Don't know why people give these muppets a platform...
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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Can you elaborate on the bolded part? To be honest I hear this a lot and don't get me wrong I am NOT saying is as good as Klopp or Pep. However I struggle to determine what is meant by this.
I mean, when you think of Pep you think of the Barca way to press high and winning the ball in dangerous areas, with tiki taka football. Meanwhile with Klopp you think of high energy side with flying fullbacks.
I believe Ole has tried to implement some of these facets to a certain extent but I believe we've lacked the squad to properly execute these styles (this is slowly improving with Bruno.)
I'm not trying to trivialise coaching in any way but I do believe that under Ole we tried to press high from the front at the beginning and this has stopped as we didn't have the legs in the side to fulfil the requirements of the style. Likewise I don't believe Ole is telling our fullbacks to sit back, in fact they seem to have pretty much free reign to get forward when they like.
I just think that Ole will again implement these once we have our finished starting 11. It's not the rocket science it's made out to be, the hardest part of being a manger is controlling the collective playing staff and getting them to gel as a team both on and off the pitch, player quality still plays a large part of it. This is where Klopp is outstanding as he transforms mediocre players into world beaters, but he is the anomaly rather than the rule.
What's the latest on Poch anyway? He's the only viable alternative at the moment isn't he.
Ed hardly going to say he’s sacking the guy. But at least he’s using words like foundations are set for the long term. Hopefully he will use them again in his thank you note when he sacks him.
I have been on fence with him now for sometime but I want him to prove all his doubters wrong. I know some may not agree with it but the best thing that can happen tot his club is us finishing in top 4 and Ole continuing and building on from that. He knows he has made some mistakes this season, maybe he can rectify them and be more prepared. But if we do not finish in top 4 then having him continue would be foolish.
Apart from top 4 I also want to see how well he does in Europa. Let us see if he can out tactic managers in 2 legged ties.
Apart from top 4 I also want to see how well he does in Europa. Let us see if he can out tactic managers in 2 legged ties.
I agree with ED!
Words mean nothing from Woodward. Wouldn't be surprised in the least if he got rid of Ole if we finished 6th and without a trophy.
I can confidently say if we do not upgrade on Solskjaer then we are likely to not see any success for years and years to come, maybe the odd minor trophy. Whilst our rivals in and around Europe will be upgrading with Nagelsmann, Rose, modern day managers, hell even Pochettino etc, we'll do what we always do, be a reactive club with poor decision making who will miss out and pay the price.
Well, thats a surprising stat. We do look far more assured with Matic around.
If he can sort out defensive set pieces we will have a pretty solid defence.
The onus is on him to fix the attack. I'd absolutely love for him to turn this around. Not sure I believe he will.
You're not happy with the signings he has made so far? Mainly defensive improvements last summer and then attacking improvements to be made this summer for sure. One in January which seems to be great so far.
I think we are moving in the right direction, more so than any other manager we have had up until now at least.
It is tough, we went off in the wrong direction too many times since Fergie. I feel he is slowly pulling things back, signing the right players and building the right mentally in the club. Still doubts over some, like Martial, but he is aware of that himself and will consider adding a striking option for sure in the summer if needed.
I didn't say I wasn't, but any manager can make signings and them be either good or bad, that isn't exclusive to Solskjaer.
I'm more considering that in his entire time in management he's only proven himself to be substandard wherever he has been and certainly not of the calibre you would associate a United manager to be, there's a reason why no other top club was clamouring for him as their manager before we came in. People are blinkered because of who he is and the fact that we've been served up such dogshit since Fergie left that people are calling the worst points tally we've ever had at this point in the season ever progress and an achievement.
Yes he has sold and bought players, our previous managers did so poorly, but that doesn't mean other managers will and that Solskjaer has the secret sauce to the transfer market for us.
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Think much of the problem is that Solskjær himself is as «young» as many of our players, management wise. At least in the top elite of football. So he has done alot of weird decisions and squad management.
If we would have gotten someone like Poch instead , we would have been comfortable within top 4, given the same quality of players getting in. Just by virtue of the fact that Poch has coached a PL team for a long time.
It might be that Solskjær has learned enough now, but I guess the last part of season will tell.
Signing the right players that suit you as a manager is important, making them work is then a challenge.
I think a major problem has been the big signings that were made by previous managers did not perform, Depay, DiMaria, Mkhitaryan, Baily, Pogba, Lukaku, etc, this really throws you off track and is bad management. "Any manager can make signings and them be either good or bad" It's not just, sign a player and it's down to luck if he plays well or not, it's down to good management, which Solskjaer deserves credit for. Solskjaer has taught us a lot as United fans about signing the right players with the right attitude, something he has done excellently so far.
Your second point is valid, but Solskjaer suits united, I don't think anyone was clamouring over Tito Villanova or even Pep Guardiola before they became Barcelona Manager.
Time will tell. I see big improvement man, Rashford, Mctominay; Greenwood coming through, Williams. Doing his best with previous signings such as Fred, Martial, Matic, Shaw and made solid additions in Maguire, Wan Bissaka and Fernandes. I look forward to further improvements he will make in attack in the summer, feel we will do as best we can to get sancho, as he seems to suit Ole's vision for United.
Can't disagree with what this person's saying.
My main fear is that if we stick with Ole, I am pretty convinced we are going to be writing off next season too - I'd expect them to give him the bare minimum in the summer drenched in gallons of spin and bullshit in the media about 'its not about new players, Ole's building something from within' or similar.....followed by us on the rocks by Christmas, Ole fired, and the entire cycle starts again with the team scrapping for 7th under a caretaker manager. And by that time, guys like Pochettino will be long gone as options meaning Ed will hire someone along the lines of Giggs or Southgate. That's my Mystic Meg moment anyway. I just don't see this guy as being the solution.
Exposed by the caf he got worse top 6 win percentage than Ole.
Unwinnable manager, you want that guy? Go support his next club.
I was being sarcastic, read my post directly above the one you quoted.
Some people, really... Ole has gone from 9th in the first 14 games to 3rd in the last 13 games, so even if the pts are lower than what we should expect, considering he was dealing with injuries and problems that impacted the squad, you can see he's building something.
I am sure all those people who think Ole is so bad won't bother reading this article then? When they do read it, I'll be happy to discuss. But there's nothing new in this article, it shows what we are witnessing on the pitch right now.
https://thebusbybabe.sbnation.com/2...small-half-time-adjustment-pays-big-dividends
I am sure all those people who think Ole is so bad won't bother reading this article then? When they do read it, I'll be happy to discuss. But there's nothing new in this article, it shows what we are witnessing on the pitch right now.
https://thebusbybabe.sbnation.com/2...small-half-time-adjustment-pays-big-dividends
Just like all those people who think he's so good seem to ignore how badly he has done in his managerial career and hasn't done all that great here either? When you acknowledge this, i'll be happy to discuss. But it's nothing new, it's just what everyone is ignoring because he used to play for us.
When you read the article, what part do you disagree?
I think Ole did great for Molde, changing the game style to adapt to the reality of his teams losing key players etc... he did that while switching from a possession oriented team to a more direct football. Cardiff was harder but when I see how he wants to play with United, I don’t think Cardiff is relevant because the setup was just not sustainable. Right now, there are good things happening on the field and we just need the right players as proven by the recent player we added.
In other words, Pep and Klopp with their demanding tactics don’t succeed at Cardiff.
Every manager builds 'something'. Give Moyes enough time and he'd show some improvement. LVG made some improvements and went ok decent runs. Mourinho did as well. This is nothing of note but the norm when you manage a club with our resources and talent. You will go on spurts of good /bad form. The more pertinent question as opposed to a 'thing' being built is A) Is that thing genuinely special and soon to be one of the best around and B) Is the man building it himself genuinely capable of being among the best
Because to win titles and reach the level we want to, we do not need something/decent/good. We need people at the club capable of building one of the best teams in Europe. This isn't a training ground. It's one of the biggest clubs on the planet.
Happy 47th birthday Ole
I am not impressed overall with his ability on the medium term to make this team one of the best in Europe, but honestly I don’t think it’s controversial to say this season with more or less money invested the squad was improved, players who weren’t happy there and the fans were tired of them were moved out of the club, liking it or not he is the one who is introducing Greenwood at this level, the only issue maybe was the fact Fernandes should have arrived during the Summer, but that’s not his fault, I dare to say not even Woodward fault, basically Sporting was demanding too much for internal reasons to appease the fans, and later Mendes started to interfere on that business, simply wasn’t Solskjaer or Woodward fault, it’s difficult to deal under pressure with other clubs who basically want to make money to balance their budgets and are extremely fragile regarding football agents influence. The Maguire and Bissaka business was fast, improved the first 11, ok we can discuss if it was too much money or not, but English clubs are victims of their own wealth. I don’t think the Daniel James signing was bad, a promising prospect from the Championship.
Ultimately everyone knows he isn’t a top manager, but I ask you this, didn’t he started to work regarding the needed improvement of the squad? What do you think would have happened if Mourinho stayed? Would he give a chance to Greenwood? Would he be open to play someone signed from the Championship? What do you think he would demand from Fernandes? Possibly would play him as a striker, complaining that the club didn’t signed anyone with Martial on the bench.
It’s not popular to say some decisions were good, ok I doubt he can work here more than 18 months, but he will deliver a better squad and atmosphere to the next top manager who replaces him.
What isn’t normal is to blame him regarding failed transfers,first because we don’t know if he has the authority to choose every player he wants, then it’s difficult to buy because every selling club wants a financial jackpot from top English clubs, and even worse when you have super agents demanding big fees that clubs in England don’t want to pay. It simply isn’t as easy as it looks reading some posts here.
Of course next games vs Brugge or away at Everton if he doesn’t win he gets the criticism he deserves, but it wasn’t a easy job he received.
Please read the article, it answers a lot of what Ole is doing. Definitely answers a lot of your questions. After that, we can discuss if you still want.
Thanks for posting this link, a really good read.
I agree, it's a very well written piece. It's just a shame that meny other fans have already built their brick house and intend to sit in it, shouting at anyone who doesn't agree.
It doesn't answer anything. A manager directing his wide players tucking in (and fullbacks over lapping) or wide players stating wide are standard common tactical approaches and switch between them is par for course too. Kudos to him for doing that of course but it's hardly a pointer to managerial excellence which sadly has not been on display for most of his managerial career at United.
At the end of the day, it just seems apparent that he's just a decent manager. And decent isn't what I imagine we want at Manchester United. All the talk of it being a 'process' is, like it was under LVG, just rhetoric to buy him more time.
I don't doubt that Ole isn't a football dunce. Of course he's not sitting there doing feck while in the job. He has experience in football and it trying what he knows and feels to be right. But I don't believe he's displayed genuine excellence as a manager here. And until he does he will not be the man for the job for me. It's just like people who are somewhat completent and knowledgeable at their job tend not to become the CEO of Google. You can make a case for them knowing a fair bit about their field. But they're not going to compete with the absolute best for it.
Not really. It's highly possible that they remain unconvinced wieghing up all the facts we have available to us.
If Ole fixes our set pieces defending
and improves the team tactically
and improves the consistency of our players
and make us win more games against smaller clubs
and while still maintaining the record against the top four
and bring more quality players to help achieve all those above during the transfer window
then indeed We have a very good manager in our hands.
and improves the team tactically
and improves the consistency of our players
and make us win more games against smaller clubs
and while still maintaining the record against the top four
and bring more quality players to help achieve all those above during the transfer window
then indeed We have a very good manager in our hands.
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So the most pertinent question is basically if the current squad or/and manager going to be the best (potentially); Not actual improvement which has been evident in style of play and our transfers?
Serious question - how and who judges this "best" criteria? LVG and Mourinho were both established coaches and they weren't the solution either. Last year Mourinho got a lot of stick for underperforming players he had bought. By the same logic Ole should have been praised for the opp.
So let's look at past credentials and not give him credit for transfers! Credit where credit is due please. Not completely in for Ole but you gotta say all transfers have worked out pretty well. I must agree the points have been bad but even other supporters are seeing the change in attitude and individual performances from almost every one bar Lingard/Andreas/Victor
I agree. We should definitely go get klopp. Maybe we can pitch him the Disney idea for the second time. He would definitely come. I mean why won’t he?
we can do better. If the new recruitment isn’t just oles players then we are onto something. A better manager is just a better manager.. the young German managers with great recruitment looks like the job at the minute. We will be in the conversation again soon. With ole I feel like there might be a few more Seasons before these lads really kick on. Come on. Let’s get our own genius! I think most competent managers could do what ole has done so far. No Bruno and everyone would be going mental right now This season has been a shitshow so far for the money we spend. As always. It feels like we are getting closer again though at least. Never a dull moment. At least there’s Seemingly some kind of nee plan In place and it’s going ok so far
Well said it seems every fan other than our very own are able to appropriately assess our current average manager.
The actual improvement has not been actual. We mostly look a mediocrely managed football team. The signings look decent so far but it's far too early to say either way. If they were bang on successes (like Klopp's) we wouldn't have one of the poorest points tallies post SAF (at least it was the case till recently).
Who decides? All of us as adults decide for ourselves applying our minds. For the club, the Glazers decide hopefully
while applying their minds.
Please dont repeat the worst argument in the history of arguments. Just because LVG and Mourinho didn't work out (so far they worked out better than Ole) it didn't mean established coaches, competence and credibility has been exhausted as a logical option. If Microsoft's reknown and highly regarded CEO fails, it doesn't mean they start going for people who aren't reknown and we'll regarded just for that reason (today is tech company analogy). LVG and Mourinho failing meant THEY weren't the solution. Not that established coaches and pedigree is not the solution.
Not that I'm that hunt up on our manager being established. But I haven't seen the potential in Ole.
Waste of a post. Shame.
Let’s take a look at his managerial career then.
He had a poor time at Cardiff and then moved on to Molde where he won 2 league titles with a team that had never won a title in their history. Whiles going into the knockout stages of the Europa league with an unfancied molde side. His managerial career isn’t great . But he has basically had one failed stint in his entire career. So what are you on about? Talking about how badly he has done in his managerial career. Was molde not part of his managerial career?
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He won Norway league before he moved to Cardiff. And after disaster in Cardiff he went back to Molde and did what? Finished 2nd,3rd and 5th. Let me guess;
Building for the future? Shit squad? Not enough time?
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