Nostalgia Draft - SF: Himannv vs The Religion

With all players in their 3 year peaks, which team would win this game?


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Physiocrat

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Himannv



The Religion



Himmanv Tactics

Tactics: 4-3-3

Features:

- Larsson up front leading the line.
- Wide forwards cutting in (Baggio and Robben)
- Midfield trio built for both on the ball and off the ball success.
- Fullbacks who can attack and defend
- Desailly and Blanc complimentary pairing
- Preud'homme in goal.

In focus:

I think Larsson is a very underrated striker and at his best is a top striker who can score loads of goals while also acting as a great focal point of an attack. Here's a compilation of him that was simply scrumptious to watch:


The Religion Tactics

Formation: 5-3-2 - High wing backs for width, high tempo, direct style, aggressive ball winning in central areas

A back three set up that has been strengthened enormously with the acquisition of German legends Sammer and Kohler. Taffarel; quick off his line and comfortable with the ball at his feet. The ideal goalkeeper to build attacks and help sweep in behind however in this system he will not be a sweeper keeper given who he has in front of him. Nice option to have though should the need arise.

The system is tailor-made for Ballon d'Or-winning colossus Sammer, who from his favoured libero role can push through into the 6 area with Makelele to help win the ball back or create an overload in attacking phases, with LCB and RCB Kohler and Cannavaro holding the fort behind him.

High positioned attacking fullbacks both with powerful engines and capable of impacting the game in offensive and defensive phases; Lizarazu and Dani Alves provide the width. The system behind them allows them to both to play with more freedom going forward utilising their creativity and ability to create overloads and overlaps in wide areas. Both have the engines to get up and down the pitch quickly and both are good with the ball - they're both ideal for the system and probably the best set of wing backs in the draft.

Makelele will play his favoured defensive screening role alongside all-action all-rounder Clarence Seedorf. Classic 6 and 8 pairing. This midfield will not be out worked or out battled, nor does it lack technical ability with Makelele offering underrated deep lying play making ability and Seedorf boasting a highly impressive technical skill set in addition to his substantial physical gifts.

Hagi is in his element as our playmaker with complete freedom to drift in the left and central areas. This brings the best out of him creatively and prevents him from becoming frustrated. A technically excellent, mobile player who can isolate weaknesses and seek to exploit them. Capable of carrying the ball and dribbling past or picking incisive passes, this role simply lets Hagi express himself.

David Villa plays in partnership with Weah. They work in tandem and interchange between roles; one can drop deep, collect and carry whilst the other seeks that space to break the lines. The versatility of both players, in particular Villa, helps this work and creates huge problems for the opposition especially if they try and get close. The fluidity means CBs get pulled out of position and space appears which both have the awareness,and blistering pace, to exploit.

Key Notes;

* Three Ballon d'Or Winners in three key areas. Cannavaro, Sammer and Weah.

* The team has leaders everywhere and a rock solid core. The defence in particular would be tough to improve upon in this draft pool and includes the Sammer/Kohler partnership.

* Top-notch build up from deeper areas through Sammer and the two of the best full backs in the draft.

* The fluidity of the system is key and has the right balance of flexibility all over the pitch.

* With threats from every channel to stretch Himannv's defenders, there's few better in the draft than Villa to exploit the gaps and supply the lethal cutting edge. He'll thrive off the sheer chaos that Weah induced in defences at his peak, particularly with a creator of Hagi's quality behind them.

Subs;

Rustu
Couto
De Boer
Marquez
Scholl
Gerrard
Bebeto (inj)
Trezeguet

Taffarel - Greatest Brazilian keeper of all time with a true modern day style, quick off his line and comfortable in possession, good distribution, excellent reflexes and superb shot stopping ability - Peak 98-01 (World Cup winner, FIFA World XI, Brazilian football hall of famer)

Lizarazu - Bayern hall of fame inductee, energetic, reliable, defensively solid, mobile and with an excellent engine. Perfectly balanced full back going forward and defensively - Peak 98-01 (UEFA team of the year, FIFA World XI, Champions League winner, World Cup and Euro winner)

Dani Alves - Best offensive full back of his generation, excellent mobility, passing and crossing ability, overlapping runs to give width, powerful engine, strong, tenacious with high energy and workrate - Peak 07-10 (Eight time FIFA world XI member, Five time UEFA team of the year, La Liga defender of the season, Three time Champions League winner, player with most collective honours ever)

Seedorf - Complete midfielder; pace, stamina, strength, technical ability and creativity. Equally good defensively and devastating going forward - box to box role - Peak 06-09 (Four time Champions League winner, two time UEFA team of the year, UEFA best midfielder award, FIFA 100 inductee)

Makelele - That good they named his holding role after him, great reader of the game and perfect shield for the defence. Underrated DLP ability with excellent short passing and tactical and positional discipline - ball winner - Peak 04-07 (FIFA World XI pick, Champions League winner)

Hagi - Showman, playmaker, creative genius and absolute character, quick, two footed and comfortable in any forward areas, his understanding of space and technical ability is unrivalled at his peak - number 10 - Peak 94-97 (FIFA WC All Star, FIFA 100 inductee, 4th place Ballon d'Or, FIFA World XI pick)

Weah - Strong, physical, quick, superb dribbler and excellent finisher, all round multi functional forward, Ballon d'Or winner, FIFA world player of the year, who Henry modelled his game on - Peak 94-97 (Ballon d'Or winner, FIFA 100 inductee)

Cannavaro - One of his best attributes is mental strength, composure and consistency. Forget stupid mistakes and lapses in concentration, Fabio doesn't do them. When you add this mindset to his pace, power, ability to read the game, tackling and ball playing ability you really get a player with no weaknesses. His height? 5'9. Problem? Not when you have a leap like Michael Jordan and the timing and accuracy to go with it - Peak 03-06 - (Ballon d'Or winner, World player of the year, Two time FIFA World XI member, Team of the decade, World Cup winner.. I could go on)

Villa - Held as one of the greatest forwards of his generation and one the the best Spanish forwards of all time, a two footed prolific goalscorer with superb finishing, composure, agility, pace and dribbling abilities. Not only was Villa ruthless in front of goal he possessed excellent vision and passing ability. This, mixed with his football intelligence, allowed him to drop deep to receive the ball and link up play with the midfield. He was equally able to create for others as he was to score himself. - Peak 07-10 - (World Cup winner, European Championship winner, FIFA world XI member, CL winner, Spain's all time top scorer)

Kohler - Strong, powerful, excellent awareness and ariel ability. Highly regarded as one of the best stoppers of his generation and of all time. Hard in the tackle yet composed enough to recover the ball and play progressively with his feet - Peak 92-95 (World Cup Winner, European Championship Winner, Champions League Winner, Multiple domestic titles, German Footballer of the Year, European Championship Team of the Tournament)

Sammer - Not many defenders win the Ballon d'Or but Sammer was much more than a defender. His superb footballing brain, technical ability and natural fitness allowed him to do everything on the football pitch making him the best libro to grace the game and supremely comfortable in a number of defensive and offensive roles - Peak 94-97 (Ballon d'Or, 100 Greatest Player of All Time, European Championship Winner, Champions League Winner, 2 x German Player of the Year)
 

TheReligion

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Weah scored 7 goals in 9 matches against Laurent Blanc..

He's going to need some back up or George is going to annihilate him.
 

Himannv

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Weah scored 7 goals in 9 matches against Laurent Blanc..

He's going to need some back up or George is going to annihilate him.
I think it's rare that there'd be one-on-one duels such as this. It'll come down to how your attack fares against my defense and vise versa. I could say Baggio has scored 2 in 2 against Sammer for example but it's slightly pointless to bring up an argument of that nature as the supporting cast and the way the game plays out differs vastly from those separate instances in my view.
 

Himannv

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Nice team you've put together mate.
Likewise mate. At this stage of the draft, there aren't going to be huge glaring mistakes to point out and you've drafted very well in my view.

Why didn't you have Kohler on the left and Cannavaro on the right? Those seemed to be the natural sides for those players I reckon.
 

TheReligion

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Likewise mate. At this stage of the draft, there aren't going to be huge glaring mistakes to point out and you've drafted very well in my view.

Why didn't you have Kohler on the left and Cannavaro on the right? Those seemed to be the natural sides for those players I reckon.
Cheers!

RE Kohler and Cannavaro. Kohler was predominantly a right footer and his left was considered much weaker. He improved this in Italy but I felt Cannavaro had the edge if using his left so figured it made sense and offered better balance.
 

TheReligion

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When Sammer moves up the pitch to overload the central areas the numbers just don't add up to me.

Makelele, Sammer, Seedorf with Hagi collecting the ball to create.

I don't see Cambiasso, Deschamps and Enrique coping physically or technically nor do I see them getting much help from Baggio or Robben especially when you consider Dani Alves and Lizarazu overlapping and running in behind.
 

Himannv

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When Sammer moves up the pitch to overload the central areas the numbers just don't add up to me.

Makelele, Sammer, Seedorf with Hagi collecting the ball to create.

I don't see Cambiasso, Deschamps and Enrique coping physically or technically nor do I see them getting much help from Baggio or Robben especially when you consider Dani Alves and Lizarazu overlapping and running in behind.
Whatever system it may be, it will always be 11 vs 11 and any advantage in one part of the pitch due to overloading normally results in a disadvantage elsewhere. You might see more of the ball in midfield at some point but if Sammer is in midfield it means your defence is also left with 2 vs 3 and you're in a position that is susceptible to a counter. When Hagi drops deeper, your forwards get more isolated as a result and the game is played out more in midfield and less in the final 3rd.

I think a midfield of Deschamps, Cambiasso, and Lucho will never completely get overrun no matter who the opposition is. In possession, we have Baggio at times dropping deeper and Blanc stepping up creating a similar sort of advantage in midfield.

I think in general there are very few advantages of system unless we are taking about a very outdated system like a WM (and even in that case I think the players adjust for any sort of overcompensation in parts of the pitch).
 

Himannv

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Two great teams. Does that not look more like a Christmas tree @Himannv?
Yeah, it's a bit narrow at the top as I expect both Robben and Baggio to mostly cut in centrally. But nah, it's 4-3-3 on paper as I want those two to start out wide more often than not or start from the little pocket of space around or between the opposition midfield and the their wide CBs. The idea was for the team to be something like a 3-2-5 in attack. Generally speaking they'll just play on the counter if they have less of the ball.
 

TheReligion

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Whatever system it may be, it will always be 11 vs 11 and any advantage in one part of the pitch due to overloading normally results in a disadvantage elsewhere. You might see more of the ball in midfield at some point but if Sammer is in midfield it means your defence is also left with 2 vs 3 and you're in a position that is susceptible to a counter. When Hagi drops deeper, your forwards get more isolated as a result and the game is played out more in midfield and less in the final 3rd.

I think a midfield of Deschamps, Cambiasso, and Lucho will never completely get overrun no matter who the opposition is. In possession, we have Baggio at times dropping deeper and Blanc stepping up creating a similar sort of advantage in midfield.

I think in general there are very few advantages of system unless we are taking about a very outdated system like a WM (and even in that case I think the players adjust for any sort of overcompensation in parts of the pitch).
They are fair points however I just don't see the same levels in quality RE Blanc stepping in vs what Sammer was capable of.

The beauty of Villa and Weah together as forwards is they are both capable of picking the ball up in deeper areas with the other running off. Villa was an equally proficient creator (top assist in La Liga one season) as he was a goalscorer with Weah in full flow pretty much unstoppable carrying the ball forward. I don't see Hagi collecting the ball slightly deeper causing an issue, especially given his own passing range and ability to create space to operate.

When you add to this the workrate and attacking capabilities of Lizarazu and Dani Alves in the channels I just don't see them getting isolated.
 

TheReligion

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RE Baggio.

Undoubtedly the star of the opposition and difficult to keep quiet. Note on his side of the pitch he's matched up against the defensively solid and tireless Lizarazu in the wide areas and fellow Ballon d'Or winner Cannavaro who is my LCB.

Makelele is also in his screening role whilst Dani Alves has exactly what is needed to match up with the pace and trickery of Robben causing mischief over the other side.

I appreciate there's fluidity and it's not always as simple as 1v1 match ups however I feel my side is better equipped to deal with the strengths of the opposition whilst I'm not convinced he can deal with mine.
 

Himannv

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They are fair points however I just don't see the same levels in quality RE Blanc stepping in vs what Sammer was capable of.

The beauty of Villa and Weah together as forwards is they are both capable of picking the ball up in deeper areas with the other running off. Villa was an equally proficient creator (top assist in La Liga one season) as he was a goalscorer with Weah in full flow pretty much unstoppable carrying the ball forward. I don't see Hagi collecting the ball slightly deeper causing an issue, especially given his own passing range and ability to create space to operate.

When you add to this the workrate and attacking capabilities of Lizarazu and Dani Alves in the channels I just don't see them getting isolated.
I don't think it's a like-for-like comparison between Sammer and Blanc. It is the midfield as a whole that you should consider and I think my midfield will not be easily turned over with Deschamps, Cambiasso, and Enrique in there supported by Baggio and Blanc.

I have to say I'm not convinced by your argument on Hagi, Villa, and Weah. They're fine as a trio, but if your instructions are for them to drop deep into midfield I think that has a relative impact on their presence in the final third. Goals win matches and you're committing too many resources into winning the midfield battle and leaving your defence and attack relatively threadbare.
 

Himannv

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I think there's a tactical issue here. With Sammer and Hagi too committed to midfield, I think the strikers get too isolated and also they are more susceptible to a counter as the tactics indicate that only two players seem to sit back, which is just suicide against Baggio, Robben, and Larsson.
 

TheReligion

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I don't think it's a like-for-like comparison between Sammer and Blanc. It is the midfield as a whole that you should consider and I think my midfield will not be easily turned over with Deschamps, Cambiasso, and Enrique in there supported by Baggio and Blanc.

I have to say I'm not convinced by your argument on Hagi, Villa, and Weah. They're fine as a trio, but if your instructions are for them to drop deep into midfield I think that has a relative impact on their presence in the final third. Goals win matches and you're committing too many resources into winning the midfield battle and leaving your defence and attack relatively threadbare.
I just don't see your midfield matching up and winning the battle. Individually or as a unit.

RE the forwards I was simply showing the flexibility in that they are capable of dropping deep and won't be isolated from the game as you suggested could happen.
 

TheReligion

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I think there's a tactical issue here. With Sammer and Hagi too committed to midfield, I think the strikers get too isolated and also they are more susceptible to a counter as the tactics indicate that only two players seem to sit back, which is just suicide against Baggio, Robben, and Larsson.
I think you're forgetting (or underestimating) what Makelele brings to the team. They literally named the screening role after him. Then you have Seedorf who is the ultimate all round midfielder. Equally capable in defensive duties as he was going forward. Both are relentless in that area of the pitch and don't allow anyone time on the ball.

Sammer was an extremely smart player and knew when to go and when to hold his position. I don't see him getting caught out as you suggest but even if he was that safety net is strong.
 

TheReligion

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@TheReligion what is your formation in an attacking phase going to look like?
I can't post another graphic at the moment but will try and get someone to do it for me (stuck on my phone!).

It's 3-5-2 going forward fluid to 5-3-2 in defence. Obviously the players allow flexibility in that system with width provided by the full backs. Can I ask where your width is coming from especially with Baggio being primarily a central SS or CF and Robben cutting in? Where are your full backs operating? It looks rather narrow.
 

Himannv

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I can't post another graphic at the moment but will try and get someone to do it for me (stuck on my phone!).

It's 3-5-2 going forward fluid to 5-3-2 in defence. Obviously the players allow flexibility in that system with width provided by the full backs. Can I ask where your width is coming from especially with Baggio being primarily a central SS or CF and Robben cutting in? Where are your full backs operating? It looks rather narrow.
So Sammer doesn't exactly join up with the midfield in attack if so? It should be a 2-6-2 if he does, but what you're saying is something completely different in a sense that the backline actually holds its line in both offensive and defensive phases.

Regarding my setup, think of it as a modern one with wing forwards and fullbacks who can attack and also defend their flank (both Cole and Lahm have played this exact setup so nothing new for them).
 

Himannv

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I think you're forgetting (or underestimating) what Makelele brings to the team. They literally named the screening role after him. Then you have Seedorf who is the ultimate all round midfielder. Equally capable in defensive duties as he was going forward. Both are relentless in that area of the pitch and don't allow anyone time on the ball.

Sammer was an extremely smart player and knew when to go and when to hold his position. I don't see him getting caught out as you suggest but even if he was that safety net is strong.
I don't think the Makelele - Seedorf midfield is in any way superior to the Deschamps - Cambiasso - Enrique midfield. Not saying it is bad or anything but it is not even close to being as superior as you seem to suggest. Not buying that at all. Will let others chime in regarding that point.
 
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TheReligion

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So Sammer doesn't exactly join up with the midfield in attack if so? It should be a 2-6-2 if he does, but what you're saying is something completely different in a sense that the backline actually holds its line in both offensive and defensive phases.

Regarding my setup, think of it as a modern one with wing forwards and fullbacks who can attack and also defend their flank (both Cole and Lahm have played this exact setup so nothing new for them).
On the first point.

Sammer is in his libero role and has enough tactical discipline to hold or go and understand when to do so. This set up is literally made for him as it allows him to contribute in the key areas of the pitch. Basic example would be when carrying the ball for instance and joining the attack you'd still end up with Cannavaro, Makelele and Kohler centrally etc.

On the other point;

I'm not certain Baggio is a) comfortable going out wide or b) helping out defensively. He was primarily a central player (correct me if I'm wrong) and I don't see him tracking back to assist Cole. These are the exact pockets the magical Hagi can exploit in his favoured role.
 

Physiocrat

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Really tight game again. Weah and Villa is a tasty front two especially with Hagi in behind. Seedorf looks a little odd in a two but given its a back 5 its fine and might provide an extra level of creativity. The Religion has a really clean team but is really shouting out for Pirlo to replace Deschamps. As it stands that midfield three is rather workman like. Still Baggio and Robben will be great.
 

Himannv

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I'm not certain Baggio is a) comfortable going out wide or b) helping out defensively. He was primarily a central player (correct me if I'm wrong) and I don't see him tracking back to assist Cole. These are the exact pockets the magical Hagi can exploit in his favoured role.
Baggio can play anywhere mate. Forward, wing forward, second striker, striker, AM, it all fits fine for him. I'd say he prefers that inside left channel if he does have a best place to be, hence his positioning. I don't think discussing Baggio's defensive workrate matters in a 4-3-3. He's there to attack and Cole can mind the flank.
 

TheReligion

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@TheReligion I assume that's Frank de Boer? Thanks for taking him off our bench (Dutch NT), but how come @Himannv doesn't have a bench?

Edit: @TheReligion congrats! You couldn't have not done it without me :)
H didn't show his bench. Infact @Himannv who did you have and out of interest would you have used them differently?

@VanDeBank I'm trying to work out how you helped here.. you didn't vote for me. Were you using the mindbending tricks of Uri Geller to get The Divine Ponytail to sky another pen?
 

VanDeBank

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H didn't show his bench. Infact @Himannv who did you have and out of interest would you have used them differently?

@VanDeBank I'm trying to work out how you helped here.. you didn't vote for me. Were you using the mindbending tricks of Uri Geller to get The Divine Ponytail to sky another pen?
I have yet to acquire Uri Geller by trading my Abracadabra.

And like I said: You couldn't have not done it without me.
 

Himannv

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H didn't show his bench. Infact @Himannv who did you have and out of interest would you have used them differently?

@VanDeBank I'm trying to work out how you helped here.. you didn't vote for me. Were you using the mindbending tricks of Uri Geller to get The Divine Ponytail to sky another pen?
I had Gullit, Gazza, Yaya and a few others. No changes to my starting lineup though. This was the team I wanted to build and I'm very happy with it despite the loss.

I wanted Deschamps sitting ahead of Blanc and Desailly from the beginning and I was lucky to get the kind of fullbacks that I liked. Plus Baggio is just phenomenal. Some people might argue against Lucho but I think you need players like him on the pitch to chase things down and get involved in the game. Also simply love Cambiasso - such a wonderful player.
 

antohan

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Missed this.

Very jealous @TheReligion, we had that convo early on about fullbacks and clearly were going in the same direction. Getting Sammer 3rd cost me Makelele and Seedorf (yes, I had both very high up on my hitlist) and now you have Sammer anyway. Bastard :mad: :lol:

@Himannv good side, very astute upgrades along the way. I was surprised you passed on Deschamps in the first reinforcement round but it all came together quite nicely and better. That side (and yes, that midfield) would give anyone a game.

Like to see a fair few not-that-fancy names trusted with roles which are absolutely spot on for them. Can't really see anyone out there that isn't 100% in his element. Brilliant.