Moyes To Succeed Ferguson Anyone?

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Buchan

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BBC Sport ‏@BBCSport 2m
BREAKING: David Moyes is set to be appointed as Sir Alex Ferguson's successor at Manchester United - via @DavidBondBBC #bbcfootball #mufc


Utterly depressing.
 

Sultan

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Shimo said:
I am of the opposite mind - this is the time to go with "boring" - if boring means consistent and stable. Something Moyes will provide with the help of Ferguson in the background, then thank goodness.

A young manager will IMO be too scared all the time to fail coming into this position and will play even safer to make sure they keep their job and not be willing to risk as much or worse, the opposite and go gung-ho trying to stamp their own authority and fall flat on their face

A high profile manager such as Mourinho will have a real problem with "meddling" from Fergie behind closed doors and that will lead to more instability.

SAF himself leaving is going to have a gargantuan affect on the club but, then there is also David Gill leaving which is another huge change. Now is not the time to change the entire club.

I also don't understand your point on modernizing the club - what about our club is not modern? We have one of the best scouting networks, the immense investment in sports medicine and our training facility. Is it that under Ferguson there has been a strong feeling of unity/family whi that has no place in the modern game and rather we should just be looking for the next best thing and sell them on every few years to bring in something new?

What about Moyes makes him any less forward thinking? Hasn't he always tried to do what he can to move Everton forward as a club - using both youth and investing in foreign players when able? Everton in recent seasons have become even more likely to go and fight among the title chasers, not backing down and going for just the point.

It just seems a lot of people aren't too keen on Moyes because of the style of play Everton seem to use but, if you take a step back you'll see Moyes uses the resources he has to give him the best chance. I fully believe given the types of players United have, he will be more than willing to play a lot less hoof it up style.

The other thing is for United to become "modern" and "forward thinking" it's going to take more than a young vibrant manager. For United to change the way they play on the field it will start not with the next manager but, more so with a philosophy in the Academy/youth setups. A new manager coming in trying to just keep their head from being chopped up I don't see having the time to spend re-doing the whole youth setup.

Whoever the next manager is, I think the hierarchy - especially SAF will have spent a lot of time for what is best for the club in the long run - and that takes more imagination than trying to get the club to change to whatever the latest new it club seems to be in the news is.
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Fantastic post, buddy.
 

RK

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paceme said:
It mattered years ago, these days you can watch absolutely any opponent on tv/live by plane. It's experience of dealing with the extra games not the opposition.
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True, that's something worth thinking about. But then it becomes more of a management issue than an experience issue. Although Moyes hasn't had to deal with 4 competitions every season, he's managed with a smaller squad.
 

Sixpence

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RK said:
Has anyone considered that "European" experience generally means feck all?

A European football match is still a football match, you can learn all you need by studying your opponents and talking to people. If you have good experience, then you have good experience for Europe.

A good manager will tweak the playing style depending on opponent and objective. Not by making drastic changes.
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Yes but it's not just about the opponent, it's managing your squad to play 3 games in a week that is difficult and Fergie has made an art. Getting a plane to play in Turkey on a Wednesday then coming back to play at Anfield on a Sunday is something that will be alien to Moyes.

He will need to manage fitness levels very well. Fergie was the master of rotation and Moyes will have the biggest squad of players he's ever managed here, he has to keep them all happy and hungry. At present he's used to managing a tight knit squad, he now comes into a club with 30 top professionals who are all capable of playing.
 

Kevin

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I feel destroyed. Scousers and co must be exhilarated.
 

The Neviller

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Shimo said:
I am of the opposite mind - this is the time to go with "boring" - if boring means consistent and stable. Something Moyes will provide with the help of Ferguson in the background, then thank goodness.

A young manager will IMO be too scared all the time to fail coming into this position and will play even safer to make sure they keep their job and not be willing to risk as much or worse, the opposite and go gung-ho trying to stamp their own authority and fall flat on their face

A high profile manager such as Mourinho will have a real problem with "meddling" from Fergie behind closed doors and that will lead to more instability.

SAF himself leaving is going to have a gargantuan affect on the club but, then there is also David Gill leaving which is another huge change. Now is not the time to change the entire club.

I also don't understand your point on modernizing the club - what about our club is not modern? We have one of the best scouting networks, the immense investment in sports medicine and our training facility. Is it that under Ferguson there has been a strong feeling of unity/family whi that has no place in the modern game and rather we should just be looking for the next best thing and sell them on every few years to bring in something new?

What about Moyes makes him any less forward thinking? Hasn't he always tried to do what he can to move Everton forward as a club - using both youth and investing in foreign players when able? Everton in recent seasons have become even more likely to go and fight among the title chasers, not backing down and going for just the point.

It just seems a lot of people aren't too keen on Moyes because of the style of play Everton seem to use but, if you take a step back you'll see Moyes uses the resources he has to give him the best chance. I fully believe given the types of players United have, he will be more than willing to play a lot less hoof it up style.

The other thing is for United to become "modern" and "forward thinking" it's going to take more than a young vibrant manager. For United to change the way they play on the field it will start not with the next manager but, more so with a philosophy in the Academy/youth setups. A new manager coming in trying to just keep their head from being chopped up I don't see having the time to spend re-doing the whole youth setup.

Whoever the next manager is, I think the hierarchy - especially SAF will have spent a lot of time for what is best for the club in the long run - and that takes more imagination than trying to get the club to change to whatever the latest new it club seems to be in the news is.
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I never mentioned modernizing the club, you've put words in my mouth there.

I also never mentioned wanting the next bright young thing, or wanting to move players on, or not liking the family feel of United. Again, putting words in my mouth.

I also never mentioned completely changing United as a club, again putting words in my mouth. There's a theme developing here.

I simply said I'd have liked us to use this as an opportunity to bring in a vibrant young manager with new ideas, who may well develop our players and playing style to suit the modern demands of European football. I don't see Moyes doing that.
 

Rowem

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Would it make a jot of difference if Moyes had won an FA Cup/League Cup?

McClaren got the England job based off winning the League Cup and getting to the finals of Europa. Short term, reactionary thinking. United, and SAF, are excellent at lunderstanding the overall picture, looking beyond the obvious.
 

Buchan

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I can't believe we kept this under wraps for months and then acted this swiftly for David Moyes. You'd say something if we had to move fast to secure a Mourinho, a Guardiola or a Klopp, but Moyes?

I'm astounded.
 

Striker10

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Thick Numpty said:
So their experience is only a positive enough to cover Moyes inexperience, but not positive enough for them to do the job themselves? Read what I was replying to.
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Lets not forget Sir Alex will still be at the club but Europes just a small part. It's not a deal breaker. If it is and the club believes that, Moyes won't be the next United boss

The fact is the job entails far more then Europe. Far more. Europes the tip of the iceberg though. The fact is in Europe providing we do well, people will be more paitent and who knows? We might even do well. It comes down to the attitude and applicate of the players
 

syrian_scholes

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thegregster said:
Thats a fair point. My main worry about Sir Alex leaving has not been what would happen in the 1-2 seasons afterwards. I think he has the squad set up so well that we will be very competitive under any manager who is fairly decent in the short term.
The big worry is the long term polices of the new manager on transfers and youth systems. Also how long will the new manager last. You just know that certain managers would just be there short term.
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That's why I'm going to support Moyes, he has a great experience with youth and he made a lot of decent transfers for the low budget he had, and you just know if he did good he'll be here long term.
 

Mersault

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I don't think people are down on Moyes because he's no good, clearly he's a top class manager. It's just that we want the best there possibly is and Moyes is unproven in many respects - I mean SAF had a much more impressive CV when he joined us in '86 than Moyes has now IMO.
Moyes has not dealt with star-studded teams, he's not done anything in Europe, he's not won a trophy, he might not attract the same caliber players someone like Jose would for instance.

If he really is appointed, would be interesting to see who his assistant will be...
 

Godfather

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The more official it gets the more depressing it feels. On one day we lost SAF the next we appoint Moyes as his successor. Ah well. Hope he will surprise us all.
 

Man-United

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Interesting what happens with Rooney now. Forgiven but not forgotten regarding the Moyes vs Rooney saga.
 

Snowjoe

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Whoever it is doesn't need the fans on his back as soon as he is appointed. We all need to give him a chance and get behind him.
 

Chesterlestreet

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Kevin said:
I feel destroyed. Scousers and co must be exhilarated.
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They of all people should keep their traps well shut, actually. He has outfought 'em in the league the past couple of seasons with a squad which compares to ours like Brenton Rodgers compares to Fergie himself.
 

Ash_G

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An Irish Red said:
David Moyes consistently finishing upper mid-table is an over-achievement worthy of a chance to take over Manchester United? I genuinely have no idea how anyone can come to that conclusion, it's ludicrous. I don't think he's done enough to warrant a chance at the likes of Arsenal, never mind United.



It doesn't make you a muppet to think that one of the biggest clubs in the world shouldn't appoint a mid-table manager.
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What do you want from him? Winning a cup doesn't mean anything. Di Matteo isn't a great manager because he fluked a CL, nor would Grant if he had beaten us which in all honesty he was pretty damn close to. We've just got what 8 years or so without winning the FA cup and we have much better resources to do so than Everton. It took Fergie 20 years or so to win two CL's.

Football has moved on from when Fergie first came. The focus on league position is so strong and the competition is so fierce. Moyes has constantly achieved greater in terms of league position than his resources would suggest he should. Those in football seem to appreciate league position more than cups. That's why Arsenal rest so many for the cups, likewise why despite us saying we want to win the cups we always rotate until it gets really tough.

In terms of qualities Moyes has shown the ability to spot talent in terms of youth players and signings, bringing through a number of players who have done well for the club and in Rooney, Englands best player for many years.

He's been loyal to his club, shown a good eye for transfers and bringing in relatively unknown players. He's shown he's not a one season wonder, achieving success in relative terms season after season. He's always got a great team spirit and consistently manages to get the most out of his players.

Is he perfect? No, there's always some risk. His record against the biggest teams could be better and he does't have european experience. But these things can be improved and learnt. Plenty of managers have shown you can get up to speed in europe quickly as, as has been noted before European football isn't quite the mystery it was. Not to mention he's undoubtedly going to be able to benefit from coming in to a club containing from the playing squad, to the coaches and then management those who have been involved in success year after year and know what's required.

As a club we pride ourselves on not just answering all problem by opening the cheque book but by giving young players or unproven players who have suggested they could step up a chance to prove themselves. There's no reason we should be different with the manager. I don't see why he couldn't come in and carry on what we've got but either way, not everything has to be immediate success, over the years from players to Fergie himself, as a club we've shown if you afford someone some time they can reward you significantly.
 

Sphaero

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Spider said:
we will soon know... doubt any manager would turn down the united job which is a dream job for any manager..
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I know that with SAF´s retirement still being so fresh in the minds of the supporters, I should not take everything literally what is written on here right now, but you do realize how freaking arrogant such an absolute statement sounds, right? Any manager without exception would drop their club for the chance to coach the holy United?

First of all about the job itself: It is a huge honor to step into SAF´s foot steps, but it is also an enourmus burden. For the next years, any manager will be constantly compared by the media and fans to the biggest legend this club has ever seen. This will make it extremely hard to install your own ideas, because SAF was so damn successful with his own path. The really big names will probably have some kind of credit for quite some time, but afterwards they will be ripped to pieces by the media for any mistake.

We should not kid ourselfes. This is the hardest job in the football buisness right now and having a spoilt fanbase does not make it any easier.

Now I try to give some explaination for the three biggest names, which are often named as the favoured successors of SAF, why they may not want to train United right now:

Guardiola: no brainer. Signed a four years contract with Bayern Munich, a club that does not need to hide itself in comparision of United. Financially extremely healthy and strong, good academy, big history, beautiful city, very strong squad, well payed job.

Mourinho: Probably the most likeliest candidate among the three. However, he has history with Chelsea, a club, where he himself will probably earn more money and has more money at his disposal to build a team to his liking.

Klopp: Works for an undoubtly smaller club. However, he is a man with a clear vision and used to have free reign over his work, which he enjoys at Dortmund bar some financial restrictions, because of the absolutely undisputed trust by the officials, the players and of course the fans (getting celebrated by 80000 lunatics at least twice in a month has a nice touch). Most people view as the greatest coach Dortmund ever had (even if he does not win the CL he has surpassed Hitzfeld already in my eyes).

He has also created a chance for himself, which United can not really offer him. If he can install Dortmund on the level of the European giants in the next years, he will undoubtly become a legend himself, because he managed to create a team from scratch (with comparable very little money) by himself that can challenge the true elite. Rather than take over SAF´s legacy at United, he can create his own. There is a reason, why he has such a long running contract and insists every time he is asked, that he will fulfill it. Dortmund is still a work in progress for him and he has absolutely no intention to leave it unfinished. He has come to love the club and would not abandon it. He has too much class for that.
 

rio's upper lip

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The more I'm on here, the more I'm depressed at the news. David Moyes? Seriously? I've registered the speculation over the years, but never thought it was particularly serious - I always though Mou was a shoo-in for the job, and lately Klopp has been impressive as well.

I'm doubly sad at the moment.
 

CnutOfAllCnuts

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Who would people prefer instead of Moyes?

In my opinion, Moyes is the natural, logical replacement. Safe, but logical.
 

Judge Red

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For a start, I doubt the blue scousers are exhilirated, and I don't see why the red ones would think they're going to get any closer to finishing above Moyes with his new squad.
 

Sultan

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Thick Numpty said:
Apart from the bits where he suggested I said stuff that I didn't actually say. He makes some good points, but he misrepresents my post entirely to do it.
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I took it as stand alone post. I never realised he had quoted you, TN.
 

charleysurf

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CnutOfAllCnuts said:
Who would people prefer instead of Moyes?

In my opinion, Moyes is the natural, logical replacement. Safe, but logical.
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United managers are usually dour characters. Fergie only got some charisma when the trophies mounted up.

An exception being Tommy Docherty. And he was a bit too "colourful".
 
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