Neville change of stance towards Glazers

[devilish]

The 'someone whose managerial career went up in flames' first interest is in property development, already significant his St Michael's development will be enormous. Add to that a successful position at Sky where he's well-regarded by most fans. It's just possible he says what he thinks

I very much doubt that he's well regarded by most fans. Actually most think that Carra (yep the Liverpool player) is a way better pundit than he is. Anyway that's not my argument. Former players are hardly the most intelligent or interesting people around. Sky could easily employ former managers to discuss football who have ten times the knowledge Gaz has. What keeps keeps them at sky on big money is their ability to access inside information at their respective clubs. The closer they are to the club the more credible they become. Having a mate as manager boosts Gaz's credibility when talking about Manchester United.

 

[Catt]

I don't think what he's saying is anything to get upset about, but some are probably annoyed he's not agreeing with them.

 

[Tom Cato]

It’s more then media campaign, it’s protest at OT and online that could genuinely turn sponsors away. I remember a while back Chevrolet twitter was getting trashed by United fans. Every post they had “feck Chevrolet, but Ford” or something along those lines

Quite frankly I agree with Neville. Shouting and picketing changes nothing. Nothing comes from it. But what I want even less than the Glazers are the Saudi royal family as owners. I don't very much want the prospect of casual beheadings in the streets to be associated with our beloved club.

The problem with online protests, is that they are protests of passion. Football fans are passionate. And as with MOST protests on the internet, they die down after a while. Sure there are some who are quite relentless and will batter their version of the truth down with every keystroke everywhere, but for most people, they just can't be bothered to sustain anger about things that don't affect their lives very negatively for too long.

And honestly its the same with protests at OT. We already tried that, hard. And it did absolutely nothing. So why would it change now? Neville has a good point, protests does nothing. It might make sense that a sponsor protest might deterr big name sponsors.. but will it?

Or better yet, how does it make any kind of sense? Here is a sponsor that wants to GIVE your club money to have their name on the shirt, and in thanks, droves of club fans will go out of their way to attack the business online with the goal to hurt their brand, sales and bottom line? It's nice that we have grateful fans.

The Chevrolet shirt deal was the biggest sponsor deal in football. And fans STILL attack the company. "It's nothing personal guys, why just don't like our owners so we are going to attempt hurt you instead of them". A+ adult behavior.

But at the end of the day, a few thousand angry passionate football fans protesting a few weeks on a company's social media posts won't do anything. As it is with anything, it will blow over when no one notices anything changing and the wind dies out of the rampant complaining.

The ONLY way that you are going to have any meaningful impact on who owns the club: Stop going to the games, stop buying season tickets, stop buying MUFC merchandise, and stop buying TV subscriptions. If you achieve all of those things along with every other match going fan, you have done the only thing you can do, hurt the long term bottom line of the club. You might even turn sponsors away with the empty seats.

Until that happens, all the outrage you can muster on twitter is like pissing in the sea, it might rise ocean levels by 0.0000000001% the width of a proton, but in the grand scheme of things it changes nothing.

I'll see everyone at the game, where we pay to be outraged, because at the end of the day no one is angry enough to stop watching the club play football.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

Stopped caring about what He says ages ago. A broken record who thinks highly of himself. But the fact is Manchester United is not up to him. He can say the Glazers are rotten but if They won't leave, They won't leave. Just like how He's now backtracking to avoid Saudi take over, He can say that but if Glazers want to sell to them, They will sell.

His opinion is that of a fan, not an important figure of the club. I just find it funny when some people here still think He's the voice of reason. Voice of treason more like.

This is my views on him too, he's irrelevant to me nowadays. He's embarrassed himself several times in terms of being a hypocrite or backtracking and not admitting to backtracking. He's become a rent-a-quote like pretty much every other pundit.

 

[Catt]

This is my views on him too, he's irrelevant to me nowadays. He's embarrassed himself several times in terms of being a hypocrite or backtracking and not admitting to backtracking. He's become a rent-a-quote like pretty much every other pundit.

What is he backtracking on?

 

[Rhyme Animal]

This is my views on him too, he's irrelevant to me nowadays. He's embarrassed himself several times in terms of being a hypocrite or backtracking and not admitting to backtracking. He's become a rent-a-quote like pretty much every other pundit.

Absolutely spot on.

I've actually come to dislike him as a media presence, quite a lot.

Failed embarrassingly as a manager, uses his media position to try and influence his own agenda rather than to offer INSIGHT INTO THE GAME.

Have very little time for what he spouts - whatever the topic.

 

[Moved To Differently]

Absolutely spot on.

I've actually come to dislike him as a media presence, quite a lot.

Failed embarrassingly as a manager, uses his media position to try and influence his own agenda rather than to offer INSIGHT INTO THE GAME.

Have very little time for what he spouts - whatever the topic.

Well those are as good a couple of reasons to dislike somebody as any I can imagine. He failed during a short stint doing the toughest job within elite-level sporting competition and he gets up every morning with the intention to protect his own interests. What a colossal prick!

Members so desperate for oil money they'll turn on a club legend at the drop of a hat and then denigrate players for being 'mercenaries'.

 

[momo83]

Firstly you link the crappy DM when the full article is actually in The Times - it's typical tabloid shite where they pick and choose their own narrative based on a couple of out of context quotes and unfortunately people like you lap it all up

Secondly every quote I read from Neville in that article is completely correct, I don't see him defending the Glazers nor criticising the fans at all - he's just stating the facts of the situation, there is no change of stance apart from in your mind

Ignore the tabloid slant, try reading the whole article and think for yourself rather than accepting the tabloid propoganda

Some of what he said I have said before he went on the media and said it “Glazers could be worse... better to have selfish business people then potentially mad dictator” so if you lack free thinking skills you didn’t need to wait until G Neville said it to realise /believe it.

People like you don’t even realise that people give interviews to fulfil objectives and because you can’t separate the legend from the person who puts his own selfish interests first you are blinded by the objective of this interview.

It’s the first shift and a major softening of the tone towards the Glazers, and for the first time starts to portray GlazerOut as the bad ones by using negative words like “whinge”... the words will get harsher.

PS.. in regards to the media silence towards Solskjær I said a few weeks ago a journo would have an exclusive sit down with G Neville very soon... and Henry Winter of The Times is has been about as supportive of Ole as they come.

 

[momo83]

He's hoping for a job at United.

Heard that United are directing business to his hotel

 

[The Irish Connection]

Didn’t it start during the period we got to 3 finals in 4 years?

Or at least, it was at its most vocal around 2010 iirc.

Yes it was. What Neville is saying is lazy. It was its most vocal then because of the shocking lack of investment in the team and the debt, and it’s still the case now.
And to say that it’s naive to think social media and other such protests won’t do anything is in itself naive. In Ireland, lots of positive things have been achieved in recent years down those avenues. It’s like saying an individual who makes an effort to use less electricity or drives an electric car won’t help climate change.

If the glazers cleared the debt (they’ve had 15 years), appointed a top director of football and invested properly in the team instead of dithering and having half baked transfer windows over and over again, no one would be ‘moaning’.
Ironic coming from Gary Neville.

As for what the alternative is: fan ownership, or part fan ownership. A group of fan investors like the red knights of a few years back. Jim ratcliffe, or him together with others.
I don’t have a list of the worlds billionaires but I’d guess there are candidates out there who are better than the Saudi Royal family. Even a Saudi billionaire outside of the royal family would be acceptable.
Or like Neville himself said a Chinese or Russian investor.

 

[Rood]

Some of what he said I have said before he went on the media and said it “Glazers could be worse... better to have selfish business people then potentially mad dictator” so if you lack free thinking skills you didn’t need to wait until G Neville said it to realise /believe it.

People like you don’t even realise that people give interviews to fulfil objectives and because you can’t separate the legend from the person who puts his own selfish interests first you are blinded by the objective of this interview.

It’s the first shift and a major softening of the tone towards the Glazers, and for the first time starts to portray GlazerOut as the bad ones by using negative words like “whinge”... the words will get harsher.

PS.. in regards to the media silence towards Solskjær I said a few weeks ago a journo would have a sit down with G Neville very soon... and Henry Winter of The Times is has been about as supportive of Ole as they come.

Well like I said, I agree with everything Neville says here and see no backtracking at all because it's not like he was hardcore GlazerOut before.

And I didn't need Neville to tell me all this either, I've said many similar things myself on this forum.
A lot of the Twitter based GlazerOut stuff is nothing more than whinging about transfers and that's exactly why it never spread to the matchgoing fans unlike powerful protests like Green&Gold in the past.

Have you actually read the proper Times article? What that he said do you actually disagree with ?

 

[Greck]

Is not that they'll give up their wealth. Not at all. They could simply venture somewhere else. There's money all around the place for people with that much money.

And are they supposed to do it because we asked them to? No, not till they are ready and want to. That's the essence of what Neville is saying. It sounds defeatist but it's hardcore realistic. Suits just don't make decisions because of consumer protests. They are as immune to our abuses as the average footballer is to the abuses on an Internet forum. They'll weather the storm as long as the venture stays profitable

 

[SteveJ]

And are they supposed to do it because we asked them to? No, not till they are ready and want to. That's the essence of what Neville is saying. It sounds defeatist but it's hardcore realistic. Businessmen just don't sell because of consumer protests. They are as immune to our abuses as the average footballer is to the abuses on an Internet forum

What about Hicks & Gilett? For all that we laugh at Liverpool fans for their online activities - and I'm as guilty as anyone on that score - they certainly succeeded in ridding their club of bad owners by using the 'net as a weapon.

 

[Adisa]

I agree. The main stick used to beat the Glazers is the lack of spending. Since Fergie retired we have spent nearly £900m. How many non oil clubs can say that?
I want them out but I prefer them the the Saudis100%.

 

[Greck]

What about Hicks & Gilett? For all that we laugh at Liverpool fans for their online activities - and I'm as guilty as anyone on that score - they certainly succeeded in ridding their club of bad owners by using the 'net as a weapon.

Don't know about Liverpool or how they got their owners out so can't comment.

Edit: but on the face of it there are major difference between us and them that make it insanely difficult

 

[C'est Moi Cantona]

He's not really defending them, what he's basically saying is that they are thick skinned business men, who don't give a feck about what anyone else thinks, and they won't be leaving until they say so, ie once they have squeezed everything out of us for their own purposes, so what's the point in the complaining about it, and even if they do go then the next owner will be likely be an areshole for us too.

Hardly a glowing endorsement, and no doubt is exactly what the Glazers want people to think now.

Personally I hate them with a passion, and there is no way I will go along with this point of view.

 

[momo83]

Well like I said, I agree with everything Neville says here and see no backtracking at all because it's not like he was hardcore GlazerOut before.

And I didn't need Neville to tell me all this either, I've said many similar things myself on this forum.
A lot of the Twitter based GlazerOut stuff is nothing more than whinging about transfers and that's exactly why it never spread to the matchgoing fans unlike powerful protests like Green&Gold in the past.

Have you actually read the proper Times article? What that he said do you actually disagree with ?

A year ago he said “there’s something rotten at the club from the boardroom up”

This twitter vs match going fans rhetoric... sorry I didn’t realise that match going fans were banned from twitter... thanks for letting me know.

 

[momo83]

Yes it was. What Neville is saying is lazy. It was its most vocal then because of the shocking lack of investment in the team and the debt, and it’s still the case now.
And to say that it’s naive to think social media and other such protests won’t do anything is in itself naive. In Ireland, lots of positive things have been achieved in recent years down those avenues. It’s like saying an individual who makes an effort to use less electricity or drives an electric car won’t help climate change.

If the glazers cleared the debt (they’ve had 15 years), appointed a top director of football and invested properly in the team instead of dithering and having half baked transfer windows over and over again, no one would be ‘moaning’.
Ironic coming from Gary Neville.

As for what the alternative is: fan ownership, or part fan ownership. A group of fan investors like the red knights of a few years back. Jim ratcliffe, or him together with others.
I don’t have a list of the worlds billionaires but I’d guess there are candidates out there who are better than the Saudi Royal family. Even a Saudi billionaire outside of the royal family would be acceptable.
Or like Neville himself said a Chinese or Russian investor.

Not Lazy, strategic because his interest have changed and he knows most people are easily influenced and won’t see through his “plot holes”

If social media had no effect... he wouldn’t mention it or use it himself. So he knows it’s value and potential influence.

Exactly. All that’s needed for bad things to happen is for good people to do nothing. Gary Neville is suddenly telling us that we should do nothing... only reason being he is now directly benefiting from this bad thing.
1) Glazers are directing business to his hotel.

2) His mate Ole is manager,

3) Funnily enough Giggs seems to be spending more time going in and out of Carrington then he does his brother’s missus

 

[fezzerUTD]

I agree. The main stick used to beat the Glazers is the lack of spending. Since Fergie retired we have spent nearly £900m. How many non oil clubs can say that?
I want them out but I prefer them the the Saudis100%.

Problem is how the clubs run, and the owners appoint the people to run the club so they either need a change (which they won't do) or need to sell up.

 

[M Bison]

I don't think what he's saying is anything to get upset about, but some are probably annoyed he's not agreeing with them.

I think this is the only conclusion to draw from a lot of the posts in this thread. What he’s been quoted as saying is perfectly sensible.

 

[SteveJ]

'If you said to me, some people don't believe Sheikh Mansour at Manchester City is a good owner of a football club because of the human rights issues in Abu Dhabi, others would say they have been the most incredible owners, because they have invested into Manchester, into the stadium, into the team.'

'I can see both sides of the story, but what I can see is the amazing impact they have made over that side of the city.'

Whoopee.

 

[SadlerMUFC]

I'm failing to see what Neville has said that is so wrong. It's not like he's done a 180 and is all of a sudden talking about how great the ownership is...

 

[momo83]

I'm failing to see what Neville has said that is so wrong. It's not like he's done a 180 and is all of a sudden talking about how great the ownership is...

That’s not how politics works. But you’ll see him get warmer to the Glazers and more scornful to GlazersOut over time. Unless if whatever has caused his shift changes.

 

[Maticmaker]

It would seem to me that the main point of Gary's article was 'be careful what you wish for'. The Glazers, even the two who take an interest in the club, Avram and Joel, couldn't be called 'died-in -the-wool' football loving billionaire Owners. However they have been prepared to spend quite a lot, but have been extremely poor in selecting their football managers/coaches.

Martin Edwards, despite his faults (and he had many) some 30 odd years ago looked for an up and coming manager, who had defied the odds, and with next to nothing and made a name for himself in taking his then club beyond the standard at that time expected and Edwards came back down from Scotland with yet another Scotsman who would, eventually, also receive a knighthood for managing Manchester United.

So is it a foretaste of things to come, will it be arise Sir Ole? Well at least Norway is North of Manchester so the Glazers could be said to be looking in the right direction...broadly speaking?

 

[Catt]

That’s not how politics works. But you’ll see him get warmer to the Glazers and more scornful to GlazersOut over time. Unless if whatever has caused his shift changes.

Has his opinion changed?

 

[Sandikan]

Was about to trash him until I read it and what he says is the unfiltered truth. That fans think a social media campaign is going to get any businessman/woman to give up a billion pound once in a lifetime asset is naivety.

Especially when they live 1,000s of miles away and almost never come anywhere near the place!

 

[momo83]

Especially when they live 1,000s of miles away and almost never come anywhere near the place!

If you’ve ever actually to been to OT and not just regurgitating rhetoric the significant number of “Tourist Fans” wont have escaped you.

Also never realised the Noodle deals and stuff that make the Glazers money came from the 70000 at OT.

 

[SteveJ]

Gary is the epitome of the once-firebrand union boss who is too cosy with the company's management, and now looks down on the shop floor workers who, apparently, are always 'whingeing' and threatening strike action.

And for him, of all people, to recommend restraint and patience is unintentionally funny.

 

[Wumminator]

You only have to look at the frankly embarrassing actions of the knobs on social media with their “Glazer Out” tweets to realise how stupid this cause is at the moment.
What Gaz has said is spot on (apart from the stuff about the protests quieting down in 2010.)

 

[caid]

Quite frankly I agree with Neville. Shouting and picketing changes nothing.

I kind of hate this attitude tbh. Its somewhat true, saying it and repeating it makes it more true though.
He wouldn't be talking about it if it wasn't relevant, the times / daily mail wouldn't be printing a story on it if it wasn't relevant. No one really wants to be associated with a brand whos followers are protesting against them. Protests are definitely capable of hurting the Glazers interests in the club. I doubt 'feck chevrolet, buy ford' is the kind of response that'll make sponsorship deals more valuable

 

[Handré1990]

Firstly you link the crappy DM when the full article is actually in The Times - it's typical tabloid shite where they pick and choose their own narrative based on a couple of out of context quotes and unfortunately people like you lap it all up

Secondly every quote I read from Neville in that article is completely correct, I don't see him defending the Glazers nor criticising the fans at all - he's just stating the facts of the situation, there is no change of stance apart from in your mind

Ignore the tabloid slant, try reading the whole article and think for yourself rather than accepting the tabloid propoganda

Best post I’ve read in a while. Redcafe, promote this guy!

 

[Handré1990]

I think that the club lost his soul the moment it was owned by an owner whose not a Man United fan. We had 1 opportunity to buy the club back when Edwards was selling his shares but unfortunately the supporters of the time failed to do so. Considering that the Glazers would whore and sell the club to anyone with money then all we can do is hope is (in order of precedence)

- The Glazers sell their shares to the public (which is highly unlikely)
- They sell the club to a United fan (Ratcliffe)
- They sell to owners that understand football (like the Liverpool owners)
- They sell to owners who will invest in the team rather then simply take money out of it.


Having mingled into the political circles myself I learnt to stir away from any false morality about us (Westerners) being better then Them (Saudi etc). Most politicians aren't that different to business men. They would sell their souls for money (investment to the country or otherwise)

I repeat regimes do not stay in power without help and we all know who back Saudi Arabia. Actually I believe that these governments are worse then the Saudi royalty. The latter commit crimes to stay in power and alive (think of how Gheddafi and Saddam ended). The former consent to such crime because its profitable.

I think the most pragmatic argument one can make is that its never a good idea being owned by a regime since regime do fall. Think of Gheddafi, Saddam, Pol Pot etc.

Heh, you’re a funny guy.

 

[lsd]

It’s more then media campaign, it’s protest at OT and online that could genuinely turn sponsors away. I remember a while back Chevrolet twitter was getting trashed by United fans. Every post they had “feck Chevrolet, but Ford” or something along those lines

Would not make the slightest difference to Chevrolet at all .

Neville is spot on about this . You have to be really dumb to think otherwise

 

[Tom Cato]

I kind of hate this attitude tbh. Its somewhat true, saying it and repeating it makes it more true though.
He wouldn't be talking about it if it wasn't relevant, the times / daily mail wouldn't be printing a story on it if it wasn't relevant. No one really wants to be associated with a brand whos followers are protesting against them. Protests are definitely capable of hurting the Glazers interests in the club. I doubt 'feck chevrolet, buy ford' is the kind of response that'll make sponsorship deals more valuable

But its not accomplishing anything for the very reasons I stated in my original posts.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Heard that United are directing business to his hotel

United are wanting to build a food kiosk right outside the hotel.

 

[Sandikan]

If you’ve ever actually to been to OT and not just regurgitating rhetoric the significant number of “Tourist Fans” wont have escaped you.

Also never realised the Noodle deals and stuff that make the Glazers money came from the 70000 at OT.

Season ticket holder for almost a decade my friend.
And you?

Also, I think you misread my post as being about fans. It was about the Glazers...re-read it.

 

[Cloud7]

It would seem to me that the main point of Gary's article was 'be careful what you wish for'. The Glazers, even the two who take an interest in the club, Avram and Joel, couldn't be called 'died-in -the-wool' football loving billionaire Owners. However they have been prepared to spend quite a lot, but have been extremely poor in selecting their football managers/coaches.

Man I've been banging this drum for so long now. Our fans will seemingly take anyone but the Glazers as the owners, despite the fact that there are many many owners who could be much worse for the club than them. It's not even like they penny pinch, the club just needs better structure.

 

[Water Melon]

Stopped caring about what He says ages ago. A broken record who thinks highly of himself. But the fact is Manchester United is not up to him. He can say the Glazers are rotten but if They won't leave, They won't leave. Just like how He's now backtracking to avoid Saudi take over, He can say that but if Glazers want to sell to them, They will sell.

His opinion is that of a fan, not an important figure of the club. I just find it funny when some people here still think He's the voice of reason. Voice of treason more like.

This

 

[Rood]

A year ago he said “there’s something rotten at the club from the boardroom up”

This twitter vs match going fans rhetoric... sorry I didn’t realise that match going fans were banned from twitter... thanks for letting me know.

Yes and he was right and I don't see anything in this article that suggests he has changed his view.
However let's not forget that
Jose had fallen out with Woodward over transfers and created a squad split with treatment of Pogba, thé club was in a mess behind the scenes and that is actually what Ole has been trying to sort out. There is a lot more harmony at the moment, how long it lasts remains to be seen

And its been clearly proven that although there were significant Twitter protests a couple of months ago, the average matchgoing fan had little interest in any of it - do you dispute that?

 

[Catt]

Man I've been banging this drum for so long now. Our fans will seemingly take anyone but the Glazers as the owners, despite the fact that there are many many owners who could be much worse for the club than them. It's not even like they penny pinch, the club just needs better structure.

This!