I wish there were two united forums, one for pessimists and one for optimists. All this agitation is making me age quicker.
No chance of top 4 after incompetently handled transfer window ft 1000000% more tears and drama
- Thread starter Ranchero
- Start date
Ole said out of his own mouth that we have to replace players that leave the club. He said it. I heard it. And he didn't mean replacing with people already here, that is not replacement. That's Herrera, Fellaini and Lukaku gone. Not replaced.
Agreed. Fellaini set the tone for the post-SAF era.
Yes, because this has only been going on for one window, good stuff.
His stature and tackling ability make him a little more defensive. He has similarities to big Norman Whiteside, although Whiteside used to be more attacking. McTominay goes in fearlessly to win the ball and get the attack started, but we don't often realise his significance because there's little creativity in the rest of the midfield.
We were 3 points off 3rd place last year. If Ole sets his sights solely on the premier league I think we can do it. If we start to put emphasis on the league cup, the FA Cup, Europa League then maybe not. Those should be strictly for rotation and youth.
Where we are at is down to years of neglect and terrible management. Yet, instead of making the relevant changes, the management is happy to continue driving this club into the ground.
Also yes, with this current management, the club as is can get fecked. This isn't the Manchester United any of us know anyway.
Also, good top red stuff, as if going to OT makes someone's opinion any more or less valid. Even though I have been to OT.
When did I say I was changing clubs? This club can get fecked, but I still love United. Not this United though. We can't attract top players, we are hiring managers that don't suit our DNA, the club has become purely a marketing juggernaut, putting football second, we are fecking decades behind in regards to football structure. We have a fecking banker in charge of footballing matters. Almost every decision the club seems to make is reactive rather than proactive.
That's not even taking into account the fact that we aren't seen as an appealing proposition by top players anymore, with our current top players wanting to leave. Couple this with the fact that we have overpaid, mediocre players who not even mid table teams want to touch - who we can't move on and you have yourself a fecking predicament.
Everything is fecked and all this nonsense from the 'top reds' about being patient and fans not being able to be frustrated is fecking stupid imo. This isn't one season now. This is approaching a fecking decade of terrible management. If we didn't have the amount of money we did, we would be fighting relegation with the decisions we've been making.
Chelsea? Really?
Didn't he say we won't sell Lukaku unless we buy a striker?
The Ty and Claude sub-forums?
Poor Ole a genuine United legend being used by the Glazers. They will throw him under the bus as soon as they can despite the fact that they have not backed him. I hate those Glazers.
All the doom mongers in one thread that's great to see. All crying before a ball has even been kicked. Lets see how the first few games eh? Maybe you will have some humble pie to eat by the end of the season. No chance of top 4? Give me a break.
I will maybe look silly in a few months but I don't think that we are on the way down anymore. I believe that this team has a clearer backbone than anything LVG or Mourinho provided, we do lack quality and quantity to be assured of CL football in 2020/2021 but I think that most positions will be confirmed and next summer will only be a matter of adding depth in midfield and a quality attacker/creative player, it may even happen this winter.
Agree about the domestic cups, but I think we need to give the Europa League a good go - it’s our back door into UCL next season.
First two games will start to define our season though. Two very good tests.
When we finish in 10th next season many more will see the light, but it will be too late.
There's no need to hit the panic button, mates.
Surely none of us believed we were ever going to be a favorite to win the PL trophy this season, right? Right. So it's all about top 4 and whether we can win the EL trophy. Do both, even either, and we can call it a fantastic season relative to realistic expectations.
We all agree that City, Liverpool and Spurs will finish ahead of us in the table. That's a given. Surely no one here seriously believes we're far behind Chelsea and Arsenal. 4th is well within our reach. We can fekk it up, no question, but it is within our reach.
As for the EL, winning it will be hard work, but based on the opposition in front of us it's well within our reach.
But is a sad state of affairs that we no longer talk of winning the PL and CL as realistic goals. That is most definitely something to moan about.
Surely none of us believed we were ever going to be a favorite to win the PL trophy this season, right? Right. So it's all about top 4 and whether we can win the EL trophy. Do both, even either, and we can call it a fantastic season relative to realistic expectations.
We all agree that City, Liverpool and Spurs will finish ahead of us in the table. That's a given. Surely no one here seriously believes we're far behind Chelsea and Arsenal. 4th is well within our reach. We can fekk it up, no question, but it is within our reach.
As for the EL, winning it will be hard work, but based on the opposition in front of us it's well within our reach.
But is a sad state of affairs that we no longer talk of winning the PL and CL as realistic goals. That is most definitely something to moan about.
Never said you were
I'm not the cnut here mate, it's the shit show running the club that need fecked with a rusty lead pipe.
Yes, I know lead pipes don't rust but I'm that angry that I would personally find trials into making it happen just so they could get fecked by one.
Sorry but you're talking rubbish.
Ole manager, Carrick and McKenna coaches, Nicky Butt promoted to help with the youth talent, Quinton Fortune involved in the youth set up. Home grown talent like Rashford, Mctominay, Lingard, Pogba in the side with Greenwood, Gomes, Garner and Tuanzebe set for big roles this season.
This isn't the United we know? It's closer to the United we've known in years! AWB, Maguire and James are all Fergie style signings.
You need to give your head a wobble.
We need to be patient or something though, that's what the 'top reds' are telling us. Even though all signs point to literally the same old rubbish for years now. When Ole fails here and is sacked, it'll be rinse and repeat.
Whats the purpose of watching any games then?
I see there will be constant battles here and name calling. Topreds stuff is already doing my head in.
I see there will be constant battles here and name calling. Topreds stuff is already doing my head in.
I think we as United fans just need to revise our status or expectation of United. This isn't the club you grew up watching and are now purely a commercial machine with little ambition of being anything on the pitch or competing for major honours. The gravy train has ended
Herrera, Valencia and Lukaku have left this summer.
Wan Bissaka, Maguire and James brought in.
Fellaini replaced by McTominay.
I for one is happy with. As I’ve said before another quality midfielder would have been ideal.
You’re full of shit, if you’re that sure that we’ll finish 7th behind fecking wolves, take this bet with me. If we finish above 7th you take a permanent ban and if we finish 7th of below I’ll take a permanent ban?
First off we have just sold a poor centre forward as we have had for a long time, why should we be worried we didnt sign another who is actually not even as good? Lukaku not being replaced by the likes of Dembele or Mandzukic is no concern at all for me personally.
Also, no chance of the top four, bar two months we were absolutely atrocious last season bar DeGea who we have managed to keep and were still in the running, we rally cant be that bad this season in my opnion. Best case scenario if all goes fruitfully is actually a possibility of second...but lets not kids ourselves (yes a bit of a pun), we could also finish as far down as 7th if it doesnt go well and be starting yet again with another manager before the season ends.
We also have three of the best youngsters breaking thourgh at once potentially we have had in along time. Unproven and pressure on there shoulders but Greenwood could be a regular early on in to the season, Gomes everybody says should be getting minutes as there is so much talent there and Tuanzabe looks to have all the tools to be a centre back.
We also have the likes of Dalot, Pereirra, McTominay, Fred, Sanchez, Martial, Lingard who surely should all perform better than they did last year.
Well, that is the positives and what if possibilities out of the way, the negatives are there for me in abundance....
We had a big squad, we still have a big squad. How many years now have people been saying YOung, Darmian, Mata, Rojo, JOnes shouldnt be here. I truly thought finally Fellaini and Valencia going would be the start of a proper clear out, yet we have just released Herrera who wanted too much money and half the rest have actually got new contracts? Talk of no quick fix, which I dont even fully agree with, but even as progressive movement a good 6/7 players should have been moved on, we have SEVEN centre backs now and the majority are barely even average.
We also only have one true defensive central midfielder and he looks at best on the wane. Our best midfielder who has spoke of leaving and is best bursting forward now looks like playing in a double pivot when virtually whenever he has played more defensively for us before he has been found wanting and not having the discipline for the role and people say he just needs better players around him, arguably he now has worse than any other time he has been at the club.
In attack unless Greenwood really does shine in his opportunities our two right wing options are still Mata and Lingard and possibly Sanchez our first choice on the left for £500k a game he doesnt show up in.
Take away the youngsters as we dont know how they will do yet....we have actually made two good signings this window and gone quite a distance to addressing our defence....but we still have a first eleven where in my opinion four/five of the likely eleven really are squad players not Manchester United starters.
Ole said we wouldnt do more than 4/5 signings, we have done three, one of which is a player for the future...two out of probably 7 positions that needed addressing have been sorted, we are now reliant on 3/4 of the other ones being filled either by players massiveley improving performance wise or teenagers making the spots there own....both are possible, but I have far more faith in the youngsters working and that says a lot in itself. Be an interesting season, still think it could go quite well, but I fear a lot of frustration, although the ins and outs have been good ones, its probably 1/3 of what we needed to do out and not much more in wise either
Also, no chance of the top four, bar two months we were absolutely atrocious last season bar DeGea who we have managed to keep and were still in the running, we rally cant be that bad this season in my opnion. Best case scenario if all goes fruitfully is actually a possibility of second...but lets not kids ourselves (yes a bit of a pun), we could also finish as far down as 7th if it doesnt go well and be starting yet again with another manager before the season ends.
We also have three of the best youngsters breaking thourgh at once potentially we have had in along time. Unproven and pressure on there shoulders but Greenwood could be a regular early on in to the season, Gomes everybody says should be getting minutes as there is so much talent there and Tuanzabe looks to have all the tools to be a centre back.
We also have the likes of Dalot, Pereirra, McTominay, Fred, Sanchez, Martial, Lingard who surely should all perform better than they did last year.
Well, that is the positives and what if possibilities out of the way, the negatives are there for me in abundance....
We had a big squad, we still have a big squad. How many years now have people been saying YOung, Darmian, Mata, Rojo, JOnes shouldnt be here. I truly thought finally Fellaini and Valencia going would be the start of a proper clear out, yet we have just released Herrera who wanted too much money and half the rest have actually got new contracts? Talk of no quick fix, which I dont even fully agree with, but even as progressive movement a good 6/7 players should have been moved on, we have SEVEN centre backs now and the majority are barely even average.
We also only have one true defensive central midfielder and he looks at best on the wane. Our best midfielder who has spoke of leaving and is best bursting forward now looks like playing in a double pivot when virtually whenever he has played more defensively for us before he has been found wanting and not having the discipline for the role and people say he just needs better players around him, arguably he now has worse than any other time he has been at the club.
In attack unless Greenwood really does shine in his opportunities our two right wing options are still Mata and Lingard and possibly Sanchez our first choice on the left for £500k a game he doesnt show up in.
Take away the youngsters as we dont know how they will do yet....we have actually made two good signings this window and gone quite a distance to addressing our defence....but we still have a first eleven where in my opinion four/five of the likely eleven really are squad players not Manchester United starters.
Ole said we wouldnt do more than 4/5 signings, we have done three, one of which is a player for the future...two out of probably 7 positions that needed addressing have been sorted, we are now reliant on 3/4 of the other ones being filled either by players massiveley improving performance wise or teenagers making the spots there own....both are possible, but I have far more faith in the youngsters working and that says a lot in itself. Be an interesting season, still think it could go quite well, but I fear a lot of frustration, although the ins and outs have been good ones, its probably 1/3 of what we needed to do out and not much more in wise either
You topred!!
Ah yes, because the selection of coaches to try and appeal to the masses is what accounts for the old United. Will your opinion remain valid when Ole and his coaching staff are inevitably sacked once they've been let down by the board?
Is the United you know one which prioritises marketability over actual football? How about one that completely compromises everything the club was built on to hire Mourinho, simply because they lack the nous to construct a successful team/structure? The United you familiar with one that sacks managers on a year by year basis, even taking into account the fact that they don't provide them with the tools to succeed?
The United you know a team that was seen as second rate by top players?
The coaches and the manager aren't even the problem with this club, so pinpointing them as a reason to suggest the club isn't a fecking joke doesn't ring true. The problem is the fecking management, I don't give a feck who is managing the team as long as these clowns are behind the scenes.
The way I've seen it in pre season has very much been a 4231 with one of the 2 being the sitting midfielder, and the other being the more creative/advanced one. Mctominay can be a more box to box one, but I think he's being eyed up as the DM, with Fred the direct back up to Pogba. If you think about the potential combinations, we shouldnt ever see a 2 of Pereira or Fred with Pogba, and we shouldnt ever see McTominay with Matic (though we did in pre season once - more out of necessity imo). It'll be a mix of McTominay or Matic, next to Pogba or Fred (or pereira). Occasionally 3 of those.
Ole on July 16 before the Maguire signing and after the Wan Bassaka capture: "We are still looking at one or two options, yeah, but it depends on outgoings as well. It might be more, because suddenly, if two or three go, then you have to replace players."
Quite clear. So what happened?
Lukaku, Herrera gone. Not replaced.
Quite clear. So what happened?
Lukaku, Herrera gone. Not replaced.
Or you could say one forum for realists and one for fantasists.
Ole clearly stated that if players left they would be replaced. That has not happened. Again. But that's okay. Nothing to see.
What top players have come out and said United are second rate?
At this point you're rambling on like a mad man who needs locking in Lou Macari's Chippy until next summer.
Agreed.
A real mixed bag of a window. Really happy we went ahead and got 2 long standing positions sorted and after a long time, there seems to be some method to the madness. The United of previous years would have panic bought Dybala who didn't want to be here for insane wages for instance. As you said, we have a structure to the team now and I think we'll get additions to the forward line and CM next summer. Can't help but be bitterly dissappointed that we didn't fix the obvious holes in CM and attack but I'm excited for what the season holds.
Personally, I think we had a good window. Obvious weaknesses were fixed with very good players and academy players will be given a chance.
I disagree with “incompetently handled”. I don’t think it’s incompetence as such. I’d say it’s probable that we’ve done a decent job in the window given the resources allowed to the football side of the business. The defense is strengthened and the manager seems to at least have a plan for the type of players he wanted for the type of football he wants to play.
However I think you have to come to the conclusion that the real aim of Manchester United now isn’t to be as successful as possible at football. We’re not a sporting club aimed at sporting success anymore. We’re a business whose main aim is to make money for the owners. Challenging for top four seems to be enough to keep the money rolling in. Long term even that strategy will probably run its course but it’s working for them at the moment. It’s disgraceful but there you go.
However I think you have to come to the conclusion that the real aim of Manchester United now isn’t to be as successful as possible at football. We’re not a sporting club aimed at sporting success anymore. We’re a business whose main aim is to make money for the owners. Challenging for top four seems to be enough to keep the money rolling in. Long term even that strategy will probably run its course but it’s working for them at the moment. It’s disgraceful but there you go.
Or one for crybaby fans and another for laid back supporters.
Dybala told us to effectively get fecked, not reducing his wages, Eriksen told us to get fecked because he's holding out hope for a club that doesn't even seem interested in him. Pogba is telling us to get fecked and looking to move, going as far as speaking publicly, getting his agent to do so and getting Zlatan to as well.
As shite as Lukaku is, he saw Inter as a more appealing prospect. This is one this window alone. A window where we supposedly weren't even pursuing top targets.
You should feel lucky he hasnt called you a topred this time.
He went to Inter cause Ole doesnt fancy him. Lets not make things up.
Wan Bissaka and Maguire when assessed individually are very good signings. When you take into account the fact that an injury to Pogba is going to have us playing Pereira as our creative midfielder, it's not enough. If we had no fecking intention of strengthening the midfield and attack, why did we sell Herrera, Fellaini and Lukaku? Pogba and Mctominay will get injured/need to be rested throughout the season, which will result in Matic, Pereira and Fred. Gomes and Garner are far too young/lack the experience to be relied on consistently throughout the season, although I hope to be wrong.
My support of Man Utd is unconditional. It is not just about winning for me and getting the best players. It is about taking really good young players and giving them a chance, watching them grow. It has been that way for decades.
If you have been a supporter since 1992 then you have been very fortunate. I started supporting the year we were relegated. It is just an incredible club and we lost a little bit of our identity in recent years. Highly unusual to sack managers in the way we have done and buy so many players at the end of their careers. I am just delighted that we are back doing the things that make us different. Lets hope that bodes well for Ole and his team as well. They need time but the signs and noises coming out of the club suggest we are very much back on track.
If you have been a supporter since 1992 then you have been very fortunate. I started supporting the year we were relegated. It is just an incredible club and we lost a little bit of our identity in recent years. Highly unusual to sack managers in the way we have done and buy so many players at the end of their careers. I am just delighted that we are back doing the things that make us different. Lets hope that bodes well for Ole and his team as well. They need time but the signs and noises coming out of the club suggest we are very much back on track.