Midfielders -- Other than the "obvious"

neverdie

Full Member
Joined
Oct 26, 2018
Messages
5,727
Not going into great detail, but other than Anderson (who I still think should be number one priority), here are some I think could do a job here ranging from elite in some people's eyes to "who is that" (but good/efficient all the same).

Joao Neves (PSG). Very hard to get?

Mamadou Sangaré (Lens). Easy to get. Good season. Only 23. I like the look of him.

Mateus Fernandes (West Ham). Easy enough to get given where they are. 21. A very good player. Gettable.

Wouter Burger (Hoffenheim). Gettable. 25. Wouldn't want to spend much on him, but he could do a job (better than Ugarte... I mean that ain't hard, but this is one of those "who is he" unless you follow Bundesliga). Squad player style.

There are others, of course, some in the PL. But other than Neves above, those three aren't costing enormous amounts (Fernandes wouldn't be cheap at all of course).

Anyone got any to add?
 
We’ve been linked with taller profile players in the last week Onana, Sangare (Forest) and Nmecha
 
AkaAkuma said:
Nmecha
Click to expand...
This one looks interesting. They're quoting 70m for him though. I mean, Anderson, PL proven, and better than Nmecha, as good as Nmecha may be, would be 100m ish. Other than Neves above and the West Ham lad (his age does the most inflation re fee), I'm not sure about those fees?
 
Last edited:
Johan Manzambi, Ayyoub Bouaddi. Yehor Yarmolyuk, Alex Scott,

I see we've been linked with Sean Steur, and I like Jorthy Mokio too. but they're too young right now.

Eduardo Camavinga, Aurelien Tchouameni and Arda Guler might come on the market too(Real Madrid are known for just randomly selling decent players).
 
RedKnight88 said:
Real Madrid are known for just randomly selling decent players).
Click to expand...
You can also count on one hand the number of players they sell that don't end up being finished or shit. A bit like Bayern. And how we used to be under Fergie. Always comes with a buyer beware when these feckers are selling players.
 
Nicolas Seiwald might be a worth a look. He isn't very creative but a hardworking DM with good passing stats. Someone who doesn't play in the spotlight but does his job. Only 24, played a lot for Leipzig and Ragnik loves him.

I would also look at one or two midfield options from the relegated teams. We not only need quality but also numbers in the summer.
 
RedKnight88 said:
Johan Manzambi, Ayyoub Bouaddi. Yehor Yarmolyuk, Alex Scott,

I see we've been linked with Sean Steur, and I like Jorthy Mokio too. but they're too young right now.

Eduardo Camavinga, Aurelien Tchouameni and Arda Guler might come on the market too(Real Madrid are known for just randomly selling decent players).
Click to expand...

Yeah, I like him.
 
Chema Andrés, from the ones who have not been mentioned yet.

Spain has a track-record of producing good No. 6s, with some of them being more box-to-box than others: Busquets, Alonso, Martínez, Rodri and so forth. Even someone like Zubimendi is serviceable, without being exceptional. And over all of those years, we have barely taken advantage of this hotbed of a market, to our detriment really. Andrés is unlikely to reach the level of the aforementioned quartet but he's arguably the best young No. 6 from Spain after Bernal of Barcelona and could develop into a good holding midfielder in his own right. Reads the game quite well for his age, good positional awareness and good in the air, Carrick-esque frame at 6'2"-6'3", decent passer with the potential to become a good passer, not the quickest or the best ball carrier but that won't matter all too much if he's is emloyed as a holding midfielder.



Of course, this signing would be contingent on Real Madrid not re-signing him from Stuttgart....
Real Madrid could bring him back for €13 million in 2026 or €16 million in 2027, a figure that is starting to look like a bargain given his progress.
Click to expand...
Los hijos pródigos de Valdebebas los canteranos que podrían volver al Real Madrid
 
AkaAkuma said:
We’ve been linked with taller profile players in the last week Onana, Sangare (Forest) and Nmecha
Click to expand...

With Casemiro leaving and Maguire likely playing less often we have to get someone with serious aerial presence. Particularly if Anderson is the other MF signing.

We'd ideally be getting 3 CMs this summer if we can move Ugarte on. Getting a different blend of profiles in that case seems reasonable. At least one of those would be a cheaper gamble.

I'm actually not convinced anymore by any of the big 3 names that have been talked about all year. Anderson is still a standout but I'm just not sure he's the right choice to spend so much on.
 
Invictus said:
Chema Andrés, from the ones who have not been mentioned yet.

Spain has a track-record of producing good No. 6s, with some of them being more box-to-box than others: Busquets, Alonso, Martínez, Rodri and so forth. Even someone like Zubimendi is serviceable, without being exceptional. And over all of those years, we have barely taken advantage of this hotbed of a market, to our detriment really. Andrés is unlikely to reach the level of the aforementioned quartet but he's arguably the best young No. 6 from Spain after Bernal of Barcelona and could develop into a good holding midfielder in his own right. Reads the game quite well for his age, good positional awareness and good in the air, Carrick-esque frame at 6'2"-6'3", decent passer with the potential to become a good passer, not the quickest or the best ball carrier but that won't matter all too much if he's is emloyed as a holding midfielder.



Of course, this signing would be contingent on Real Madrid not re-signing him from Stuttgart....

Los hijos pródigos de Valdebebas los canteranos que podrían volver al Real Madrid
Click to expand...

This one's interesting. First I've heard of him to be honest. But you're right, Spain produces (or has in the recent past) some of the best 6s.

Always worth a gamble -- if we could get him for that kind of re-buy price Real has baked in, then it would be worth the speculation (you never know with these Spanish 6s and you clearly rate him).
 
I really rate Alex Scott, been a huge fan all season.

I also really rate Aleksandar Stanković at Brugge for an outside the box option.
 
neverdie said:
Anyone got any to add?
Click to expand...

Did this really need another thread?

There's already been loads of discussion and suggestions in the other 'Centre Midfielder Transfer Links' thread...

It might be worth your checking out my posts here:
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/centre-midfielder-transfer-links.488776/post-34033035

and here:
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/centre-midfielder-transfer-links.488776/page-77#post-33997872

Albeit those are specifically focused on more defensive-minded midfielders.
 
For me Man Utd Koné is difficult to ignore. He is both skilled and a pretty good ball winner.
 
goldenboy said:
Did this really need another thread?
Click to expand...
Yes. Reason: it's so fecking dense in terms of trying to find similar threads (which aren't even the same) that I cannot be bothered unless it's a major topic.

Also, that's "transfer links". I'm not asking or necessitating that there be any links, just asking for players that went under the radar or are under the radar and seeing how people rate midfielders (no link required) within that category. It's not the same function re thread creation.



Good posts btw.
 
Think Amadou Onana is a good option. Villa seem to be heading towards PSR trouble, and not only does he play the same position as Casemiro, but would also fill the set piece void Casemiro's exit would create. Only problem is his injury record, which (without checking) seems a bit risky to me. We need someone to come in and have the quality, and physicality to play 50 games a season. Think we have to follow the same strategy as Mbuemo and Cunha, given the criticality of the situation.
 
Our very own Martinez is the obvious choice to me. Great passer and gets involved all the time. Plus we develop either Heaven or Yoro or both.

If Anderson’s not coming: Save the money for a big talent/player like Rogers and play Martinez. Bring Koné through the ranks if Martinez is injured. He is 20 years old, should be time soon.
 
RedKnight88 said:
Johan Manzambi, Ayyoub Bouaddi. Yehor Yarmolyuk, Alex Scott,

I see we've been linked with Sean Steur, and I like Jorthy Mokio too. but they're too young right now.

Eduardo Camavinga, Aurelien Tchouameni and Arda Guler might come on the market too(Real Madrid are known for just randomly selling decent players).
Click to expand...

This guy looks very interesting. Ineos obviously know the French market well. He's the standout young midfielder post Camavinga. If we could get him for Yoro type money on the proviso that we will slowly develop him if he's not fully ready. Yoro looks well able, he always looks great when he comes in but there's no pressure on him outside of that. That's the way it should be with players still learning the game in an unforgiving league
 
Nickelodeon said:
Think Amadou Onana is a good option. Villa seem to be heading towards PSR trouble, and not only does he play the same position as Casemiro, but would also fill the set piece void Casemiro's exit would create. Only problem is his injury record, which (without checking) seems a bit risky to me. We need someone to come in and have the quality, and physicality to play 50 games a season. Think we have to follow the same strategy as Mbuemo and Cunha, given the criticality of the situation.
Click to expand...
Is he really a signing to move the needle? As you say, seems to have issues staying fit but also it's not like he's that young and there's a lot of improvement to come, he will be 25 before next season starts so these next few seasons should be his peak. I think this about Anderson as well in honesty, it's so hard to judge these guys playing in teams that set up differently and most weeks play on the counter. As we have seen, you can rack up great stats for shit like 'progressive passes' playing as the underdog team and you'll have a load of defensive contributions but ultimately we're looking to sign someone who would be amongst the best in the world on the ball as well as off the ball ideally.
 
I'd love us to sign Mateus Fernandes.
I think he's going to be a top player and we may get him for a decent fee.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
and you'll have a load of defensive contributions
Click to expand...

That's why you need to look at stuff like Pass-Adjusted tackles+interceptions...

Not sure that it's easier to rack up progressive passes playing for underdog teams though - you might have less of the ball and fewer team-mates to hit. The top of the league players for progressive passes per 90 include players from all sorts of clubs - from eg Anderson to Bruno Fernandes.
 
ROFLUTION said:
Our very own Martinez is the obvious choice to me. Great passer and gets involved all the time. Plus we develop either Heaven or Yoro or both.

If Anderson’s not coming: Save the money for a big talent/player like Rogers and play Martinez. Bring Koné through the ranks if Martinez is injured. He is 20 years old, should be time soon.
Click to expand...

Does he have the legs or the lungs?
 
ROFLUTION said:
Our very own Martinez is the obvious choice to me. Great passer and gets involved all the time. Plus we develop either Heaven or Yoro or both.

If Anderson’s not coming: Save the money for a big talent/player like Rogers and play Martinez. Bring Koné through the ranks if Martinez is injured. He is 20 years old, should be time soon.
Click to expand...
He's seldom fit as it is, putting him in midfield would obliterate him.
 
goldenboy said:
That's why you need to look at stuff like Pass-Adjusted tackles+interceptions...

Not sure that it's easier to rack up progressive passes playing for underdog teams though - you might have less of the ball and fewer team-mates to hit. The top of the league players for progressive passes per 90 include players from all sorts of clubs - from eg Anderson to Bruno Fernandes.
Click to expand...
That's arguably less accurate? I feel like I always run into you using stats but without ever showing the context (i remember I asked you something about one of the skill wheels). If you simply cumulate the number of tackles a player makes, it is already a pretty bad stat without any kind of context, if you then per 90 something or 'adjust' it by another stat is compounds the issue.

Also you have listed 2 players who play in counter attacking setups for the most part?
 
tomaldinho1 said:
If you simply cumulate the number of tackles a player makes, it is already a pretty bad stat without any kind of context, if you then per 90 something or 'adjust' it by another stat is compounds the issue
Click to expand...

Errrrr no.

Making it 'Pass-adjusted' is precisely the context which rectifies the issue.

'Pass-adjusted Tackles+Interceptions per 90' means that instead of just adding up the total number of tackles+interceptions per 90, it relativises the number to how much possession the opponent has. Because obviously you can't make a tackle or interception when you have the ball, not the opponent. i.e. It is obviously more of an impressive feat if you manage to make 2 tackles+interceptions in a 90 minutes when an opponent has only 30% of the ball, than if you manage the same 2 but while the opponent dominates the ball with 60% possession.
 
Top_Bins said:
I'd love us to sign Mateus Fernandes.
I think he's going to be a top player and we may get him for a decent fee.
Click to expand...
Like him too, has impressed me at West Ham. Kees Smit looks like another top talent on the verge of breaking through.
 
goldenboy said:
Errrrr no.

Making it 'Pass-adjusted' is precisely the context which rectifies the issue.

'Pass-adjusted Tackles+Interceptions per 90' means that instead of just adding up the total number of tackles+interceptions per 90, it relativises the number to how much possession the opponent has. Because obviously you can't make a tackle or interception when you have the ball, not the opponent. i.e. It is obviously more of an impressive feat if you manage to make 2 tackles+interceptions in a 90 minutes when an opponent has only 30% of the ball, than if you manage the same 2 but while the opponent dominates the ball with 60% possession.
Click to expand...
Yes...as said already. I think everyone gets how it's calculated?
The stat is flawed even without the adjustment, the adjustment arguably makes it even less accurate because you've added a further layer ontop. There's no context for tactics, the player's role, the opponent, in this specific case it also puts more value on something like a tackle (often the result of being out of position) vs being in a good position and forcing the opponent to pass the ball.

Your last sentence shows you do not understand. You have reduced football to a purely stats based game, devoid of any context. Why would 2 tackles + interceptions in 90 mins when the opponent has 30% of the ball be 'obviously more impressive' than if you managed the same two when the opponent has 60% possession?
 
Poor source but yesterday, footmercato linked us with Papa Gueye from Villarreal.

Anyone know much about him?

Apparently he had a solid AFCON and we want him to replace Casemiro.
 
Camavinga. I think Real would sell for the right price and he would be a terrific signing.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
Is he really a signing to move the needle? As you say, seems to have issues staying fit but also it's not like he's that young and there's a lot of improvement to come, he will be 25 before next season starts so these next few seasons should be his peak. I think this about Anderson as well in honesty, it's so hard to judge these guys playing in teams that set up differently and most weeks play on the counter. As we have seen, you can rack up great stats for shit like 'progressive passes' playing as the underdog team and you'll have a load of defensive contributions but ultimately we're looking to sign someone who would be amongst the best in the world on the ball as well as off the ball ideally.
Click to expand...

Very difficult to find a signing who moves the needle, without it being a gamble. We could go for 80-100 Mn player somewhere, or we could find a good deal where the player is just about to hit their peak value. It could be Onana, but may as well not be.

I do share your concerns (not about the age though). There aren't any obvious signings out there. Specific to Onana, I think he wouldn't have a low floor. Essentially, we wouldn't get a Ugarte like shock to the system. He has been quite brilliant in certain games, but again, not available for so many. I do have a feeling though that he just could be one of those who, on the back of a good season, would suddenly be touted as a 75 million+ player.
 
In the context of what we need and what we have, you're looking at starters and depth for:
A sitting/holding midfielder who is more positionally, defensively focused (currently Casemiro)
A more expansive midfielder who has more license to roam (currently Mainoo).

Both do a bit of everything of course, it's a pair behind Bruno as the 10, but you need to look at who complements who. Mainoo is here to stay and I don't think it's wise to spend 100m on a player to compete with him. Mateus Fernandes would be quite good as the depth and competition here, or Joao Gomes from Wolves. The partner to Mainoo should look to compliment him best though. Is Elliot Anderson that player, not for me. Baleba (the potential) is that player still I think. Ugarte as the depth to that is still probably not a bad thing to keep, but if we sell him then we need to find another player who can be the more holding mid.

Nobody is going to be perfect, so it's about finding balance and improving in other ways. The set pieces will be a big loss regardless, and finding the right defensive ability will be hard to match up with Casemiros deep playmaking and passing range. But you can improve in press resistance, energy, pace and how the partner to Mainoo can cover ground (Baleba excels here).
 
JPRouve said:
For me Man Utd Koné is difficult to ignore. He is both skilled and a pretty good ball winner.
Click to expand...

I have watched him a lot for Roma this season and I am certain he would adapt to the PL pretty easily which is not always the case with players coming from another league. He is a nice blend of power and technique and is just about to enter his peak years.
 
Nickelodeon said:
Very difficult to find a signing who moves the needle, without it being a gamble. We could go for 80-100 Mn player somewhere, or we could find a good deal where the player is just about to hit their peak value. It could be Onana, but may as well not be.

I do share your concerns (not about the age though). There aren't any obvious signings out there. Specific to Onana, I think he wouldn't have a low floor. Essentially, we wouldn't get a Ugarte like shock to the system. He has been quite brilliant in certain games, but again, not available for so many. I do have a feeling though that he just could be one of those who, on the back of a good season, would suddenly be touted as a 75 million+ player.
Click to expand...
True, it depends on who is the coach as well. Finding a 6 who is great in possession is much harder, for me, than signing more of an engine all rounder type.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
True, it depends on who is the coach as well. Finding a 6 who is great in possession is much harder, for me, than signing more of an engine all rounder type.
Click to expand...

I also struggle with the profile we should be targeting. Unsure if we should try to find someone who's great in possession and build up (like a Frenkie De Jong), or more of a energetic ball winner (Kante) or someone in Casemiro mould who can keep things simple with the ball, but provide protection to the back line and be a set piece threat as well.
 
I’ve read a lot of rumors the last day or two of Sean Steur from Ajax. Never heard of him. Any good and what’s his best position (6 or 8) and play style? Decent passer and physique?
 
Bouaddi and Man Utd kone would both be fantastic signings imo.

I saw we were linked with Papa Guyey today at Villareal. Looks a very physical and athletic player but haven't watched him play live before.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.