Devil_forever
You're only young once, you can be immature f'ever
No thanks.At the end, it leaves us with the option of Zidane. A much respectable option in my opinion. The league will be terribly fierce in a few months.
No thanks.At the end, it leaves us with the option of Zidane. A much respectable option in my opinion. The league will be terribly fierce in a few months.
Yeah well. I don't think I'd want Conte here anyway so not losing any sleep over it.In the meantime we still have Ole ….yippee!!!
Hes waiting for the France job and doesn't want United.At the end, it leaves us with the option of Zidane. A much respectable option in my opinion. The league will be terribly fierce in a few months.
Your problem here is that you somewhat misconstrue and oversimplify what the issue is. The point is not simply to get a manager that stays for a large number of years. The point is to build a certain stability in the style of play and type of football and identity generally, because that is conducive to long-term recruitment and also to talent development, and additionally it is no longer really a functioning model to regard the whole organisation as a tool that works to the demands of whoever the manager is presently. Long term results come out of a complex organisation that involves a lot more elements and people than 20 years ago, and for that to work, it has to be informed by some sort of longer term coherent vision and sense of direction. It's at least as much about not changing that every two years as it is about not changing the manager every two years. And while for United, all of that sort of grew out of Ferguson's way because he was here for so long and was so successful, it can't work that way generally. In that sense, we really do have to get away from SAFs legacy. In order to remain, a manager must achieve success. Agreed. But in order for the organisation to be successful with any consistency, you can't just hand over the keys to someone you fancy as a winner in whatever way, and go with that until it's over, and then start all over again. Barca doesn't do that, Bayern doesn't do that. I'm pretty sure Liverpool and City isn't going to do that either, when the time comes for Klopp and Pep to leave.One of our biggest problems is actually this obsession with long-term managers. Long term managers at big clubs are simply managers that keep winning and want to stay. Guardiola never really looked like a long term manager, but the fact that he keeps winning things means everyone is happy and he'll be there for probably 7+ yrs by the time he finishes. If he wants to stay for 10, 15, 20+ years he can, as long as he keeps winning.
At United we put the cart before the horse. We make winning secondary to having managers that are around for a long time. We recruit managers and tell them its a long term appointment, which justifies each new manager ripping up the squad they found, spending a fortune on players that only suit them, and underperforming for a couple of seasons.
The hard reality is that when a manager starts to fail at United, they get sacked, the same as anywhere else. You can't keep a failing manager with unhappy players, the media and the fans all turning on him, just because two years ago you wanted it to be different.
The practical upshot is that we end up being a more short term club than even Chelsea. At Chelsea they build the squad first and foremost and then just choose a manager to make the most of it. They prioritise continuity of the players from season to season instead of the manager. We not only replace the manager every two or three years, we replace the squad too.
If we want a long term manager, start with getting a successful one, and keep them happy. Until we accept the reality that the only long term managers are successful ones, we're stuck making the same mistakes, in a cycle of perpetual transition.
I don't either, but it's still bad news for us if Tottenham gets him. At least and especially in the short term.Yeah well. I don't think I'd want Conte here anyway so not losing any sleep over it.
Possibly the biggest tosh I've read for a while.Nope. I don't buy that for a second. He's manage to make Tottenham a global brand that is likely to be involved in the sweeping changes involving the top tier of the sport. At this juncture, it is probably more important than a club like Spurs actually winning trophies.
As a comparison point: Leicester, who have been more successful over the last 25 years but have not had a sniff of getting into any proposed Super League.
Listen, I wouldn't be surprised if Conte is also gone before the season is over.I don't either, but it's still bad news for us if Tottenham gets him. At least and especially in the short term.
Thanks mate I appreciate it. I hope you arent too sad over Conte.You're so funny.
He hasnt won two matches in a row before? How odd. I must be misremembering. Oh thats right you mean now because every match is enoguh to call for a managers head. Plastics gonna plastic.Imagine calling people plastics after giving a clearly not good enough manager almost 3 years in charge, and 440m in transfers, and after embarrassing display after another with a squad stacked with quality and a wage bill that is higher than 99.99% of clubs in world football.
At least wait for Ole to win two matches in a row before acting like a proper top red cnut.
He’s not good enough, but he’s easily better at managing than you are at reading. Is English your 3rd language?He hasnt won two matches in a row before? How odd. I must be misremembering. Oh thats right you mean now because every match is enoguh to call for a managers head. Plastics gonna plastic.
This you?He hasnt won two matches in a row before? How odd. I must be misremembering. Oh thats right you mean now because every match is enoguh to call for a managers head. Plastics gonna plastic.
Ramshock said:he has lost my support.,,,jve had enough of inept tactics and bizarre team selections. His disdain for Kagawa fecking baffles me
From February of Moyes' first season... so having been in the job for about 6 months. But you're giving out to other posters who now think Ole needs to go, having been here 3 years?Ramshock said:Whats it going to take for him to get sacked this season?
Then someone said that some posters are happy for Untied to lose because it means Moyes might get sacked, you replied:Ramshock said:Rapidly losing my patience with him
Ramshock said:Yes because fans love when we lose...grow up
Ramshock said:Look I understand supporters are impatient these days and for the most part I would agree with you but we have a guy here who just makes the most baffling team selections and seemingly has a touch of the Jonah about him when it comes to luck with injuries etc.
This you he says. How about you go back and check on the rest of my posts those seasons and come back to me. I will always support the manager until it is obvious he is detrimental to the team. Go back and find more posts from those seasons please.This you?
From February of Moyes' first season... so having been in the job for about 6 months. But you're giving out to other posters who now think Ole needs to go, having been here 3 years?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/moyes-so-far.373984/page-386#post-14992095
In fact, from October of Moyes' first season:
Then someone said that some posters are happy for Untied to lose because it means Moyes might get sacked, you replied:
Maybe you wanna chill on the sanctimonious labeling of other supporters as plastics?
I'm alright thanks, but you keep labeling people plastics, clearly that's your MO and what gives you pleasure on hereThis you he says. How about you go back and check on the rest of my posts those seasons and come back to me.
Agreed, but it was in response to the poster saying the only available managers who would take the job are x, y, z. My point is koeman would take it. Seems like conte is taking the job so he was there too.Koeman would but he’s an awful manager who treats players like crap. His tactics are poor, he played Dominic Calvert-Lewin as a right-back in a match once.
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Was just saying he’s available and would definitely take it mWhy would anyone go for koeman?
^^Even Woodward won’t touch him, which is saying something.
Aye you are alright thanks because you know you are in the wrong, trying to be smart by cherry picking peoples posts. Go back and find more and dont be such a yellow streak of pish.I'm alright thanks, but you keep labeling people plastics, clearly that's your MO and what gives you pleasure on here
Not trying to be smart, just calling out top red bs without resorting to insults like you areAye you are alright thanks because you know you are in the wrong, trying to be smart by cherry picking peoples posts. Go back and find more and dont be such a yellow streak of pish.
Brilliant.This you?
From February of Moyes' first season... so having been in the job for about 6 months. But you're giving out to other posters who now think Ole needs to go, having been here 3 years?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/moyes-so-far.373984/page-386#post-14992095
In fact, from October of Moyes' first season:
Then someone said that some posters are happy for Untied to lose because it means Moyes might get sacked, you replied:
Maybe you wanna chill on the sanctimonious labeling of other supporters as plastics?
No what you are doing is cherry picking posts to suit your poor argument. Like I said I will always support the manager until its clearly detrimental to the team. And as you are fond of browsing peoples posts you will see that for yourself. I backed Moyes, LVG and Jose. Usually when I have felt they have been detrimental to the players I have stated so and not long after they have been sacked. Maybe LVGs sacking caught me out as it was a surprise to everybody. I dont see Oles reign being that detrimental yet. You tried to be smart and its backfired. So If I were you I would cut along.Not trying to be smart, just calling out top red bs without resorting to insults like you are
Brilliant.
Ramshock said:You know things are bad when your Spurs supporting cousin gives you shit most weeks
We need Ramshock to let us know when we should care about what fans of other clubs think and when we should ignore it!The mods can sort these threads quickly.
Who gives a feck what other clubs fans think, we have enough idiots of our own who call themselves fans.
There may be 50 shades of grey but if people think if and when theres a new manager and the #ManagerOut stuff will stop they are fecking morons. Our club is polluted with infantile plastic arseholes who will cry #ManagerOut even when things arent as bad as they have been. They of course will always be right as eventually managers leave but until then they are insufferable and miserable cnuts who if you pull them up on it whine like little bitches and bring out the novel Top red nonsense. You all know the type theres a lot of them on here who will always be miserable unless we are winning a top trophy every year and even then they will still fecking moan.
I don't actually have an 'argument' I am just pointing out your hypocrisy. Just be consistent, make your point without trying to cut down other posters for expressing their own opinions. I actually don't care if you support/don't support the manager but perhaps you could reflect on the fact that different opinions does not always = other people are plastics.No what you are doing is cherry picking posts to suit your poor argument. Like I said I will always support the manager until its clearly detrimental to the team. And as you are fond of browsing peoples posts you will see that for yourself. I backed Moyes, LVG and Jose. Usually when I have felt they have been detrimental to the players I have stated so and not long after they have been sacked. Maybe LVGs sacking caught me out as it was a surprise to everybody. I dont see Oles reign being that detrimental yet. You tried to be smart and its backfired. So If I were you I would cut along.
Well conte is about to take the job unless we swoop in for him, that’s saying something.Your off your head if you think Moyes would go to Spurs
He’s had a sting of terrible moves recently Moyes
United
Sunderland
Sociedad
None have done him any good, yet now he’s found a team he’s flying with….with a decent project, excellent players, big Club, you think he’ll leave all that for Spurs?? After all he’s been through recent appointment wise???
Spurs is a club in absolutely turmoil with an owner that has zero ambition and players that are wanting to leave, one of them the star man in Kane.
Football is never clear and straightforward
But it is clear and straightforward that Moyes is never leaving West Ham for Spurs.
You could put your life on it and be able to sleep easy at night
Top work. The less said the better, though. I just ignore him and my experience on the caf is better for it.Moyes thread:
Ole thread, today:
We need Ramshock to let us know when we should care about what fans of other clubs think and when we should ignore it!
Fair play, I usually do, that's good advice! I won't say any more to derail the thread, I think the point has been madeTop work. The less said the better, though. I just ignore him and my experience on the caf is better for it.
Moyes thread:
Ole thread, today:
We need Ramshock to let us know when we should care about what fans of other clubs think and when we should ignore it!
This you?
From February of Moyes' first season... so having been in the job for about 6 months. But you're giving out to other posters who now think Ole needs to go, having been here 3 years?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/moyes-so-far.373984/page-386#post-14992095
In fact, from October of Moyes' first season:
Then someone said that some posters are happy for Untied to lose because it means Moyes might get sacked, you replied:
Maybe you wanna chill on the sanctimonious labeling of other supporters as plastics?
Not nearly as sad as you are, in general.Thanks mate I appreciate it. I hope you arent too sad over Conte.
Conte and Levy. Should be interesting.Well conte is about to take the job unless we swoop in for him, that’s saying something.
Well played! Impressive work thatThis you?
From February of Moyes' first season... so having been in the job for about 6 months. But you're giving out to other posters who now think Ole needs to go, having been here 3 years?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/moyes-so-far.373984/page-386#post-14992095
In fact, from October of Moyes' first season:
Then someone said that some posters are happy for Untied to lose because it means Moyes might get sacked, you replied:
Maybe you wanna chill on the sanctimonious labeling of other supporters as plastics?
This you?
From February of Moyes' first season... so having been in the job for about 6 months. But you're giving out to other posters who now think Ole needs to go, having been here 3 years?
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/moyes-so-far.373984/page-386#post-14992095
In fact, from October of Moyes' first season:
Then someone said that some posters are happy for Untied to lose because it means Moyes might get sacked, you replied:
Maybe you wanna chill on the sanctimonious labeling of other supporters as plastics?
What a hypocriteMoyes thread:
Ole thread, today:
We need Ramshock to let us know when we should care about what fans of other clubs think and when we should ignore it!
Yes, because stamping around a discussion forum labeling people you don't agree with as "plastics" shows tremendous growth and maturityNot really, people are entitled to change their minds and mature their opinions
I’m talking merely about the posts aboveYes, because stamping around a discussion forum labeling people you don't agree with as "plastics" shows tremendous growth and maturity
That's fine, maybe one changes their mindset over time, it happens, but like I said that doesn't mean you need to insult and aggressively call out other people for expressing their opinions (especially if you have history for expressing similar opinions about a different manager), as he routinely does. Just my two cents and I'll move on now.I’m talking merely about the posts above
Sure. But aren't people entitled to think that United should move on from Ole without being stamped as "plastics" and bad fans? Criticise the post and not the poster and all that...Not really, people are entitled to change their minds and mature their opinions
Sure that’s a fair point. I was really just commenting on finding something from the moyes time and saying he may have changed his opinionSure. But aren't people entitled to think that United should move on from Ole without being stamped as "plastics" and bad fans? Criticise the post and not the poster and all that...
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