Next Manager Poll

[DJ_21]

Well that does mean we can give Carrick a chance, if it doesn't work out then Iraola will still be availble givem how ;ong Chelsea managers last these days

If he goes Chelsea then the chance of him coming here is very slim. Chelsea ruin managers reputations and how often do teams go for a manager after failing at another big club. Like Moyes with us… he didn’t get another big club after us as he shown he couldn’t handle the pressure.

 

[manichester]

Carrick = Southgate only a few years younger.

 

[Rolaholic]

 

[sp_cgb]

If we were to limp over the line, I think the decision to stick with Carrick will be pretty tough. Therefore I'd still wait before drawing any conclusions. Another anemic performance tonight against Brentford, followed by a loss against Liverpool next weekend and all of a sudden there will be a lot of noise again questioning his credentials. I don't think Ineos want to go into the summer with major doubts and negative sentiments swirling in the background.

Of course if we end the season on a high, I think he'll get the job. Beat Brentford, Liverpool and Forest, draw/win at Sunderland and Brighton.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

If we were to limp over the line, I think the decision to stick with Carrick will be pretty tough. Therefore I'd still wait before drawing any conclusions. Another anemic performance tonight against Brentford, followed by a loss against Liverpool next weekend and all of a sudden there will be a lot of noise again questioning his credentials. I don't think Ineos want to go into the summer with major doubts and negative sentiments swirling in the background.

Of course if we end the season on a high, I think he'll get the job. Beat Brentford, Liverpool and Forest, draw/win at Sunderland and Brighton.

It seems they made their decision, and he's the safest option for them regardless of how we finish the season. Anything else demands a lot of work, thinking and preparation which doesn't seem to be their strong suit. If they appoint a new guy who won't hit the ground running, the circus around the club will be jumping at their backs because they didn't give the gig to the manager who earned them CL qualification. If the new guys the rest of the competition get next summer do well while we struggle under Carrick, they can always play the "rally behind the United man" card (who, unlike Amorim, will keep his mouth shut). I don't think it goes beyond that as far as INEOS are concerned.

 

[AFIABM]

What are these mistakes?

The response below sums it up well I think. Carrick deserves huge credit for what looks like it's going to be a successful interim period in terms of returning us to the CL.

But that's all it should be - an interim post, not a permanent one, and the performances indicate this.

However the sentiment seems to be that he should be given a go, let's be a solid 4th place team first then think about challenging for the title, etc.

The club are stuck in a perpetual loop of selling a transition narrative, appointing or persevering with unsuitable managers based on vibes and clichés whilst ignoring the evidence in front of them.

Poor managers, overpaying for players, not using the scouts and more

Carrick for me has already shown his level. Another counter attacking coach or fall flat. It will not succeed. But it is the easy decision, and we’re a fanbase stuck in the past and nostalgia. That’s why we’re almost irrelevant in modern football.

That’s a curious way to describe a club which is still one of the most popular, most watched, and most talked about.

Which are great metrics if one measures success like the Glazers, Woodward or Ineos.

But when was the last time United were in a title race or in the CL semi finals?

 

[sp_cgb]

It seems they made their decision, and he's the safest option for them regardless of how we finish the season. Anything else demands a lot of work, thinking and preparation which doesn't seem to be their strong suit. If they appoint a new guy who won't hit the ground running, the circus around the club will be jumping at their backs because they didn't give the gig to the manager who earned them CL qualification. If the new guys the rest of the competition get next summer do well while we struggle under Carrick, they can always play the "rally behind the United man" card (who, unlike Amorim, will keep his mouth shut). I don't think it goes beyond that as far as INEOS are concerned.

Something to look forward to then.

 

[pcaming]

That’s a curious way to describe a club which is still one of the most popular, most watched, and most talked about.

We are big for now as an institution, we are irrelevant as a football team.

 

[Baxquux]

We are big for now as an institution, we are irrelevant as a football team.

For all the pelters Amorim got, we reached a European final last season (and should have won it and got CL; again, whether you want to primarily blame luck, the players around clutch moments or Amorim, is a matter of taste/judgment). That may be small-fry compared to the Fergie days, but it's not nothing. We've won other trophies in recent years, could (should?) have won another European final in Ole's last full season.

Again, it's just small differences and better squad-building ( setting aside the Glazers and structural issues there, the biggest recent impediment has been letting ETH squad-build, with profile of the squad setting us back a couple of years given spending and unsuitability for the league) for United to become contenders, if not necessarily preeminent whilst City are still around to leverage their political ties, grey-market payments and reserves.

 

[SteveCoppellFan]

Allowing Iraola to go to Chelsea whilst we stick with the job for the boys theory would keep me awake at night.

 

[Lash]

Allowing Iraola to go to Chelsea whilst we stick with the job for the boys theory would keep me awake at night.

I'll lose all respect for him if he goes Chelsea. You simply can't go to that circus right now unless you just want the pay out. I think if it's a shoot out between Chelsea and Athletic Club, he'll go home.

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

Allowing Iraola to go to Chelsea whilst we stick with the job for the boys theory would keep me awake at night.

Iraola is at Bournemouth now and has yet to finish higher than 9th in the Premier League. It's absolutely absurd that people are so desperate for him to come here.

He's just as likely to be another Graham Potter/Amorim/Rosenior etc etc than actually be a success at a higher level club.

 

[DJ_21]

I'll lose all respect for him if he goes Chelsea. You simply can't go to that circus right now unless you just want the pay out. I think if it's a shoot out between Chelsea and Athletic Club, he'll go home.

Depends if he wants to stay in the prem and give it a go with a bigger club. He’ll always have the opportunity to go back home to Spain. The opportunity to manage one of England’s biggest despite them being in a mess doesn’t come around much.

 

[Lash]

Depends if he wants to stay in the prem and give it about with a bigger club. He’ll always have the opportunity to go back home to Spain. The opportunity to manage one of England’s biggest despite them being in a mess doesn’t come around much.

There's something systemically wrong with Chelsea though. They don't sign players to improve the team, that's a bi-product for them and on top of that, they look to be in pretty bad shape financially. You'd be going in there with a lot of good faith that anything is going to change and they've not shown at any point they stray from the model. I get they're big club, but it's a terrible "next step" after building up so much credit in the bank.

 

[Ryan_]

Seems that our runaway favourite Luis Enrique won't be available this summer.

Julian Nagelsmann is narrowly beating Iraola in the Caf poll, which surprises me a bit.

For those backing Nagelsmann - what makes you choose him over Iraola?

 

[matsdf]

Seems that our runaway favourite Luis Enrique won't be available this summer.

Julian Nagelsmann is narrowly beating Iraola in the Caf poll, which surprises me a bit.

For those backing Nagelsmann - what makes you choose him over Iraola?

Bigger personality. Which I think is almost as important as the tactical side as our manager.

 

[sullydnl]

Seems that our runaway favourite Luis Enrique won't be available this summer.

Julian Nagelsmann is narrowly beating Iraola in the Caf poll, which surprises me a bit.

For those backing Nagelsmann - what makes you choose him over Iraola?

Younger, more experienced, more elite-level experience, and doesn't come with any of the "how does his style of play and tactical approach translate to a higher level" questions.

 

[hellhunter]

Nagelsmann has a very similar profile to Amorim. That's certainly a massive risk in my book.

Iraola's profile on the other hand isn't too different to Potter or Frank, so definitely not without risk either

 

[Smores]

Iraola is at Bournemouth now and has yet to finish higher than 9th in the Premier League. It's absolutely absurd that people are so desperate for him to come here.

He's just as likely to be another Graham Potter/Amorim/Rosenior etc etc than actually be a success at a higher level club.

You're saying that as if Bournemouth should finish higher? That's a fantastic achievement for them given what they spend, and they do it playing very good football.

Getting the most of your players and playing good football isn't something most managers achieve in a season.

Ideally I want someone with experience of winning titles but if we can't get a top coach Irola is the next best bet. Certainly more so than Carrick whose greatest achievement is a small interim run.

 

[Apokalips]

Iraola is at Bournemouth now and has yet to finish higher than 9th in the Premier League. It's absolutely absurd that people are so desperate for him to come here.

He's just as likely to be another Graham Potter/Amorim/Rosenior etc etc than actually be a success at a higher level club.

What exactly is he supposed to achieve with Bournemouth? CL Football?

Who can make the step up to the coach a top club then? The performance of Graham Potter has 0 influence on the performance of Iraola at another club.

 

[Lash]

Nagelsmann has a very similar profile to Amorim. That's certainly a massive risk in my book.

Iraola's profile on the other hand isn't too different to Potter or Frank, so definitely not without risk either

I'm an Iraola fan, but one thing I think would be a big positive in the Nagelsmann column is the fact Nagelsmann and Vivell would likely be very aligned on recruitment. That's one massive risk you can mitigate against, which has plagued every single manager we've brought in.

 

[HTG]

Younger, more experienced, more elite-level experience, and doesn't come with any of the "how does his style of play and tactical approach translate to a higher level" questions.

His elite level experience wouldn’t matter much to me, considering how he has not achieved anything of note with Bayern. The lowlight being a quarter final exit in the CL against Villarreal. He also has consistent issues with top players, who at times visibly despise him (Lewandowski or Neuer).

And the style of play is a huge question, as he has not managed to achieve a balance between defense and offense at all with both Bayern and Germany. It’s a constant question mark and he is famous for leaving his defense exposed.

Nagelsmann lives of name recognition only. He was seen as this extremely young wonder-manager, who saved Hoffenheim when the situation was horrible. But ever since that semi final in the CL with Leipzig, he has shown no development as a manger or person, has consistently caused uproar in his teams due to the way he deals with the media and absolutely loves to be the centre of attention, to the point where his own players resent him for it.

iIf he hadn’t started out as a 27 year old, who became so famous because of it, nobody would consider him. At this level, he’s average at best. Signing him would mean, that you bet on the hope, that he changed his man management drastically.

 

[Gaidal]

Since Carrick took over as interim manager, we are second in the form table with 26 points - just behind City on 27. Honestly, if that was anyone else in charge, people would be losing their minds over it.

The issue is it’s Carrick. He doesn’t have that big-name pedigree yet, so there’s this assumption that bringing someone else in would magically get us more points and have us playing incredible football every week. But that’s not really how it works. Even Pep Guardiola - the best in the business - has had spells where results or performances dip. You can’t dominate every game all season and expect to win everything; it’s just not realistic.

At the end of the day, it’s about winning games, and Carrick’s doing exactly that.
If we can sort out a few key areas in the summer and go into next season with a stronger, more balanced squad, there’s no reason he can’t give the league a proper go.

Based on that, I’d be more than happy to see Carrick given the job full-time next season.

I dont care about his pedigree, i care that we have looked really poor in most games and that allt he problems that boro fans voiced are the same problems for us.

 

[pelterz]

Nagelsmann has a very similar profile to Amorim. That's certainly a massive risk in my book.

Iraola's profile on the other hand isn't too different to Potter or Frank, so definitely not without risk either

My big problem with Carrick is if we have a bad start next year(a couple of key injuries) he has no experience to fall back on. We are already becoming a meat and two veg team getting the job done. With an even older set of players than this season it could be a catastrophe next year.

 

[KStandBarmyArmy1993]

What exactly is he supposed to achieve with Bournemouth? CL Football?

Who can make the step up to the coach a top club then? The performance of Graham Potter has 0 influence on the performance of Iraola at another club.

You're saying that as if Bournemouth should finish higher? That's a fantastic achievement for them given what they spend, and they do it playing very good football.

Getting the most of your players and playing good football isn't something most managers achieve in a season.

Ideally I want someone with experience of winning titles but if we can't get a top coach Irola is the next best bet. Certainly more so than Carrick whose greatest achievement is a small interim run.

I'm saying that he's managed a team in midtable in the Premier League and has zero experience of managing at the highest level.

Much like the managers I mentioned above, he's going to need time to implement a style of play/philosophy etc and actually succeed. That's just time he's not going to get. He's been allowed time to build at Bournemouth where the basic expectation is avoiding a relegation battle

In two years time and maybe when we're a bit more settled and he has experience of even managing a side like Athletic Club in the Champions League, that will be the time to get him.

As I said earlier in the thread, it's very rare for a manager to succeed in England without some experience of managing at a high level beforehand.

Carrick has a lot of weaknesses but I still think he can take us to regular Champions League qualification. That would be progress before we look for the person to take us to the next step of winning the big trophies.

 

[stefan92]

iIf he hadn’t started out as a 27 year old, who became so famous because of it, nobody would consider him.

No matter if he was 27 or 57, his work with Hoffenheim was amazing and he would be praised for getting them from relegation danger zone into the CL.

And what he did at Leipzig would be seen as solid work at a top club if he did that at 60. Sure no wonderkid, but someone who you can hire if you are a big club.

That said I agree that he never reached true elite level as a manager and I doubt if he will.

 

[DJ_21]

There's something systemically wrong with Chelsea though. They don't sign players to improve the team, that's a bi-product for them and on top of that, they look to be in pretty bad shape financially. You'd be going in there with a lot of good faith that anything is going to change and they've not shown at any point they stray from the model. I get they're big club, but it's a terrible "next step" after building up so much credit in the bank.

True. But you could also say the same for us. We’re one of the biggest in the world but we’ve been in a bad mess with bad owners yet the likes of ETH, Amorim still wanted to take that step up. Our situation probably isn’t as bad as Chelsea’s though to be fair. Your spot on when you say they don’t sign players to improve them but they just sign a ton of players for the same position which affects chemistry

 

[HTG]

No matter if he was 27 or 57, his work with Hoffenheim was amazing and he would be praised for getting them from relegation danger zone into the CL.

And what he did at Leipzig would be seen as solid work at a top club if he did that at 60. Sure no wonderkid, but someone who you can hire if you are a big club.

That said I agree that he never reached true elite level as a manager and I doubt if he will.

If he had done what he did at Hoffenheim at the age of 57, nobody outside of Germany would have cared. Look at the English media back then. Every article leads with his age. That’s the story they told and it worked great.
A manager doing the things he did, at that age, fuels the imagination, because people immediately wonder, what else he might achieve, once he gets older. That’s just not the case, for a 57 year old. People love the idea of potential. It’s no different than the discussions around 17 year old players. It’s not what they already did, that makes them so special. It’s what they might do eventually.

 

[hellhunter]

If he had done what he did at Hoffenheim at the age of 57, nobody outside of Germany would have cared. Look at the English media back then. Every article leads with his age. That’s the story they told and it worked great.
A manager youngster things he did, at that age, fuels the imagination, because people immediately wonder, what else he might achieve, once he gets older. That’s just not the case, for a 57 year old.

His Hoffenheim run isn't all that different to Emery at Villa, isn't it?

 

[HTG]

His Hoffenheim run isn't all that different to Emery at Villa, isn't it?

I honestly don’t know enough about Emery at Villa to answer that.

 

[Exiled_Red]

Carrick = Southgate only a few years younger.

Horrible take. Carrick is already miles better than Southgate.

Southgate has a 29% win rate in his career and Carrick is at 45%.

I'm not sold on Carrick as manager, but comparing him to Southgate is nonsense.

 

[Lash]

True. But you could also say the same for us. We’re one of the biggest in the world but we’ve been in a bad mess with bad owners yet the likes of ETH, Amorim still wanted to take that step up. Our situation probably isn’t as bad as Chelsea’s though to be fair. Your spot on when you say they don’t sign players to improve them but they just sign a ton of players for the same position which affects chemistry

That's a fair point, we're still a risk. I think we're probably less of one, as there is still an attempt to sign players for a manager, rather than the blue co franchise!

 

[sullydnl]

His elite level experience wouldn’t matter much to me, considering how he has not achieved anything of note with Bayern. The lowlight being a quarter final exit in the CL against Villarreal. He also has consistent issues with top players, who at times visibly despise him (Lewandowski or Neuer).

And the style of play is a huge question, as he has not managed to achieve a balance between defense and offense at all with both Bayern and Germany. It’s a constant question mark and he is famous for leaving his defense exposed.

Nagelsmann lives of name recognition only. He was seen as this extremely young wonder-manager, who saved Hoffenheim when the situation was horrible. But ever since that semi final in the CL with Leipzig, he has shown no development as a manger or person, has consistently caused uproar in his teams due to the way he deals with the media and absolutely loves to be the centre of attention, to the point where his own players resent him for it.

if he hadn’t started out as a 27 year old, this become famous, nobody would consider him. At this level, he’s average at best. Signing him would mean, that you bet on the hope, that he changed his man management drastically.

When I say "elite level experience", I don't just mean at Bayern. I mean at the CL-level generally. Nagelsmann has maybe 40-odd games experience in the CL and (as you say) reached the semi-finals with Leipzig before even arriving at an elite club. And even at Bayern, at the point he was fired ye had won all your games in the CL that season, including two games each against all of Inter, Barcelona & PSG.

As opposed to Iraola, who has never managed a CL-level side before.

 

[croadyman]

Poor managers, overpaying for players, not using the scouts and more

Carrick for me has already shown his level. Another counter attacking coach or fall flat. It will not succeed. But it is the easy decision, and we’re a fanbase stuck in the past and nostalgia. That’s why we’re almost irrelevant in modern football.

Yeah they showed nostalgia and bowing to fan pressure when it came to sacking Ten Hag in 2024

 

[Zumbi]

Which are great metrics if one measures success like the Glazers, Woodward or Ineos.

But when was the last time United were in a title race or in the CL semi finals?

Doesn’t mean we’re irrelevant - we’re currently third in the league and will be in the CL again next year. It’s not outlandish to suggest that if we had pulled the trigger on Amorim earlier this season we might have actually been in a title race.

Describing us as almost irrelevant is bitter nonsense.

 

[Zumbi]

We are big for now as an institution, we are irrelevant as a football team.

Bollocks, were third in the table and qualifying for the CL again. That’s a major step back into relevance after Ten Hag and Amorim did their best to drop our standards.

 

[croadyman]

I think it's safe to say @HTG doesn't think Nagelsmann will succeed at Utd due to his man management at Bayern. Just maybe he will have learnt a lot from that experience, so wonder what it would take for him to see any positive in the appointment IF it ever actually happened of course.

 

[CM]

Allowing Iraola to go to Chelsea whilst we stick with the job for the boys theory would keep me awake at night.

I like Iraola and he has an impressive body of work at Bournemouth but we aren't talking about some Luis Enrique or Pep Guardiola level of slam dunk with him.

There's a weird fascination with this jobs for the boys rhetoric on this forum. Carrick has done a respectable job since coming in and there isn't an outstanding pool of available candidates. It's natural that he'd become a strong contender in those circumstances.

Particularly when you consider the last manager who came in with a great reputation turned out to be a complete bluffer. If the guy in the hot seat is producing results, that has to count for something.

 

[croadyman]

Doesn’t mean we’re irrelevant - we’re currently third in the league and will be in the CL again next year. It’s not outlandish to suggest that if we had pulled the trigger on Amorim earlier this season we might have actually been in a title race.

Describing us as almost irrelevant is bitter nonsense.

Unfortunately he didn't lose it in a press conference early enough this season for that to happen

 

[HTG]

I think it's safe to say @HTG doesn't think Nagelsmann will succeed at Utd due to his man management at Bayern. Just maybe he will have learnt a lot from that experience, so wonder what it would take for him to see any positive in the appointment IF it ever actually happened of course.

He might very well learn from it. And to his defense, we did have a difficult squad at that time and our management was somewhat dysfunctional. It wasn’t an easy task for him. But so far, he’s repeating the same pattern for Germany. Which is why I’m so skeptical. If it had just been his stint with us, I wouldn’t be this „aggressive“ in my messaging. But he’s doing the same things again.
And then I look at the media landscape around United, which is at the very least as difficult as with Bayern and Germany and have a hard time imagining him as a success.