Mourinho's signings at United

Focusmate

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I just don't think signings are necessarily primarily the managers any more. We looked at Maguire last year, Ed decided no but changed his mind this year. Is this somehow a success for Ole?
A lot of players like Pogba were being worked on years before being signed.
Its 80% on Ed, the board, scouts and Judge, and maybe 20% the manager if one of their suggested priorities gets picked.
Main problem we have is no DOF setting a clear playing style and long term vision, for which the right players are then signed.
No idea why Mourinho has been singled out when out signings for the last 10 years have been dire..
 

Karlos PFC

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A lot of people myself included expected mikhi to flop just like kagawa. He was never that special.

The rest are all just excuses. If you cant accept how shit of a signing lukaku and matic have been you're biased.

We are obsessed with Mourinho because its inprotant people realize how much he fecked us up before getting impatient with ole.
Lukaku was a bad signing that did not suit us but certainly not a bad player.
Matic at the time I thought was a short term solution, the argument still holds though. He is a better player than MCT or whoever else in that position in the team. The downside of course is his age.

I dont think that Mourinho fecked us more than Moyes or Van Gaal (for some, I loved the guy he was a joy, more than his football. But that's another topic) did. Mourinho had his share of course but the problem lies with Ole. The hugest mistake Ed did all these years (and made alot of terrible ones this cnut) was not going all in for Poch. Ole I hope someday be a great coach but I can't see this happening any time soon.

Up until Christmas we'll be outside of the top 6. And once again we will be looking for a manager. And the only available is Alegri at the moment. I dont think the fans will accept him, they couldn't stand Mou. Same philosophy. I hope we'll go for Poch or else Ten Hag or Tuchel.
 
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mariachi-19

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I just don't think signings are necessarily primarily the managers any more. We looked at Maguire last year, Ed decided no but changed his mind this year. Is this somehow a success for Ole?
A lot of players like Pogba were being worked on years before being signed.
Its 80% on Ed, the board, scouts and Judge, and maybe 20% the manager if one of their suggested priorities gets picked.
Main problem we have is no DOF setting a clear playing style and long term vision, for which the right players are then signed.
No idea why Mourinho has been singled out when out signings for the last 10 years have been dire..
Bollocks. You can also hardly blame Ed if that were the case on the basis that Mourinho had brought in two previous central defenders of an age where there was scope for development. When it became obvious last year that one in particular was not up to the task, we've rightly decided to invest in Stones.
 
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Ekeke

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He still contributed way more than the like of Jones for his huge wages or Rojo or Young or let's talk about Sanchez . But nah you speak about one of our only successful signings of the recent history . Bizarre
He was paid double Jones, Rojo or Young. Strange that you dont get that someone being paid as a superstar but only being quite good is a problem
 

Leftback99

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16/17 wasn't bad and the season was a reasonably success. For me it all started going wrong with Ibrahimovic's injury, suddenly we needed an £80m striker to replace a better player we lost for nothing. The money could have been better used elsewhere or instead of cheap 2nd rate targets.
 

Enigma_87

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Eric Baily (Shit - should be sold)
Zlatan Imbrahimovich (Olddie but a goodie - Gone but not forgotten)
Henrikh Mkhitaryan (Shit - Sold)
Paul Pogba (very very good when he's on it, inconsistent - questions marks if he wants to be here)
Victor Lindelof (See Pogba but less good - should keep wants to be here)
Romelu Lukaku (Shit - sold)
Nemanja Matic (good for 3 months then shit - should be sold)
Alexis Sanchez (outrageously shit - on loan, should be sold)
Fred (inconsistent, flashes of quality - needs more time)
Diogo Dalot (handy player who I believe needs to play on the right wing more - prospect)
Lee Grant (who?)


So 5 players of which 3 of them were not deemed world class but haven't yet been deemed horrendous signings. that could quite easily fall to 2 being Pogba and Zlatan depending on how the others develop.

feck me, people complain about the Glazers not giving him money, but you can hardly blame them. There's no coherence or consistency in those players either. Its literally a scatter gun approach.
Mostly I'd agree. For some I don't.

Baily - is a good CB with potential but injuries took a toll on him. Not bad price so probably can give him some leeway.
Lukaku - also had bright moments.
Matic - fell off a cliff, started well.
Fred - very very shit considering the transfer sum. Don't know what we ever saw in him.

Overall:

Good signings: Pogba, Zlatan, Lindelof
So/so: Lukaku, Matic
Didn't turn well due to injuries: Baily
Bad to incredibly shit: Mkhi, Alexis, Fred
Jury is still out: Dalot
Make no difference: Grant.
 

GBBQ

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I just don't think signings are necessarily primarily the managers any more. We looked at Maguire last year, Ed decided no but changed his mind this year. Is this somehow a success for Ole?
The thing about that is, Mourinho had already spent relatively big in the previous 2 summer windows bringing in 2 central defenders with potential and not moving anyone on. I think the board are entitled to ask that he actually looks to coach the players he brought in first and foremost rather than trying something new each year.

For ole its different, he can come in, assess the squad and say these aren't going to work for my system, I need Maguire but I will get rid of x players to balance the books.
 

Tel074

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He was paid double Jones, Rojo or Young. Strange that you dont get that someone being paid as a superstar but only being quite good is a problem
If you think he was quite good then you should watch another sport . He has a great season with us . You cant be so idiotic to not realise what you wrote is moronic but instead of back tracking you are going to keep running with it . I will say it again to pick out Zlatan as one player who didn't deserve what he earned is beyond belief when he have a squad full of guys earning way way above what they deserve
 

fps

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He was paid double Jones, Rojo or Young. Strange that you dont get that someone being paid as a superstar but only being quite good is a problem
No, it's very odd that you're singling out one player who was a definite success. It doesn't matter how much he was paid, he sold more shirts and got more clicks and made far more money back for the club than those guys. Additionally, he scored 28 goals in 46 games, or whatever it was, so his contribution in that season was more than Jones has contributed, in a defensive sense, for United in the 25 years he's been at the club.
 

Enigma_87

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16/17 wasn't bad and the season was a reasonably success. For me it all started going wrong with Ibrahimovic's injury, suddenly we needed an £80m striker to replace a better player we lost for nothing. The money could have been better used elsewhere or instead of cheap 2nd rate targets.
We had to get a top striker at the time. Unfortunately our options were limited to Lukaku and Morata. Either of them wouldn't work. We probably made the better choice in Lukaku as he still got some goals and most of the money back.
 

buchansleftleg

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I'm mystified that some are surprised at this. Outside of what he achieved with Porto "the translator" has only ever had one transfer strategy...Keep buying. He just keeps buying players and then discarding them. It's probably why he loves buying older players as he has an inbuilt excuse if they fail...they failed to adapt, or they lost a yard etc etc

I now feel used and dirty that he was ever involved in the club.
 

Leftback99

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We had to get a top striker at the time. Unfortunately our options were limited to Lukaku and Morata. Either of them wouldn't work. We probably made the better choice in Lukaku as he still got some goals and most of the money back.
I'm not saying it wasn't the right decision to buy Lukaku at the time (I'd have done the same) but if Ibra didn't get injured we most likely wouldn't have bought a striker that summer and improved the team elsewhere.
 

Enigma_87

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I'm not saying it wasn't the right decision to buy Lukaku at the time (I'd have done the same) but if Ibra didn't get injured we most likely wouldn't have bought a striker that summer and improved the team elsewhere.
Probably. My biggest gripe with Mourinho was(considering his record before) not being able to get our CB pairing sorted for that long. He should booted Smalling/Jones much earlier and tried at least another one before the third season.
 

romufc

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I just don't think signings are necessarily primarily the managers any more. We looked at Maguire last year, Ed decided no but changed his mind this year. Is this somehow a success for Ole?
A lot of players like Pogba were being worked on years before being signed.
Its 80% on Ed, the board, scouts and Judge, and maybe 20% the manager if one of their suggested priorities gets picked.
Main problem we have is no DOF setting a clear playing style and long term vision, for which the right players are then signed.
No idea why Mourinho has been singled out when out signings for the last 10 years have been dire..
So why does having a better manager help in bringing signings?

Only clubs like Real, Barca, Juve who sign galacticos the managers have minimal say.

In the prem we have seen managers have a say. Fellaini was not a Moyes signing?

Rodri not a Pep signing?

Managers get a say in signings, if you think otherwise i'm afraid you are getting it wrong.

We would not have signed Dan James under Jose.

The Maguire's, AWB's of this world are signings clubs make because
a) the manager has a requirement of a player in that area
b) any United manager would have taken Maguire and AWB
 

Keefy18

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I don't need to be on the board of the club to know the motive behind each signing.....
Actually you would, otherwise you just come across as some smug twat thinking he has insider knowledge but in reality you haven't a clue at all. You've clearly had your head buried in idiotic, brainless anti Glazer crap being spun around twittah and buying it like its the gospel.

The link you posted has no bearing at all - what do you expect Jose to say concerning the signings of his CEO? "Alright, fellas. welcome to this press conference. I'd like to categorically state I do not like the signings made this window." Is it crack? Obviously, he's got to come out and do PR stunts like all is well in the hood.
Dismisses my link that has actual quotes in it, but then proceeds to put up a link from an utter s*it rag like the mirror as "evidence" to support his claims. :lol::houllier:

How many times did Jose say he should be called a head coach, rather than a football manager last summer? He was subliminally telling whoever could read between the lines that he's got no say on whom United bring in or not. He can only submit a list of players. The board then decides whether to pursue his targets or not.
Yeah, nah...that's not quite how transfers work. It isn't that black and white and straight forward as you suggest.

Scouting and the manager / coaches will source targets and of course fire over a list and contact is made with the club to agree that they can discuss a possible transfer and in turn negotiations commence if all that is agreed.

When it gets to the financials, the manager would of course be involved in discussions to a degree. The financials obviously have an impact on how the manager can build his team, that is just common sense. It's beyond ridiculous to suggest that a manager simply fires over a list / report and that's their part closed out. They will be privy to the numbers mentioned in terms of transfer fee and wages and how that affects their budget.

Personally I believe Ole did want another CM this summer for example but his heart was absolutely set on getting Maguire done so that was that. Sales then had to be completed as well and thanks to LCFC being dicks about the transfer and dragging it out we missed out on a CM.

Your saying Sanchez was solely an Ed signing, yet ignore that Jose was already previously targeting not one...but 2 ageing wide attacking players in Perisic & Willian. The board agreed to give him Sanchez, a PL proven attacking player who up to that point was one of the leagues best attackers in the previous 3 seasons at least. Arguably the best option of the 3, but no one could of predicted how utterly shambolic it'd turn out to be.

Simple question, if a manager is demanding Sanchez and the board deliver...who's fault is it then? The manager who demanded him or the board showing support to the manager making that demand?

That's Ed admitting his mistake in signing Sanchez. We all know Woodward sees commercial revenue first before football ability when it comes to marquee players. Before Sanchez, United went after Bastian, Di Maria, Falcao, etc. Were those Jose's signings too or you simply cannot see a similar pattern of Woodward's incompetence concerning transfers?
Bastian was an ex LVG player, the feck you on about. LVG rated him extremely highly, utter BS to say he was a marketing signing.

ADM was arguably one of the best wide attacking players in the world at the time. It was wrong to sign him though cause he didn't want to be here, but LVG also admitted he rated him very highly and had previously tried to sign him a number of years prior.

Falcao was deemed good enough for Jose to sign him after we let him go, but OK.
 

Mike Phelan's Former Tash

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Mourinho didn't think Lukaku was good enough for Chelsea when he was their manager so why the feck did he ever think he was good enough for Manchester United!? (he wasn't btw and Ole could see that because he was good enough for United and knows what it takes).

When we signed Miki, what was the plan for him? Same for Sanchez. We had Martial playing well at the time and he was dropped. Why? He moaned about not getting a new CB, he signed Bailly and Lindelof but still played Jones and Smalling! Why not go for Verane, Giminez, Godin or Bonnuchi - experienced quality defenders!?

I'm just glad the mourinho reign is over. It was enevitable that he would manage United at some point, if it wasn't then it would be now.

Ole has done well so far to repair the damage.
 

Aouer-United

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Are people seriously claiming that Jose wasn’t backed fully in his third summer transfer window? Not to mention the list of target he gave Woodward were awfully bad, especially he include the likes of Boateng, Toby, Willian, bale, Rebic, Pereric, Godin, etc. The board could choose to back him fully if they want but we’d be still end up with more deadwoods. He spent on 400m, he could have spent closer to 600m or so if he was backed fully in his third summer and all his supposed targets will not improve United in the future.

The problem is, he is not trying hard to improve the squad, he is just too nice to the player we consider it as deadwood, like “if they want to leave, they can leave” rather than “I need to get rid of them, they need to be shipped off because they wasn’t enough good for us” and we didn’t get rid of many deadwoods in all summer.

I think the board would back him fully if he have shown more progressive in brand of football, improving players to be better. So he didn’t do that, the board would ask themselves “do we need to back him blindly when he haven’t met our expectations on our investment we spent and the player wasn’t improved or not performing so well under Jose and the brand of football is not enough good with the massive investment we spent” whilst looking at City and Liverpool’s investment and development in player and brand of football gotten better under Pep and Klopp.

So yeah, I’m glad the board didn’t back him in his 3rd season because I’d be afraid we’d be ending up with more deadwood that is like tot stay here for years.
 

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Dismisses my link that has actual quotes in it, but then proceeds to put up a link from an utter s*it rag like the mirror as "evidence" to support his claims. :lol::houllier:
If only you could read, you would see that the mirror link was culled from The Sunday Times. I couldn't post the original link because the article is behind a paywall. So your "utter s*it rag" description of the link failed just like the rest of your codswallop.


What a load of shit. The arse clown has spent his entire career running from burning dumpster fires that he creates in order retain his reputation as a top class manager.
>81 points with Smalling/Jones in his defence
>2nd place finish - above media darlings like Klopp, Pochettino and Wenger
>2 trophies.

Problem for him now is only deluded fools are buying into his bullshit at United. He unequivocally failed after being backed by some 400 million worth of signings and the club finally evaluated his proposals and said no. Look at the list on my op, rightly so.
A manager won 2 trophies, got the club to a 2nd(the highest position since SAF's retirement), beat the other 19 teams in the league but he unequivocally failed. This is hilarious.

You don’t think I’m right? Why isn’t he in a managing job? Nobody within the Jose “circle of clubs I’m willing to put reputation on the line with” (ie cashed to the moon) want to touch him with a 10 foot barge pole.
This is a piss-poor argument.

Wenger, Allegri, Spalletti aren't managing - it must be because they spent their entire career running from burning dumpster fires that they have created in order to retain their reputations as top tier managers.
 

Ekeke

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>81 points with Smalling/Jones in his defence
>2nd place finish - above media darlings like Klopp, Pochettino and Wenger
>2 trophies.


A manager won 2 trophies, got the club to a 2nd(the highest position since SAF's retirement), beat the other 19 teams in the league but he unequivocally failed. This is hilarious.
Would have had another 10 points if any of his signings had worked out at all that season.



Our biggest ever transfer budget (£175 million) and we came 2nd by a large distance of 19 points. Not good enough
 

fergiesarmy1

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2nd position is overhyped. Of course, it is.

Meanwhile, finishing 6th last season was under-rated.:D
I remember Fergie finishing 2nd in his first full season coming from 11th the season before. He was so impressed with that he tore that team up and started again.
 

charlenefan

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He’s gone thank god, that 2nd placed finish was so overhyped as well.
Was it? I mean it's not a great achievement for Man Utd but we finished with 81 points that season, that's the same number of points that won Leicester the PL, it's only 6 points off the total that won Chelsea the league before that and only 5 points off the total that won City the league before that. Our last title win we finished with 89 points.

Again finishing 2nd is not anything for a Man Utd side to shout about but we showed some pretty good consistency that season with there being a couple of pretty obvious standout periods that you could pinpoint as where any title challenge was lost (as well as other factors of course like brining Sanchez in)

Considering the points totals before and since (all post Fergie) it's quite obviously our best league campaign
 

fergiesarmy1

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Was it? I mean it's not a great achievement for Man Utd but we finished with 81 points that season, that's the same number of points that won Leicester the PL, it's only 6 points off the total that won Chelsea the league before that and only 5 points off the total that won City the league before that. Our last title win we finished with 89 points.

Again finishing 2nd is not anything for a Man Utd side to shout about but we showed some pretty good consistency that season with there being a couple of pretty obvious standout periods that you could pinpoint as where any title challenge was lost (as well as other factors of course like brining Sanchez in)

Considering the points totals before and since (all post Fergie) it's quite obviously our best league campaign
I remember it as Liverpool (especially) and Arsenal concentrating on Europe allowing us to take 2nd after we dismally went out of Europe at the 2nd round stage leaving us with nothing else to focus on.
 

charlenefan

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I remember it as Liverpool (especially) and Arsenal concentrating on Europe allowing us to take 2nd after we dismally went out of Europe at the 2nd round stage leaving us with nothing else to focus on.
Well firstly you dont remember it very well as it was Chelsea for long periods under Conte who were the biggest threat to the 2nd place position and that regardless the points total is still what it is and while yes Mourinho fecked us over in the UCL we did have the FA Cup final that season as well
 

fergiesarmy1

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Well firstly you dont remember it very well as it was Chelsea for long periods under Conte who were the biggest threat to the 2nd place position and that regardless the points total is still what it is and while yes Mourinho fecked us over in the UCL we did have the FA Cup final that season as well
Well they finished 11 points behind us and our form wasn’t fantastic closing the season with 10 points from the last 15 so they couldn’t have been that close.

I did forget about the cup final though, thanks for reminding me :lol:
 

amolbhatia50k

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We did well to get 2nd but everyone who was paying attention knew that we were not making the progress we needed to, and that the early season form and the points tally/position itself flattered us. And those people called Liverpool actually looking the team headed in the correct direction.

The football in the second half of the season. Sanchez signing and displacing Martial. Lukaku's weaknesses becoming more evident. The football being turgid and insipid as the season wore on. His transfers doing sod all. From what I recall, we were all fine with 2nd place but the feeling and progress was not great.
 

Keefy18

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>81 points with Smalling/Jones in his defence
>2nd place finish - above media darlings like Klopp, Pochettino and Wenger
>2 trophies.

A manager won 2 trophies, got the club to a 2nd(the highest position since SAF's retirement), beat the other 19 teams in the league but he unequivocally failed. This is hilarious.
Hilarious? I'll tell ya what's hilarious.

Yeah whilst he ditched his own investments of Bailly and Lindelof for the majority.

Will ya ever give over about the 2nd placed finish, he was feckin 19 pts from City that year! Jesus, LVG's 5th place Finish saw him only 14pts off then Champions.

He was utterly, utterly destroyed by a far more competent manager in Pep. He's had riches the vast majority of managers can only dream of, so give over with the woe is Jose utter tripe!

The 2 trophies were B Cups! The Europa League win arguably kept him in his job after an utterly dreadful season finishing 6th.

This is doing the rounds today, about £450m of that £1.6B was spent specifically at United in two and a half seasons here, that's before we get into the fact he oversaw a 46% increase in our wage bill.

The man is finished at a top level and will never manage a big club again, Why?

He is a slow, brutal cancer to any club. He is a poison!

[/QUOTE]
 

Jackal

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Hilarious? I'll tell ya what's hilarious.

Yeah whilst he ditched his own investments of Bailly and Lindelof for the majority.

Will ya ever give over about the 2nd placed finish, he was feckin 19 pts from City that year! Jesus, LVG's 5th place Finish saw him only 14pts off then Champions.

He was utterly, utterly destroyed by a far more competent manager in Pep. He's had riches the vast majority of managers can only dream of, so give over with the woe is Jose utter tripe!

The 2 trophies were B Cups! The Europa League win arguably kept him in his job after an utterly dreadful season finishing 6th.

This is doing the rounds today, about £450m of that £1.6B was spent specifically at United in two and a half seasons here, that's before we get into the fact he oversaw a 46% increase in our wage bill.

The man is finished at a top level and will never manage a big club again, Why?

He is a slow, brutal cancer to any club. He is a poison!

This is the worst propaganda I have seen.

Did you bother to check how much spent per player before coming with this pathetic list? Are you aware Jose started managing 8 good years before Pep? If anything, this list is a big indictment on Pep, rather than Jose.

Hilarious? I'll tell ya what's hilarious.

Yeah whilst he ditched his own investments of Bailly and Lindelof for the majority.
He ditched them cos they proved not to be good enough. Pep ditched Bravo and Nolito, where's the outrage against him? Klopp ditched Karius and Klavan, where is the protest from Liverpool fans.

United got the pair of Lindelof/Bailly(2 unproven rookies) at £60m while Liverpool got one quality defender at £75m. When you buy substandard products, you often have to change them quicker than the guy that buys quality.

Will ya ever give over about the 2nd placed finish, he was feckin 19 pts from City that year! Jesus, LVG's 5th place Finish saw him only 14pts off then Champions.
If he was 19 points from City that year, how many points off were Klopp, Poch and Wenger?

LVG's 5th finish wasn't against Pep. It's highly irrelevant to this discourse. Compare like for like.

He was utterly, utterly destroyed by a far more competent manager in Pep. He's had riches the vast majority of managers can only dream of, so give over with the woe is Jose utter tripe!
He wasn't destroyed by Pep. Pep got a more comfortable rebuilding job to do. Pep inherited a squad that won the PL in the penultimate season before he arrived and they were a goal away from playing in the Champions League final the previous season. That squad already had 5 world class players in Aguero, Kompany, David Silva, Sterling and Fernandinho. Pep came in and bought 22 players(outspent Jose Mourinho) as an addition to the strong foundation he inherited.

Jose's rebuilding job was more difficult. He took over a hapless squad whose last PL win was 2013 and their best CL run was in 2014 under Moyes(round of 16). There was a gulf in the quality of both teams. City were miles ahead. The only world class player United had when Jose arrived was De Gea. Rooney was finished by 2015/16 and the rest of the squad was brimming with quack players. Man Utd board didn't have the gift of foresight to outspend Man City so they can be at par with them on the pitch.

The 2 trophies were B Cups! The Europa League win arguably kept him in his job after an utterly dreadful season finishing 6th.
It wasn't Jose's fault United found themselves in a B-competition. LVG dumped United in Europa league. What's Jose to do? If he had lost a KO game against a club from Romania, you would have mocked him. Damned if he won Europa league, damned if he had been eliminated from it. Don't let your bias becloud your use of logic.

This is doing the rounds today, about £450m of that £1.6B was spent specifically at United in two and a half seasons here, that's before we get into the fact he oversaw a 46% increase in our wage bill.
Mourinho does not control transfer market. United's wage bill went bananas the moment someone thought Rooney should be paid £300,000 per week. Don't put this on Jose. Woodward writes the contracts.

The man is finished at a top level and will never manage a big club again, Why?
We shall revisit this later - when he gets another big job and wins a league title before United do.

He is a slow, brutal cancer to any club. He is a poison!
This brutal cancerous manager gave United their best season since SAF retired.

I reiterate, y'all are hilarious.
 
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Keefy18

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This is the worst propaganda I have seen.

Did you bother to check how much spent per player before coming with this pathetic list? Are you aware Jose started managing 8 good years before Pep? If anything, this list is a big indictment on Pep, rather than Jose.
You mean long before player prices vastly inflated? OK then.

He ditched them cos they proved not to be good enough. Pep ditched Bravo and Nolito, where's the outrage against him? Klopp ditched Karius and Klavan, where is the protest from Liverpool fans.
So he invested poorly then? You admit he bought poorly which is the entire point of the thread ya clown.

Bravo was 17m, we spent more on De Gea... 5 years previous. Nolito likewise was £14m. Bailly cost more than both of them alone!

Karius & Klavan didn't together, didn't even cost £10m. Jesus wept what utterly stupid comparisons.

United got the pair of Lindelof/Bailly(2 unproven rookies) at £60m while Liverpool got one quality defender at £75m. When you buy substandard products, you often have to change them quicker than the guy that buys quality.
Oh great, you see the difference then.

Weren't Karius & Klavan largely "unproven" as well? I mean Klavan's biggest club prior to Liverpool was Augsburg or AZ Alkmaar! Karius was very much an untested rookie, only experience was Mainz!

You've just contradicted yourself here between the above 2 sentiments.

If he was 19 points from City that year, how many points off were Klopp, Poch and Wenger?
What's it matter, end goal is winning the league? He was further away than LVG was.

Spin it anyway you like, he failed miserably and your utterly brainwashed... what is known as a Joseite.


He wasn't destroyed by Pep. Pep got a more comfortable rebuilding job to do. Pep inherited a squad that won the PL in the penultimate season before he arrived and they were a goal away from playing in the Champions League final the previous season. That squad already had 5 world class players in Aguero, Kompany, David Silva, Sterling and Fernandinho. Pep came in and bought 22 players(outspent Jose Mourinho) as an addition to the strong foundation he inherited.
He was utterly destroyed by Pep!

Pep inherited a squad with some ageing players, players under performing and over paid. He shifted dead wood, something Jose simply didn't do to raise funds for further transfers. Pray tell how LVG & Ole both managed to shift on dead wood but Jose couldn't in rebuilding? You know well he feckin failed miserably but pains you to admit it.

In Jose's first 2 season's here he openly praised the board, stated openly he got 7 of 8 of his desired players. He had Zero, zero... excuses for failing as bad as he did.

On top of that due to his continual demands of big name signings we saw our wage bill double (46%) during his 2 years approx here.

Pep largely kept City's wage budget under control due to the outgoing as just pointed out.

Jose's rebuilding job was more difficult. He took over a hapless squad whose last PL win was 2013 and their best CL run was in 2014 under Moyes(round of 16). There was a gulf in the quality of both teams. City were miles ahead. The only world class player United had when Jose arrived was De Gea. Rooney was finished by 2015/16 and the rest of the squad was brimming with quack players. Man Utd board didn't have the gift of foresight to outspend Man City so they can be at par with them on the pitch.
This is complete and utter, utter, utter.... Bollicks!

Jose took over a young team on the up. He was announced on the day of us winning our first trophy post Fergie, a team that finished level on points with City who you said were in better shape than us... so which is it? You can't have it both way for god sake.

If City were a better team and Pep had less work, does that mean LVG over achieved?

Fast forward a year City were 9pts ahead, fast forward 2 years... 19pts. By the time he got sacked.... 12pts after 17 games!

But he was a glowing success right?

It wasn't Jose's fault United found themselves in a B-competition. LVG dumped United in Europa league. What's Jose to do? If he had lost a KO game against a club from Romania, you would have mocked him. Damned if he won Europa league, damned if he had been eliminated from it. Don't let your bias becloud your use of logic.



Mourinho does not control transfer market. United's wage bill went bananas the moment someone thought Rooney should be paid £300,000 per week. Don't put this on Jose. Woodward writes the contracts.
He has input and its naive to suggest otherwise.

He demands certain players and Ed / Board has to be seen supporting him in turn.

I mean he demanded Fellaini be kept ffs and here you are defending him? How utterly clueless can you be man! Darmian as well, refused to sell him time and time again...goes back to my point above about not selling deadwood.

If he's demanding big names like Zlatan (16m in wages), Pogba (15m), Sanchez (24m) and Rom (12m)... its on him as much as anyone else.

We are paying the price for his childish demands.



We shall revisit this later - when he gets another big job and wins a league title before United do.
Who's signing him ffs? He's with Sky!

He's finished completely.

Shocking, utterly feckin shocking we've folks defending him.

He's the most damaging manager hired in the post Fergie years.

His term here saw our spending become utterly reckless, he created player power, enforced half arsed efforts from senior players and refused to drop them (Rom & Matic), ignored youth (Martial & Rashford were 2 of Europe's best young talents in 2016 and have never recovered since). He openly abused the clubs history, mocked the Munich disaster by showing up in a feckin track suit, mocked players and fell out with the board, enforced players openly being unprofessional over social media...

But hey, he won a league cup and Europa so he's a feckin god to his brain washed followers.
 

Jackal

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You mean long before player prices vastly inflated? OK then.
So why bring up the idiotic stats on money spent then? So you knew there was inflation and yet to presented the stats regardless cos you thought you were debating with an illiterate? Mourinho also spent money during the era of vastly inflated prices so your point does not hold water. Mourinho bought Pogba and Lukaku for £89m and £75m respectively.


So he invested poorly then? You admit he bought poorly which is the entire point of the thread ya clown.

Bravo was 17m, we spent more on De Gea... 5 years previous. Nolito likewise was £14m. Bailly cost more than both of them alone!

Karius & Klavan didn't together, didn't even cost £10m. Jesus wept what utterly stupid comparisons.
Why do you care how much was spent? The crux of the issue is only Mourinho gets criticised for trying to replace a player he bought. How much was spent is vastly irrelevant. According to your theory, Pep and Klopp also bought poorly but they were backed by their respective boards to replace their mistakes.


Oh great, you see the difference then.

Weren't Karius & Klavan largely "unproven" as well? I mean Klavan's biggest club prior to Liverpool was Augsburg or AZ Alkmaar! Karius was very much an untested rookie, only experience was Mainz!

You've just contradicted yourself here between the above 2 sentiments.
You are still debating yourself. Karius and Klavan were unproven - Klopp bought them and he was allowed to replace them. Lindelof and Bailly were also unproven but Jose was vetoed off when he asked for Toby Alderweireld and Boateng. How can you not see the difference?

Besides, there are several rumours that Bailly and Lindelof were even scouted and imposed on Jose by Woodward. Throughout his career, there has never been a time he used unproven rookies in his defence. He's a highly defensive manager who always used players with wealth of experience in his defence. Carvalho, Ramos Lucio, Zanetti, Terry, etc.

What's it matter, end goal is winning the league? He was further away than LVG was.

Spin it anyway you like, he failed miserably and your utterly brainwashed... what is known as a Joseite.
LVG finished with 70 points in 14/15 and 66 points in 15/16. Deduct those points from the record breaking Pep side that finished with 100 points. He was further away? How did you arrive at that conclusion? Did you use abacus counting?

He was utterly destroyed by Pep!
With the quality of players at their disposal, this was inevitable. Pep was given a job where it's impossible to fail.

Pep inherited a squad with some ageing players, players under performing and over paid. He shifted dead wood, something Jose simply didn't do to raise funds for further transfers. Pray tell how LVG & Ole both managed to shift on dead wood but Jose couldn't in rebuilding? You know well he feckin failed miserably but pains you to admit it.
Ageing players that got into CL semis - a feat Pep is yet to achieve with his megabillions. The same ageing players won the league 2 seasons before Pep's arrival. The same ageing players never dropped out of top 4. Keep deluding yourself comparing their quality to United's. United made top 4 once in that period. They finished 7th under Moyes, 4th and 5th under LVG.

In Jose's first 2 season's here he openly praised the board, stated openly he got 7 of 8 of his desired players. He had Zero, zero... excuses for failing as bad as he did.
And he delivered in those first two seasons. This club had forgotten what it meant to be in the Champions League. Jose qualified United for CL throughout his stay at United and he even went further to get United into the KO stage. Something his predecessors couldn't achieve consistently.

On top of that due to his continual demands of big name signings we saw our wage bill double (46%) during his 2 years approx here.
You gave Rooney £300k/week. When quality players(Pogba, Ibra, Sanchez, etc) arrived, it was only natural they wanted the same. The wage structure was destroyed long before Jose arrived. Stop blaming everything on Jose.

Pep largely kept City's wage budget under control due to the outgoing as just pointed out.

This is complete and utter, utter, utter.... Bollicks!
The stats state otherwise. United won only the FA cup in the 3 seasons after SAF. Jose took over and won 2 trophies in his debut.

Jose took over a young team on the up. He was announced on the day of us winning our first trophy post Fergie, a team that finished level on points with City who you said were in better shape than us... so which is it? You can't have it both way for god sake.
City were in a better shape than United. City achieved their objective - they made top 4, United didn't. Stop colouring failure with beautiful words like finishing level on points with City. City made semi finals of the CL that season & they won the Premier League trophy the previous season. How can you compare their squad with United who were eliminated in the group stage of CL, got demoted to Europa league and still got eliminated in the round of 16? Are you trolling?

A team on the up? :D

If City were a better team and Pep had less work, does that mean LVG over achieved?
LVG didn't overachieve, he was shit. Pep and LVG never competed head to head. Stop with the daft comparison.


Fast forward a year City were 9pts ahead, fast forward 2 years... 19pts. By the time he got sacked.... 12pts after 17 games!
Conveniently forgetting Pep had spent about £250m on his defence while United persisted with ex-wingers that were 32 years of age in their full backs. All the defenders Pep got rid of at City would conveniently walk into Man Utd's XI. That's the gulf in quality in between both clubs.

Did I also mention Ederson, Mendy, Walker, Stones and Laporte were all record signings at the time they were bought? Yet, you think it was the same level playing field comparing these seasoned players to Smalling, Jones, Young, Valencia, etc.

You are hilarious!!

But he was a glowing success right?
The best achievement since SAF - there's no debating.


He has input and its naive to suggest otherwise.

He demands certain players and Ed / Board has to be seen supporting him in turn.
He only provided the list of the players he wanted. It was up to Ed and co to either approve or admit it. That's no input. FFS, Jose asked for Perisic to complement the Lukaku signing but the board felt Lingard and Mata could fill the void.

I mean he demanded Fellaini be kept ffs and here you are defending him? How utterly clueless can you be man! Darmian as well, refused to sell him time and time again...goes back to my point above about not selling deadwood.
The same Fellaini that was instrumental to all the trophies and success United have had since his arrival. I'm now very confident you are one of the media-brainwashed sheep that just kowtow whatever gibberish that comes out of Gary Neville, Jamie Redknapp and the other morons in Sky studios. So how has the club fared since Fellaini's departure. Lingard took Fellaini's space since January - a youngster at 27 with 0 goals and 0 assists in all of 2019.

Of course, Fellaini was the problem.

If he's demanding big names like Zlatan (16m in wages), Pogba (15m), Sanchez (24m) and Rom (12m)... its on him as much as anyone else.

We are paying the price for his childish demands.
It's not on him that the new players met a wage structure that already had one player copping £300k/week. If the highest paid player was on £150k/week before Zlatan's arrival, they would never have demanded double of that. Rashford is on £250k/week - handed to him by Ed. Kane & Aguero earn less. Maybe you will blame Jose for that too.


Who's signing him ffs? He's with Sky!
He's finished completely.
Shocking, utterly feckin shocking we've folks defending him.
I shall remind you when he gets the next big job. It's not even up to a year since his last job. Why are you so sure he won't get another job?

He's the most damaging manager hired in the post Fergie years.
He's the most successful post Fergie too. Maybe, just maybe you don't understand what it takes to be successful. You have a creative manager now - lying 8th on the league table with a squad he was extremely happy with preseason.

His term here saw our spending become utterly reckless, he created player power, enforced half arsed efforts from senior players and refused to drop them (Rom & Matic), ignored youth (Martial & Rashford were 2 of Europe's best young talents in 2016 and have never recovered since). He openly abused the clubs history, mocked the Munich disaster by showing up in a feckin track suit, mocked players and fell out with the board, enforced players openly being unprofessional over social media...
He ignored youths? Rashford had more games under his belt than Ronaldo for United at the same age. Are you kidding me? Where do you get this misinformation from? Martial blew hot and cold and Jose axed him for his weird attitude. The treatment worked a treat - he was the goal getter before Jose himself got sacked by the inept Man Utd board.

Jose will not cuddle mediocre players and we have seen that even his successor can't seem to get the best out of these players.The narrative when Jose was here was that he was stifling Rashford with his defensive approach. Months later, it was because Jose didn't play him in the centre forward position. Jose got sacked and Ole was hired.

What has become the outcome since then? Rashford has 3 goals in 21 appearances from open play. The regular goal-getter(Lukaku) was hounded out by Sky pundits. He's on top of the league in Italy right now where Rashford(the best player since Pele) can't finish off Astana. Can't you just see that the media are just feeding you lots with nonsense? Think outside the box for once and admit everything you have heard from Skysports is complete bollocks.

But hey, he won a league cup and Europa so he's a feckin god to his brain washed followers.
He's been gone for 10 months now - we should be seeing changes already. Brendan Rodgers and Lampard have shown more promises than our current manager in the little time they have been at their jobs. Ole is faltering - 5 wins in the last 19 games. His team(the same one Jose held back) has scored a total of 17 goals in the last 16 games and there's been no away win since PSG.

However, he's positive, he believes in the youth, his style of play is attacking. We can ignore the poor results and focus on the positivity and the fat arm he wraps around the players that aren't performing for him.

You said Ole managed to shift 'deadwoods' - something Jose couldn't do while here. How has this panned out? No fit striker at the club. 2 goals down and the only hope was to bring on Lingard(goalless in 2019) to salvage the game. Jose wasn't interested in shifting 'deadwoods' because there was no promise of replacement. Ole took the dive regardless and it's come back to bite him in the arse.

When we finish 12th this season, I shall seek your opinion. I am going to ask whether we have progressed or regressed.

Have a nice day.....
 

mariachi-19

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I may be the devil, but i'm not a monster
You can add Fred to the list of shit players...

Mourinho was a wonderful manager :lol:

Edit: Roy Keane should have knocked him the feck out live on air last week. He talks about he always did what was right for Manchester United, there's the first move.
 
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