If only there was a way to find out the truth rather than speculating. We could call this system 'the courts' maybe and put her in one to find out.
Which part? For civilian workers, at least in the case of Germans, it would be treated as more or less any other job. You didn't get rounded up at 18 and put as a first secretary to a concentration camp commander. If she worked at a concentration camp it's because she applied to work there. If she only discovered where she was working after she got there, then she could have asked to work somewhere else. It might have negatively affected her career, but at least she wouldn't be tangentially involved in genocide, which I feel is a fair trade-off.
I dunno, she was a nazi working in a death camp? Accused of literally getting paid to help organise the death of thousands.
'Normal' German citizens were not forced to work in the camps, they did so through choice.
Do you think she should stand trial?
Shot in the dark here, but probably from the knowledge of what the Nazis did at the camps. Could be wrong though, who knows?
What was new during WWII was the victimisation, murder and abuse of citizenry also including the Japanese treatment of civilians as well as prisoners of war. Being the victors, the Allies decided that the actual perpetrators should be punished, those with an active hand in the deeds, but these War Crimes were already set out by the Geneva Convention prior to the conflict beginning and in general societies haven't themselves been identified as perpetrators of such crimes. Maybe the last time we punished a whole nation had a hand in bringing about the 2nd World War.
perhaps carpet bombing whole swathes of the middle east to take out 'selected' terrorists / enemy combatants / induce regime change, hasnt exactly worked out too well either. in the future as more and more errors / atrocities come to light, where will society draw the line for culpability? drone operators, mechanics, what about the pollsters and spin doctors?
The Geneva Convention is still in effect. It was also used in the War Crimes trials and convictions of Americans for their roles played in Vietnam.
We have the ICC, but ironically enough Israel is not a member and has rejected any investigations into its conduct, and it certainly has a different view on Geneva Conventions when it comes to occupation / settlements than the majority of the rest of the world. Its not about criterion at all is it, its whether you have the economic / military standing and/or alliances to disregard conventions and laws. it was ever thus.
I have no sympathy for Nazi scum. She knew very well what was going on. Think most people fail to understand that the majority of the young population growing up in Nazi Germany believed firmly and blindly in it's ideologies.
I suppose you are right, you have to be the 'victors' such as the Allies following WWII to have the power, all sorts of support taken away and it's been noted many times on CE that the USA will never vote as Security Council Members against Israel.
So judgy…
You're seriously asking that about a Nazi?
I dunno, I guess lines can be drawn anywhere, I just choose to draw them at being a literal nazi working in a literal death camp.
I'm focused more on the soldiers, and its relevant because we're not talking specifically about those that took part in the killing. There is at least one documented case of a transfer simply being refused. I think generally it's just a really tough thing to be too black or white on, when it comes to assuming people had free choice. Even with the civilians did they know what those camps actually were when they applied? Very unlikely given the deliberate net of secrecy they operated under.
I don't want to start an argument with you but most Germans thought the camps were initially for education purposes but as time went on became more and more aware of the real purpose.
Maybe? But in this case it always comes back to the fact that she was married to an SS officer and became the first secretary of the camp commander. None of that suggests she didn't know or at the very least shouldn't have known.
Yes, i wonder why someone, probably born in the 80s, 90s or even 00s, would hate someone that deeply (to be able to write and feel something as hateful as the comments i have quoted above), for something a person at the age of 18 may or may not have known (there is no prove yet in this specific case, isn't it?) almost a century ago.
I grew up with stories from my great grandfather about what the Nazis did when they occupied my country and in my adult life I have seen and read enough to absolutely despise everything the Nazis stood for.Yes, i wonder why someone, probably born in the 80s, 90s or even 00s, would hate someone that deeply (to be able to write and feel something as hateful as the comments i have quoted above), for something a person at the age of 18 may or may not have known (there is no prove yet in this specific case, isn't it?) almost a century ago.
I hope this sentence is written understandable.
Are you seriously suggesting that a person would need to have lived through the era of Nazi Germany in order to hate Nazis?Yes, i wonder why someone, probably born in the 80s, 90s or even 00s, would hate someone that deeply (to be able to write and feel something as hateful as the comments i have quoted above), for something a person at the age of 18 may or may not have known (there is no prove yet in this specific case, isn't it?) almost a century ago.
I hope this sentence is written understandable.
I am of the opinion that this woman absolutely needs to be charged and go on trial, for the precedent and for the historic record.
You'd have to tick the box stating that you were a party member at least.
Maybe it's just me, but i can't hate a person enough to wish her to burn or die whatsoever. For me to hate a person that much, it must be someone i have personally seen killing or raping children for example by myself (and even then i prefer the law to take the person to justice). But certainly it is not a 18 year old secretary woman. No matter if nazi or not.
Yeah I'm not standing up for her case in particular, I'm just a bit uncomfortable with the more recent cases going after the very peripheral figures who didn't directly act and who werent given a lot of choice in actually being there.
I'd say the trial is worth having solely for that reason, to confront her with what she was part of and to deliberately not take things lightly due to passage of time/obeying orders excuse.
Yes, I agree with that. Her parents may have been party members, men particularly needed to carry the card to get a decent job, a few of the luxuries of life like eating and a roof over their heads. Of course there were many who weren't Nazis but to have her job she had to be one in name at least.
I didn't realise how young she was when Hitler came to power, but, at the same time, she would have been reading the words in front of her and known what they meant.
Considering Sophie Scholl was about the same age and was beheaded after a public show trial for speaking out against the Nazi regime the same year this woman decided to work at a concentration camp in Occupied Poland, I don’t feel one damn bit of sympathy for her. She can fecking rot.
*This article was amended on 30 September 2021. An earlier version said that Stutthof camp was “in Nazi-occupied Poland”. In fact it was in the Nazi-occupied area of the Free City of Danzig.
While i agree, that she should be put on a fair trial, our society of today should do much better than this hateful speech. That is exactly my point.
Nah. feck nazis
Anyone who commits a crime, even if wearing a uniform or following orders, should never be allowed to escape being tried for the crime. Victims deserve justice no matter what. Am I right?
Is that a serious question or are you that ignorant?
Not sure you can fairly damn someone for not having the stones to speak out and get beheaded, seems a bit harsh. Given the whole economy was pretty much geared for war, most jobs could be seen as facilitating the Nazis in some capacity- the camps obviously being a particularly grim example. The country was also coming out of depression for the early to mid-30s, so not clear how much you could pick and choose on jobs, particularly outside of large urban areas.
