Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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Sky1981

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I somewhat agree with posters making the point that there's no need for hyperbole on either side of the ole in/out debate. I'm firmly Ole out but you can't whitewash the man completely. He does have certain qualities, like he has kept morale relatively high despite appalling results, young players feel confident playing under him.

At the same time, the stats don't lie. The run of form since after PSG has been appalling. The Ole in crowd will point to injuries and being unlucky etc etc. Ole has been doing this too, saying the goals just needed to be moved an inch or two to the left or whatever. But it's not bad luck.It's what points to, imo, his ultimate failing as a manager and why he will most likely never be good enough for a club this size.

Another poster can't remember who it was hit the nail on the head by saying 'he only plans for the best ever possible scenario' or words to that effect. And that in a nutshell is what makes him such a terrible manager. This might have been that same quality that made him one of the best ever supersubs. That level of belief in a positive outcome, despite the odds, might be what drove him to score so many goals in the last 20 mins of matches.

As a manager though it is an appalling quality and why so many of us saw a big fecking red flag appearing on the horizon when he decided to go into this season with such a light attacking force. There was also no guarantee at that time that Rashford would elevate himself to a level where he was basically carrying the team, so the mind kind of boggles as to where we would be now, if we had had the Rashford of last season.

Ole's chief failure is contingency planning. A good manager/leader would plan for the worst possible situations they can face, so that when those situations arise they can be dealt with. All the 'Ole in' posters saying 'he was so unlucky with injuries etc'. No, he wasn't unlucky. We became overstretched over the season as he was overplaying players in every competition trying desperately to get results to save his bacon, and thats what led to an injury crisis. From the beginning of the season he should have been looking at all the things that could have gone wrong and how things would start playing out when the chips were down.

I think he's a victim of being too fecking positive. Part of what must be so seductive about his management to the 'Ole in' crowd as it's like the complete polar opposite of Jose, who would control for all factors in a football match, even if that meant crushing the life out of it as a joyous enterprise. Ole is all about belief, positivity, Man Utd DNA, young players etc etc. In his head he probably thought Lingard and Pereira were gonna tear it up as attacking midfielders because they were Man Utd academy lads with the right DNA and just needed that belief to elevate them to the next level.

But the reality about Ole as a manager and in general the 'Ole In' crowd is that It's simply dreadfully fecking naive. The red flags were right there when we sold lukaku, loaned and sanchez and didn't try to replace them. How rose tinted can you get that you are going to send out that team into the money laden premier league against managers who do understand how to plan for the worst possible situations, because they don't have the players that are going to nick them a result. The only reason it hasn't been awful is we have some seriously good players who can dig us out a result every now and then, even against the best teams in the league. All in all though he's extremely lightweight as a manager and doesn't have the ruthless qualities of a SAF or a Klopp or a Guardiola.

The other massive red flag is how matey he is with the other managers, particularly Klopp and Guardiola. He's all smiles after games with them and I agree with RvP, after that kind of sh*t 'now is not the time to be smiling'. I doubt Klopp or Guardiola would be that matey with him if the roles were reversed and their team was languishing in 7th, unable to open up defences and turning their home stadium into the dampest of damp squibs. Their blood would be fecking boiling in such a situation, because not winning is like a personal affront. The fact Ole's started saying all kinds of Moyesy kind of things post match now really should be the final nail in the coffin of any hope. He's unable to deal with it, same way Moyes wasn't, so he's just saying stuff now to help him avoid facing the harsh fecking reality of the situation.

And now in these threads we're getting the same kind of tactic from the vociferous 'ole in' crowd. Saying anything they can to avoid confronting reality. Resorting to ad hominems because deep down they know the arguments for him as manager are weak as sh*t. The excuses that are being created seem to constantly evolve and become more and more delusional. 'Klopp needed time'. 'We almost sacked SAF after one year' 'Noone could have foreseen Pogba and Rashford getting injured' (btw yes they could and thousands did) 'its the board and the glazers (he spent £150m on players in one season, most midtable clubs would be lucky to spend that in 5) etc etc.

Positivity is a good thing and it's the main weapon 'Ole IN' crowd have used against everyone who has highlighted lack of planning or poor decisions; 'so much negativity and moaning blah blah'. But, sometimes positivity just turns into downright delusion, a fear of facing the cold hard reality of the situation. And when it gets to this point, it's hard to even say that it's actually even positivity anymore. Delusion isn't a positive thing, it's negativity shielded by a layer of fantasy.

The stats don'e lie, they are as real as it gets. At the moment we need some reality.

Bit of a rant and I'm obviously largely preaching to the choir, but my 2 cents anyway.
This. Superb post
 

Rolaholic

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Was #MouOut all the way his final season but Ole's got no room talking about standards and hat 2nd pace finish when he won't come close to that during his tenure here :lol:
 

Foxbatt

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Was #MouOut all the way his final season but Ole's got no room talking about standards and hat 2nd pace finish when he won't come close to that during his tenure here :lol:
Now they are happy even with 7th with him.
 

LuckyScout78

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I could easily do a better job than Ole. And it's definitive room for improvement, with this current squad available. Like before the Wolves games.

If your mindset before the Wolves is to go out and dominate them. And you dont have an ideal nr.10, a cam. Then you should drop the nr.10 and go for 2 CF and start with Greenwood on top with Martial. The first thing you will imrpove the team.

Second it is the combination and line up you set up. Like music chords. Some chords suit and sound better with some chords than others chords. Same with players. Some players suit better with each others than with others. Then you have to know all the abilities of your players. To set up players who are been able to play quick and precise pass and movement football. Deliver the ball when you have to pass and take the extra touch if you have too. Right decisions most of the time of possible.

So back to the cam and nr.10. When you dont have an ideal nr.10 and you still use a nr.10. You are weakend the full packet of a football team. The strenght of the collective and combination of the set up players you start with. So if i am DOF and Woodward job and owner. Observing and evaluation. This is one of the factor that will count to end his contract. And using a weaken 4-2-3-1 formation is not the first time. Ole has use 4-2-3-1 formation from start of the season and until now. So if Woodward is doing his job and have this football knowledge about place the best players to every positions. So even Ole cant see it. How can you expect Woodward with close to zero football knowledge, can evaluate football manager decisions?It is here, the big factor. That the boss over Ole, the one who appoint and evaluate him. Has a really high level of ratings football players qualities and knowledge. If Woodward and the Owner and this case the Glazer. Really low footbball knowledge. Then its all down to luck and fate. Spend and waste your money until you drive your car of money until the ground. On the football side of business. United has spend and throw a lot money out of the window the last 5-6 years. Because the football knowledge of Woodward is not helping much + sentimental and rush appoitment of Ole right after the PSG victory. Who with neutral glasses, not watching with United glasses. Knew it was a lucky win against PSG. And after that PSG lucky with, the reality hit Woodward and United in the face.
It was 2 rush. Rush to appoint Ole as caretaker manager right after sacking Mourinho. And rush to appoint Ole permanent after PSG victory. Woodward after PSG victory: "Ole is the right man..." So if am the owner with really good football knowledge. I would not only blame on Ole, but Woodward too. And who really appoint Woodward in the first place?The boss of the boss. When you first want to change something negative to positive. You have to find the main roots of the problem. Cutting the grass on the surface will just help in short term, like appointed Ole as caretaker. Just short time solution, based on sentimental and positive energy. Then in short time the grass and problem will grow up again. In this case with United, because you havent destroy and find the main root of the problem.

So if the owner is smart and want to make money by qualifying to ch.league most of the years as possible and becoming a dominate and winning team again. The owner have to move Woodward from football relate jobs. Like Football CEO and negotiate of football transfer. If not i am thinking the Glazer will lost more money and they earn. Get the best football head and true leader you can get as Football CEO. A true leader, no sentimental and rush decisions, highest football knowledge as possible and do most right decisions as possible. No sentimental, but still seeing things clear and has the calmness and composure. To make the right decisions. Woodward is lacking many areas. But to end this. Woodward might be appoint my other, the owner. And we all have to apart what is job and private. Even he is doing a poor job, doesnt mean automatically he is a poor man, husband and human beeing in general life too. So no violent attack against every who has relate to United.

But again, back to the cam role and 4-2-3-1 formation. Ole get time factor on his side. Winters break and maybe Pobga and others important key players will come back to help the team to get better result. Like Pogba back and Bruno up as the n.10. But if Ole keep using Bruno as nr.10 and Mata, Perreira and Lingard as nr.10 and Greenwood on the bench most of the time or as right winger, not as one of the two CF upfronts. Ole might create his own path out of the Old Trafford. Same time when Van Gaal and Mourinho using wrong players for positions. Players has suit each others. You cant, on the highest level. Put 2 really good ball players + 3 average premier league level football players. Then naturallly the sum of it, your team will struggle. Not only once or twice. Like many times this seasons.

Example the line up could be like this against Wolves, due to the line up and sub that day:

De Gea + Bissaka - Lindelof - Maguire - Williams + Chong - Bruno - Fred - James + Greenwood - Martial.

So if, Pogba, McTom or Rashford will not come back to the next league game. United have nothing to loose now. A bit spinky Chong, but still fast and skill ful RW will not weakened the team so much. Chong is defintive a natural RW, compare to Greenwood and rest of the United squad. The most natural and highest pontential RW is Chong. If you dont trust Chong, then the next highest pontential RW is Greewood. Then with Ighalo arriving. The line up combination be like this.

De Gea + Bissaka - Lindelof - Maguire - Williams + Greenwood - Bruno - Fred - James + Ighalo - Martial.

Still with 2 CF and no cam/nr.10

But with Pobga back and with Bruno still. Then it is right time to use the cam and 4-2-3-1 formation. But you have to move Martial down as LW, because of his one on one skill. Like this.

Greenwood/Chong - Fred/McTom - Pogba - Martial + Bruno + Ighalo/Greenwood.

In the end. Greenwood is natural goalscorer. So use him as CF, to let the boy develop in the position where he is best. Then give Chong time to develop and show he is the one to go for that RW position, from now until the summer.

Sum up. Right and best players for every positions. If you have level higher than average, which is 3. 4 or above. Then drop it. To get the best out of the combination and line up you start with. If not, you are creating our own path out of the exit door of Old Trafford, as the permanent manager.


"Football is my home, street and passion."
 

croadyman

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I am convinced he isn't the right Utd manager long term, however I would be willing to give him more time if he was at least prepared to get rid of Carrick & McKenna in the summer and bring in some experienced coaches at this level around him. Maybe then we would see some of his in game management decisions questioned by the right people and perhaps we could see some improvement in that side of the game from Ole.
 

beer&grill

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I am convinced he isn't the right Utd manager long term, however I would be willing to give him more time if he was at least prepared to get rid of Carrick & McKenna in the summer and bring in some experienced coaches at this level around him. Maybe then we would see some of his in game management decisions questioned by the right people and perhaps we could see some improvement in that side of the game from Ole.
If Ole remains the head coach, then we should bring Klopp or Pep as assistant. No amount of assistants can make up the lack of quality of the head coach. I think it’s a bit harsh on Carrick and McKenna to suggest they ar at fault for the manager’s shortcomings. Sure, they may not be the greatest, but there’s a reason they, as well as every other assistants, aren’t paid 7.5m per season.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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Ole is so full of shit it's unbelievable. I'd love some ABU Journalist to start bringing up these fecking soundbites and statistics to really put him on the spot. 7th in the league, 200m spent more or less, Jokeshop manager.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Has any of the Ole In explained our poor run of form with most of our first team players including Pogba at the end of last season? What was their excuse?
 

Bilbo

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Do you guys even realise that you're now only debating with yourselves?
 

DomesticTadpole

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Has any of the Ole In explained our poor run of form with most of our first team players including Pogba at the end of last season? What was their excuse?
Injuries to important players, trying to get rid of others managers bad buys and it's going to take another two years to get them fit apparently.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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Has any of the Ole In explained our poor run of form with most of our first team players including Pogba at the end of last season? What was their excuse?

There will be one, mate. Something like 'the season was over, theyd mentally checked out' despite it being Ole's job to make sure that doesn't happen, of course.
 

Judas

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Do you guys even realise that you're now only debating with yourselves?
To be fair its an internet forum, it is pretty much just venting into the void, but it's probably quite therapeutic for some? Even though there's a lot of repeating of posts and going round and round and round in circles.
 

AneRu

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I am convinced he isn't the right Utd manager long term, however I would be willing to give him more time if he was at least prepared to get rid of Carrick & McKenna in the summer and bring in some experienced coaches at this level around him. Maybe then we would see some of his in game management decisions questioned by the right people and perhaps we could see some improvement in that side of the game from Ole.
What happens if we don't, another season written off on his account? If he isn't good enough what makes you think he has the capacity to identify a capable manager and the grace to let that manager effectively takeover the team? He isn't Sir Alex who could have a top class Assistant Manager and not feel threatened or undermined enough to give them a free rein.
 

Maluco

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Do you guys even realise that you're now only debating with yourselves?
It’s because it hurts. Every game hurts. It’s painfully obvious he is hurting the club, lowering standards and worsening the reputation of the club ahead of a massive summer.

It hurts that top 4 would have been almost a given with a decent coach, as teams drop points all over the place. It is incredibly frustrating and ruins my weekend consistently. Then we have to watch him smile and make excuses without questioning what he is doing to the club.

It hurts because, for me personally, I don’t have as long a connection with almost anything, as I do with Manchester United and it hurts to see a giant become such a tame minnow playing such a poor standard of football.

It is directionless, never improves and it’s at least another year written off through stubbornness and certain people’s refusal to admit they have made the wrong choice or aren’t cut out for a job.

Surely you can allow people the opportunity to let out their frustrations on the internet with people who are just as annoyed as they are?

It’s only out of love for the club after all!
 

Di Maria's angel

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It’s because it hurts. Every game hurts. It’s painfully obvious he is hurting the club, lowering standards and worsening the reputation of the club ahead of a massive summer.

It hurts that top 4 would have been almost a given with a decent coach, as teams drop points all over the place. It is incredibly frustrating and ruins my weekend consistently. Then we have to watch him smile and make excuses without questioning what he is doing to the club.

It hurts because, for me personally, I don’t have as long a connection with almost anything, as I do with Manchester United and it hurts to see a giant become such a tame minnow playing such a poor standard of football.

It is directionless, never improves and it’s at least another year written off through stubbornness and certain people’s refusal to admit they have made the wrong choice or aren’t cut out for a job.

Surely you can allow people the opportunity to let out their frustrations on the internet with people who are just as annoyed as they are?

It’s only out of love for the club after all!
You could regard this forum as a place to gain validation for the way you feel about the club - whether youre happy or not.
 

Sky1981

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Has any of the Ole In explained our poor run of form with most of our first team players including Pogba at the end of last season? What was their excuse?
Jose left him with shits, poor fitness, burnout.

Wait till he has a full preseason under him, they'll be the fittest teams in the league. Hard to beat, run alot.

At least moyes delivers on the run alot part
 

AshRK

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There is high chance we may end up finishing somewhere around 8th or 9th or even 10th. I don't see how he gets to keep the job if we don't finish in top 4 and god forbid 7th or below. I don't know what plans we have going forward with Ole. Wasting season after season is what we are doing right now.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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Jose left him with shits, poor fitness, burnout.

Wait till he has a full preseason under him, they'll be the fittest teams in the league. Hard to beat, run alot.

At least moyes delivers on the run alot part
The burnout thing was interesting. He played Pogba every game pretty much. Also I don't think Pogba looked that tired. More just dropped confidence near the end.
Lukaku did look slow and heavy, but he sold him and he looks good for Inter.
Mctominay and Fred was not burned out since he barely played them.
Matic maybe, but he looked alright up to his injury. Still Ole rushed him back and benched Mctominay after the PSG win.
Young maybe too, but if he was tired why on earth did he start him every game? He was not even that important for us.
 

Adisa

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I am convinced he isn't the right Utd manager long term, however I would be willing to give him more time if he was at least prepared to get rid of Carrick & McKenna in the summer and bring in some experienced coaches at this level around him. Maybe then we would see some of his in game management decisions questioned by the right people and perhaps we could see some improvement in that side of the game from Ole.
He literally has one of the most successful coaches in this club's history sitting beside him.
 

passing-wind

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One thing I can't stand with the blindsided fans is that many of their theology is based on the quality of the squad but nothing to do with the influence of the football on the pitch.

We play some of the worst football in the league, even a lower standard compared to teams in the lower half in the division. We do not create chances, we have no phases of play, there's no structure in attacking shape nor movement, we rely on individual brilliance, players aren't improving under the system, there's no transition from midfield to attack, no dynamics in wide areas. These are all aspects that buying new surnames have no effect on. The problem is Mourinho stagnated much of the development of the team because he's not a coach but a decent manager, with Solskjaer we have both a rancid coach and a rancid manager.

As a club we are absolutely finished if Ole has another season, the damage will be irreparable. We can have the best window under Woodward it will make no difference when the manager is garbage.
 

billybee99

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Jose left him with shits, poor fitness, burnout.

Wait till he has a full preseason under him, they'll be the fittest teams in the league. Hard to beat, run alot.

At least moyes delivers on the run alot part
This. They weren't fit and needed a preseason with Ole in order to play his high press. Now, it's injuries. In the summer, it will be that he needs to purchase his own players after the deadwood clear out.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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This. They weren't fit and needed a preseason with Ole in order to play his high press. Now, it's injuries. In the summer, it will be that he needs to purchase his own players after the deadwood clear out.


…..yep.
Then at the end of the summer, it'll be "Euro 2020 made it impossible to sign said players - another summer of prep should have them pumped for the new season".

Then around Christmas, it'll be 'injuries and shit squad again'.

And at every little milestone mentioned above, the same fans will swallow every word of it while watching the team floundering around 14th in the league.
 

oreon

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Just read on the Ole Sarr Jim Solkabben story. Just heard of it. I don't know if it's going to blow up and become a big story. But if UTD were smart they'd let Ole go and eliminate the risk.
 

Rolaholic

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Seeing quite the ugly story regarding Ole's time in Norway making the rounds on social media...

For his sake, I truly hope the accusations aren't true as it would reflect horribly on him and might shorten his leash/turn the media tide against him

Look up the Babacar Sarr story for anyone interested, might even warrant it's own thread if it blows up
 

Paul_Scholes18

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Seeing quite the ugly story regarding Ole's time in Norway making the rounds on social media...

For his sake, I truly hope the accusations aren't true as it would reflect horribly on him and might shorten his leash/turn the media tide against him

Look up the Babacar Sarr story for anyone interested, might even warrant it's own thread if it blows up
Doesn't sound like Ole is involved here, but he is working with an agent that appears far worse than Mino and is helping his client get away from a crime potentially.
Ighalo uses that agent too. So him and the club still uses a shitty agent like that.

Ole making that guy captain too just shows his terrible judgement of character. If this gets big at least it might push the Glaziers to kick him out.
He has fecked with our club enough. Although not really rape since the Glaziers do not mind for some odd reason.
 
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McGrathsipan

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One thing I can't stand with the blindsided fans is that many of their theology is based on the quality of the squad but nothing to do with the influence of the football on the pitch.

We play some of the worst football in the league, even a lower standard compared to teams in the lower half in the division. We do not create chances, we have no phases of play, there's no structure in attacking shape nor movement, we rely on individual brilliance, players aren't improving under the system, there's no transition from midfield to attack, no dynamics in wide areas. These are all aspects that buying new surnames have no effect on. The problem is Mourinho stagnated much of the development of the team because he's not a coach but a decent manager, with Solskjaer we have both a rancid coach and a rancid manager.

As a club we are absolutely finished if Ole has another season, the damage will be irreparable. We can have the best window under Woodward it will make no difference when the manager is garbage.
Jesus the drama.

It'll be a clusterfcuk alright but it wont be irreparable.

Liverpool were lower than this and now look at them !!

Its about bottoming this out. God knows when but its going to get worse yet.
 

Lost bear

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Getting really sick and tired of him sitting hopelessly on the bench just waiting for something to happen.
yes, that is particularly difficult, I find. He looks so lost, and Michael Carrick just looks like he wishes he was anywhere else.
It appears that Ole is simply paralysed, and always leaves. necessary substitutions, which the CAF is screaming out for in the match threads, until it’s too late.

He really doesn’t strike me as a good or effective manager, though he has brought some good players in. I kind of want to like the guy, but he’s just so exasperating!
 

oreon

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Doesn't sound like Ole is involved here, but he is working with an agent that appears far worse than Mino and is helping his client get away from a crime potentially.
Ighalo uses that agent too. So him and the club still uses a shitty agent like that.

Ole making that guy captain too just shows his terrible judgement of character. If this gets big at least it might push the Glaziers to kick him out.
He has fecked with our club enough. Although not really rape since the Glaziers do not mind for some odd reason.
That story is a PR nightmare. If it blows up there would be massive damage to the club's image. If the club was smart they would let Ole go now before this becomes a huge story
 

Samid

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Doesn't sound like Ole is involved here, but he is working with an agent that appears far worse than Mino and is helping his client get away from a crime potentially.
Ighalo uses that agent too. So him and the club still uses a shitty agent like that.

Ole making that guy captain too just shows his terrible judgement of character. If this gets big at least it might push the Glaziers to kick him out.
He has fecked with our club enough. Although not really rape since the Glaziers do not mind for some odd reason.
The guy captained one pre season game, way before being charged. Stop spreading bollocks.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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That story is a PR nightmare. If it blows up there would be massive damage to the club's image. If the club was smart they would let Ole go now before this becomes a huge story
If the the club was smart he would never have been appointed in the first place.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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The guy captained one pre season game, way before being charged. Stop spreading bollocks.
Nothing wrong with the statement. I have not followed his squad management at Molde though.
He is terrible with his judgement based on his time here.
 

L1nk

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Anyone see a report from a Norwegian newspaper, something along the lines of this;


 

USREDEVIL

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Seeing quite the ugly story regarding Ole's time in Norway making the rounds on social media...

For his sake, I truly hope the accusations aren't true as it would reflect horribly on him and might shorten his leash/turn the media tide against him

Look up the Babacar Sarr story for anyone interested, might even warrant it's own thread if it blows up
Just read it myself. So if i'm reading it right, it's possible that Ole assisted or abetted in Sarr's flight from justice through the transfer, along with the agent of course. What i did not get is why this is suddenly news now as it happened when Ole was at Molde.
 
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Paul_Scholes18

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Just read it myself. So if i'm reading it right, it's possible that assisted or abetted in Sarr's flight from justice through the transfer, along with the agent of course. What i did not get is why this is suddenly news now as it happened when Ole was at Mole.
Maybe since we signed Ighalo with that agent?
 

redshaw

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Anyone see a report from a Norwegian newspaper, something along the lines of this;


Shouldn't come as a surprise really. United fans in the ground like to show support and they gave it to Moyes LVG and Jose to the bitter end, lots of supportive chants, thumbs up and waves while the managers trundle off after another shocking performance and a sack looming.
 

The Bloody-Nine

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So that's Molde fans who wanted rid of him. Ask Cardiff fans how they rate him. But we, the so called biggest club in the world, still have diehards who believe he should be given a few more years. Because he used to play for us. How depressing.
 
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