[Paul_Scholes18]

I'm going to say here what I said in the Transfer Tweets thread.

This forum is predictably the same everytime. 99% of it was slagging him off for the longest, saying he was old, past it and was part of the 'deadwood' that needed to go. Now all of a sudden he comes in and does decently well for a couple of games (hard to do worse than what we have to be fair) and all of a sudden it's good news he gets an extension and he can do a job etc. It's this attitude and constant flip flopping that means players like Matic, Jones etc that should have been gotten rid of at the earliest opportunity continue to remain here and get new contracts. We deserve everything we get I swear, and that's to drown in mediocrity.

Same thing happens with every player, as it happens with every manager we have, 1 shit game 'GET RID', 1 good game 'KEEP HIM'. It's the same everytime, same thing happened when Jesse Lingard scored a couple of goals that one month he decided to become a competent footballer, probably because he knew that's the only way he could get Jenna Frumes to stick around, it certainly wasn't because he was shouting about beans on Instagram, and everyone on here was calling him Messe Lingod and called him absolute quality despite the utter shite he'd been serving up for years.

As I said, attitudes like this deserve the mediocrity.

Different people say different things. Just selling everyone is not the solution which many people thinks.

We lack attacking midfielders, wingers and strikers right now. In defensive midfield we got options and Matic can do a good job. He has done well recently and he can still play for a few more years.
I think people underrate our defensive midfield due to Ole and also since we lack a good number 10 or attacking midfielders.

When you look at the best teams in the world then they hardly have insane defensive midfielders compared to ours.
Fabinho been ups and down for Pool although talented. Rodri has struggled in City a bit. Busquets is far past his best.
Many teams play without pure defensive ones or actually put defenders like Kimmich into midfield or Marquinhos.
Kante has been pretty poor this season and is not a defensive GOD way above our midfielders.

If I could get a free pick for any defensive midfielder to join us then I am not sure who I would get. Probably Casemiro, but not sure he has been amazing
recently either. Ndidi is pretty good, but not that great with the ball anyway. Gueye is pretty good too, but hardly at a level far above our guys.

 

[pascell]

We sold two midfielders and have two injured......are you seriously suggesting going into the second half 5 midfielders down?

No, insufficient recruitment especially in midfield leading to us having to extend a contract we shouldn't have to is what I was getting at. Extending this contract i think means we're not going to sign as many CMs in summer as we'd hope for.

 

[Thiagoal]

Very happy if he were to sign an extension! We need numbers and his performances lately suggest he has a lot to offer the team

 

[Adisa]

Becomes a problem when his contract is used as an excuse not to properly strengthen the team.

 

[edgar allan]

No, insufficient recruitment especially in midfield leading to us having to extend a contract we shouldn't have to is what I was getting at. Extending this contract i think means we're not going to sign as many CMs in summer as we'd hope for.

When Pogba goes we will be 3 midfielders short, there is no way in the world we will be signing 3-4 new ones.
He is obviously many years past his best and well below the standard we should be aiming but until we start building a better squad we need him.

 

[pascell]

When Pogba goes we will be 3 midfielders short, there is no way in the world we will be signing 3-4 new ones.
He is obviously many years past his best and well below the standard we should be aiming but until we start building a better squad we need him.

The bolded points are what I'm alluding to. We shouldn't need him as we should already have sufficient numbers for CM, again, this is why Woodward has come up short.

 

[lifted]

We shouldn't need him, but we do, so extending his contract makes sense regardless of who's to blame for the situation.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I'm going to say here what I said in the Transfer Tweets thread.

This forum is predictably the same everytime. 99% of it was slagging him off for the longest, saying he was old, past it and was part of the 'deadwood' that needed to go. Now all of a sudden he comes in and does decently well for a couple of games (hard to do worse than what we have to be fair) and all of a sudden it's good news he gets an extension and he can do a job etc. It's this attitude and constant flip flopping that means players like Matic, Jones etc that should have been gotten rid of at the earliest opportunity continue to remain here and get new contracts. We deserve everything we get I swear, and that's to drown in mediocrity.

Same thing happens with every player, as it happens with every manager we have, 1 shit game 'GET RID', 1 good game 'KEEP HIM'. It's the same everytime, same thing happened when Jesse Lingard scored a couple of goals that one month he decided to become a competent footballer, probably because he knew that's the only way he could get Jenna Frumes to stick around, it certainly wasn't because he was shouting about beans on Instagram, and everyone on here was calling him Messe Lingod and called him absolute quality despite the utter shite he'd been serving up for years.

As I said, attitudes like this deserve the mediocrity.

Your problem @L1nk is that you think these are the same people, when most of the time they aren't. People like myself have always maintained that Matic should be around and used, him coming back and having a few good games is proof in my eyes that I was correct. It's very different to Jesse the attacker Lingard coming in and having a decent game or scoring a goal after going an entire year doing nothing.

But that said, if a few people are proven wrong about a player (Fred is a great example), manager, DoF, isn't it to be applauded when said posters can hold their hands up and say "I'm wrong" rather than the absolute dickheads on here that will maintain they are correct and that a player is shit no matter how well he does.

Just because you have a different perspective on it doesn't mean your opinions are so important or ground-breaking that we need to read them in two separate threads.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

The bolded points are what I'm alluding to. We shouldn't need him as we should already have sufficient numbers for CM, again, this is why Woodward has come up short.

Woodward doesn't pick players or build squad ffs. My God you people.

 

[Fiskey]

Carrick had a bad season or two when he was losing his mobility, but then seemed to find a way to change his game and still have a positive impact. Hopefully Matic is doing the same.

 

[11101]

Woodward doesn't pick players or build squad ffs. My God you people.

Of course he does.

The manager says which positions he wants strengthening
The manager and the scouts identify individual players
Woodward goes and buys them

The first two have always done their job. The fact our squad is all over the place is because Woodward keeps fecking up the buying process.

 

[pascell]

Woodward doesn't pick players or build squad ffs. My God you people.

Correct he doesn't but he controls the budgets and works on the deals, we should've had enough funds and time in the summer to buy a CM as it was glaringly obvious that we needed one after losing Herrera.

 

[L1nk]

Your problem @L1nk is that you think these are the same people, when most of the time they aren't. People like myself have always maintained that Matic should be around and used, him coming back and having a few good games is proof in my eyes that I was correct. It's very different to Jesse the attacker Lingard coming in and having a decent game or scoring a goal after going an entire year doing nothing.

But that said, if a few people are proven wrong about a player (Fred is a great example), manager, DoF, isn't it to be applauded when said posters can hold their hands up and say "I'm wrong" rather than the absolute dickheads on here that will maintain they are correct and that a player is shit no matter how well he does.

Just because you have a different perspective on it doesn't mean your opinions are so important or ground-breaking that we need to read them in two separate threads.

Well your perspective maintains that, players have turned a corner after a couple of decent matches, my argument is people should only make the judgements after sustained form. Give Matic a new contract? Sure, if he put in at least a minimum seasons worth of worthwhile performances, "proven wrong" oh yeah, play gash for 99% of the time, 2 good matches, omg he's proved us all wrong! So reactionary its ridiculous and has gotten us into the mess we are.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Well your perspective maintains that, players have turned a corner after a couple of decent matches, my argument is people should only make the judgements after sustained form. Give Matic a new contract? Sure, if he put in at least a minimum seasons worth of worthwhile performances, "proven wrong" oh yeah, play gash for 99% of the time, 2 good matches, omg he's proved us all wrong! So reactionary its ridiculous and has gotten us into the mess we are.

You're still chatting complete bollocks @L1nk but I don't think Matic has turned any corner, I think he had a great first season helping us to 2nd, followed by a shit first half of his second whilst his favourite boss and entire team were going to shite. Played excellent again at the start of Ole's reign and was ever present in the first 11 wins (and playing through the pain according to Ole) before being ruled out for some games with injury.

He's into season 3 now and has played well this year pretty much every time he's been given the chance, lately he's been our top performer I'd argue.

Attempting to hyperbole that into "Playing gash for 99% of the time" is the real problem with the caf, hyperbolic nonsense that can't see the wood for the trees.

That said, he's role should be a squad one after the Summer no doubt and a new DM should be targeted especially if Pogba leaves, but his experience and composure are something that this squad clearly lacks so a new 2 year deal makes complete sense.

 

[redshaw]

Ole has probably learned you can't keep playing the same players. Jose did the same and overplayed Matic and even looked poor in this preseason such was the toll on the player. I'm fine with Matic staying if we use him the right way rotating, he's still a class player.

 

[edgar allan]

Woodward doesn't pick players or build squad ffs. My God you people.

Do you think Ole suggested selling 2 midfielders and not replacing them??

 

[Raven]

Would other fans say matic is as good as Carrick was around the same age? I think matic is a little underrated by many fans, he's not a defensive midfielder, he's a deep lying playmaker and if protected with the right players around him in midfield I think he could still make a positive contribution to the team.

I wish Solskjear would get over the obsession with having to always play with a number 10, I would have liked to have seen mctominay and fred next to matic over the past 3 or 4 months since pogba has been sidelined, they would compliment him well with their energy to cover ground, win the ball back and allow matic to pull the strings in midfield.

Matic is nowhere near Carrick's level at the same age. Matic refuses to pass the ball through the lines, something Carrick was excellent at, his positioning was also on a different level to Matic's.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Do you think Ole suggested selling 2 midfielders and not replacing them??

Ole gets to say if anyone stays or goes, so if he agreed to anyone leaving, yes. He concentrated everything this Summer on his defence.

 

[Lee565]

Matic is nowhere near Carrick's level at the same age. Matic refuses to pass the ball through the lines, something Carrick was excellent at, his positioning was also on a different level to Matic's.

I think matic makes more penetrating passes than it is perceived with fans who hang onto the idea that he just does sideways passing, also was Carrick better positioning helped by the fact that he was playing in better sides organized by arguably better managers?

When matic was at Chelsea under Mourinho and conte he looked class and when ever the team had good spells in the season over the past 3 seasons since he joined he was a starter during them periods like the first half of the 2017/18 season and the first few months when Ole was still caretaker.

 

[Raven]

I think matic makes more penetrating passes than it is perceived with fans who hang onto the idea that he just does sideways passing, also was Carrick better positioning helped by the fact that he was playing in better sides organized by arguably better managers?

When matic was at Chelsea under Mourinho and conte he looked class and when ever the team had good spells in the season over the past 3 seasons since he joined he was a starter during them periods like the first half of the 2017/18 season and the first few months when Ole was still caretaker.

I disagree, I have never seen him as a creative passer, he occasionally makes a pass that lets you know it's in his locker, but generally he avoids forward passing. He's over the hill at this stage, we looked far better with Fred and Scott before Christmas.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

We looked far better with Fred and Scott before Christmas.

Far better against Everton and Watford before Scott's injury? Syeah right Revan.

 

[Raven]

Far better against Everton and Watford before Scott's injury? Syeah right Revan.

Like Burnley last weak

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Like Burnley last weak

Aye, we were wank. Your point? I mean, you were the one who said we looked much better with Fred and McTom before xmas when actually we've looked just as wank with them even more often, Bournemouth away loss was another one. Right before xmas they got embarrassed by Watford, our worst performance of the season for me.

Should we list out the games in which we were wank this year @Revan? It'll be a long one

As for Burnley, these were the comments after that game:

MOTM tonight (albeit the pick of a woefully inadequate bunch), ball retention in the first half excellent and played a few incisive passes. Second half bit laboured, which sums up the whole team.

Matic Motm today, switched play and alot of good forward passes, one that should have been a sitter by Martial. One other thing I loved, I noticed Matic giving alot of instructions, keeping everything in check. I wouldnt argue with anyone picking AWB.

Thought he was excellent tonight. Man of the Match for me.

I wish we had this Matić every week.

Spot on mate!

 

[Raven]

Aye, we were wank. Your point? I mean, you were the one who said we looked much better with Fred and McTom before xmas when actually we've looked just as wank with them even more often, Bournemouth away loss was another one. Right before xmas they got embarrassed by Watford, our worst performance of the season for me.

Should we list out the games in which we were wank this year @Revan? It'll be a long one

As for Burnley, these were the comments after that game:

Why do you keep tagging Revan?

We've been an inconsistent mess this season, like a number of the supposed top teams, unfortunately it's the state we are in, seemingly regardless of who we put in midfield. When Fred and Scott were partnered up in midfield our play was a lot faster and more attacking. As I've mentioned a number of times in this thread, I disagree with those saying that he has been good recently. He has been good on the ball with his dribbling and strength, allowing him to look like he's playing well but when it comes to releasing the ball, he's terrible. Watching him saunter around the pitch at a mile an hour while I can see our forwards calling for the ball through the lines or making runs in behind only for him to take another 5 touches and pass it to the full back has me pulling out my hair at times.

 

[edgar allan]

Ole gets to say if anyone stays or goes, so if he agreed to anyone leaving, yes. He concentrated everything this Summer on his defence.

Ah c'mon......the dogs in the street know that Ole has next to no say.
He may well have been promised replacements, but at least he knows now not to believe a word the club says.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Why do you keep tagging Revan?

Since when is tagging someone once "keep tagging"

We've been an inconsistent mess this season, like a number of the supposed top teams, unfortunately it's the state we are in, seemingly regardless of who we put in midfield. When Fred and Scott were partnered up in midfield our play was a lot faster and more attacking. As I've mentioned a number of times in this thread, I disagree with those saying that he has been good recently. He has been good on the ball with his dribbling and strength, allowing him to look like he's playing well but when it comes to releasing the ball, he's terrible. Watching him saunter around the pitch at a mile an hour while I can see our forwards calling for the ball through the lines or making runs in behind only for him to take another 5 touches and pass it to the full back has me pulling out my hair at times.

I think Fred and Scott have looked good in some games, and absolutely dreadful in others (Bournemouth and Watford especially), in those games Scott especially being guilty of trying to force everything and giving us zero composure in the middle. His horrific 65.3% passing accuracy vs. Bournemouth is stone cold proof of this, we could've done with a calm headed Matic in that game calming the tempo. You however are making the mistake that thinking faster play is always better, it aint, and Carrick was a perfect example of this. Games should be sped up and slowed by the CM, Scott is often guilty of doing everything at pace but he'll learn.

Fair enough if you think he's not been good, just know you're in the minority on that one.

 

[Classnordic]

Good player with alot of experience and a good mentality it seems, extension would be good in our current position.

 

[Raven]

Since when is tagging someone once "keep tagging"



I think Fred and Scott have looked good in some games, and absolutely dreadful in others (Bournemouth and Watford especially), in those games Scott especially being guilty of trying to force everything and giving us zero composure in the middle. His horrific 65.3% passing accuracy vs. Bournemouth is stone cold proof of this, we could've done with a calm headed Matic in that game calming the tempo. You however are making the mistake that thinking faster play is always better, it aint, and Carrick was a perfect example of this. Games should be sped up and slowed by the CM, Scott is often guilty of doing everything at pace but he'll learn.

Fair enough if you think he's not been good, just know you're in the minority on that one.

I'm not saying that McTominay is world class by any stretch of the imagination. Generally speaking, I felt what Fred and Scott offered was far better that Fred and Matic. Scott is going to need to gain some composure but that will come, like you say. Either way I think both will be in a rotation role by the end of the season, with Bruno coming in it will surely be Fred and Pogba with Bruno ahead of them.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I'm not saying that McTominay is world class by any stretch of the imagination. Generally speaking, I felt what Fred and Scott offered was far better that Fred and Matic. Scott is going to need to gain some composure but that will come, like you say. Either way I think both will be in a rotation role by the end of the season, with Bruno coming in it will surely be Fred and Pogba with Bruno ahead of them.

"I felt what Fred and Scott offered was far better that Fred and Matic".... depends completely on the game for. Matic and Fred were superb at Burnley away for example, the type of game the other pairing has struggled in. Against the likes of Spurs and City at home, early December, defo Fred and McTominay.
I feel it's a shame that we as a fanbase love to write off players when they turn 30, I think both Scott and Matic have plenty to offer the squad, Scott will keep improving, but as you say, I think first choice will be Fred, Pogba and Bruno.

 

[Raven]

"I felt what Fred and Scott offered was far better that Fred and Matic".... depends completely on the game for. Matic and Fred were superb at Burnley away for example, the type of game the other pairing has struggled in. Against the likes of Spurs and City at home, early December, defo Fred and McTominay.
I feel it's a shame that we as a fanbase love to write off players when they turn 30, I think both Scott and Matic have plenty to offer the squad, Scott will keep improving, but as you say, I think first choice will be Fred, Pogba and Bruno.

I'm starting to understand your point, he does bring a level of composure against the smaller teams that sit back and play on half chances, as I mentioned in previous posts, he has the technical qualities and still looks great on the ball. Where he is lacking is his willingness to play the ball quickly and forward, which is needed against packed defences. Games like Tranmere are perfect for him, he can run riot in midfield but in the premier league he's fine as a squad player, someone you bring on to settle a game down but pretty rubbish when starting regularly because he kills our attacks before they begin.

 

[charlenefan]

Is he suspended for the weekend now?

 

[el3mel]

I really like him. One of the most likeable guys in the squad for me. Maybe he's past his peak but he plays his role in the best way he could and shows he really care. He still has enough quality to be important for us 2 more years at least even if not main starter.

 

[Dorris]

Is he suspended for the weekend now?

Yep. They stopped yellows carrying over, but reds still do

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

Very good game, but a stupid second yellow card to take. We probably would have failed to win anyway, but it still cost us a big chance to advance.

 

[charlenefan]

Yep. They stopped yellows carrying over, but reds still do

Well Bruno straight into the XI then

 

[VP89]

He was solid again and unfortunate to go off. That second card was weak as feck given what rodri got away with.

 

[ivaldo]

Moronic decision.

 

[A-man]

Good game but stupid first yellow. Sometimes the speed is too high but he was critical at times.

 

[Adam-Utd]

He’s been a lot better since his return from injury, actually looks in shape - compared to before and under mourinho he’s a different man.

shame he ruined a good performance with a silly challenge

 

[OleBoiii]

Silly red, but he's actually doing well lately. Could be worth a contract extension, even though Fred and McTominay should be ahead in the pecking order.