Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2020/21 Discussion

Ed9

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I love Ole and I don't blame him. He's definitely doing all he can to help United, it's not his fault it's not good enough. He'll eventually get a sack, we'll hire a new guy and we'll all be happy how the air has cleaned and whatever until it goes tits up again. Then another guy. Just like before. Meanwhile we'll be making loads of money from sponsors and that's all that matters at the top. They're like drug dealers profiting from our lifetime addiction. And that's United now. Simple. Until those facehuggers from Trumpland and their scrotumlooking Smithers are here United will be nothing but their cash cow.
 

arthurka

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Yes Ole this is your team and you should take full blame for this. That said he needs to have a word with couple of players out there and that captain should be dropped with Shaw and Pogba. 5 games into the season we have played one and a half games of decent football against Luton and Brighton in the cup. Ole needs to stop this nice guy crap, time for some tough loving.
 

criticalanalysis

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"the boys go away on international duty, find their mojo themselves and the others that are going to stay here, we've got to help them".

I know it's only one comment but that to me summarises Ole's approach to the game. Bring in quality players, tell them how we want to play then let them figure it out themselves hoping their ability and freedom shines.
 

SAFMUTD

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We've fired 3 managers in 7 years and nothing has changed. We can't keep doing it.
I agree, we shouldn't bring new players either. We have been bringing new players since SAF retired and nothing has changed. We can't keep doing it.
 

Sky1981

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Today was a disgrace, and to see him smiling coming off the pitch was a real head scratcher. Even in his interview he didn't seem the way most would be after being hammered 6-1 at home.

HOWEVER

What is sacking him going to do?

We've been down this road. Time and again. We get top 4 and get Champions league only to see the summer window be taken lightly. We struggle to start the season and manager ends up getting fired.

We've fired 3 managers in 7 years and nothing has changed. We can't keep doing it. There is something seriously wrong at the core of the club. Right from top to bottom there is a cancerous tumour eating away at the club. The players don't care. The board doesn't seem to care. Woodward doesn't seem to care and the Glazers don't seem to care as long as we get that precious top 4 spot.

A change of manager won't do a thing because 18 months from now we will be having this exact discussion again about firing him.

Something is fundamentally wrong at the club. It has been for years but no one at the club seems to care.
The last time we sacked moyes we won the FA cup
The last time we sacked LVG we won League cup + UEFA cup

Granted it's not the holy grail, but still
 

Craig Ward

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The board has let every manager down in recent history - even SAF.

We are so inept at transfer dealings it's inevitably costing the team on the pitch, our lack of transfer strategy and failure to get good deals donw and players moved out is costing us. We over pay our players and struggle to move them on.

What irritates me the most is it's plainly obvious our model as a club has no chance of footballing success. Ed is a yes man to the Glazers, the Glazers have no interest in winning major trophies - they just want the finances to keep ticking over.

To go this long without even a title challenge and to still hold the allure of one of the world biggest clubs is actually quite an achievement. But it took Liverpool 20 odd years to get back to a league win. Look at how far AC Milan have fallen for example. The game is so competitive these days and it's very easy to get stuck behind.

We are already too far behind and we don't seem to have a plan to change that. Until we have a change of direction from the owners (DOF, major overhaul of decision making staff behind the scenes & a desire to win trophies instead of profit) then we will be in this loop forever.

Funny thing is - when we stop even competing for top 4 the Glazers might get the hump and sell. Only way the fans win is for the ownership to change.

To Ole:
He's inevitably going to be sacked. It's what this board does, it's just a matter of when.

He's a fan favourite and a club icon - he's trying to do things the right way, the honest way and i've nothing but respect and admiration for him. He inherited a disjointed squad full of over paid, unmotivated players that accumatively 4 other managers picked.

He was tasked with giving us short term stability and rightfully got the job full time. The man deserves a chance, he deserves our backing and most importantly he deserves the boards backing.

Ole is the only manager in recent time to have a transfer strategy - young hungry players. Ole is also trying to change the mentality around the squad and overhaul it. The only way this club becomes successful is if half to 3/4 of the squad he inherited leaves and is replaced by signings/promotion from our academy.

That strikes me as a minimum 3 year turnaround with each transfer window vital in terms of both incomings and outgoings.

He has to do this while remaining competitive in the top 4 race, cups and satisfying the fans who demand 110% every game regardless of circumstance.

To be blunt - with this board and some of the mediocre players at his disposal - what f-ing chance has the man got?!

I do think Ole could be better tactically - but we would find these criticisms in any manager.

Has he got faults? Yup.

If results continue to be as calamitous as the start of the season - the board will knee jerk and fire him.

Hire a new manager and repeat - next manager wont fare any better under this clubs structure. It's a poisoned job under Woodward and the Glazers
 

kkengvib

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The board has definitely taken a lot of the blame, and rightly so. However, Ole and the coaching staff needs to be accountable for the performance on the pitch as well.

I believe a good/great manager is able to make the team performance better as a whole, getting role players to perform at a standard higher than their regular ability.
I just haven't seen enough of that from Ole.

I would argue that Martial is the only player he has visibly improved. The rest I say are the same players before he joined and with the exception of Bruno, his signings have generally been at the level we expected them to be & have not really progressed. Some of the players have actually regressed since he joined (e.g. Pogba).

I think realistically he'll have until the end of the year, at best the end of the season.
He's done well to clear out deadwood and perhaps rid us of the toxic environment in the dressing room, but in the end I'm afraid we'll someone else that can take us to the next level. Who? No clue.
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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He puts too much trust in some players when they are either not match fit, like pogba or not mentally fit like Maguire. The first two games were enough evidence to have started this game with Fred in midfield and someone else at center back.
 

Pogue Mahone

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He puts too much trust in some players when they are either not match fit, like pogba or not mentally fit like Maguire. The first two games were enough evidence to have started this game with Fred in midfield and someone else at center back.
Hmmm... Lindelof has been pretty shit in recent matches too. If we drop him and Maguire who’s left to start? And let’s not forget that Bailly was piss poor too.

I just think we’re past the point of looking for tweaks to the starting line-up or scapegoating individual players. The issue is systemic. There’s only one way out of this mess and it’s not about who we pick to start the next game.
 

romufc

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He puts too much trust in some players when they are either not match fit, like pogba or not mentally fit like Maguire. The first two games were enough evidence to have started this game with Fred in midfield and someone else at center back.
This is going to be his downfall, and I am a Ole supporter.

Pogba should not have started any of the 3 games. We can all talk about squad depth and quality, is there a reason why we should bring squad depth?

People said when Pogba, Bruno, Maguire, Rashford, Martial, AWB are off form, we have no one to bring on. Well, I say you can have whatever squad depth you want, if the manager is stubborn it wont matter.

We bought Donny in to fight with Bruno and Pogba - Start of season Pogba starts awful. Pogba starts all 3 games. Maguire starts awful, starts all 3 games.

You can bring quality players in but if Ole does not have the balls to drop Pogba or Maguire, the same issues will keep creeping up.
 

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Hmmm... Lindelof has been pretty shit in recent matches too. If we drop him and Maguire who’s left to start? And let’s not forget that Bailly was piss poor too.

I just think we’re past the point of looking for tweaks to the starting line-up or scapegoating individual players. The issue is systemic. There’s only one way out of this mess and it’s not about who we pick to start the next game.
Agreed.

My post from another thread regarding this:

I've been thinking about this for a while because imo our defenders can't get bad that fast. They're not very good but you don't get that good defensive record if you're bad defenders.

Imo the biggest difference between this season and last season is our tactic. And Pogba and Matic.

Last season for the bigger part we played mostly with a counter attack approach. Which suited slow but strong players like Maguire, Matic. Or good defensively player like AWB, Shaw. We only employed the current 4231 high defensive line, FB going forward very high after the Covid break. We had a decent run but truth is our defence was not solid at all. Especially against fast counter attack.

Now Matic and Pogba. Matic got a year older and can't run as much as he used to. Pogba was injured for the large part of the last season and we played Fred, McT and Pereira. Tbh I'm no fan of those especially Pereira but at least those guys run and tackle a lot. Which lead to our midfield could protect our defence. Pogba has been dogshit and we have literally no midfield recently. Which make our defence super exposed. Teams cut through us like a hot knife through butter.

Imo Ole got all this wrong. His current tactic doesn't play to the strength of his line up but rather expose all their weaknesses. He has super slow defenders and midfielders playing a high line. And bad attacking FB going as far as the box. Him keeping Pogba doesn't help either.
Imo first thing Ole should do is to drop Pogba. Play VDB, Fred, McT. Drop Bruno a bit closer to the other two midfielders. Then he should drop this high line stuffs against teams who have a better midfield than ours or can do a good high press. Let them attack then counter. We switch to that high line approach only if we can dominate them. And only one FB going forward at a time. Imo that would probably solve most of our midfield and defence issues.
 

Pogue Mahone

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Agreed.

My post from another thread regarding this:



Imo first thing Ole should do is to drop Pogba. Play VDB, Fred, McT. Drop Bruno a bit closer to the other two midfielders. Then he should drop this high line stuffs against teams who have a better midfield than ours or can do a good high press. Let them attack then counter. We switch to that high line approach only if we can dominate them. And only one FB going forward at a time. Imo that would probably solve most of our midfield and defence issues.
When I say the issue is systemic, I don’t think a tactical tweak will help. We need a new manager. Someone who knows a hell of lot more than you or me about how to get this squad to perform to the best of its abilities. Which it isn’t doing now and hasn’t done for the majority of Ole’s time in charge.
 

11101

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This is the same team as last year. We looked unbeatable at times in almost this exact lineup and tactical setup. I think it was @acnumber9 in another thread who said the real problem is that we have not built on that over the summer as everybody from the players to the fans expected us to, and the whole club is now totally deflated because of it. We have talked ourselves up all summer and totally flopped. Even if we do sign Sancho today, the damage is already done. It's the managers job to motivate the team but i think even SAF would struggle to motivate us after this, the same old story year after year.

On Ole specifically, we have some questionable coaching and Ole is useless at in game management, but he is good at player management and he knows how to set up from the start. Mourinho fell apart here but he remains one of the best tactical minds the game has seen, Ole was easy meat for him. He wasn't the first and he won't be the last. I don't think he's right for us but i'm not going to judge him when the club is run this way. Nobody will succeed until the board changes.

Like i say, this is the same team as last year. That it's the same team as last year is the real problem, and that's not Ole's fault.
 

#07

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I am, unashamedly, Ole in. For the most part I don't blame him for the collapse yesterday. I think Gary Neville was closest to the truth when he said the team is psychologically beaten. Having gone into the summer on the up, then seeing other sides strengthen, I think disillusionment has seeped into the team. The belief that the club is moving forward is gone and its effecting them. Mentally, they look gone.

However, its part of Ole's job to deal with that situation. If you know your players are on edge, don't ask them to play like they're Holland 1974. We've got the goalie going short, we've got defenders trying to pass out from the back where they have low technical ability, we're trying to play a high line and press when the pace and positioning of our back four is questionable. I can't believe that Ole cannot see the limitations of his players so now its just bloody mindedness.

I'm sorry, with the team we have, the instruction should be lump it from the back and win the second ball. Its not pretty. However, we don't have Lothar Matthaus sweeping up for us. We've got Maguire, Lindelof and Bailly. These players can't be dribbling and passing out of defence. They will make mistakes if we keep asking them to play this way. Maybe we have to stop trying to be a front foot team and go back to defending deep and countering?

Its great to want to be expansive but you just have to accept reality.
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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Hmmm... Lindelof has been pretty shit in recent matches too. If we drop him and Maguire who’s left to start? And let’s not forget that Bailly was piss poor too.

I just think we’re past the point of looking for tweaks to the starting line-up or scapegoating individual players. The issue is systemic. There’s only one way out of this mess and it’s not about who we pick to start the next game.
It's a war of attrition right now but the whole team looked a lot more balanced with a functioning midfield midweek against Brighton.

A lot of that has to do with the energy afforded by Fred and McTominay which Pogba and Matic just can't offer right now.

Wan Bissaka and his Dubai sojourn haven't helped either. It's been a nightmare of a season break for the defense.
 

Strelok

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When I say the issue is systemic, I don’t think a tactical tweak will help. We need a new manager. Someone who knows a hell of lot more than you or me about how to get this squad to perform to the best of its abilities. Which it isn’t doing now and hasn’t done for the majority of Ole’s time in charge.
That I'd disagree I think. Maybe if this disaster continues for a few more matches.

Even SAF got it wrong sometime, point is he always knew how to fix his wrong and turn the table. Let's see if Ole would.
 

ti vu

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It's a war of attrition right now but the whole team looked a lot more balanced with a functioning midfield midweek against Brighton.

A lot of that has to do with the energy afforded by Fred and McTominay which Pogba and Matic just can't offer right now.

Wan Bissaka and his Dubai sojourn haven't helped either. It's been a nightmare of a season break for the defense.
You can't compare midweek vs Brighton second string. Our midfield was sloppy as feck. They didn't have quality.

This game is more about tactic. Kane had a new dimension to his game. We got totally lost about how to deal with him drop deep pulling string. Shaw was instructed to man mark the wide attackers both Lucas and Lamela, and both drift central, and we left clueless how to do with Aurier with acres of space. The left side was a bit better since Bailly with his pace is comfortable to come out and sweeping loose runners.

So it's not just about selection. Adding energy and more defensive minded player may prevented the margin of defeat, but it's a game we have no answer to their tactic. Our 2 wide attackers can't track their full backs, while Kane role played a blinder on our whole defensive tactic.
 

hungrywing

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I am, unashamedly, Ole in. For the most part I don't blame him for the collapse yesterday. I think Gary Neville was closest to the truth when he said the team is psychologically beaten. Having gone into the summer on the up, then seeing other sides strengthen, I think disillusionment has seeped into the team. The belief that the club is moving forward is gone and its effecting them. Mentally, they look gone.

However, its part of Ole's job to deal with that situation. If you know your players are on edge, don't ask them to play like they're Holland 1974. We've got the goalie going short, we've got defenders trying to pass out from the back where they have low technical ability, we're trying to play a high line and press when the pace and positioning of our back four is questionable. I can't believe that Ole cannot see the limitations of his players so now its just bloody mindedness.

I'm sorry, with the team we have, the instruction should be lump it from the back and win the second ball. Its not pretty. However, we don't have Lothar Matthaus sweeping up for us. We've got Maguire, Lindelof and Bailly. These players can't be dribbling and passing out of defence. They will make mistakes if we keep asking them to play this way. Maybe we have to stop trying to be a front foot team and go back to defending deep and countering?

Its great to want to be expansive but you just have to accept reality.
That's actually not necessarily a bad thing for a good motivator. 'They are coming to take your milkshake' and siege mentality and all that.
 

ForeverRed1

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I love ole and we could argue that all managers we have had since fergie have failed, which is true. A valid argument is how many time’s can you not back a manager? How many times can you change the manager when results don’t go your way? How much of this is sustainable? We’re in danger of becoming Real Madrid or Chelsea with the managerial Merry go round.

Then you take a look at the squad we have... Over 400million £s worth of players. Marcus rashford, paul pogba, Anthony martial, Mason Greenwood, Bruno Fernandes, Nemanja Matic, David de Gea and so on, it’s a hell of a squad we have. (Even if the balance is off). We still have a better squad at our disposal than most managers have. A expensive squad at that.


THE BARE MINIMUM is to get these players playing some nice football. Fight and compete. Thats all we have wanted for a long time now. Make us horrible to play against. Make us entertaining. Give us something to atleast feel some pride towards, even in defeat. Atleast get the tactics and positioning right. It’s a basic fundamental in even grass roots football. It’s not that much to ask.


Then something clicked after the game yesterday. Ole walked around the pitch, smiling, joking with the officials. Shaking the players hands... pats on the backs. I mean, I don’t expect him to run down the tunnel sobbing .. but to be smiling and laughing after that defeat... it just doesn’t feel right. It doesn’t sit right.


maybe we were too spoiled with fergie being our manager and being such a sore loser? We had so much fight and aggression. The players gave everything to the club, the team and the manager. The manager would be running up and down the touchline directing players, jumping for joy when we win. Punching the floor when we lose.

Just give us that passion. I don’t see it from ole, at all.
 

Giggsyking

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make whatever excuses you want, write thousands of words of posts trying to make him relevant to the job, even bully other user who wants him out. In the end, you yourself will come to the conclusion one day and you would want him out. He is not good enough.
 

YAMS49

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Why did he put Pogba at LM where Aurier could attack the crap out of him? Hardly Pogba's strength defending is it. Seems a very questionable move to me. With 10 men I would have taken Pogba off at HT definitely.
 

johanovic

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Ancelotti signed Allan,Doucore,Rodriques and Godfrey today from Norwich. All those players would have improved our team and on top of that Ancelotti has improved a player like Calvert greatly. He has a strong vision for how to play football and it´s just plain for everyone to see what kind of difference a proven manager supplies. OGS is a person and player I liked a lot but he´s just not good enough as a manager. Playing Pogba,Matic and Maguire together makes us slow as feck both defending and getting the ball in play during attacking transitions. He has no clear playing style and it feels like a team without any direction. The defence is a joke and the commitment and workrate of the team is not up to par. There is no excuse for players at United to not give their all while playing and Pogba is a prime example of a individual that does not give an effort and play´s like old man in a five side. What fecking excuse is there for extremly well paid professionals not delivering on basis like tracking back, supporting the attack and fight for your team. What in the world can justify a big time charlie like Pogba strolling around not giving a feck, bench him or better than that sell him....I would love for OGS if he continues much longer to bring Keano back as a coach. Give those fecking primadonnas a kick up their backside and if they do not improve then throw them out....there can not be any more excueses for having players in the team thinking they are much better then they are and not doing what every top professional does..DO THE BLOODY HARD WORK needed to be able to show your talent....talent is no good in football if you are a lazy fecker
 

united_99

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On- and off field performances are related strongly. If the club is a mess then the morale within the squad will also be down.
People say Klopp came across as someone who knew he would bounce back from their defeat as opposed to Ole. Well of course he did! He is managing the reigning champions, he is a better manager than Ole, he has a better squad than Ole, their board is better than ours, they have made quality additions to an already great team, the morale is high.
With Ole his body language for weeks has been worrying as if he knows the board are making the club and his work go backwards.
More proven managers in similar situations couldn’t handle this kind of environment (Jose, Poch before he got fired at Spurs) so it is hard to see how Ole can manage it well. At the end the manager has to take the responsibility and turn it around or he is gone.
He and the team albeit not great, are much better than what we have seen recently, but everyone knows, if you are on a good run, it can last and if you are on a bad run, it can last as well.
The next few league games will make or break our season and Ole’s future with the club.
But not sure if even that will change anything at board level.
Look at Aston Villa, barely stayed up, but then kept their best player, spent a lot of money on other players and are currently doing much better than they are.
With us it’s the opposite.
 

Greck

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Congrats to Ole. He finally got the depth he asked for, the one that kept our pristine starting XI from really kicking on at the end of last season because they were knackered. Hope he can build on from last season with this promising core
 

Idxomer

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If he plays 4-2-3-1 with the same shape we've seen so far in the next 3 games with no Martial, there's no hope for him.
 

LoneStar

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While we need to replace him at some point (he’s just not good enough), I don’t think replacing him with our current structure would do much. At this point, it’s becoming a cycle with every manager.
 

pass.pass.pass

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Ole may still prove me wrong by the time the game against Newcastle ends, but just what the feck is that lineup?

James and Mata on the wings?
McT and Fred in midfield with VDB on the bench again? Against Newcastle who are known to be ultra-defensive?
Lindelof in for Bailly when it was Maguire who threw the game against Spurs?

Is he asking to be sacked?

Well, at least he did drop Pogba.
 

Samid

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Ole may still prove me wrong by the time the game against Newcastle ends, but just what the feck is that lineup?

James and Mata on the wings?
McT and Fred in midfield with VDB on the bench again? Against Newcastle who are known to be ultra-defensive?
Lindelof in for Bailly when it was Maguire who threw the game against Spurs?

Is he asking to be sacked?

Well, at least he did drop Pogba.
No.
 

#07

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More evidence tonight to back up the rumours that the players are questioning whether Ole's the right man. Dressing room looks totally divided. :houllier: :p
 

Brokenbeard

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Ole may still prove me wrong by the time the game against Newcastle ends, but just what the feck is that lineup?

James and Mata on the wings?
McT and Fred in midfield with VDB on the bench again? Against Newcastle who are known to be ultra-defensive?
Lindelof in for Bailly when it was Maguire who threw the game against Spurs?

Is he asking to be sacked?

Well, at least he did drop Pogba.
So glad your are not pleased.
 

Godfather

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I have to say. He really makes us play good football against teams that set up high on the pitch. Once these teams break up we play beautiful football. I hope he manages to get us break these deep sitting teams up more often.