Might even be better than Arteta, having learned from world class managers.
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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It seems that anyone would have done it all anyway, but better, and all that whilst producing consistent victories and sparkling attacking football
Mckenna was lauded as the U18's coach, not in small part because he was getting them to play light years better than Sbargia's U23's bunch, if he now has more ideas than Ole then I'm worried, he should be been guided himself by the world class coach that we have at the helm, that allows himself to take his career to the next level, and where Carrick falls in all this I have no idea.
Seemingly the managerial setup mirrors the 'board' setup, clueless.
Who is RedReveal and why are they spreading nonsense?
In fact, why are so many twitter accounts spreading shit lately?
In fact, why are so many twitter accounts spreading shit lately?
That's what @Seij is talking about. Convincing people about this rebuilding project BS and that it'll take time so that he keeps his job safe. Absolutely no indication considering what we're seeing on the pitch regularly that 5 years from now and 500m more spent we'll be anywhere better under his guidance with such style of play. Just like cultural changes, these are BS narratives pushed by Ole to convince everyone he's doing a great job and he should keep his position, and you're falling into it just like the majority of Ole supporters who are supporting him for the sole purpose of proving to others that they're the real fans who know the real way of supporting the club and that they have longer sight than us.
No need to get defensive and bring up the current Arsenal headcoach who is irrelevant to the discussion.
McKenna is a fantastic young coach potentially that has gone from u18s to being the main man at first team level. Such responsibility thrust on him is a little unfair but sadly we've put ourselves in a situation where McKenna is the most talented coach we have and by default he has to take charge.
They both learned from the best but have no actual experience, nor won any trophies. I'd say it's a more realistic comparison
Which is pathetic, Giggs for all his haters no doubt learnt loads from LvG, and Mckenna should be learning how to become better, not be the leader, we will run the risk of losing him as well if we are not careful.
I appreciate this story is hearsay, but it is so blatantly believable.
Learning from the best is when you're working alongside the best in a coaching role. Arteta did that but Ole didn't.They both learned from the best but have no actual experience, nor won any trophies. I'd say it's a more realistic comparison
It's a shambles.
On every level, we can't just focus on the first team management, nothing changes until everything changes,.
How are they not fantasies?! Jesus christ, our squad has an abysmal injury record and looks like one of the least fit sides in the league even after Ole's whole "we just need a pre season to get the boys in shape" spiel. Ole has even caused his best players to get injured through just sheer idiocy.We don't have a style of play any pundit or fan can point to and say "wow this team is great to watch". We've had about 4 halves of good football all fecking season! We look tumescent, bereft of ideas and worse than at any point under Mourinho, Moyes or LVG against any side not in the top 6.
Any talk of a 3 year plan is obviously bullshit. No one should be stupid enough to buy that crap by now. LVG and Mourinho were all about the mythical "3 year plan"... it's vacuous crap. And if it doesn't slide from top managers (in their day), why should it slide as an excuse for a managerial no-mark like Ole? And at least Mourinho and LVG didn't need to detour the club to true lower-mid table levels of performances and results (or relegation candidate performances from Ole's United in 2020) on the journey through their 3 year plans.
Purchasing young hungry players... well the jury is still very much out on that one. Maguire is worse than he was last season. AWB is worse than he was last season. James is a Championship quality of player and doesn't look like he'll ever be much more than an impact sub.
We press well at times though. That is probably the best we do. Still conceding goals on set pieces for fun.
We don't have a style of play any pundit or fan can point to and say "wow this team is great to watch". We've had about 4 halves of good football all fecking season! We look tumescent, bereft of ideas and worse than at any point under Mourinho, Moyes or LVG against any side not in the top 6.
Any talk of a 3 year plan is obviously bullshit. No one should be stupid enough to buy that crap by now. LVG and Mourinho were all about the mythical "3 year plan"... it's vacuous crap. And if it doesn't slide from top managers (in their day), why should it slide as an excuse for a managerial no-mark like Ole? And at least Mourinho and LVG didn't need to detour the club to true lower-mid table levels of performances and results (or relegation candidate performances from Ole's United in 2020) on the journey through their 3 year plans.
Purchasing young hungry players... well the jury is still very much out on that one. Maguire is worse than he was last season. AWB is worse than he was last season. James is a Championship quality of player and doesn't look like he'll ever be much more than an impact sub.
Also not doing much with the ball.
I do think Maguire is better than last year. He was pretty poor for Leicester from what I can remember. They did concede a lot and didn't play that well before they got Rodgers.
The narrative about Ole's football being based on counter attacking is hilarious.
Did you watch any games since December 2018 ? Like for real ?
If you think otherwise then you are probably the one who hasn't been watching us.
You just need to wake up, that's OK.
Here come the leaks.
Can you point to any game we've won under Ole this season that wasn't based on counter attacking?
Chelsea (H&A), Norwich (A&H), Brighton (H), Tottenham (H), Newcastle (H), Burnley (A).
Colchester (H), Partizan (H&A), AZ (H), Astana (H), Wolves (H), Tranmere (A).
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I'm fully awake. You are the one who is having day dreams.
We are a top 3 richest and most popular club in the world. There is absolutely no reason to excuse this dross for a year. This is not some FM season where you promote and sign a bunch of young players and auto play the season trusting a scout predicted growth curve. I don't see any sign of improvement in the way we play. In fact, we look worse than a year ago if anything.
This "squad is fecked over" doesn't make sense. He is the one that thinned the squad to this extent and didn't replace them properly. Our 3 "brilliant signings" all look worse after being managed by Ole for several months than they did initially. Ole is the one emphatically stated "football is easy when you have good players" when we were in good form. Then he blamed lack of fitness when the results went off the cliff and said he'll need the summer to work on the players' fitness. Then when the results this season didn't improve at all he basically wrote off the season saying this season is really for him to assess the squad and rebuild. He keeps coming up with excuses and you're eating them up like candies.
Tell me, if our manager's name was David Moyes and he was doing exactly the same thing with same results as Ole to date, would you be still singing "Moyes in / downfall to the keyboarder warrior condescenders"? Actually, don't answer that since I know your answer already and I don't believe it.
Come on, a few months ago there were posters talking about whispers how McKenna was a genius.
HAHAHAHAHAHA
We're all just fools to the MUFC briefings and astroturfing.
Look where this genius and shining beacon Ole have led us to in the table.
The worst thing is how poorly the team seems to play.. genius coaching? GENIUS PR
HAHAHAHAHAHA
We're all just fools to the MUFC briefings and astroturfing.
Look where this genius and shining beacon Ole have led us to in the table.
The worst thing is how poorly the team seems to play.. genius coaching? GENIUS PR
Can only assume you do not know meaning or word narrative, counter attacking football and have not figured out sometimes the opposition don’t let us counter attack (those are the games we do terrible in next time your watching).
Surely a lazy attempt at being a WUM.
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He shouldn't be here next season. We would probably sign more players in the summer that Ole deems the right fit and I'm expecting the squad to look solid then. But Ole will underachieve with such a squad just like he's underachieving with this one currently.
The only foundation Ole has laid is promoting youth, clearing deadwood and recruiting young hungry players. He's built a young squad so far which is what coaches like Pochettino, Rose, Nagelsmann or Ten Hag works with. Give any of these coaches the budget or the improved squad Ole will get this summer transfer window and they will perform better than he would with the improved squad.
Ole has done well in the sense that he has shown Ed and the board what they need to do and what the fans want. Attacking football, signing the right fit, promoting youth, clearing average players etc. And this is good because now we can look for a good coach that ticks all these boxes. We can continue signing the right fit and doing the good work of Ole but with better coaching. It will look like Ole never left but with better football. Give Ole next season and he will underachieve (like he is doing now) even after getting new players and a solid squad. Give a better coach the job next season, continue signing the right fit, continue playing attacking football, clearing deadwood etc and we're on the right course
2020 and people still don't understand how those twitter accounts work. They've literally given the source and everything, and you're still confused
Just to clarify, I do not think he is the man to lead us post this season. We need a new manager, to me it seems Ole is a yes man to the players too, he doesn't seem to have that aura about him to manage United.
Even though I do not think he is the right man, I feel he has made changes that will benefit us in the future.
The reason we rushed for a striker is because in the summer, they didnt feel anyone they wanted was available and wait for another year. This way we will have an idea if Martial will make it here as a No. 9, and it seems he wont.
Our defence: We have improved but even if we keep clean sheets, to win games we need to score and we don't.
I think hes signings have been good, better than signings made by any of the last 3 managers.
IN respects to Greenwood, I can appreciate not giving him too much pressure etc, but as the manager you have come out and said he is the most natural finisher, that means to me he is brilliant in the box, yet we play him RW and Martial CF when he doesnt even get into the box. Some will say he is too young, I don't buy that because Haland at 19 is playing week in week out, Trent was playing weekly at 18. We can play him this season and when we sign a ST have him back up again?
When was Ole assistant coach for sir Alex? I cant recall that time!They both learned from the best but have no actual experience, nor won any trophies. I'd say it's a more realistic comparison
Ole is a genius in a way. How he convinced the board about his many years plan and more importantly how he convinced some of our fans about it is amazing. Do not underestimate him.
Amazing John cross story is just taken as truth without any doubt.
Yeah ManUtd players complained about the training and revealed it to John Cross, who has history of fabricating stories.
Yeah ManUtd players complained about the training and revealed it to John Cross, who has history of fabricating stories.
People talk about counter attacking as though it is an ugly tactic. What is it now is just a lazy criticism, and usually from the same individuals who criticise coaching. Sometimes it is just the right fit for a team. United are still 20th out of 20 in terms of long balls played, so its not as if we are pumping it long to our forwards Allardyce style. Far from it in fact. There is a clear intention to play the ball out from the back whenever possible, and while this occasionally gets us into trouble (like most teams), its the way we should be looking to play - which incidentally would not have been possible with Smalling in the team.
Our lazy reputation for counter-attacking actually stems from a coaching team understanding and adapting to what this team hasn't had - creative midfield players. We struggle when opponents defend deep because of this, so how do we counteract that? The only way we can, by trying to engineer situations where our forwards can receive the ball in space, which is when they become quite lethal. Its not really a shock or any kind of insult to the staff - if anything its more of a compliment. We have a squad that have serious creativity issues when Pogba is unavailable (so basically always) and they are making the most of what they have got. Many of our poorest results have come from matches where we have held a territorial advantage for the most part, so I really don't see what the issue is with this. Its just another boring argument from people looking anywhere they can for reasons to criticise.
How is it a criticism if it’s how we play and how the manager chooses to play. What people have to realise is Ole isn’t a top class coach or a manager, not even close. Basic tactics, limited playing style etc is what we should expect, that’s the manager we hired. There’s no point pretending he is anything but that or has anything in common with the best managers.
One minute Ole is laying foundations and focused on the future the next he’s making most of what he’s got (mind you that’s a bit of a stretch) and only playing this way because he has to.
Clearing deadwoods is like crediting the dynamite team that clears the rubbles to build the taj mahal
Any manager can do the culling, what saf did was culling on the fly while keeping standards high. What ole did was brining the dynamite and blows the wrong part. While spending the budget on something that doesnt need to be blown up but he blew anyway.
And still we dont have a fecking roof
Ole is a huge problem, or the biggest problem why we play so poorly. Having said that, that coaching team has been around for a long time, it is time to change that as well imo. I wouldn't trust them if a new manager came in
Well, if you actually watch our games, you could see we are always building possession from the back with Lindelöf and Maguire, they find the right passes to break the lines and to play fast through. They play in the little spaces with quick passes and often forward. We also keep the ball a lot more than before with Jose. We use our fullbacks way more and they participate on the building part and last movement (crosses, key passes through the lines).
But, McTominay and Pogba are injured all the time, Lingard and Andreas are ineffective creatively and our forwards have been out injured too or out of form. You also can see that we don't have any viable options on the right flank, James being unrecognizable for few weeks now. And now Rashford is out, we have a problem on the left wing. Our squad was already paper thin but with all theses injuries and out of form players, it's complicated for any manager, even the better. And I know there are a lot of better managers than Solskjaer but he'll give all he have for our club and will put the culture first, the one why we felt in love with Manchester United.
So no, our playing style is not counter attacking, surely not. And yes, Ole lacks a lot of things to implement the kind of football he wants his team to play. Once we have all our players back and 2-3 additions in the summer (DM, RW, CAM), I'm sure we'll more progress than we actually see.
Forget Ole is the manager for one second and let's pretend its Pep, Klopp, Pochettino, whomever you want. Then look at the squad and tell me where you think the current set of players realistically have a chance of finishing.
Top 6?
Top 4?
Top 2?
I agree. If we do go down the road of bringing in a successful manager, then let him bring his own staff with him. McKenna and Carrick are both novices and shouldnt be the main men. Phelan bragged he ran the club under Fergie, but like his spell at Hull it shows he isnt all he thinks he is.
Better coaching would have u top 4 at least. Who bought in James as a top striker/winger? Who bought in Wan B when he wanted a RWB? Who hasnt improved the team one bit in 14 months? Lets hope Bruno is the real deal and doesnt get coached poorer than when he came.
Well said.
Honestly it get so tiresome arguing on here when every post just descends immediately into the bolded line above. Where does a conversation go from there exactly? You have no idea what constitutes a top class coach any more than I or the rest of this board does. When people say 'coaching is shit' what they actually mean is 'results are shit'. Its time people accepted that there are gaping holes in our squad that cant be solved by coaching.
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