Alexei Navalny | Has died in prison, according to the Russian prison service

Paxi

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Was it such a shit job? They got in, delivered the poison and got out. Maybe they overestimated the lethality of Novichok, maybe not. We know Putin doesn't really care about completely covert operations, he just needs it known how dangerous it is to feck with him and his. There are countless examples long before Skripal. Remember the FSB guys getting caught planting the 5th apartment bomb? They can get away with anything.

Don't know if its already been mentioned on the thread/forum but as its relevant:

A 'suicide' of another Putin critic, within days of the Salisbury poisonings, has only just this month been ruled as homicide.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-56695489

And today there's uproar in Czech Republic about new evidence showing a 2014 bombing of military warehouses being caused by the GRU/FSB/KGB. Suspects being the same two accused of the Salisbury poisons.
https://www.politico.eu/article/cze...s-alleging-kremlin-role-in-deadly-2014-blast/
Absolute botch job. Make no mistake. Maybe harms is right. Maybe Putin got personal with nepotism. I really don't think that is true of Putin, about him being brazen. Again what you're getting at is term called sabre-rattling but to what end?
 

calodo2003

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Well that's certainly an interesting theory. Certainly subversive. Should laugh but alas, Ive no idea either how agencies do wet work. Oooh I sound cool, I said wet work in a sentence...sorry mate I was just having a moment.


Not entirely, in fact entirely sure I misused the term; wet work. I'm wet now.
You were correct.
 

Sir Matt

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I never knew about nepotism around his judoka etc etc.

I also know, albeit, provincial officials and I can only describe them as quite smart and switched on. I made the assumption that the chain if command followed that. I mean why wouldn't?
If you are interested enough to read a biography or two, I would recommend Mr. Putin: Operative in the Kremlin by Fiona Hill and Clifford Gaddy. Hill became well known during the Trump impeachment, but she's a well-respected expert on Russia and Putin. The New Tsar by Steven Lee Meyers is also very good. They both go into how his regime is built on personal relationships with people and loyalty, like the Ozero group.
 

Sir Matt

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I worry about what happens to Navalny's movement if he dies. He's not like Bobby Sands who had a whole organization and movement behind him or Gandhi whose profile was so high that the British didn't want him to die in custody. Putin likely won't care if he dies since he can't face much harsher international repercussions, and I'm not sure how much the Russian public will care either. The ones who would have been intimidated by Putin and his police forces.

Does his wife become the leader?
 

Salt Bailly

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I worry about what happens to Navalny's movement if he dies. He's not like Bobby Sands who had a whole organization and movement behind him or Gandhi whose profile was so high that the British didn't want him to die in custody. Putin likely won't care if he dies since he can't face much harsher international repercussions, and I'm not sure how much the Russian public will care either. The ones who would have been intimidated by Putin and his police forces.

Does his wife become the leader?
The repurcusions would be severe you would think, both internationally and in the motherland. Navalny is making the ultimate sacrifice; I only wish there were more people of his ilk holding governments to account closer to home.
 

harms

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Actually, the point about the “survivors bias” is a good one. Most likely FSB and/or GRU had many more successful covert operations that we don’t know about, it’s just that their failures are so well-documented and widely discussed.

By the way, Navalny was transferred to a hospital. A prison hospital without access to his own doctors, but a hospital nonetheless.
 

harms

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About 1500 people were detained in Russia following the protests with the most coming from St. Petersburg (around 700 people). It’s scary how apologetic it feels that” 1500 people arrested for exercising their constitutional right :lol:

Moscow meeting was surprisingly chill with almost no police/arrests (they’ve mostly arrested/detained activists and journalists in the morning before the actual meeting). Not sure why.

Edit: I’ve changed by most since apparently I can’t read properly.
 

harms

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He certainly seems less racist than navalny though.
I thought that I'd put it here as not to derail the Israeli-Palestinian thread even further. I doubt that either one of them are to be fair.

They are quite similar in that regard as they're pragmatics first, although Putin choses to bet more on elites (in different stages of his political career he swayed between oligarchs and FSB/police/military as his main source of power) & Navalny is a populist. In mid 00's Navalny made a bet on the rising nationalistic tendencies, which didn't turn out great for him (around 2010 Putin & FSB, who often used organised nationalists in their own interest decided that they were becoming too big of a threat and launched an extremely brutal and effective campaign against them) — more recently he focused more on fighting corruption & Putin's regime and targeted a new electorate, way more liberal/leftist. He even apologised many times for his past with nationalism, as his crowd obviously had issues with some of his earlier statements.

He didn't do this out of the goodness of his heart, he felt the wind changing and adapted to it, like any good populist would. So I'm pretty sure that neither Putin nor Navalny have racism as one of their personal motivators, at least in a big way. Rather they both use(d) nationalism as a tool in their political career (which doesn't make it better by the way), with one doing it way more effectively than another.
 

68cob

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Al Jazeera and Sky reporting that Navalny is dead, but no details yet
 

Eyepopper

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Well that's really really really really really really really really surprising.
 

B. Munich

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Navalny wasn't even 50 years old. Correctly treated, he wouldn't have died at such a young age.

He showed balls when he returned to Russia after being poisoned and treated in Germany.
Putin is just disgusting coward.
 

harms

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His team hasn't confirmed it yet but the Russian prison system has released an official statement. Jesus Christ.
 

Mike Smalling

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RIP.

In retrospect, it's kind of surprising that he lasted this long since returning to Russia. Putin is such a disgusting fecker.
 

The Firestarter

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Was only going one way after he returned. An ill advised decision which I still can't believe he made.
 

Solius

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Wow Putin is certainly fortunate that literally everyone who ever opposes him just seems to drop dead.
 

Pexbo

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Wow Putin is certainly fortunate that literally everyone who ever opposes him just seems to drop dead.
Give me a lucky president rather than a great president.
 

rimaldo

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Wow Putin is certainly fortunate that literally everyone who ever opposes him just seems to drop dead.
fell down the stairs whilst shaving. just a freak accident.