in the end (in my view) but even if it didn't, I wouldn't bother too much. Liverpool is a football club like any other. If anything, they are the closest there is to Manchester United, especially in England.
It just feels like an unhealthy grudge to keep for something of so little importance and consequence. What's the worst outcome of it? Owen is now back being Liverpool ambassador and he doesn't go shouting "Glory, glory Man United" on the streets? Who cares?
Would you have no issue if, after a career of trying and failing to win the league with Liverpool, we bought Gerrard in at 36 as ‘cover’ and he played 12 games and a PL winners medal? Then popped back over to Liverpool to become a coach and continue as normal.
As a default position, I’m happy that all of that Liverpool lot have never won a PL title before. It’s great. Liverpool will win it this year after they have all gone and they will never have that medal. Except Owen. He got one out of a kindness from United. We should have looked into taking Gerrard and Carragher at the end of their careers too, so they could all retire as PL winners, on us. As I’ve said, if we had taken Owen the superstar, I’d not begrudge him getting his medal with us. But to spare him from that category of failed Scousers, by allowing him a medal that even he said he was a little ashamed to win due to the fact that he wasn’t really of much use, doesn’t sit well. In a twist of irony, he’s been let off the hook, by none other than Manchester United - the team he was raised to hate. He managed to sneak in and feast with his enemies when it was all over for him, then returned back to his people. He was of little use to us, he was no Van Persie or anything. It’s be like us signing Kompany on a 12 month deal this summer and him getting a CL medal through the backdoor. Could we not possibly find someone else to perform that role? Like Owen, he would be Kompany in name only anyway. Owen could have easily been just about anyone, and we’d have won the league regardless. And he’d still be another failed Scouser who’d have never won the league, to which reds would take pleasure.
Why would you care? I don't understand this mentality, and it's never really been articulated in a way that makes sense to me.
I wouldn't have any issue if we get ANY player and they help us achieve our goals. I don't care where they are coming from if they apply themselves, act professionally and accordingly, the manager sees them as important for their plans (important does not mean automatic starter).
I guess you hate Dennis Law too?
Also, about that "category of failed Scousers", I guess that kind of answers my question. But it also popped up a new one: do you prefer Manchester United succeeding or Liverpool failing? If you could only have to choose from these two options. If life was so binary. What would it be?
Well why would you care about anything football related? Are they your children?!
At the risk of going around in circles here, I’ll clarify my point again, as it appears people are wilfully deleting (important) bits they don’t wish to engage.
Dennis Law scored hundreds of goals for Manchester United. As I’ve said, numerously, if we signed Owen, Gerrard, Aguero or Van Persie from our rivals in their prime while they were great players, I wouldn’t care. We are not doing that player any sort of favour, they can help us win titles.
I do NOT think we should be signing any sort of ‘in name only’ version of a Liverpool or City superstar though, who is not expected to have any real significant contribution to our pursuit of trophies. For THAT particular role, the options are plentiful, and are not restricted to Liverpool greats. Signing Michael Owen as cover is not what will determine ‘Manchester United success’ - signing Van Persie, while he was the best striker in England, was.
I’ll repeat, Michael Owen HIMSELF has said he almost felt embarrassed to win his PL medal, such was his level of contribution. He was not vital. It didn’t have to be him, and I don’t think it should have been. He should have been consigned to the same fate as the rest of his Liverpool gen by never winning a league title, but instead, he was done a massive favour by Sir Alex and Manchester United, one that I’d have rather we didn’t do.
So who should we have signed that would have made equal or more important contribution, with little transfer money involved and low wages?
Im sure ive made this point before, but given the clubs hes played for, (Liverpool, Newcastle, United, Madrid), hes not really adored by many of the supporters for each of the clubs.
And hes an even worse commentator / pundit.
And hes an even worse commentator / pundit.
I bet Michael looks at his medal with pure joy, then he remembers the players that played alongside him, and a single tear rolls down his cheek.
He also has to hide it under the couch every time Gerrard and Fowler come round his house.
Fergie snatching up Liverpool's former golden boy for peanuts, make him win the league with United, giving him the # 7 while only using him as a plan C or D.
If that's not master level trolling - or brilliantly yet subtly rubbing in Manchster United's superiority over Liverpool - I don't know what is. Absolutely love that this guy actually played for us, still makes me laugh right now.
If that's not master level trolling - or brilliantly yet subtly rubbing in Manchster United's superiority over Liverpool - I don't know what is. Absolutely love that this guy actually played for us, still makes me laugh right now.
I am not really sure why people dislike him so much. Did he choose to take up the chance to play for Manutd instead of staying at some crappy clubs? I guarantee any of those Liverpool fans would have done the exact same thing if they were in his shoes.
Honestly, if I was a player at Newcastle or something, I would admit that I would take up an offer from Liverpool. Even though I am a Manutd fa, you cannot be childish when you are thinking about it in terms of a career.
Just because he played for Manutd does not mean he cannot still be a Liverpool supporter afterwards.
He's boring but isn't exactly an arsehole.
Honestly, if I was a player at Newcastle or something, I would admit that I would take up an offer from Liverpool. Even though I am a Manutd fa, you cannot be childish when you are thinking about it in terms of a career.
Just because he played for Manutd does not mean he cannot still be a Liverpool supporter afterwards.
He's boring but isn't exactly an arsehole.
I can't understand why one poster insists on criticising and second guessing the greatest manager the Premier League ever saw.
If SAF thought signing Owen was a good move, I'm not going to argue.
He knew a little bit more about managing Utd than most on here :-)
If SAF thought signing Owen was a good move, I'm not going to argue.
He knew a little bit more about managing Utd than most on here :-)
Giving a long past-prime Liverpool icon the #7 when he wouldn't have even got into the Liverpool team felt like an insult. Towards the end I remember him coming deep a lot more, trying to play like a #10, and he was nowhere near good enough to do it. Thanks for the derby winner, but he was mostly just taking up a squad space and saving the club spending some money or giving a young player an opportunity.
Not really bothered by his time here. We all knew he couldn’t stay fit, so it’s not like he was brought here with us needing him to deliver. Having said that the few times we actually needed him he actually delivered, the derby, equalizer I think against Bolton, cup final and against Wolfsburg when he was the only option. I think he also scored a few in the Carling cup as well. For a free transfer it’s not too bad, we’ve had players we’ve paid good money for who’ve done far less for us.
Having said that, he’s a smug prick and his personality rubs me the wrong way. I can easily see why people don’t like him.
Having said that, he’s a smug prick and his personality rubs me the wrong way. I can easily see why people don’t like him.
If Liverpool are still as shit as They were. This signing would be lauded as one of the best signings by Fergie to rub some salt to Liverpool's wound.
Unfortunately, times changed and I have never liked him. Both as a player and a pundit. Even when He scored against City I was more happy about the scoreline than him scoring. I knew his career would turn out to be a short one at Utd. Shit pundit too.
Unfortunately, times changed and I have never liked him. Both as a player and a pundit. Even when He scored against City I was more happy about the scoreline than him scoring. I knew his career would turn out to be a short one at Utd. Shit pundit too.
this had me in absolute stitches ha ha.
I think the main point of disagreement I have with your logic (beyond the strong feelings you have for Liverpool) is the "it didn't have to be him". I think the goal against City was probably worth more than 5 other goals combined. Sometimes seemingly unimportant things/events lead to very important results and stating in hindsight that any odd striker would've scored the goals Owen scored is, to me, wildly inaccurate.
For all the lost pace, Owen still had the positioning and movement of the killer fox striker of his better days. If you ask me, it kind of had to be him even if he didn't score the seemingly most important goals.
But let's move on. I respect your opinion and even follow your posts on the forum. I have not deleted any part of your post in my quote-reply and if I haven't addressed the parts you allude to, it's just oversight or I haven't read the same level of importance as you have intended when writing.
No worries sir, we can agree to differ on this. And thank you for your respectfully written post, I’d do well to remember to use a similar tone sometimes!
Cool, let’s re-open the forum when the Glazers hire Michael McIntyre as the manager and not before.
If this is your logic, you must find it difficult to understand 90% of the posts on here, given they come from plumbers and computer programmers instead of coaches.
I’ve just shamed my previous post in about 20 seconds!
I don't think you can compare Owen to Stevie G though.
Gerrard has been fairly open about his dislike for the club. Was Owen ever? Even before his move? Don't think so.
Now if we somehow signed Suarez after the Evra incident, I think that would be universally disliked by all United fans even if we won titles.
Gerrard has been fairly open about his dislike for the club. Was Owen ever? Even before his move? Don't think so.
Now if we somehow signed Suarez after the Evra incident, I think that would be universally disliked by all United fans even if we won titles.
Actually, I find the general disdain for Owen amongst online United fans a bit extreme. Growing up in Manchester, I don't really recall my mates and I despising him like we did some of Pool's other players (God, we HATED Gerrard... Fowler... Torres for example) because... I dunno I think part of it was maybe how much he provided for the England national team? Felt like he was making amends to us or something! He's ironically one of two players Liverpool have ever fielded that I can remember kinda liking. I do agree that giving him the 7 doesn't sit perfectly right with me because of his scouse connections, so I do know what OP is on about, but I also concede and agree with the other posters saying this was a master stroke by Sir Alex in terms of man management.
Overall I really appreciate the contribution. I remember the City goal too fondly to hate on Owen, even if it was before they were genuinely the "noisy neighbours". I don't remember him playing all that much in the time he was here and he also chipped in with a dozen or so other goals, so very good for a free transfer if you ask me.
I don't feel the same way about him as I do about Paul Ince for example.
Overall I really appreciate the contribution. I remember the City goal too fondly to hate on Owen, even if it was before they were genuinely the "noisy neighbours". I don't remember him playing all that much in the time he was here and he also chipped in with a dozen or so other goals, so very good for a free transfer if you ask me.
I don't feel the same way about him as I do about Paul Ince for example.